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Any believers left?

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What do you want?

Poll runs till Fri Dec 31, 2021 9:32 am

Keep Carroll
6
8%
Fire Carroll
46
64%
Extend Wilson (after his contract is up)
6
8%
Let Wilson Walk
14
19%
 
Total votes : 72

Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:32 am
  • Seeing as how this team is in shambles and has been for some time whether people here agree or disagree.

    How would you like to proceed starting this off-season.
    TheLegendOfBoom
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:46 am
  • TheLegendOfBoom wrote:Seeing as how this team is in shambles and has been for some time whether people here agree or disagree.

    How would you like to proceed starting this off-season.


    If I had my preference. Fire Pete, get a new HC that will most effectively utilize the offensive talent on the field. Sadly I don’t think RW wants to stay so gonna lose both at this point or be stuck with Pete for a few more years without RW before top finally makes the moves
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:17 am
  • ZagHawk wrote:
    TheLegendOfBoom wrote:Seeing as how this team is in shambles and has been for some time whether people here agree or disagree.

    How would you like to proceed starting this off-season.


    If I had my preference. Fire Pete, get a new HC that will most effectively utilize the offensive talent on the field. Sadly I don’t think RW wants to stay so gonna lose both at this point or be stuck with Pete for a few more years without RW before top finally makes the moves

    I mean at some point, you have to move on from either the winning head coach or the winning QB, or both.

    The head coach isn’t winning anymore and the QB looks like a shell of his former self.

    This should be an easy decision based of the two things I said above.
    TheLegendOfBoom
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:36 am
  • At this point I'm for burning it all down.

    Fire Pete
    Fire John
    Find your next coach and GM, then trade Russell for as much as you can get for him.

    If the new coach and GM want to keep Russell for another year and see if they can cater the scheme and offense to his strengths? I'm willing to see what that looks like.

    But at this point in time I honestly can't see Russell getting better as he's aging, or even remaining the same. I see a QB who's age and lack of mobility is only going to get worse, not better.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:42 am
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:At this point I'm for burning it all down.

    Fire Pete
    Fire John
    Find your next coach and GM, then trade Russell for as much as you can get for him.

    If the new coach and GM want to keep Russell for another year and see if they can cater the scheme and offense to his strengths? I'm willing to see what that looks like.

    But at this point in time I honestly can't see Russell getting better as he's aging, or even remaining the same. I see a QB who's age and lack of mobility is only going to get worse, not better.

    I agree.

    If a new coach steps in and wants to see if Wilson can play still, so be it, give him a year extra but Wilson can become a placeholder for the next franchise QB.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:24 am
  • I still think Russ has a few really good years left in him but I am all for seeking as much as we can for him now. Unfortunately his stock isn't at a high at the moment. If you can get two firsts and a 2nd and or third, pull the trigger. I can't believe I am even saying this right now. Best QB we have ever had and if you think we are just going to magically find another Russ in the draft, good luck with that.

    I also think it's time to move on from Pete and John. Hey man, it was a hell of a run. Nothing to be ashamed of. We finally achieved the top of the mountain with those two. But it's time.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:51 am
  • At this point, ya gotta move on from both Pete and Russ. You gotta get an offensive minded HC as the game is so geared towards offense. I have mixed feelings on RW, but in the end, we badly need draft picks and a QB who isn't hogging up so much cap space. Speaking of draft picks, the hardest guy to decide on is Schneider. His track record has not been great for a long time. But how much of that was Pete influence?? What a big ole friggin mess!


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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:51 am
  • Aros wrote:I still think Russ has a few really good years left in him but I am all for seeking as much as we can for him now. Unfortunately his stock isn't at a high at the moment. If you can get two firsts and a 2nd and or third, pull the trigger. I can't believe I am even saying this right now. Best QB we have ever had and if you think we are just going to magically find another Russ in the draft, good luck with that.

    I also think it's time to move on from Pete and John. Hey man, it was a hell of a run. Nothing to be ashamed of. We finally achieved the top of the mountain with those two. But it's time.

    If Pete and John are making the trade, we really might trade Russ for less than we gave up for Jamal Adams.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:55 am
  • If the Packers can get rid of SB winning with many playoff appearances coach Mike McCarthy and retain Aaron Rodgers. I'd like the Seahawks to do the same with RW and Carroll. It is sadly unlikely given how long this thing got drawn out though.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:39 pm
  • TheLegendOfBoom wrote:
    If a new coach steps in and wants to see if Wilson can play still, so be it, give him a year extra but Wilson can become a placeholder for the next franchise QB.



    Yah, just what we now need....... a $29 million dollar a year placeholder. :roll:
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:40 pm
  • Russell needs his own Matt Lafleur. A smart, creative offensive minded head coach that will build around and utilize their strengths.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:50 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:At this point I'm for burning it all down.

    Fire Pete
    Fire John
    Find your next coach and GM, then trade Russell for as much as you can get for him.

    If the new coach and GM want to keep Russell for another year and see if they can cater the scheme and offense to his strengths? I'm willing to see what that looks like.

    But at this point in time I honestly can't see Russell getting better as he's aging, or even remaining the same. I see a QB who's age and lack of mobility is only going to get worse, not better.

    Pretty much exactly how I feel (though I'm open to John staying with a new coach).

    I don't think any offense that's not built on a great RB first and foremost will cater to Russ's strengths at this point. I just think we sacrifice too much at this point to make the offense work 'for him' instead of 'for the Seahawks'. But I'm willing to let our new HC keep Russ if that's what he thinks is best.

    Otherwise? It's time to start the next era of this franchise.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:53 pm
  • Why do we have to trade russ?

    Honestly I hope they do so all you whiners can see he wasn't the problem. Then balls out for another team.

    On the other hand he needs to remain a hawk with different approaches to coaching. Only way that happens is with a coaching change.

    The idea that we trade away the best player we have ever had on the idea he has regressed or is broken is non sense.1 it's not true. 2 there is nothing supporting you on those arguments. It's all opinion. Someone said his mobility is down. You guys are out of your dam mind again. You act like he can't run anymore. Instead he just doesn't. Tries to throw more. That I will agree with you on. Could help himself take less sacks(although it's also a line issue) and he could find shorter hot routes instead of looking deep. That is all you guys got. Even when he is down he finds a way to not be. He didn't yesterday with the long pass to Tyler and dk. Just dk wasn't inbounds. Tyler was and ended up scoring few plays later.

    Also, how many dropped passes did we have? Blame russ all you want. Dk dropped two off his hands. Dallas dropped 1. Dissly dropped 1. Hart dropped a laser, but still hit his hands. I don't want to hear the"he shouldn't have thrown into dbl coverage". Even dk will tell you...if it hits the hands...it should be a catch. That's where you separate qb to wr responsibility.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:03 pm
  • jamescasey1124 wrote:Why do we have to trade russ?

    Honestly I hope they do so all you whiners can see he wasn't the problem. Then balls out for another team.

    On the other hand he needs to remain a hawk with different approaches to coaching. Only way that happens is with a coaching change.

    The idea that we trade away the best player we have ever had on the idea he has regressed or is broken is non sense.1 it's not true. 2 there is nothing supporting you on those arguments. It's all opinion. Someone said his mobility is down. You guys are out of your dam mind again. You act like he can't run anymore. Instead he just doesn't. Tries to throw more. That I will agree with you on. Could help himself take less sacks(although it's also a line issue) and he could find shorter hot routes instead of looking deep. That is all you guys got. Even when he is down he finds a way to not be. He didn't yesterday with the long pass to Tyler and dk. Just dk wasn't inbounds. Tyler was and ended up scoring few plays later.

    Also, how many dropped passes did we have? Blame russ all you want. Dk dropped two off his hands. Dallas dropped 1. Dissly dropped 1. Hart dropped a laser, but still hit his hands. I don't want to hear the"he shouldn't have thrown into dbl coverage". Even dk will tell you...if it hits the hands...it should be a catch. That's where you separate qb to wr responsibility.


    He isn't playing within the offense design.

    He costs too much to keep when your rebuilding, you are basically doing the same thing you would do if he was on the bench, paying money for something that isn't going to make a difference for a few years.

    If your rebuilding you need capital since we don't have any in Draft picks, he has worth to someone now, keep failing and that drops.

    That's a few, add if you replace Pete the new guy may envision something different and Wilson may not fit that as an established QB, Pete gave Hass one year and really didn't try to resign him either. If the culture evolves around Wilson and you want to change that you have to move him.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:09 pm
  • jamescasey1124 wrote:Why do we have to trade russ?.


    Lots of reasons;

    1. How can you rebuild your roster with no draft picks. Quickest way to get a bunch of high picks is to trade your player with the most value. Russell.

    2. Russell's reached the peak of his potential. His game is elusiveness, escapability, scrambling around and making explosive plays downfield. Is that going to get better or worse as he continues to age, get slower and have more injuries? Worse.

    3. We might not have a choice, if Russell was unhappy after a 12-4 season, what do you think his unhappiness level's going to be after an abysmal 4-5 win season? Going to be off the charts, and he will again ask for a trade, this time much more forcefully.

    Blow it up. Blow it all up.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:13 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:Blow it up. Blow it all up.


    I hate that you are right but you are right.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:38 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Why do we have to trade russ?

    Honestly I hope they do so all you whiners can see he wasn't the problem. Then balls out for another team.

    On the other hand he needs to remain a hawk with different approaches to coaching. Only way that happens is with a coaching change.

    The idea that we trade away the best player we have ever had on the idea he has regressed or is broken is non sense.1 it's not true. 2 there is nothing supporting you on those arguments. It's all opinion. Someone said his mobility is down. You guys are out of your dam mind again. You act like he can't run anymore. Instead he just doesn't. Tries to throw more. That I will agree with you on. Could help himself take less sacks(although it's also a line issue) and he could find shorter hot routes instead of looking deep. That is all you guys got. Even when he is down he finds a way to not be. He didn't yesterday with the long pass to Tyler and dk. Just dk wasn't inbounds. Tyler was and ended up scoring few plays later.

    Also, how many dropped passes did we have? Blame russ all you want. Dk dropped two off his hands. Dallas dropped 1. Dissly dropped 1. Hart dropped a laser, but still hit his hands. I don't want to hear the"he shouldn't have thrown into dbl coverage". Even dk will tell you...if it hits the hands...it should be a catch. That's where you separate qb to wr responsibility.


    He isn't playing within the offense design.

    He costs too much to keep when your rebuilding, you are basically doing the same thing you would do if he was on the bench, paying money for something that isn't going to make a difference for a few years.

    If your rebuilding you need capital since we don't have any in Draft picks, he has worth to someone now, keep failing and that drops.

    That's a few, add if you replace Pete the new guy may envision something different and Wilson may not fit that as an established QB, Pete gave Hass one year and really didn't try to resign him either. If the culture evolves around Wilson and you want to change that you have to move him.



    Who said we are rebuilding? You? Good thing you don't run the seahawks.

    Bye
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:45 pm
  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Why do we have to trade russ?

    Honestly I hope they do so all you whiners can see he wasn't the problem. Then balls out for another team.

    On the other hand he needs to remain a hawk with different approaches to coaching. Only way that happens is with a coaching change.

    The idea that we trade away the best player we have ever had on the idea he has regressed or is broken is non sense.1 it's not true. 2 there is nothing supporting you on those arguments. It's all opinion. Someone said his mobility is down. You guys are out of your dam mind again. You act like he can't run anymore. Instead he just doesn't. Tries to throw more. That I will agree with you on. Could help himself take less sacks(although it's also a line issue) and he could find shorter hot routes instead of looking deep. That is all you guys got. Even when he is down he finds a way to not be. He didn't yesterday with the long pass to Tyler and dk. Just dk wasn't inbounds. Tyler was and ended up scoring few plays later.

    Also, how many dropped passes did we have? Blame russ all you want. Dk dropped two off his hands. Dallas dropped 1. Dissly dropped 1. Hart dropped a laser, but still hit his hands. I don't want to hear the"he shouldn't have thrown into dbl coverage". Even dk will tell you...if it hits the hands...it should be a catch. That's where you separate qb to wr responsibility.


    He isn't playing within the offense design.

    He costs too much to keep when your rebuilding, you are basically doing the same thing you would do if he was on the bench, paying money for something that isn't going to make a difference for a few years.

    If your rebuilding you need capital since we don't have any in Draft picks, he has worth to someone now, keep failing and that drops.

    That's a few, add if you replace Pete the new guy may envision something different and Wilson may not fit that as an established QB, Pete gave Hass one year and really didn't try to resign him either. If the culture evolves around Wilson and you want to change that you have to move him.



    Who said we are rebuilding? You? Good thing you don't run the seahawks.

    Bye


    Oh you would keep everything as it is, maybe trade 3 more high picks for a DT this time?
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:47 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Why do we have to trade russ?.


    Lots of reasons;

    1. How can you rebuild your roster with no draft picks. Quickest way to get a bunch of high picks is to trade your player with the most value. Russell.

    2. Russell's reached the peak of his potential. His game is elusiveness, escapability, scrambling around and making explosive plays downfield. Is that going to get better or worse as he continues to age, get slower and have more injuries? Worse.

    3. We might not have a choice, if Russell was unhappy after a 12-4 season, what do you think his unhappiness level's going to be after an abysmal 4-5 win season? Going to be off the charts, and he will again ask for a trade, this time much more forcefully.

    Blow it up. Blow it all up.


    You can build a team with free agents. Not just a draft. Again, no one said we were rebuilding accept people on this board. No one in control of the hawks.

    You have decided he reached the peak of his potential. That is your opinion. Not factual. My opinion is you don't know what the hell you are talking about.

    Stop assuming you speak for other people. You don't know what russ will do. Honestly, if nothing changes and Pete remains with all of his staff...I hope russ is gone. I would love to see him play for a team who will build around him instead of a worn out philosophy. Also, it would piss off alot of you naysayers who want him gone anyway.

    I'm telling you right now...you are wrong. Russ is not the problem. Only deals with what he is given. Over the years it has gotten worse and everybody is taking it out on him. If he is provided a chance to win here still...he will stay. Alot has to change. But not the change you are talking about.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:51 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Why do we have to trade russ?

    Honestly I hope they do so all you whiners can see he wasn't the problem. Then balls out for another team.

    On the other hand he needs to remain a hawk with different approaches to coaching. Only way that happens is with a coaching change.

    The idea that we trade away the best player we have ever had on the idea he has regressed or is broken is non sense.1 it's not true. 2 there is nothing supporting you on those arguments. It's all opinion. Someone said his mobility is down. You guys are out of your dam mind again. You act like he can't run anymore. Instead he just doesn't. Tries to throw more. That I will agree with you on. Could help himself take less sacks(although it's also a line issue) and he could find shorter hot routes instead of looking deep. That is all you guys got. Even when he is down he finds a way to not be. He didn't yesterday with the long pass to Tyler and dk. Just dk wasn't inbounds. Tyler was and ended up scoring few plays later.

    Also, how many dropped passes did we have? Blame russ all you want. Dk dropped two off his hands. Dallas dropped 1. Dissly dropped 1. Hart dropped a laser, but still hit his hands. I don't want to hear the"he shouldn't have thrown into dbl coverage". Even dk will tell you...if it hits the hands...it should be a catch. That's where you separate qb to wr responsibility.


    He isn't playing within the offense design.

    He costs too much to keep when your rebuilding, you are basically doing the same thing you would do if he was on the bench, paying money for something that isn't going to make a difference for a few years.

    If your rebuilding you need capital since we don't have any in Draft picks, he has worth to someone now, keep failing and that drops.

    That's a few, add if you replace Pete the new guy may envision something different and Wilson may not fit that as an established QB, Pete gave Hass one year and really didn't try to resign him either. If the culture evolves around Wilson and you want to change that you have to move him.



    Who said we are rebuilding? You? Good thing you don't run the seahawks.

    Bye


    Oh you would keep everything as it is, maybe trade 3 more high picks for a DT this time?


    Nope. Keep as is. Talent is there. It's execution with what is given. That is a coaching problem.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:56 pm
  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Why do we have to trade russ?.


    Lots of reasons;

    1. How can you rebuild your roster with no draft picks. Quickest way to get a bunch of high picks is to trade your player with the most value. Russell.

    2. Russell's reached the peak of his potential. His game is elusiveness, escapability, scrambling around and making explosive plays downfield. Is that going to get better or worse as he continues to age, get slower and have more injuries? Worse.

    3. We might not have a choice, if Russell was unhappy after a 12-4 season, what do you think his unhappiness level's going to be after an abysmal 4-5 win season? Going to be off the charts, and he will again ask for a trade, this time much more forcefully.

    Blow it up. Blow it all up.


    You can build a team with free agents. Not just a draft. Again, no one said we were rebuilding accept people on this board. No one in control of the hawks.

    You have decided he reached the peak of his potential. That is your opinion. Not factual. My opinion is you don't know what the hell you are talking about.

    Stop assuming you speak for other people. You don't know what russ will do. Honestly, if nothing changes and Pete remains with all of his staff...I hope russ is gone. I would love to see him play for a team who will build around him instead of a worn out philosophy. Also, it would piss off alot of you naysayers who want him gone anyway.

    I'm telling you right now...you are wrong. Russ is not the problem. Only deals with what he is given. Over the years it has gotten worse and everybody is taking it out on him. If he is provided a chance to win here still...he will stay. Alot has to change. But not the change you are talking about.



    No one who's watched the Hawk's since mid season last year can say with a straight face that Russell's not part of the problem with this team. His play, his relationship with his coach, his injury, his drama, etc.

    Now is Russell THE problem? No, he's pretty far down the list. But his poor play of late and other things I've listed are certainly part of the equation of why the Hawk's are now 3-7.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:01 pm
  • Trading Russ makes no sense.

    Let's assume Russ is at fault. You have a 10% chance of him being effective with another coach.

    Why wouldn't you take that?

    10% vs 0% seems pretty reasonable.

    Almost ANY franchise is taking the 'you have a 10% chance at a HOF QB' offer. You know how I know? Because that is essentially your chances when you are the literal #1 pick in the NFL draft and you pick a QB for that slim chance that the QB ends up a star.

    Go look at the #s, one of the best cases is Cam Newton. Another is Luck for the Colts. You don't think they would have traded those results for what Wilson delivered here? And those are some of the best cases.

    So yes, you keep your QB even if you are sure it is his fault, because you have to try with another coach to be certain.

    There is no circumstance where it is worth 1st round picks (you might want to check the success rates on 1st round picks in the NFL btw...because it is not even 50%).

    And there is no circumstance where Pete rebuilds without Wilson unless you rip the team down to the studs/frame.

    Pete could potentially rebuild here but it would take 3-5 years and he would need to lose often in the interim.

    You roll the dice, even on the slim chance, with Wilson because the alternative is nothing. 10% or even 5% chance of success is better than assured failure.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:05 pm
  • I think it will be easier to get a top coach with Wilson here. With the right pieces he can get you to a championship much easier. Plus we will not have a first round pick this year. The issue is that RW is going to collect 35-40 mil a year.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:30 pm
  • What puzzles and concerns me is that a head coach with almost 40 years experience can hold a press conference and say he's frustrated but not sure what's wrong with the team. He's been doing that on a weekly basis. The problems that plague this team are the same each week. The defense can't get off the field, the offense can't consistently sustain drives or convert 3rd downs, the team discipline or lack thereof is atrocious, etc.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:52 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Why do we have to trade russ?.


    Lots of reasons;

    1. How can you rebuild your roster with no draft picks. Quickest way to get a bunch of high picks is to trade your player with the most value. Russell.

    2. Russell's reached the peak of his potential. His game is elusiveness, escapability, scrambling around and making explosive plays downfield. Is that going to get better or worse as he continues to age, get slower and have more injuries? Worse.

    3. We might not have a choice, if Russell was unhappy after a 12-4 season, what do you think his unhappiness level's going to be after an abysmal 4-5 win season? Going to be off the charts, and he will again ask for a trade, this time much more forcefully.

    Blow it up. Blow it all up.


    This. Father Time is undefeated. Russ looks slow and confused, and that won't get better with age. Time to blow it up. This team is just about unwatchable. The only reason I even do is because I've been a fan for decades. But it's pretty hard to watch this level of ineptitude, and see it slowly getting worse every year.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:00 pm
  • Trading Russ for draft picks would be terminally stupid.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:18 pm
  • TwistedHusky wrote:Trading Russ for draft picks would be terminally stupid.

    For this current front office, yes, but, for a new front office, high draft picks may be exactly what is needed to properly rebuild.
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:38 pm
  • John is done..Most of his draft/trades blow up in his face.
    Pete is done..He is stubborn and won't change-Too loyal.
    Russ is gone..Forget playing till 40..The legs are gone(Houdini is dead)
    BWags is done..Father time has arrived-Yeah it sucks.
    IndyHawk
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 8:04 pm
  • I guess that I have not given up all hope...I see that the Hawks have lost the last two games to two of the best football teams in the NFL when they are trying to get on track... tough schedule... clearly the PACK and the Cards are a better team right now... I still think the Hawks turn it around but I'm un sure if this team can make the playoffs I think they would have to win out and even then it might not happen... they have the talent to do it whether they will or not I don't know...


    LTH
    LTH
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:40 pm
  • LTH wrote:I guess that I have not given up all hope...I see that the Hawks have lost the last two games to two of the best football teams in the NFL when they are trying to get on track... tough schedule... clearly the PACK and the Cards are a better team right now... I still think the Hawks turn it around but I'm un sure if this team can make the playoffs I think they would have to win out and even then it might not happen... they have the talent to do it whether they will or not I don't know...


    LTH


    It would be very hard to get back into the playoff, I am assuming this season is lost. Me as a 12, I like to see the team play youngsters, sign FAs, get back to experimenting, start always compete. Some to think of it, always compete MUST start with Russ vs Geno, may the best QB start the next game.
    toffee
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Re: Any believers left?
Tue Nov 23, 2021 8:07 am
  • Full House cleaning is the only way to go from here. New staff, New players. Many bad seasons ahead but atleast there would be a plan to build.
    TwilightError
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Re: Any believers left?
Tue Nov 23, 2021 9:00 am
  • Pete did leave us the blueprints for creating a top 5-10 team if we follow it.

    It would be completely counterintuitive and involve a lot of things we hated about our drafts here, but it would likely work.

    You really have to just get lucky on the QB front so the chances of getting another elite QB falls to near zero, something like less than 20% even with the first pick.

    But you could have a great team in 3-5 years if you follow the path Pete laid out. If John stays, I think he could reproduce it if he could manage to hold off the fans after several 'failed' drafts.

    You then need a good coach though. And that is the wildcard, because those like the QB, are tremendously hard to find. You would not want Pete under any circumstance.

    The roadmap is built, whether we follow it or not is another issue.
    TwistedHusky
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Re: Any believers left?
Tue Nov 23, 2021 9:18 am
  • I used to be a believer when Paul was the owner, but now I can't say I trust ownership to turn things around.

    If there ever was a time for Jody Allen or at least Chuck Arnold to publicly come forward and give us the temperature of what's going on, this is the time.

    This organization's been on cruise control since Paul died, and THIS is a time when you find out if you have an owner who's engaged and cares.

    It's time for someone to step up and give us something. We're staying the course, we trust Pete and John, we need to see improvement or there's going to be changes.............anything. SOMETHING.
    Sgt. Largent
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Re: Any believers left?
Tue Nov 23, 2021 9:56 am
  • TwistedHusky wrote:Pete did leave us the blueprints for creating a top 5-10 team if we follow it.

    It would be completely counterintuitive and involve a lot of things we hated about our drafts here, but it would likely work.

    You really have to just get lucky on the QB front so the chances of getting another elite QB falls to near zero, something like less than 20% even with the first pick.

    But you could have a great team in 3-5 years if you follow the path Pete laid out. If John stays, I think he could reproduce it if he could manage to hold off the fans after several 'failed' drafts.

    You then need a good coach though. And that is the wildcard, because those like the QB, are tremendously hard to find. You would not want Pete under any circumstance.

    The roadmap is built, whether we follow it or not is another issue.


    Why keeping John is important at least for a while, he has tagged the last few really decent QB's as his specific interest, that alone I think puts a hold notice on him, I also think he would be good in the Hire process of a New Coach knowing what it takes to be successful.
    chris98251
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Re: Any believers left?
Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:45 am
  • Can we trade Wilson and Carroll for Mac Jones and Belichick ? Wish I wasn't kidding . :D
    xray
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Re: Any believers left?
Thu Nov 25, 2021 10:39 am
  • TwistedHusky wrote:Pete did leave us the blueprints for creating a top 5-10 team if we follow it.

    It would be completely counterintuitive and involve a lot of things we hated about our drafts here, but it would likely work.

    You really have to just get lucky on the QB front so the chances of getting another elite QB falls to near zero, something like less than 20% even with the first pick.

    But you could have a great team in 3-5 years if you follow the path Pete laid out. If John stays, I think he could reproduce it if he could manage to hold off the fans after several 'failed' drafts.

    You then need a good coach though. And that is the wildcard, because those like the QB, are tremendously hard to find. You would not want Pete under any circumstance.

    The roadmap is built, whether we follow it or not is another issue.
    One could argue that Pete failed to do what Pete preached.

    1. The minute Pete started to cleanse the team of Wilson doubters, Pete basically turned his back on his own mantra of always compete. He had little credibility left with players.
    2. compound that with failure in recent drafts,
    3. Pete's failure to draft develop or sign FA RBs to run PeteBall.

    I don't think PeteBall was the culprit of our current state, but the failure to sign develop personel to execute PeteBall probably responsible for our misery.

    Sent from my IN2017 using Tapatalk
    toffee
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Re: Any believers left?
Sun Nov 28, 2021 12:44 pm
  • Moving Wilson this offseason will be a priority for the front office in terms of reaping a huge windfall in draft capital. . Pete will probably stay and Jody will do nothing about it is my guess. Wilson costs too much and produces very little in return. And we need to spend this offseason on free agency wisely. Listen to what I say and we will succeed. If a guy like Geno Smith can play 2 nail biters against 2 of the better defenses in the league I like our chances with a guy like Colt McCoy, Geno, Ryan Fitzpatrick if he doesn't retire or trade to Philly for Hurts and picks or.....trade Wilson to the Giants for Mike Glennon and 5 first rounders lol. Sound good?
    ArlosSpecial
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Re: Any believers left?
Sun Nov 28, 2021 1:32 pm
  • Change for change's sake? just so we see something different? how about we wind up jumping from the frying pan, right into the fire.
    I know that there's a hell of a lot of y'all that don't believe that things will get any better until we s#it-can everything, and start all over with someone/anyone other than Pete Carroll, and the FACT is, it's entirely possible that everything winds up in said --S#it-Can. :17:
    scutterhawk
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Re: Any believers left?
Sun Nov 28, 2021 5:05 pm
  • Landing in the right place, at the right time and most importantly in the right program ..........



    .................. we heard lots of noise among Patriot fans including those who wanted Bill's head just a few months ago.

    Guess there is life after Brady after all ...... :229031_shrug: ...... the demise of the Patriots was highly exaggerated.
    Jville
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Re: Any believers left?
Sun Nov 28, 2021 5:54 pm
  • TwistedHusky wrote:Trading Russ for draft picks would be terminally stupid.



    This^^
    John63
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Re: Any believers left?
Sun Nov 28, 2021 6:07 pm
  • ArlosSpecial wrote:Moving Wilson this offseason will be a priority for the front office in terms of reaping a huge windfall in draft capital. . Pete will probably stay and Jody will do nothing about it is my guess. Wilson costs too much and produces very little in return. And we need to spend this offseason on free agency wisely. Listen to what I say and we will succeed. If a guy like Geno Smith can play 2 nail biters against 2 of the better defenses in the league I like our chances with a guy like Colt McCoy, Geno, Ryan Fitzpatrick if he doesn't retire or trade to Philly for Hurts and picks or.....trade Wilson to the Giants for Mike Glennon and 5 first rounders lol. Sound good?


    What? :34853_doh:
    hawkfan68
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Re: Any believers left?
Sun Nov 28, 2021 6:09 pm
  • Absolutely hate the idea of Russ playing for another team but, I do believe a full rebuild is necessary. I voted Fire Pete…appreciate what he’s done but, all good things eventually come to an end.

    Russ has several years left in him and could possibly lead another team to the SB. “Strike while the irons hot” is fitting. If you can still get three firsts, a third, and a quality player or two, do it. With a rebuild in mind, you try to get at least a third for Wagner, a second (maybe a reach) for Lockett. You’re probably screwed with JA. Keep young talent if possible (fairly sure DK would want out though). Build from the lines first, corners next, then LBs. Going to need more LBs than most will admit. I know he is young and perhaps we’ve been spoiled by Wagz and KJ, but Brooks doesn’t look like he’s going to be a “star”. Maybe a bit below average. Keep developing the likes of Lewis, Taylor, etc.. Hopefully Brown recovers and is 100% because that kid can play.

    I’m under the impression that Pete’s had the most influence in the drafts. I have also heard that JS was the driver for folks like Russ, Carson, etc. Personally, I think our draft picks have been subpar in the last several years. Too many picks like LJ and Penny. If we were able to get our hands on all those picks, I’d love to see JS work some magic without overriding power from PC. I don’t have knowledge or specific support of these comments about the Hawks drafts…just what I’ve read on sites such as this one and Field Gulls.

    It’s hard to imagine the Hawks without PC and/or Russ but, I’m convinced this is the way we should go. We can give Russ a bit of justice by sending him to a team & coach that will utilize his strengths, possibly get him a SB or a deep playoff run.

    The first few years results could mirror what we’re seeing now but, the future could be bright. A gamble no doubt but, one I think needs to happen.

    Unfortunately, I’m not the owner and I don’t think she (they) have the cojones to do all of this…
    GemCity
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Re: Any believers left?
Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:44 pm
  • I’d say blow it up. Convince Pete to retire and trade Russ. Let the team suck next year and get a top draft pick slot for 2023. You have to be realistic. It’s going to take 3 years minimum to get competitive again. AZ, and to some extent so does SF, have a leg up and the Rams way find out they are on the downside of things. Just too many holes to plug to realistic challenge for a Stuper Bowl the way things are right now. I wish it was true, but see it happen over and over for decades. Ignoring the issue will not make them go away. Time to address the problems.
    nwHawk
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Re: Any believers left?
Sun Nov 28, 2021 9:04 pm
  • TwistedHusky wrote:Trading Russ makes no sense.

    Let's assume Russ is at fault. You have a 10% chance of him being effective with another coach.

    Why wouldn't you take that?

    10% vs 0% seems pretty reasonable.

    Almost ANY franchise is taking the 'you have a 10% chance at a HOF QB' offer. You know how I know? Because that is essentially your chances when you are the literal #1 pick in the NFL draft and you pick a QB for that slim chance that the QB ends up a star.

    Go look at the #s, one of the best cases is Cam Newton. Another is Luck for the Colts. You don't think they would have traded those results for what Wilson delivered here? And those are some of the best cases.

    So yes, you keep your QB even if you are sure it is his fault, because you have to try with another coach to be certain.

    There is no circumstance where it is worth 1st round picks (you might want to check the success rates on 1st round picks in the NFL btw...because it is not even 50%).

    And there is no circumstance where Pete rebuilds without Wilson unless you rip the team down to the studs/frame.

    Pete could potentially rebuild here but it would take 3-5 years and he would need to lose often in the interim.

    You roll the dice, even on the slim chance, with Wilson because the alternative is nothing. 10% or even 5% chance of success is better than assured failure.



    I recall people taunting a certain NE coach named Bellichik with words like " How is he doing without the franchise QB NOW"? Well look at what HE IS BUILDING, and PC is tearing down and wasting draft picks like they are nothing. PC is clearly a poor coach at this point in his career. The game has passed him by, the players do not listen, and he doesn't have the testicular fortitude to tell talented players like Penny (sorry Lucky Penny I really do and did root for you), stay on the field or you will be cut as soon as he comes off injury list. The same for Carson, who would make a 8 yard run, then wave at the sideline so he could go get something to drink and a couple of lung fulls of O2. THAT IS COACHING.
    jeremiah
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Re: Any believers left?
Sun Nov 28, 2021 9:09 pm
  • Jville wrote:Landing in the right place, at the right time and most importantly in the right program ..........



    .................. we heard lots of noise among Patriot fans including those who wanted Bill's head just a few months ago.

    Guess there is life after Brady after all ...... :229031_shrug: ...... the demise of the Patriots was highly exaggerated.



    The Hawks would be better off with Colt McCoy, a lot of money and draft picks. RW is done D U N....DONE. He is the Donovan McNabb of this generation
    jeremiah
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 29, 2021 6:31 am
  • That's cute ^
    God this place is a joke sometimes. Happy that I rarely stop by these days.
    SoulfishHawk
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 29, 2021 6:42 am
  • I'm at the point where I don't care what the change looks like, I just want to see change that envolves Pete walking. If we got to suffer through a rebuild then so be it. I'm a Cougar, Mariner and old seahawk fan, losing unfortunately comes with the territory here in WA state.
    hawker84
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 29, 2021 6:51 am
  • 2021 sports in Seattle can eff off. Sincerely
    SoulfishHawk
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Re: Any believers left?
Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:32 am
  • Have Pete resign...he'll want to....I think he will after the season....he won't stay for a rebuild.

    Let Russ move on after 10 years.


    Mark my words.
    Vesuve
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