The Defense in the 2nd half

Scorpion05

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People have been saying that the offense kept the defense on the field too much, but after taking another look it turns out that the offense only had the ball once in the 3rd quarter. So despite having rest at halftime, the defense simply could not get off the field.

The time of possession disparity was largely caused by the Seahawks defense getting gashed on the ground and with tight ends.
 

Hawaii-hawk

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The Defense gave up 530 yards. They couldn’t stop the run. They couldn’t stop the pass. All game long the Titans were moving up and down the field at will and only a few lucky plays/Titans mistakes held them to field goals or that turnover on downs.

To a team the cards held to 250 yards last week.

Absolutely atrocious. And when it became apparent the Titans were getting back into the game no adjustments were made.

Next week at the Vikings. Go hawks
 

calinator

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The offense definitely wasn't good in the second half but instead of blaming either side hard, praise needs to be given to the job Tannehill did on many key 3rd downs. The Titans receivers dropped so many passes but overall their 2 star WR's had good games(actually i'm not sure about AJ Brown).

Here is the biggest thing to me: Henry got 13 carries in the first half and the Seahawks handled him really well. Even being behind 15 they stuck with him and eventually the front 4 completely fell apart trying to stop that big man for 60 minutes. They were totally gassed, and the Titans just had to keep hammering at the wall till it broke. You can talk about how many possessions the offense actually had but they had many 3 and outs their and the defense needed help, especially against a beast like Henry.
 

SarG3Hawk

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The defense is getting the blame but we went into overtime. That means they held on just enough to not lose it in regulation. Last time I checked they stopped the Titans on some 4th downs and 3 and outs as painful as it was to watch. Then the offense got on the field and honored Schotty by being inept and giving Henry the ball back when he was rolling. No creativity or balls on offense yesterday. A broken play was our only scoring drive. Tennessee is a hard football team to beat I don’t think they are as bad as what we saw vs the cards because it was only week 1. I also think (hope) we aren’t as bad as what we saw yesterday.
But both sides deserve some blame. I can’t tell you how many times I’m yelling at the tv seeing the no name TE or back up RB sitting in the middle of the field and Bobby or whoever else is supposed to be there is 10 yards away. They keep attacking our middle but we act like we have never seen that before.
 

hoxrox

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The base defense which is designed to stop the run and defend against being beaten over the top, is constantly exploited with regularity. This is an ongoing Pete/KNJ issue.

Sometimes it might better to just get beaten over the top for a quick score, than death by a thousand cuts, and give the other team all that time to play keep away from Russell.
 

fenderbender123

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Offense needs some work. But the defense is a mess. They played like a bottom 5 defense yesterday.
 

Tusc2000

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Derrick Henry wore the defense down. The D-line was totally gassed by the 4th quarter and could provide no resistance. Our LBs were not effectively covering Henry out of the backfield, allowing Tannehill to continuously check down to him for 8-10 yard gains. And our safeties were more interested in delivering a big hit than in wrapping up the ball carrier. The 4th quarter was an epic failure. Even with all of that, we still could have pulled the game out. But we needed someone to step up and make a defensive play at the end. No one did.
 

Sgt. Largent

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What I saw was Pete and Norton not trusting our corners to play man to man because Jones was torching them, so they allowed a mediocre QB carve up their soft inside zone over and over the entire 2nd half hoping we'd hold onto our lead.

Listen, we all knew the BIG Achilles heal of this defense this year is the corners, and it was on full display yesterday in the 2nd half once the Titans figured out they needed to attack Flowers And Read down with seam routes...........left us with no option other than to play zone to roll over the safeties to help the corners.

Left the entire middle of the field open for easy dump down passes and TE/WR inside crossing routes.

That's the bad news Hawk fans, this isn't correctible, MUCH better offenses, coordinators and QB's are going to destroy our weak ass corners all year.
 

TwistedHusky

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We have a below-average DC.

This year, our corners are even worse than last. A decent DC would have a hard time with this personnel pool.

That isn't an ideal combination.

I suspect that our pass rush looking good vs the Colts was more an illusion. Probably created by the holes in the Colts' line. Yesterday the Titans had holes in the OL and we still struggled to get pressure.

So for those scoring at home, problems with the defense include:

DC
Pass rush
Corners

Of course yesterday our offense did not help. When you have that bad of a defense, you have to score on almost every drive. Somehow, our offense made one of the worst defenses in the league look adequate to good (at least in the 2nd half). We also did not have the tempo and movement we had in the 1st half (but to be fair, a few of those scores were just flat out blown coverages by the Titans - you cannot bank on those over 4 qtrs).

Largent is right. We are going to have problems with this defense all year because much better OCs will figure out that we are easy and soft targets right over the middle. And our DC does not have the acumen or ability to adapt to fix it.
 

Sgt. Largent

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TwistedHusky":31emvzas said:
Largent is right. We are going to have problems with this defense all year because much better OCs will figure out that we are easy and soft targets right over the middle. And our DC does not have the acumen or ability to adapt to fix it.

The problem is in today's modern NFL game, there IS no way to hide bad corner play. Go nickel, go dime, play man, play zone, mix it up, do whatever you want but if you don't have at least average corners that can stay on their receivers until your D-line gets home?

You're doomed.

Read's a small castoff corner that plays with tenacity but is often outmatched by much larger more physical WR's (like Brown and Jones showed yesterday), and Flowers is flat out the worst starting cover corner in the entire league. He can't stay with a receiver without help over the top AND inside.

There's no D-coordinator that can make that work.
 

AgentDib

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hoxrox":1l9iriei said:
Sometimes it might better to just get beaten over the top for a quick score, than death by a thousand cuts, and give the other team all that time to play keep away from Russell.
That could be a general feeling but I don't see how this is a takeaway from yesterday's game. We lost because we failed to properly slow down the game on either side of the football.

On defense, we had a certain player get overly aggressive and attempt to make a big play and then lose outside containment on Derrick Henry as a result. That let them get a 60 yard TD run and get right back into the game. If we play that more conservatively and give up 6 yards instead then we were well positioned to hang onto a win.

On offense, we were completely incompetent in regards to running clock. Tons of three and outs peppered with incompletions and just four total carries for Carson in the second half.
 

hoxrox

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AgentDib":1kur2ira said:
hoxrox":1kur2ira said:
Sometimes it might better to just get beaten over the top for a quick score, than death by a thousand cuts, and give the other team all that time to play keep away from Russell.
That could be a general feeling but I don't see how this is a takeaway from yesterday's game. We lost because we failed to properly slow down the game on either side of the football.

On defense, we had a certain player get overly aggressive and attempt to make a big play and then lose outside containment on Derrick Henry as a result. That let them get a 60 yard TD run and get right back into the game. If we play that more conservatively and give up 6 yards instead then we were well positioned to hang onto a win.

On offense, we were completely incompetent in regards to running clock. Tons of three and outs peppered with incompletions and just four total carries for Carson in the second half.

Yeah, it's more of a general feeling. They give up the short/intermediate middle a lot. Seems all OC's need to do is attack that area on the field on 3rd down and it will be a completion.
 

Sgt. Largent

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hoxrox":36mq5v0h said:
Yeah, it's more of a general feeling. They give up the short/intermediate middle a lot. Seems all OC's need to do is attack that area on the field on 3rd down and it will be a completion.

You are correct, this is especially true when your two corners are DJ Read and Trey Flowers who can't cover good receivers man to man and need zone help.

Exposes the middle of the field and seams.

This problem is not going away anytime soon, and will probably get worse as the D-line gets dinged up and less effective, as we saw yesterday when we had to resort back to sending Adams and Wagner on inside blitzes because the front four couldn't get pressure.
 

AgentDib

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hoxrox":25ksc7bg said:
Yeah, it's more of a general feeling. They give up the short/intermediate middle a lot. Seems all OC's need to do is attack that area on the field on 3rd down and it will be a completion.
In my view they played it correctly yesterday. It was tighter in the middle in the first half, but they were correct to loosen things up in the second half due to the game situation. The one thing they had to avoid was getting beaten with explosive plays deep, which is why the error on the Henry TD was so crucial. They tightened things up again in OT and got off the field.

It's important that they are smart about that and follow the game situation because this secondary will always be at risk of getting beat deep.
 

hawk45

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There's going to be a lot of lamenting the soft zone this year but as Largent points out, the die was cast when we went into the season with the corners we have. We are definitely better than last year's zero pass rush on the DL, but we'd have to have a monster pass rush to protect those corners and that's not what we have. We have Dunlap and some guys with potential who may or may not make any great leaps, and are more likely to be inconsistent.

When asking why a coach would ever use a soft zone that gives up easy yards over the middle, the question is "what's the alternative." Fans tend to believe that aggression is a better approach. Press-man, man to man, blitz heavy if the front 4 aren't getting home. There are times when you need to stop a drive to save the game, like we did in OT, and as Dib said, we tightened it up and got off the field. But when you have a lead, and your corners are Flowers and Reed, first and foremost you're thinking about not giving up the big play. Getting hit over the middle sucks and is frustrating, but at least it takes the opponents a half to catch up to you (if your offense isn't doing squat). Put Flowers on an island in man coverage or force him to play at the LOS and get instantly smoked, and your lead vanishes much more quickly. As Dib points out, the soft zone sucked, but giving up the big play to Henry on a too-aggressive angle was the real dagger.

The head-scratcher is, why play soft-zone which is a delaying tactic kind of approach but then not play ball-control offense? The combination of the two is what left the D out there all game and all but ensures they will wear down against a physical offense.

Which is why I feel that, pathetic as it was, the defensive strategy was the best of the bad options with the corners we have, while the offensive strategy was off and offense has better personnel. No reason we couldn't have run the ball more or go for some nice short and intermediate gains to TEs or whatever in the second half.
 

OrangeGravy

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hawk45":1m3pe8bv said:
There's going to be a lot of lamenting the soft zone this year but as Largent points out, the die was cast when we went into the season with the corners we have. We are definitely better than last year's zero pass rush on the DL, but we'd have to have a monster pass rush to protect those corners and that's not what we have. We have Dunlap and some guys with potential who may or may not make any great leaps, and are more likely to be inconsistent.

When asking why a coach would ever use a soft zone that gives up easy yards over the middle, the question is "what's the alternative." Fans tend to believe that aggression is a better approach. Press-man, man to man, blitz heavy if the front 4 aren't getting home. There are times when you need to stop a drive to save the game, like we did in OT, and as Dib said, we tightened it up and got off the field. But when you have a lead, and your corners are Flowers and Reed, first and foremost you're thinking about not giving up the big play. Getting hit over the middle sucks and is frustrating, but at least it takes the opponents a half to catch up to you (if your offense isn't doing squat). Put Flowers on an island in man coverage or force him to play at the LOS and get instantly smoked, and your lead vanishes much more quickly. As Dib points out, the soft zone sucked, but giving up the big play to Henry on a too-aggressive angle was the real dagger.

The head-scratcher is, why play soft-zone which is a delaying tactic kind of approach but then not play ball-control offense? The combination of the two is what left the D out there all game and all but ensures they will wear down against a physical offense.

Which is why I feel that, pathetic as it was, the defensive strategy was the best of the bad options with the corners we have, while the offensive strategy was off and offense has better personnel. No reason we couldn't have run the ball more or go for some nice short and intermediate gains to TEs or whatever in the second half.
This is the real issue in the game and why the O has to take the bulk of the blame. Now we just need to find out what the play calls are coming through the headset vs what ends up happening at the LOS! Wouldn't that be nice? It would end some debates real quick. I would love to sit through this week's film session on O
 

cymatica

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hawk45":rp41xt69 said:
There's going to be a lot of lamenting the soft zone this year but as Largent points out, the die was cast when we went into the season with the corners we have. We are definitely better than last year's zero pass rush on the DL, but we'd have to have a monster pass rush to protect those corners and that's not what we have. We have Dunlap and some guys with potential who may or may not make any great leaps, and are more likely to be inconsistent.

When asking why a coach would ever use a soft zone that gives up easy yards over the middle, the question is "what's the alternative." Fans tend to believe that aggression is a better approach. Press-man, man to man, blitz heavy if the front 4 aren't getting home. There are times when you need to stop a drive to save the game, like we did in OT, and as Dib said, we tightened it up and got off the field. But when you have a lead, and your corners are Flowers and Reed, first and foremost you're thinking about not giving up the big play. Getting hit over the middle sucks and is frustrating, but at least it takes the opponents a half to catch up to you (if your offense isn't doing squat). Put Flowers on an island in man coverage or force him to play at the LOS and get instantly smoked, and your lead vanishes much more quickly. As Dib points out, the soft zone sucked, but giving up the big play to Henry on a too-aggressive angle was the real dagger.

The head-scratcher is, why play soft-zone which is a delaying tactic kind of approach but then not play ball-control offense? The combination of the two is what left the D out there all game and all but ensures they will wear down against a physical offense.

Which is why I feel that, pathetic as it was, the defensive strategy was the best of the bad options with the corners we have, while the offensive strategy was off and offense has better personnel. No reason we couldn't have run the ball more or go for some nice short and intermediate gains to TEs or whatever in the second half.

https://youtu.be/W1DSclpWEqI

I don't think there's any excuse to run that soft zone. They need to make an average QB work for it, not concede the easiest throw and catch up the field. There is no logic to that: give up free and easy yards while gassing your defense.
 

hoxrox

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I know the corners suck, but Pete and KNJ needs to revisit this approach. Make the QB/WR earn it at least. The easy dump offs gave them all the control. Otherwise, get a starting caliber corner in the building ASAP.

[youtube]W1DSclpWEqI[/youtube]
 

LTH

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Sgt. Largent":62ppup2j said:
What I saw was Pete and Norton not trusting our corners to play man to man because Jones was torching them, so they allowed a mediocre QB carve up their soft inside zone over and over the entire 2nd half hoping we'd hold onto our lead.

Listen, we all knew the BIG Achilles heal of this defense this year is the corners, and it was on full display yesterday in the 2nd half once the Titans figured out they needed to attack Flowers And Read down with seam routes...........left us with no option other than to play zone to roll over the safeties to help the corners.

Left the entire middle of the field open for easy dump down passes and TE/WR inside crossing routes.

That's the bad news Hawk fans, this isn't correctible, MUCH better offenses, coordinators and QB's are going to destroy our weak ass corners all year.

Yep its going to be an issue. the Hawks have cap space i think i heard between 11 and 15 million. Hopefully they make a move.


LTH
 

HawkFreak

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Sgt. Largent":2zyajg02 said:
You are correct, this is especially true when your two corners are DJ Read and Trey Flowers who can't cover good receivers man to man and need zone help.

With always hearing Pete supposedly being such a great defensive mind - especially in regard to DBs - how in the heck was this team allowed to get in the position where this is the current state of things...
 
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