Maybe Pete Did Learn

pittpnthrs

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After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm
 

Chapow

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pittpnthrs":2u7cokkn said:
After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm

How do you know Pete held no one accountable? Is there no way to hold people accountable other than to fire them?

Also, Bevell was the OC for our team the season we won a SB 43-8, and also the OC for our team that got back to the SB the very next season. Is it really that unreasonable to not have fired that guy because 1 play went very, very wrong for us? Like, everything that happened before that play shouldn't have counted for anything?
 
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pittpnthrs

pittpnthrs

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Chapow":3jolx9ia said:
pittpnthrs":3jolx9ia said:
After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm

How do you know Pete held no one accountable? Is there no way to hold people accountable other than to fire them?

Also, Bevell was the OC for our team the season we won a SB 43-8, and also the OC for our team that got back to the SB the very next season. Is it really that unreasonable to not have fired that guy because 1 play went very, very wrong for us? Like, everything that happened before that play shouldn't have counted for anything?

The locker room fell apart because Bevell was kept. A play of that horrific magnitude, somebody needed fired. Team hasent been right since.
 

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pittpnthrs":2yby7xay said:
Chapow":2yby7xay said:
pittpnthrs":2yby7xay said:
After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm

How do you know Pete held no one accountable? Is there no way to hold people accountable other than to fire them?

Also, Bevell was the OC for our team the season we won a SB 43-8, and also the OC for our team that got back to the SB the very next season. Is it really that unreasonable to not have fired that guy because 1 play went very, very wrong for us? Like, everything that happened before that play shouldn't have counted for anything?

The locker room fell apart because Bevell was kept. A play of that horrific magnitude, somebody needed fired. Team hasent been right since.


Trust me I know what you're saying, but I wonder how many franchises would take 64-33, 2 division titles and 5 playoff appearances in 6 years as "not being right" ;)
 

Spin Doctor

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Pete Carroll refuses to hold himself accountable, that is the main issue at hand. He adheres to a style of football that quite frankly isn't viable anymore. In his words, he thinks the only way to beat the two deep is a run game. That is just one way to beat it, but you can also do that through the passing game. You beat the two deep through short passes, and passes up the seam with the TE or slot receiver. How many times have teams dink and dunked their way, or used YAC to completely destroy our defense when we used that scheme? The answer is a lot.

We've beaten several teams this year through the short passing game, and dinking and dunking. Against Atlanta the offense looked like something Holmgren would have drawn up. The problem wasn't Schottenheimer, earlier this season he dialed up dynamic offenses, the main problem is Pete. He's looking at the game through an extremely reductionist viewpoint, especially in terms of the offense. The run game is just one tool to beat that coverage, he failed to see the other tools at his disposal and has quite frankly admitted it in press conferences.
 

chris98251

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As soon as we blew out the Jets he dialed it back, the defense looked to be coming into form and he neutered the offense.

Maybe before a few games, it looked like we had a offense that could inflict it's will and a defense that could shut things down, get turnovers and field position.

We didn't need hero ball, just unpredictable and balance.
 

Chapow

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pittpnthrs":326wyhi7 said:
Chapow":326wyhi7 said:
pittpnthrs":326wyhi7 said:
After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm

How do you know Pete held no one accountable? Is there no way to hold people accountable other than to fire them?

Also, Bevell was the OC for our team the season we won a SB 43-8, and also the OC for our team that got back to the SB the very next season. Is it really that unreasonable to not have fired that guy because 1 play went very, very wrong for us? Like, everything that happened before that play shouldn't have counted for anything?

The locker room fell apart because Bevell was kept. A play of that horrific magnitude, somebody needed fired. Team hasent been right since.

Ah yes, if only Pete would have made Bevell the sacrificial lamb everything would have been hunky dory, and we would have gone to at least 2 or 3 more Super Bowls in a row because there definitely weren't any other problems with that team in or out of the locker room.

I mean, it's a nice story, that if only Pete had done that 1 thing differently we would have been a dynasty, probably not really based in reality, however.

Don't get me wrong, I would very much like to have seen what would have happened if they had just handed the ball to Marshawn, or if they would have fired Bevell because of the result of not handing it off to Marshawn, but that's because I have the benefit of hindsight. At the time, Pete didn't have the benefit of hindsight.
 

Maelstrom787

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Spin Doctor":1qlj9z2x said:
Pete Carroll refuses to hold himself accountable, that is the main issue at hand. He adheres to a style of football that quite frankly isn't viable anymore. In his words, he thinks the only way to beat the two deep is a run game. That is just one way to beat it, but you can also do that through the passing game. You beat the two deep through short passes, and passes up the seam with the TE or slot receiver. How many times have teams dink and dunked their way, or used YAC to completely destroy our defense when we used that scheme? The answer is a lot.

We've beaten several teams this year through the short passing game, and dinking and dunking. Against Atlanta the offense looked like something Holmgren would have drawn up. The problem wasn't Schottenheimer, earlier this season he dialed up dynamic offenses, the main problem is Pete. He's looking at the game through an extremely reductionist viewpoint, especially in terms of the offense. The run game is just one tool to beat that coverage, he failed to see the other tools at his disposal and has quite frankly admitted it in press conferences.

Why force the short passing game though? It just doesn't fit. Russell doesn't take the short stuff. As much as I love Russ, we need to acknowledge his weaknesses - he holds the ball and looks for the deep shot, and consistently looks off his short options that usually are open on frequently-called techniques like mesh. We've seen it time and time again that he holds the ball and misses the short stuff, so why not provide the run support to make his job easier and let him focus on his strengths? We've seen him have massive success with it in the past, with no meltdowns like 2020.

Teams are having massive success with rushing attacks that fulfill the same role as a short passing attack - reliable yardage to keep the chains moving and sustain drives. Avoiding getting behind schedule with incompletions and setting up hard third downs. Indirectly helping your defense by keeping them off the dang field.

Schottenheimer did facilitate a passing attack and philosophy shift that worked early on, but teams adjusted and they absolutely befuddled Russ. Which is the easier route to take - trying to develop a better rushing game that rushes more often for similarly efficient yardage, or trying to change Russell as he is quickly approaching the 10 year mark?

We always talk about adjusting the scheme to the quarterback. Well... this is that, and as much as we'd love for the Let Russ Cook Madden-attack to work for a full season, it's easy to shut down without the ability to make teams pay for parking their safeties up high.
 

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Learned what? Lol. Pete has no interest in anyone that will challenge his philosophy. We will never, ever be an air it out offense.
 

Maelstrom787

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Scorpion05":37jy81gq said:
Learned what? Lol. Pete has no interest in anyone that will challenge his philosophy. We will never, ever be an air it out offense.

Is that something that Seattle needs to be, though? Why force it?

Check out the passing play percentages. The teams that rush the most are better. Now, I fully realize that is affected a bit by the tendency to rush the ball when ahead - but check it out. Green Bay a full 5% under Seattle. They centered their whole offseason around crafting a better rushing attack to support Rodgers, and uh.. it worked. Cleveland's rushing attack takes the weight off Mayfield, they rush fourth most in the league. The Titans crafted an awesome rushing attack to let Tannehill breathe. San Francisco 2019 ran it more than half the time to a Super Bowl appearance that they lost because their quarterback sucked.

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/passing-play-pct

Going full air-it-out isn't swimming with the current of success, its swimming against it, ESPECIALLY with a quarterback that lives and dies on his deep game.
 

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pittpnthrs":1t2vsg6q said:
Chapow":1t2vsg6q said:
pittpnthrs":1t2vsg6q said:
After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm

How do you know Pete held no one accountable? Is there no way to hold people accountable other than to fire them?

Also, Bevell was the OC for our team the season we won a SB 43-8, and also the OC for our team that got back to the SB the very next season. Is it really that unreasonable to not have fired that guy because 1 play went very, very wrong for us? Like, everything that happened before that play shouldn't have counted for anything?

The locker room fell apart because Bevell was kept. A play of that horrific magnitude, somebody needed fired. Team hasent been right since.
I think it was more they passed the ball trying to get Wilson the MVP. The LOB gave Wilson shit during practices the following year and things started to leak how they felt Wilson was babied by the coaching staff. So maybe it wasn’t bevel that needed to be fired for the team to heal. Maybe if the coaching staff treated Wilson like everyone else things might have been able to recover.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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It's funny how people remember the end of 49. After a circus catch by Kersey and almost a td run by Lynch we got down to the goal line with like 52 seconds left. All of a sudden the problem was not scoring, but scoring too soon and giving Brady any time for a tying field goal. So they took a bunch of time down and called a time out. I think there was 25 seconds left and we had one more time out left. It made sense to try and maximize how many plays we had. Passing gives us three plays. A wasted play that takes time isn't even a bad thing. We were all worried about leaving too much time for Brady. He was eating #27 alive. And we did a great job of not scoring too soon.
The second thing so many people don't remember was the play after the play not to be mentioned. They were on the one foot line and it had to be a sneak. Stop them for a safety and come back and win. It's a giant mental shift, but it was there. However I bet Bellichek never would let Brady hike it. Just let us go offsides. Why ever hike the ball. It would be mathematically impossible to get a safety if you never ever hiked the ball. And it would be legal, but alas it was not too be #72.
 

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evergreen":1xio1t06 said:
It's funny how people remember the end of 49. After a circus catch by Kersey and almost a td run by Lynch we got down to the goal line with like 52 seconds left. All of a sudden the problem was not scoring, but scoring too soon and giving Brady any time for a tying field goal. So they took a bunch of time down and called a time out. I think there was 25 seconds left and we had one more time out left. It made sense to try and maximize how many plays we had. Passing gives us three plays. A wasted play that takes time isn't even a bad thing. We were all worried about leaving too much time for Brady. He was eating #27 alive. And we did a great job of not scoring too soon.
The second thing so many people don't remember was the play after the play not to be mentioned. They were on the one foot line and it had to be a sneak. Stop them for a safety and come back and win. It's a giant mental shift, but it was there. However I bet Bellichek never would let Brady hike it. Just let us go offsides. Why ever hike the ball. It would be mathematically impossible to get a safety if you never ever hiked the ball. And it would be legal, but alas it was not too be #72.

Yep, passing was the right call, it just wasn't the safest play call. Had it fallen incomplete, they still had two more chances and with one time out, they both could have been runs.
 

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pittpnthrs":3ir08sf6 said:
After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm

Your wishful thinking got the better of you in a moment of weakness. I do it sometimes too, because we'd all like for the Seahawks to look at what their doing wrong and improve on their weaknesses, instead of doing the same thing every year and expecting a different result.

This was a Pete Carroll, my way or the highway scenario.

Thus, "Philosophical differences."
 

John63

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HawkinNY":2jd5q7ha said:
pittpnthrs":2jd5q7ha said:
Chapow":2jd5q7ha said:
pittpnthrs":2jd5q7ha said:
After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm

How do you know Pete held no one accountable? Is there no way to hold people accountable other than to fire them?

Also, Bevell was the OC for our team the season we won a SB 43-8, and also the OC for our team that got back to the SB the very next season. Is it really that unreasonable to not have fired that guy because 1 play went very, very wrong for us? Like, everything that happened before that play shouldn't have counted for anything?

The locker room fell apart because Bevell was kept. A play of that horrific magnitude, somebody needed fired. Team hasent been right since.
I think it was more they passed the ball trying to get Wilson the MVP. The LOB gave Wilson $h!t during practices the following year and things started to leak how they felt Wilson was babied by the coaching staff. So maybe it wasn’t bevel that needed to be fired for the team to heal. Maybe if the coaching staff treated Wilson like everyone else things might have been able to recover.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The proof they were trying to get Wilson the MVP? Never mind you have none just another made up thing.
 

chris98251

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John63":1os95bj3 said:
HawkinNY":1os95bj3 said:
pittpnthrs":1os95bj3 said:
Chapow":1os95bj3 said:
How do you know Pete held no one accountable? Is there no way to hold people accountable other than to fire them?

Also, Bevell was the OC for our team the season we won a SB 43-8, and also the OC for our team that got back to the SB the very next season. Is it really that unreasonable to not have fired that guy because 1 play went very, very wrong for us? Like, everything that happened before that play shouldn't have counted for anything?

The locker room fell apart because Bevell was kept. A play of that horrific magnitude, somebody needed fired. Team hasent been right since.
I think it was more they passed the ball trying to get Wilson the MVP. The LOB gave Wilson $h!t during practices the following year and things started to leak how they felt Wilson was babied by the coaching staff. So maybe it wasn’t bevel that needed to be fired for the team to heal. Maybe if the coaching staff treated Wilson like everyone else things might have been able to recover.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The proof they were trying to get Wilson the MVP? Never mind you have none just another made up thing.

You mean like proof Pete was messing with the offense like many of us said and you blamed Schotty?
 

John63

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Fade":2fmrtjev said:
pittpnthrs":2fmrtjev said:
After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm

Your wishful thinking got the better of you in a moment of weakness. I do it sometimes too, because we'd all like for the Seahawks to look at what their doing wrong and improve on their weaknesses, instead of doing the same thing every year and expecting a different result.

This was a Pete Carroll, my way or the highway scenario.

Thus, "Philosophical differences."


agreed and we can now look forward to more run, run ,run punt, Wilson save us in the 4th qtr. Its perfect for Pete if it works he can say his style works, if it doesn't its Wilson fault for not bringing us back
 
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pittpnthrs

pittpnthrs

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Fade":1qwdppf2 said:
pittpnthrs":1qwdppf2 said:
After Super Bowl 49, Pete held nobody accountable and the locker room fell apart. Hawks just lost to the Rams in a tragic display and the locker room started rumbling again,,,,,,,Schotty fired. Hmmmm

Your wishful thinking got the better of you in a moment of weakness. I do it sometimes too, because we'd all like for the Seahawks to look at what their doing wrong and improve on their weaknesses, instead of doing the same thing every year and expecting a different result.

This was a Pete Carroll, my way or the highway scenario.

Thus, "Philosophical differences."

You're probably right.
 
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