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Shane Waldron Our New Offensive Coordinator

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  • Maelstrom787 wrote:
    John63 wrote:we will know pretty quick, first possession if they snap it with 5 or less, are predictable than PC has neutered him. If we don't and it looks different he has not. All that aside keep in mind just like this year things might go great for a few games than one hiccup, injury or a defense struggling and PC might take control again, and we are back to same old.


    If it were that simple, everyone would be a successful coach in the NFL. It isn't anywhere close to the black-and-white "he's neutered or not neutered" description posted here.



    John, I used to think the same way you did, and I started watching other teams. Many of them do the exact same thing. Why? To keep the opposing D on the field longer? Rest their own D? I think it's mostly to force the Defense to show themselves. But in reality, I have no idea.

    Even so, I would like to see them change it up, let Russell decide when he's going to snap the ball based on what he's seeing.

    I like the hire, and I doubt Pete is going to be in this guy's ear as much as people say he will. I believe that Pete will give him guidelines, then turn him loose. I believe that Russell is going to demand that.

    One of the problems with the 2020 offense, was there were times when RW wasn't allowed to change the play. Per Jake Heaps, the Giants game was one where Russell had to go with the plays he was given. I think that's going to change.

    I like the fact that Sean McVay had Waldron calling the plays during the 2019 Preseason. So why didn't McVay promote him to OC during the year? Because their QB was Goff. McVay was having a lot of success calling plays, and no way was he handing that part of the game off.

    I also like the fact that Waldron has been on 3 NFL teams, picking up ideas from some good coaches. The other important point is his experience as TE Coach, and OLine coach. I like the idea of a youngster drawing up plays when he is familiar with the entire offense. I think this is going to be a good thing, especially for Russell.

    Listening to Jake Heaps, apparently there were other people trying to hire Kevin O'Connell, so they had to offer him a title. IIRC, it was still McVay calling all of the plays.
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  • Then there's this:

    Shane Waldron was Jake Heap's pick yesterday.

    Jake's friend on the Rams staff told him "This is a bigger loss for us than people realize! Shane is a great match for Russ!

    "Waldron was McVay's right-hand guy, and was the key member on that offensive staff, when it came to game planning each week!"
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  • The advantages of running a two back set are as follows:

    1. A lead blocker on run plays

    2. A extra pass blocker in a max protection or blitzing situation.

    3. A extra check down receiver.

    4. Can free up a TE from his block duties.

    5. Lens more creedents to the play action pass.

    A two back set is crucial to the success of any NFL team.
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  • Chawker wrote:The advantages of running a two back set are as follows:

    1. A lead blocker on run plays

    2. A extra pass blocker in a max protection or blitzing situation.

    3. A extra check down receiver.

    4. Can free up a TE from his block duties.

    5. Lens more creedents to the play action pass.

    A two back set is crucial to the success of any NFL team.


    Sure, it's a good personnel grouping to have, but it is in no way critical in the modern NFL. Exactly why the fullback position is dying out.
    Maelstrom787
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  • Chawker wrote:The advantages of running a two back set are as follows:

    1. A lead blocker on run plays

    2. A extra pass blocker in a max protection or blitzing situation.

    3. A extra check down receiver.

    4. Can free up a TE from his block duties.

    5. Lens more creedents to the play action pass.

    A two back set is crucial to the success of any NFL team.


    In 1995

    Name one successful team since the 90s that ran a two-back offense? Even the 2013 Seahawks had a fullback on the field for 8 plays in the SB.
    sdog1981
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  • sdog1981 wrote:
    Chawker wrote:The advantages of running a two back set are as follows:

    1. A lead blocker on run plays

    2. A extra pass blocker in a max protection or blitzing situation.

    3. A extra check down receiver.

    4. Can free up a TE from his block duties.

    5. Lens more creedents to the play action pass.

    A two back set is crucial to the success of any NFL team.


    In 1995

    Name one successful team since the 90s that ran a two-back offense? Even the 2013 Seahawks had a fullback on the field for 8 plays in the SB.


    Pretty sure 49ers w/ Juice is the only team out there that even approaches 60%, and he didn't hit 60% of offensive snaps in a game a single time this year.

    But they're an outlier.
    Maelstrom787
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  • Chawker wrote:The advantages of running a two back set are as follows:
    1. A lead blocker on run plays
    2. A extra pass blocker in a max protection or blitzing situation.
    3. A extra check down receiver.
    4. Can free up a TE from his block duties.
    5. Lens more creedents to the play action pass.

    All of those benefits you are assigning to 21 personnel are also true of 12 personnel, with the second TE substituting for the FB. Teams have gravitated that way in the running game because the second TE is more flexible. The Patriots even ran effectively out of 02 personnel with Hernandez taking handoffs and running behind Gronk.

    11/10 personnel can also counter those advantages with their own benefits - instead of using an extra blocker against a blitz you can have a hot receiver instead. Having a slot receiver/TE running a route is a great way to back LBs off the run. The play action run is extremely effective with extra receivers on the field. Most importantly, 11 packages are extremely versatile. The QB can go under center or in shotgun, audible just to about anything to keep the defense guessing, and run the ball to either the strong or the weak side without losing advantage.

    Even 00 personnel is used occasionally by teams like the Patriots and Packers as an extension of the running game with quick WR screens and bubble screens, because it forces the defense to bring in more DBs and take linemen off the field. The 49ers used to kill the Packers with Kap running out of 00 personnel because he could outrun their LBs.
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  • AgentDib wrote:
    Chawker wrote:The advantages of running a two back set are as follows:
    1. A lead blocker on run plays
    2. A extra pass blocker in a max protection or blitzing situation.
    3. A extra check down receiver.
    4. Can free up a TE from his block duties.
    5. Lens more creedents to the play action pass.

    All of those benefits you are assigning to 21 personnel are also true of 12 personnel, with the second TE substituting for the FB. Teams have gravitated that way in the running game because the second TE is more flexible. The Patriots even ran effectively out of 02 personnel with Hernandez taking handoffs and running behind Gronk.

    11/10 personnel can also counter those advantages with their own benefits - instead of using an extra blocker against a blitz you can have a hot receiver instead. Having a slot receiver/TE running a route is a great way to back LBs off the run. The play action run is extremely effective with extra receivers on the field. Most importantly, 11 packages are extremely versatile. The QB can go under center or in shotgun, audible just to about anything to keep the defense guessing, and run the ball to either the strong or the weak side without losing advantage.

    Even 00 personnel is used occasionally by teams like the Patriots and Packers as an extension of the running game with quick WR screens and bubble screens, because it forces the defense to bring in more DBs and take linemen off the field. The 49ers used to kill the Packers with Kap running out of 00 personnel because he could outrun their LBs.


    Tell what TE can Block and read a defense to open a hole on this team from the H back location.

    I don't have many years left to wait so appreciate expedition.

    Pete has been trying this ever since M rob left, it has not worked, it has got our RB's more injuries as a unit then any team I can think of however if you want to be number 1 in something.

    I like the hire, and I doubt Pete is going to be in this guy's ear as much as people say he will. I believe that Pete will give him guidelines, then turn him loose. I believe that Russell is going to demand that.


    Ivotuk, When has Wilson demanded anything, he doesn't even do it during contract negotiations.
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  • One of the problems with the 2020 offense, was there were times when RW wasn't allowed to change the play. Per Jake Heaps, the Giants game was one where Russell had to go with the plays he was given. I think that's going to change.

    This reminds me of a quote from Russ after that awful 4th and 1 play in that game that didn't come close to working. Russ said that "they didn't get the look they were expecting". I just threw my arms up reading that thinking whey didn't he change the play or just take the 5 yard delay of game and punt it.
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  • HawkRiderFan wrote:One of the problems with the 2020 offense, was there were times when RW wasn't allowed to change the play. Per Jake Heaps, the Giants game was one where Russell had to go with the plays he was given. I think that's going to change.

    This reminds me of a quote from Russ after that awful 4th and 1 play in that game that didn't come close to working. Russ said that "they didn't get the look they were expecting". I just threw my arms up reading that thinking whey didn't he change the play or just take the 5 yard delay of game and punt it.



    Trust issues raises it's head again.
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  • He has practically no play calling experience. Another lap dog and "yes man" for Pete.
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  • HawkRiderFan wrote:One of the problems with the 2020 offense, was there were times when RW wasn't allowed to change the play. Per Jake Heaps, the Giants game was one where Russell had to go with the plays he was given. I think that's going to change.

    This reminds me of a quote from Russ after that awful 4th and 1 play in that game that didn't come close to working. Russ said that "they didn't get the look they were expecting". I just threw my arms up reading that thinking whey didn't he change the play or just take the 5 yard delay of game and punt it.



    so now you know what alot of his knew Wilson was not allowed to change plays as much as some think. When it comes down to it like it or not the reality is PC has an iron fist on the offense. He is the reason we don't throw short much, he is the reason we go long alot which means holding the ball more., he is the reason why we play or do not play for 3 qtrs. HE is the reason this offense looked like crap starting game 6. And barring a come to Jesus moment he will be4 the reason it looks bad again. And because some on hear are so loyal to the HC who got us our first Championship even more so than the QB who go it, he will get away with it.

    Just look at the cadence of the offense and players for qtrs 1-3 and then the 4th. Notice a change that is because in qtr4 is when they let the offense off the leash, that's when they play a real offense.
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  • sdog1981 wrote:
    Chawker wrote:The advantages of running a two back set are as follows:

    1. A lead blocker on run plays

    2. A extra pass blocker in a max protection or blitzing situation.

    3. A extra check down receiver.

    4. Can free up a TE from his block duties.

    5. Lens more creedents to the play action pass.

    A two back set is crucial to the success of any NFL team.


    In 1995

    Name one successful team since the 90s that ran a two-back offense? Even the 2013 Seahawks had a fullback on the field for 8 plays in the SB.


    Not saying I agree with him, but um, the 2005 Seahawks.
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  • hawksfansince90 wrote:He has practically no play calling experience. Another lap dog and "yes man" for Pete.


    This is what I mean when I say that folks are gonna stick to whatever narrative they've heard, come hell or high water.
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  • Seanhawk wrote:
    sdog1981 wrote:
    Chawker wrote:The advantages of running a two back set are as follows:

    1. A lead blocker on run plays

    2. A extra pass blocker in a max protection or blitzing situation.

    3. A extra check down receiver.

    4. Can free up a TE from his block duties.

    5. Lens more creedents to the play action pass.

    A two back set is crucial to the success of any NFL team.


    In 1995

    Name one successful team since the 90s that ran a two-back offense? Even the 2013 Seahawks had a fullback on the field for 8 plays in the SB.


    Not saying I agree with him, but um, the 2005 Seahawks.


    2005 is much closer to the 90s than 2021.

    As for the 49ers, Juszcyk is on the field for 40% of the snaps. That includes the team running 57% of their snaps from 1 back sets. New England ran the most 2 back sets last season with 37% of their snaps.
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  • Like I said before, no matter who they chose, plenty of people would complain. Pretty predictable.
    I'm looking forward to a change, welcome to Seattle. Let's roll.
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  • Maelstrom787 wrote:
    hawksfansince90 wrote:He has practically no play calling experience. Another lap dog and "yes man" for Pete.


    This is what I mean when I say that folks are gonna stick to whatever narrative they've heard, come hell or high water.


    Well homey here has been a hawks fan since 90, so he probably knows what he's talking about.

    I can almost guarantee that Waldron was a Russell approved hire, because you know damn well Pete and Russell met post season and Russell expressed his concern with the stagnated and predictable offense.

    So IMO the Waldron hire IS Pete being proactive about trying to get a little more innovation into his offensive schemes, and Waldron comes from the Belichick/Shanahan and McVay tree, which is EXACTLY that, dynamic innovative run and short passing game.

    Great fit for me. Obviously experience is an issue, but he's been in those meeting rooms for almost a decade, so I'm honestly not worried about the experience part. Seems like a very sharp coach.
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  • Good points. And everyone at some point was inexperienced. You have to start somewhere, and this not only looks like a good hire, but you're right, probably one that Russ endorses.
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  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Maelstrom787 wrote:
    hawksfansince90 wrote:He has practically no play calling experience. Another lap dog and "yes man" for Pete.


    This is what I mean when I say that folks are gonna stick to whatever narrative they've heard, come hell or high water.


    Well homey here has been a hawks fan since 90, so he probably knows what he's talking about.

    I can almost guarantee that Waldron was a Russell approved hire, because you know damn well Pete and Russell met post season and Russell expressed his concern with the stagnated and predictable offense.

    So IMO the Waldron hire IS Pete being proactive about trying to get a little more innovation into his offensive schemes, and Waldron comes from the Belichick/Shanahan and McVay tree, which is EXACTLY that, dynamic innovative run and short passing game.

    Great fit for me. Obviously experience is an issue, but he's been in those meeting rooms for almost a decade, so I'm honestly not worried about the experience part. Seems like a very sharp coach.


    Wilson asking to be included tells me he was a CC on the email not the To, Wilson will approve or say he approves anyone we bring in because he is not counter Culture and does Corporate speak as well as CEO's, he hated seeing Schotty go, at least he actually stated that.

    I really wish they would go back and look at the Bills under Levy, the K Gun would be a perfect offense for us, using Thomas and Reed as will as a host of other receivers and TE's Kelly moved that offens e up and down the field.

    They used Shot gun a lot and spread the field. Look at Indy under Reich, they have a lot of it's elements also, why they could turn things around quickly there with Rivers even who came from a different type of offense with the Chargers.
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  • chris98251 wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Maelstrom787 wrote:
    hawksfansince90 wrote:He has practically no play calling experience. Another lap dog and "yes man" for Pete.


    This is what I mean when I say that folks are gonna stick to whatever narrative they've heard, come hell or high water.


    Well homey here has been a hawks fan since 90, so he probably knows what he's talking about.

    I can almost guarantee that Waldron was a Russell approved hire, because you know damn well Pete and Russell met post season and Russell expressed his concern with the stagnated and predictable offense.

    So IMO the Waldron hire IS Pete being proactive about trying to get a little more innovation into his offensive schemes, and Waldron comes from the Belichick/Shanahan and McVay tree, which is EXACTLY that, dynamic innovative run and short passing game.

    Great fit for me. Obviously experience is an issue, but he's been in those meeting rooms for almost a decade, so I'm honestly not worried about the experience part. Seems like a very sharp coach.


    Wilson asking to be included tells me he was a CC on the email not the To, Wilson will approve or say he approves anyone we bring in because he is not counter Culture and does Corporate speak as well as CEO's, he hated seeing Schotty go, at least he actually stated that.

    I really wish they would go back and look at the Bills under Levy, the K Gun would be a perfect offense for us, using Thomas and Reed as will as a host of other receivers and TE's Kelly moved that offens e up and down the field.

    They used Shot gun a lot and spread the field. Look at Indy under Reich, they have a lot of it's elements also, why they could turn things around quickly there with Rivers even who came from a different type of offense with the Chargers.


    Wilson was absolutely consulted on both the firing of Schotty and the hiring of Waldron.

    Not saying either were his decisions, Pete has final say, obviously. But if you're Pete and John with your shiny new extensions in place, you're not going to freeze out your franchise QB on any coordinator hiring or firings.

    Waldon feels VERY much like a Wilson was heavily involved hiring, and not a plain vanilla re-tread hire because Pete wants to run the ball Bevell or Schotty hire were.
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  • Make no mistake about it. This has Wilson's hand prints all over it. It shows Pete is willing to be flexible with the offense and trusts Russ' input enough to allow his thoughts and concerns to shape the hire itself. I love it.
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  • Aros wrote:Make no mistake about it. This has Wilson's hand prints all over it. It shows Pete is willing to be flexible with the offense and trusts Russ' input enough to allow his thoughts and concerns to shape the hire itself. I love it.


    Yes, and here's Brock Huards Mynorthwest.com piece showing that Waldron was indeed Russell's guy.

    https://sports.mynorthwest.com/1286532/ ... e-waldron/
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  • sdog1981 wrote:
    Seanhawk wrote:
    sdog1981 wrote:
    Chawker wrote:The advantages of running a two back set are as follows:

    1. A lead blocker on run plays

    2. A extra pass blocker in a max protection or blitzing situation.

    3. A extra check down receiver.

    4. Can free up a TE from his block duties.

    5. Lens more creedents to the play action pass.

    A two back set is crucial to the success of any NFL team.


    In 1995

    Name one successful team since the 90s that ran a two-back offense? Even the 2013 Seahawks had a fullback on the field for 8 plays in the SB.


    Not saying I agree with him, but um, the 2005 Seahawks.


    2005 is much closer to the 90s than 2021.

    As for the 49ers, Juszcyk is on the field for 40% of the snaps. That includes the team running 57% of their snaps from 1 back sets. New England ran the most 2 back sets last season with 37% of their snaps.


    You said name one since the 90s. I did. Quit moving the goal posts.
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  • If Russ likes it I like it. I also like hearing from so many here that like it.
    Maybe it won't turn out to be a "misery loves company" deal.
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  • I hope this is more than spin from the team.

    For me I like the hire as he’s a fresh face with fresh ideas for a program that had become predictable. I hope he demonstrates some plasticity in being able to change up quickly uptempo when needed, ground and pound when needs indicate, and is anything but predictable.

    That RW is happy with the selection is a great thing, we don’t need the dysfunction that is being seen in Houston where their young and talented franchise QB has been ignored in the selection process. For many here the choice shows them that it isn’t always my way or the highway. Kudos to the front office for this hire.
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  • I have issues when ESPN does we told you stories about any player wanting or saying something.

    They have almost zero credibility anymore.
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  • Maelstrom787 wrote:
    hawksfansince90 wrote:He has practically no play calling experience. Another lap dog and "yes man" for Pete.


    This is what I mean when I say that folks are gonna stick to whatever narrative they've heard, come hell or high water.

    Hell to the Yeah..^^^^ THIS ^^^^
    It's like, man I wish I could buy some kids for what they're really worth, and SELL them for what they THINK they are worth....I'd be a bazillionaire :lol:
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  • Looks like Waldron is bringing Andy Dickerson along with him to be the run game coordinator. Dickerson is also unproven but will be a great resource if Waldron is trying to recreate the McVay offense as closely as possible. I would have liked to see us bring in a more experienced veteran, but we'll still have Solari and probably a handful of consultants.
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  • Aros wrote:Make no mistake about it. This has Wilson's hand prints all over it. It shows Pete is willing to be flexible with the offense and trusts Russ' input enough to allow his thoughts and concerns to shape the hire itself. I love it.

    HEAR HERE!!, My sentiments exactly...Hell, when DK Metcalf said that "Teams Defenses were figuring us out", tells you all you need to know about the crappy timing, and play-calls not being called in in a timely manner.
    IT wasn't always on Wilson & the last minute ball snaps....Defense confused the play-calls which killed the timing.
    Wilson HAS TO BE ABLE to "Opt Out" of a bad play-call, and I don't think he was given the freedom to do so for the first three quarters.
    I don't think Pete is as foolish as some folks around here thinks he is, and if a dialed up game plan is working?, I think he's pretty much hands off....I also think he holds Russell Wilson in the highest of Regards.

    :vodka:
    p.s. One shouldn't Drink & Post :smilingalien:
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  • Seems kinda strange to me that it has now been days since the news broke, and there STILL HAS BEEN NOT A WORD about the 'hire' on .com. Does it take that long to construct a virtual frame?
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  • Appyhawk wrote:Seems kinda strange to me that it has now been days since the news broke, and there STILL HAS BEEN NOT A WORD about the 'hire' on .com. Does it take that long to construct a virtual frame?

    Has there been an official Team announcement yet? Dot com generally waits for that. Perhaps they are wrangling over details of the contract and job duties?
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  • Well done. Very well done.

    He checks all of the boxes.

    I just can't see Pete meddling anymore--yes he will still get final say of course. But you don't hire someone from McVay's coaching tree to not be creative. We may see some teething pains from the offense next year as Waldron implements his offensive, but it will be worth it.

    All we need now is some discipline on the offensive line to avoid drive killing penalties and we should be good.
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  • Either way, I'm looking forward to more "point guard" Russ and less "wait until I got three guys on me and chuck it" Russ.
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  • Appyhawk wrote:Seems kinda strange to me that it has now been days since the news broke, and there STILL HAS BEEN NOT A WORD about the 'hire' on .com. Does it take that long to construct a virtual frame?


    Idk what a virtual frame is, but it does take time to iron out contracts, get everyone back in the building and organize a presser.
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  • If I'm Waldron the contract details are pretty much ironed out before I say "yes".
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  • Sgt. Largent wrote:It's official, for those of you who were nervous that it might not be official, even though everyone told us it was official, just not OFFICIAL enough for your particular official tastes.

    https://www.seahawks.com/news/seahawks- ... ame-coordi

    Guess it was a package deal. :D

    Nothing is "official" until the ink is dry. :twisted:
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  • Not one mention of Wilson involved in anything.
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  • Well, after reading the print on another pitcher of Kool-Aid, that pretty much ends this book. That leaves us with imagining what our offense will look like, who we'll be able to re-sign, what we can do in FA, and/or what we have to do to recapture some draft leverage. So roll the tires in and lets get to kicking them.
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  • If this is indeed true, this is the best the Seahawks could ever hope for.

    My wish was to nab someone from the Shanny/McVay/Lafleur tree.

    McVay and Shanny's system is run first. Which, of course will make Pete very happy.

    But here's the thing, it's not a system of running for the sake of running. Like Pete has been doing, and done in the past.
    Where they have 2 offenses. The running offense to shorten the game, limit turnovers, etc., and the uptempo passing offense to score points. Very stilted.

    Unlike Pete, Shanny and McVay run a widezone, AND consistently boot their QB off of it. Meaning, you overplay the run, and they are going to murder you with the QB boot-action that comes off it. Pick your poison. McVay's twist to Shanny's system was he blended more, much more jet action, and Air Raid passing concepts / run to grass out of 11 personnel. (Goff and Kupp came from the Air Raid 10 personnel.) As that started getting figured out (end of 2018) McVay moved to 2 TEs ends, and a more classic Shanny bootgame to do his best to help Goff. Goff has thrived on playaction, but struggles in traditional drop-back passing situations, but I digress.

    I have been very frustrated the entire RW era, how they do not boot Wilson very often. Just Gun inside zone runs, feigning zone-read, with the same 5-7 step deep drop over and and over, with Wilson having to create the movement on a scramble play. In the playoff game against the Rams, they called ZERO rollouts on 35 dropbacks. That is pure ineptitude. The Seahawks make everything so damn difficult on offense, and for their QB. They've been walking a tightrope for years, with Wilson pulling it off most of the time. But Wilson has been dealing with one of the highest degrees of difficulty at the position, especially since Marshawn left.

    The Shanny system blends, and marries both the run game and pass game together. It makes it very hard for defenses to tell if you're running or passing. The opposite of the Seahawks who again have been very predictable, and stilted, over the years.

    Another big benefit is Waldron has been on the staff that has dominated Wilson for most of his career. Those dumpster fire gameplans against the Rams can finally be balled up and thrown in the trash.

    Of course, Pete could intervene and screw the whole thing up at anytime, we'll just have to wait and see. But this is definitely a step in the right direction. Pete just needs to let Waldron do his thing, and continue to babysit Norton and focus on his defense.
    Fade
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  • So what's first, look for a O line that fits or tell Wilson to lose 15 pounds to get his agility back since he is going to be doing sprint roll outs.
    chris98251
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  • chris98251 wrote:So what's first, look for a O line that fits or tell Wilson to lose 15 pounds to get his agility back since he is going to be doing sprint roll outs.

    A little bit of both. They will need to upgrade both the LG & C positions, especially LG.

    But just putting it out there, Wilson ran for 6+ yards a carry and 500+ yards on the season. Not bad for porky.

    He could stand to shed a few pounds no doubt, get a little lighter, but Wilson's lack of mobility has been greatly over blown. And wasn't the glaring issue, or reason for the offense's demise.

    1) Predictable Peteball.
    2) Gameplanning properly for opponents (ties into Peteball).
    3) O-Line injuries. LG, C, & RT during the 2nd half of the season.
    4) DK Metcalf drops.
    5) RB injuries.
    6) Lack of big play capability at the TE position.
    7) Lack of a 3rd weapon in the passing game. Too Lockett & Metcalf dependent.
    8-) Wilson's weight (mobility).
    9) Uncharacteristic Lockett drops.
    10) Penny not showing more at the end of the year. Understandable, but still disappointing.

    Just by being in a less predictable offense, that will actually roll Wilson out more, the whole mobility issue goes away. Especially if he was still capable of running for 500 yards at over 6 yards a clip, all while being a little plump in the sitting duck of an offense he played in last year.
    Fade
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  • Fade wrote:If this is indeed true, this is the best the Seahawks could ever hope for.

    My wish was to nab someone from the Shanny/McVay/Lafleur tree.

    McVay and Shanny's system is run first. Which, of course will make Pete very happy.

    But here's the thing, it's not a system of running for the sake of running. Like Pete has been doing, and done in the past.
    Where they have 2 offenses. The running offense to shorten the game, limit turnovers, etc., and the uptempo passing offense to score points. Very stilted.

    Unlike Pete, Shanny and McVay run a widezone, AND consistently boot their QB off of it. Meaning, you overplay the run, and they are going to murder you with the QB boot-action that comes off it. Pick your poison. McVay's twist to Shanny's system was he blended more, much more jet action, and Air Raid passing concepts / run to grass out of 11 personnel. (Goff and Kupp came from the Air Raid 10 personnel.) As that started getting figured out (end of 2018) McVay moved to 2 TEs ends, and a more classic Shanny bootgame to do his best to help Goff. Goff has thrived on playaction, but struggles in traditional drop-back passing situations, but I digress.

    I have been very frustrated the entire RW era, how they do not boot Wilson very often. Just Gun inside zone runs, feigning zone-read, with the same 5-7 step deep drop over and and over, with Wilson having to create the movement on a scramble play. In the playoff game against the Rams, they called ZERO rollouts on 35 dropbacks. That is pure ineptitude. The Seahawks make everything so damn difficult on offense, and for their QB. They've been walking a tightrope for years, with Wilson pulling it off most of the time. But Wilson has been dealing with one of the highest degrees of difficulty at the position, especially since Marshawn left.

    The Shanny system blends, and marries both the run game and pass game together. It makes it very hard for defenses to tell if you're running or passing. The opposite of the Seahawks who again have been very predictable, and stilted, over the years.

    Another big benefit is Waldron has been on the staff that has dominated Wilson for most of his career. Those dumpster fire gameplans against the Rams can finally be balled up and thrown in the trash.

    Of course, Pete could intervene and screw the whole thing up at anytime, we'll just have to wait and see. But this is definitely a step in the right direction. Pete just needs to let Waldron do his thing, and continue to babysit Norton and focus on his defense.


    a Freakin men.

    The 4 RO runs up the middle and RW never keeping it with 7 step chuck and duck drops was infuriating. Easiest offense in the league to defend, no defense was ever on their heels playing the Hawks.
    Smellyman
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  • Fade wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:So what's first, look for a O line that fits or tell Wilson to lose 15 pounds to get his agility back since he is going to be doing sprint roll outs.

    A little bit of both. They will need to upgrade both the LG & C positions, especially LG.

    But just putting it out there, Wilson ran for 6+ yards a carry and 500+ yards on the season. Not bad for porky.

    He could stand to shed a few pounds no doubt, get a little lighter, but Wilson's lack of mobility has been greatly over blown. And wasn't the glaring issue, or reason for the offense's demise.

    1) Predictable Peteball.
    2) Gameplanning properly for opponents (ties into Peteball).
    3) O-Line injuries. LG, C, & RT during the 2nd half of the season.
    4) DK Metcalf drops.
    5) RB injuries.
    6) Lack of big play capability at the TE position.
    7) Lack of a 3rd weapon in the passing game. Too Lockett & Metcalf dependent.
    8-) Wilson's weight (mobility).
    9) Uncharacteristic Lockett drops.
    10) Penny not showing more at the end of the year. Understandable, but still disappointing.

    Just by being in a less predictable offense, that will actually roll Wilson out more, the whole mobility issue goes away. Especially if he was still capable of running for 500 yards at over 6 yards a clip, all while being a little plump in the sitting duck of an offense he played in last year.

    So much this. Great post.
    Sports Hernia
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  • Spent some time to read Rams forum about their coaches joining us. They didn't seem to be worried. More like as a thank you that they got rid of them. Let's wait and see. I hope our new coaches prove them wrong and use our talents wisely.
    Gio
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    Posts: 262
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  • Gio wrote:Spent some time to read Rams forum about their coaches joining us. They didn't seem to be worried. More like as a thank you that they got rid of them. Let's wait and see. I hope our new coaches prove them wrong and use our talents wisely.


    Maybe they are in denial
    HawkRiderFan
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    Posts: 1158
    Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 5:10 pm


  • HawkRiderFan wrote:
    Gio wrote:Spent some time to read Rams forum about their coaches joining us. They didn't seem to be worried. More like as a thank you that they got rid of them. Let's wait and see. I hope our new coaches prove them wrong and use our talents wisely.


    Maybe they are in denial


    I haven’t seen any Rams fans thankful we got rid of him. Weird.

    I think McVay had confidence in him, but it was McVay doing the play calling. I think he did have Waldron calling plays for some preseason games to get experience.

    Seems like a good guy overall. I also don’t feel particularly worried that he’s no longer with the Rams.
    RedAlice
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  • Own The West wrote:Either way, I'm looking forward to more "point guard" Russ and less "wait until I got three guys on me and chuck it" Russ.

    ^
    And the 'deer in the headlights ' look on his face is getting worse . OL doesn't help him much . IMO
    xray
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    Location: AZ


  • Fade wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:So what's first, look for a O line that fits or tell Wilson to lose 15 pounds to get his agility back since he is going to be doing sprint roll outs.

    A little bit of both. They will need to upgrade both the LG & C positions, especially LG.

    But just putting it out there, Wilson ran for 6+ yards a carry and 500+ yards on the season. Not bad for porky.

    He could stand to shed a few pounds no doubt, get a little lighter, but Wilson's lack of mobility has been greatly over blown. And wasn't the glaring issue, or reason for the offense's demise.

    1) Predictable Peteball.
    2) Gameplanning properly for opponents (ties into Peteball).
    3) O-Line injuries. LG, C, & RT during the 2nd half of the season.
    4) DK Metcalf drops.
    5) RB injuries.
    6) Lack of big play capability at the TE position.
    7) Lack of a 3rd weapon in the passing game. Too Lockett & Metcalf dependent.
    8-) Wilson's weight (mobility).
    9) Uncharacteristic Lockett drops.
    10) Penny not showing more at the end of the year. Understandable, but still disappointing.

    Just by being in a less predictable offense, that will actually roll Wilson out more, the whole mobility issue goes away. Especially if he was still capable of running for 500 yards at over 6 yards a clip, all while being a little plump in the sitting duck of an offense he played in last year.

    Wilson still is mobile, but one thing I notice is he doesn't have the same suddenness and agility that he used to have. Wilson used to pull off Randall Cunningham and Fran Tarkenton plays on a regular basis. He looked a little bit like Barry Sanders at the QB position. No matter how people tried they couldn't seem to get him down, and were clasping at air. Like Barry Sanders he had a lot of big negative plays as well as huge pop offs.

    He hasn't had many of those plays in the last few years. He still is pretty quick, but he doesn't have the same change of direction, and sudden burst ability. He could stop and go to full speed within a matter of a second when he was younger. Russell Wilson has more Cam Newton type of speed now, we're he has a decent top end but takes longer to ramp up. I suspect his extra weight is playing into that some.
    Spin Doctor
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