Looking ahead to the biggest matchups vs. Rams (Week 1)

[Hawks46]

I don't doubt that this will be an ugly game for the offense, and our OL will get dominated in a lot of places. That said, if Fisher gets cute and switches Quinn and Long, that would be be best thing for our Tackles.

Okung struggles with really quick edge rushers, to the tune of lots of False Starts to help him keep up. He does, however, own power rushers. I think he would do a great job on Long.

Gilliam would have a tough time with Long, but is built to do better against guys like Quinn. Don't get me wrong, it's still a tough matchup, and Quinn is more talented than Long, but Gilliam flashed well against Justin Houston in his very first start, so I like his matchup with Quinn better than Long.

The only prayer their secondary has against our WRs is getting tons of pressure on Wilson.

"The only prayer their secondary has against our WRS is getting tons of pressure on Wilson".

You've got to be kidding...you got Graham, and a rookie who has never played an NFL game - to add to your self proclaimed worst WR corps in the NFL. And suddenly the Rams secondary needs a prayer to stop it?

Graham has never done anything against us....and that was with Brees throwing him the ball. Lockett might be good, but that remains to be seen. And it's foolish to put that much stock in a rookie playing his first career game. Every match up at every level for both teams is won by the defense in this game.

It's going to come down to special teams and turnovers.

Funny, Tate and Baldwin have done ok against you in the past, and we still have Baldwin. We have Matthews, who is 6'5" and tore up the Patriots secondary in the SB, and their secondary was by FAR more highly rated than yours. If you have a bunch of 5'10" and 5'11" CBs (which you do), Matthews is going to abuse them. I don't put stock in the preseason, so I'm not counting Lockett outside of returns.

So, tell me, who exactly do you have in the secondary that is so good, so shut down ? Don't tell me Jenkins, he typically doesn't cover against us well, and has a decent amount of penalties. Graham is playing in a different offense where he isn't necessarily the primary option, so that makes it tougher to cover. And if you have to double him, it pulls a guy out of the box against Lynch, which is what makes Graham so deadly; he didn't have a running game in NO.

If Wilson gets time (he won't) he's going to have a minimum of 250 yards passing against you guys. Book it.

 

[12thbrah]

Despite the pass rush Russell balled out last season in St Louis. 300 yards passing and 100 yards rushing. The only reason St Louis pulled out the fake punt in the end is because Jeff Fisher didn't want the ball back in Wilson's hands because at that point they could do nothing to stop him.

 

[Ramfan128]

I don't doubt that this will be an ugly game for the offense, and our OL will get dominated in a lot of places. That said, if Fisher gets cute and switches Quinn and Long, that would be be best thing for our Tackles.

Okung struggles with really quick edge rushers, to the tune of lots of False Starts to help him keep up. He does, however, own power rushers. I think he would do a great job on Long.

Gilliam would have a tough time with Long, but is built to do better against guys like Quinn. Don't get me wrong, it's still a tough matchup, and Quinn is more talented than Long, but Gilliam flashed well against Justin Houston in his very first start, so I like his matchup with Quinn better than Long.

The only prayer their secondary has against our WRs is getting tons of pressure on Wilson.

"The only prayer their secondary has against our WRS is getting tons of pressure on Wilson".

You've got to be kidding...you got Graham, and a rookie who has never played an NFL game - to add to your self proclaimed worst WR corps in the NFL. And suddenly the Rams secondary needs a prayer to stop it?

Graham has never done anything against us....and that was with Brees throwing him the ball. Lockett might be good, but that remains to be seen. And it's foolish to put that much stock in a rookie playing his first career game. Every match up at every level for both teams is won by the defense in this game.

It's going to come down to special teams and turnovers.

Funny, Tate and Baldwin have done ok against you in the past, and we still have Baldwin. We have Matthews, who is 6'5" and tore up the Patriots secondary in the SB, and their secondary was by FAR more highly rated than yours. If you have a bunch of 5'10" and 5'11" CBs (which you do), Matthews is going to abuse them. I don't put stock in the preseason, so I'm not counting Lockett outside of returns.

So, tell me, who exactly do you have in the secondary that is so good, so shut down ? Don't tell me Jenkins, he typically doesn't cover against us well, and has a decent amount of penalties. Graham is playing in a different offense where he isn't necessarily the primary option, so that makes it tougher to cover. And if you have to double him, it pulls a guy out of the box against Lynch, which is what makes Graham so deadly; he didn't have a running game in NO.

If Wilson gets time (he won't) he's going to have a minimum of 250 yards passing against you guys. Book it.

Tate isn't on the team - I've said that I think Baldwin is a good WR.

Jenkins had one bad game against Seattle....really one bad play. He's good but he's not "shut down". My comment was more geared toward your receiving corps rather than our secondary. At worst our secondary is average; and all offseason all I heard from Hawks fans was how bad your WR corps is. It gets to game time and now it's not that bad?

It seems like anyone arguing that Wilson is great downs the WRs, while anyone arguing the team is great talks the WRs up a little bit.

Wilson's good game last year came while our defense was horrific. His 2nd game against us is more of what you should expect. Defense was much better as the year went on, and I think it was a product of being in a new system and the time it took to adjust. People talk about the pass rush in that game - there was none. That's why Wilson tore us up. Our pass rush didn't really break out until at SF last year - which was game 8. The first 7 games we barely touched the QB, and our defense in general was very very bad.


I agree that he will get 250 yards if he gets time...it's usually bad when you don't pressure an NFL QB.

 

[hawknation2015]

Tate isn't on the team - I've said that I think Baldwin is a good WR.

Jenkins had one bad game against Seattle....really one bad play. He's good but he's not "shut down". My comment was more geared toward your receiving corps rather than our secondary. At worst our secondary is average; and all offseason all I heard from Hawks fans was how bad your WR corps is. It gets to game time and now it's not that bad?

It seems like anyone arguing that Wilson is great downs the WRs, while anyone arguing the team is great talks the WRs up a little bit.

Wilson's good game last year came while our defense was horrific. His 2nd game against us is more of what you should expect. Defense was much better as the year went on, and I think it was a product of being in a new system and the time it took to adjust. People talk about the pass rush in that game - there was none. That's why Wilson tore us up. Our pass rush didn't really break out until at SF last year - which was game 8. The first 7 games we barely touched the QB, and our defense in general was very very bad.


I agree that he will get 250 yards if he gets time...it's usually bad when you don't pressure an NFL QB.

Thanks for the insights, Ramfan128. It's always nice to hear the perspective of a rival fan. I agree with your sentiments about the Rams secondary.

As a fan base, we have been incredibly impressed with Tyler Lockett this preseason. In three months, I think he has a chance to be considered the best WR on the roster.

IMO, the best way to attack your defense through the air is to use Graham outside at Split End. He has the same athletic ability as Mike Williams, who was the last player to have a 100-target season for the Seahawks.

Such a move would provide so many potential benefits to this offense. Graham's weakness as an in-line blocker would suddenly become a strength, when faced off against secondary players rather than defensive linemen.

Russell would have a clearer sight to Graham outside, as he sometimes has trouble seeing open receivers over the middle. It's a win-win strategy that is totally consistent with the philosophy of this team. I would start Luke Willson at TE and let him develop as an in-line blocker.

What do you think are some of the biggest matchups (or mismatches) in this upcoming game? There are so many that it's hard to remember them all.

 

[chris98251]

I see the biggest mismatch being more Seahawks fans in St Louis then Rams fans.

 

[SuperMan28]

Yeah, the match ups can be flipped in several areas. The trenches, mainly.

You won't see TJ McDonald matched up with Jimmy a whole lot in man, if that's what you were referring to. James Laurinits does really well covering TE's and so does Ogletree. Those two struggle with tackling, really. James doesn't slip off tackes like Ofletree but he doesn't always stop them in their tracks.

Containing Russell Wilson and Lynch is always priority #1 when playing the Seahawks. The defense is gonna send a lot of pressure. I know Donald has looked superb in Preseson. If they can get pressure with just 4 and randomly send guys like Ayers, Barron, and Joyner, it'll be tough.

A key match up for me is Robinson Vs Bennette. Straight up, Robinson can't block him 1 on 1. He's gonna need constant help. Robinson has looked aweful in Preseson. I hope that's not the case now.

Rob Havenstein has had his struggles, too. Got beat badly against the Colts on one play where he completely whiffed on a lower-tier player. It was awful, but he is just a rookie.

Jamon Brown and Saffold have been the only consistent bright spots on the OL. Saffold is doing that hurt thing still, though. Hear as I know the OL is healthy, which is rare.

Expect several screens and plays to Tavon and Cook. Boy it would be nice to get Tavon going. Hopefully Frank Cignetti doesn't have a brain fart every week when figuring out how to use him. That was a huge problem with Schotty. Just get him the ball in space some way, some how. Running him between the tackles was just aweful on so many levels. :x

 

[hawknation2015]

Yeah, the match ups can be flipped in several areas. The trenches, mainly.

You won't see TJ McDonald matched up with Jimmy a whole lot in man, if that's what you were referring to. James Laurinits does really well covering TE's and so does Ogletree. Those two struggle with tackling, really. James doesn't slip off tackes like Ofletree but he doesn't always stop them in their tracks.

Containing Russell Wilson and Lynch is always priority #1 when playing the Seahawks. The defense is gonna send a lot of pressure. I know Donald has looked superb in Preseson. If they can get pressure with just 4 and randomly send guys like Ayers, Barron, and Joyner, it'll be tough.

A key match up for me is Robinson Vs Bennette. Straight up, Robinson can't block him 1 on 1. He's gonna need constant help. Robinson has looked aweful in Preseson. I hope that's not the case now.

Rob Havenstein has had his struggles, too. Got beat badly against the Colts on one play where he completely whiffed on a lower-tier player. It was awful, but he is just a rookie.

Jamon Brown and Saffold have been the only consistent bright spots on the OL. Saffold is doing that hurt thing still, though. Hear as I know the OL is healthy, which is rare.

Expect several screens and plays to Tavon and Cook. Boy it would be nice to get Tavon going. Hopefully Frank Cignetti doesn't have a brain fart every week when figuring out how to use him. That was a huge problem with Schotty. Just get him the ball in space some way, some how. Running him between the tackles was just aweful on so many levels. :x

Thanks for your thoughts.

Was there much discussion about Quinn and Long switching spots in that 3rd preseason game? I don't think Quinn played in the 4th game. Do you personally expect Quinn to see more snaps at LDE than he has in previous seasons?

 

[Hasselbeck]

Of course, our OC is Darryl Bevell, so who knows what we'll see?

All jet sweeps. All the time.

He'll be mixing in plenty of bubble screens to Ricardo. You can also count on lots of empty backfield sets on 3rd and 2.

ukeface:

You guys are all wrong.

Jet sweeps to Jimmy Graham. They'll never see it coming

 

[Hawks46]

Yeah, the match ups can be flipped in several areas. The trenches, mainly.

You won't see TJ McDonald matched up with Jimmy a whole lot in man, if that's what you were referring to. James Laurinits does really well covering TE's and so does Ogletree. Those two struggle with tackling, really. James doesn't slip off tackes like Ofletree but he doesn't always stop them in their tracks.

Containing Russell Wilson and Lynch is always priority #1 when playing the Seahawks. The defense is gonna send a lot of pressure. I know Donald has looked superb in Preseson. If they can get pressure with just 4 and randomly send guys like Ayers, Barron, and Joyner, it'll be tough.

A key match up for me is Robinson Vs Bennette. Straight up, Robinson can't block him 1 on 1. He's gonna need constant help. Robinson has looked aweful in Preseson. I hope that's not the case now.

Rob Havenstein has had his struggles, too. Got beat badly against the Colts on one play where he completely whiffed on a lower-tier player. It was awful, but he is just a rookie.

Jamon Brown and Saffold have been the only consistent bright spots on the OL. Saffold is doing that hurt thing still, though. Hear as I know the OL is healthy, which is rare.

Expect several screens and plays to Tavon and Cook. Boy it would be nice to get Tavon going. Hopefully Frank Cignetti doesn't have a brain fart every week when figuring out how to use him. That was a huge problem with Schotty. Just get him the ball in space some way, some how. Running him between the tackles was just aweful on so many levels. :x

Good insight, thanks.

For the record, I go by what I see on the field and personnel match ups, not what fans say on message boards. That said, there is a definite group think that our WRs are much better than last year's. Unless you guys have gotten taller in the secondary, your CBs last year were both 5'11", and Matthews (6'5") tore up 5'11" CBs last year in his last game. We'll have to see consistency, but if Wilson trusts his receivers, he'll throw it up to them (Tate, Kearse) and if that happens, Matthews is going to win a lot of contested catches. This is important because:

Your DL is going to own our OL. I think our OL overall is better than yours is shaping up to be, but it consists of 3 new guys (well, 1 guy isn't new, just new to the position) and that is going to be a steep learning curve. The reason we will probably run the ball better than usual is Graham. If we split him out to peel a LB out of the box, it's going to be a mismatch with 6 in the box. Put a Safety on Graham and he will roast him. Graham will also force single coverage on Baldwin. Wilson is going to need time to find Baldwin, but he will be open. He was getting open on Revis.

I think our DL will own your OL. This is going to be the usual street fight down there. The biggest difference is that our ST looks VERY sharp compared to last year, so we've improved in this area. Also, the Rams have relied on the ST trick play the last few times to get wins and that only goes so far.

 

[SalishHawkFan]

Great post. Thanks for the great read :th2thumbs:

 

[HawKnPeppa]

Very good write-up, but I think we're hanging on to hope and prayer as far as the O-line in week one. Talk about baptism by fire. I espect to see a bunch of quick-hit type plays drawn up early on to keep them honest, and I think we go about 60/40 or higher running vs. passing this game. Let Russell get out on some roll-outs to hit guys like Graham and Matthews down field, push Baldwin and Lockett into the flat in the intermediate range, give russell some options out there.

Of course, our OC is Darryl Bevell, so who knows what we'll see?

Bevell has not shown the abilty to come up with a decent short-to-intermediate passing game plan.

 

[HawKnPeppa]

Of course, our OC is Darryl Bevell, so who knows what we'll see?

All jet sweeps. All the time.

He'll be mixing in plenty of bubble screens to Ricardo. You can also count on lots of empty backfield sets on 3rd and 2.

I don't agree.

 

[HawKnPeppa]

If Wilson gets time (he won't) he's going to have a minimum of 250 yards passing against you guys. Book it.

Hahaha! If he has time... he won't, but if he does. [emoji12]

 

[ivotuk]

Fabulous post, and some great responses. THanks everyone for putting in the time, I always learn something here. :th2thumbs:

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

Fabulous post, and some great responses. THanks everyone for putting in the time, I always learn something here. :th2thumbs:

I'll bet you didn't learn anything new about Bevell though. I figure you are already in tune with empty backfields on 3rd and 2, bubble screens to Lockette, play action on 3rd and 14, etc.

 

[Azul e Oro]

Hi All,
Rams fan since the early 70s, longtime member at ClanRam. What a great thread. Good to be talking about real football again, isn't it ?!

I noticed the Quinn switch to RDE for a series in the last preseason game, too, but I suspect it was more about evaluating/getting work for back-ups at LDE. Still, DC Gregg Williams is nothing if not cuckoo for cleaning QB clocks so anything is possible. I hope they'll stick to the containment strategy that I think is a sound approach .Not sayin' RW can't play from the pocket ,just the lesser evil,imo. They'll blitz the snot out of the Hawks OL, esp the new RT and the interior in general, but Long and Quinn need to be disciplined on the edge , not headhunting.( If Long is healthy; he had a back issue in TC/Pre.... Brockers & Fairley have also missed time in TC/Pre,fyi).Quinn was strong in run support as pre went on but quieter than you'd like vs the QB. But the starting DEs going sackless won't necessarily be a telling stat in a loss, anymore than several apiece would indicate a probable win,imo. Akeem Ayers,who took Dunbar's spot at OLB, & Mark Barron at safety are guys I'd watch for as blitzers.

As you noted, The Rams have been solid vs TEs ,inc JG a couple of years ago. He's undoubtedly a playmaker but he and RW didn't seem quite in sync in Pre on the few plays I saw them try to connect.No doubt, much of his package is under wraps. Thanks for the Davis tackle loop. Makes me laugh & cringe every time I watch it.Poor Laverne was never quite the same after TJ (TugJob) McDonald um....manhandled him, was he ?! As others have noted, several Rams may cover Graham & have a record of being effective in the role, but he's a physically-imposing beast who usually comes down with the jump ball if given the chance. A wildcard, for sure. If he has the feisty but tiny Joyner on him in the slot, The Rams are in deep doo-doo.Still, someone I'll worry more about in the second game.

The interior line battles will be the crux of the matter,imo, as is so often the case.The story of The Rams DL and OL is a tale of two starkly different sack cities that are perhaps not quite what you'd expect from the brochure. Donald looks primed, but both Brockers and Fairley have missed practice & game reps. The unit is deep but it's a concern,truth be told.

The OL isn't the disaster you claim,imo, but a work in progress ,nonetheless.Dunno about pressures but 12 sacks ?! According to nfldotcom, Foles was sacked 3 times, the other 3 QBs,once each,iirc.Too much experimentation on the OL at the expense of building cohesion for my taste. At least they seem to have the right combo at last,imo, except for center which remains a mysterious worry..I had my doubts about Foles but his touch/accuracy & functional mobility have shown to be better than I'd hoped & so far he's been progressing well , completing over 69% of his passes in pre, despite what has admittedly been a messy pocket at times. One bad pick, the other clanged off a WR's hands.Some nice improv, a good deep ball or two. The Rams will need Napoleon Dynamite to bring his best moves to compensate for what is definitely a weakness this early on & I agree it could be a key factor this Sunday; the projected starting OL has never played a snap together in the same positions & are woefully short on game experience in general. The upside to this group over last year's is a noticeable improvement in both size/strength, and athleticism. The Rams showed very little of new OC Cignetti's scheme in pre except a marked improvement at pressure-relieving screens,etc, largely because of effective 2nd level blocking by the OL. Straight-up 3-5 step drop pass pro was a crapshoot but better than the debacle the OP seems to imply.

Which team compensates best for missing/status unknown
key players may be the shadow match-up of the day; there are several guys on both sides I could name but let's call it Kam-less vs Tre-less for simplicity's sake.Then, of course, there are the wildcards like Tavon and Tyler L., STs trickeration, turnovers, yada-yada. The usual tense affair with the winner scoring in the high teens, low twenties,imo.

 

[hawknation2015]

Hi All,
Rams fan since the early 70s, longtime member at ClanRam. What a great thread. Good to be talking about real football again, isn't it ?!

I noticed the Quinn switch to RDE for a series in the last preseason game, too, but I suspect it was more about evaluating/getting work for back-ups at LDE. Still, DC Gregg Williams is nothing if not cuckoo for cleaning QB clocks so anything is possible. I hope they'll stick to the containment strategy that I think is a sound approach .Not sayin' RW can't play from the pocket ,just the lesser evil,imo. They'll blitz the snot out of the Hawks OL, esp the new RT and the interior in general, but Long and Quinn need to be disciplined on the edge , not headhunting.( If Long is healthy; he had a back issue in TC/Pre.... Brockers & Fairley have also missed time in TC/Pre,fyi).Quinn was strong in run support as pre went on but quieter than you'd like vs the QB. But the starting DEs going sackless won't necessarily be a telling stat in a loss, anymore than several apiece would indicate a probable win,imo. Akeem Ayers,who took Dunbar's spot at OLB, & Mark Barron at safety are guys I'd watch for as blitzers.

As you noted, The Rams have been solid vs TEs ,inc JG a couple of years ago. He's undoubtedly a playmaker but he and RW didn't seem quite in sync in Pre on the few plays I saw them try to connect.No doubt, much of his package is under wraps. Thanks for the Davis tackle loop. Makes me laugh & cringe every time I watch it.Poor Laverne was never quite the same after TJ (TugJob) McDonald um....manhandled him, was he ?! As others have noted, several Rams may cover Graham & have a record of being effective in the role, but he's a physically-imposing beast who usually comes down with the jump ball if given the chance. A wildcard, for sure. If he has the feisty but tiny Joyner on him in the slot, The Rams are in deep doo-doo.Still, someone I'll worry more about in the second game.

The interior line battles will be the crux of the matter,imo, as is so often the case.The story of The Rams DL and OL is a tale of two starkly different sack cities that are perhaps not quite what you'd expect from the brochure. Donald looks primed, but both Brockers and Fairley have missed practice & game reps. The unit is deep but it's a concern,truth be told.

The OL isn't the disaster you claim,imo, but a work in progress ,nonetheless.Dunno about pressures but 12 sacks ?! According to nfldotcom, Foles was sacked 3 times, the other 3 QBs,once each,iirc.Too much experimentation on the OL at the expense of building cohesion for my taste. At least they seem to have the right combo at last,imo, except for center which remains a mysterious worry..I had my doubts about Foles but his touch/accuracy & functional mobility have shown to be better than I'd hoped & so far he's been progressing well , completing over 69% of his passes in pre, despite what has admittedly been a messy pocket at times. One bad pick, the other clanged off a WR's hands.Some nice improv, a good deep ball or two. The Rams will need Napoleon Dynamite to bring his best moves to compensate for what is definitely a weakness this early on & I agree it could be a key factor this Sunday; the projected starting OL has never played a snap together in the same positions & are woefully short on game experience in general. The upside to this group over last year's is a noticeable improvement in both size/strength, and athleticism. The Rams showed very little of new OC Cignetti's scheme in pre except a marked improvement at pressure-relieving screens,etc, largely because of effective 2nd level blocking by the OL. Straight-up 3-5 step drop pass pro was a crapshoot but better than the debacle the OP seems to imply.

Which team compensates best for missing/status unknown
key players may be the shadow match-up of the day; there are several guys on both sides I could name but let's call it Kam-less vs Tre-less for simplicity's sake.Then, of course, there are the wildcards like Tavon and Tyler L., STs trickeration, turnovers, yada-yada. The usual tense affair with the winner scoring in the high teens, low twenties,imo.

Thanks for your insights! I did notice when Quinn was playing LDE, Chris Long was playing RDE, which he hasn't down much.

 

[hawknation2015]

Seahawks.com's Three Key Matchups for Seahawks at Rams:
http://www.seahawks.com/news/2015/09/11 ... hawks-rams

1. An inexperienced offensive line vs. a great defensive line.
-They combined all of these possible individual matchups into one.

2. A new Rams quarterback vs. a new-look L.O.B.
-How Foles' handles our pressure is of greater interest to me.

3. Jimmy Graham vs. whoever is covering him.
-Again, I think T.J. McDonald is their best matchup of size, speed, and coverage ability against Graham.

 

[hawknation2015]

It looks like Benny Cunningham will get the start at RB for the Rams. Todd Gurley has officially been ruled out for Sunday. Tre Mason has not practiced all week while recovering from a hamstring injury.

Cunningham is most famous for being "posterized" by Earl Thomas's incredible TD-saving karate chop:

Cunningham, a stalky 5'10, is a former track guy who has been timed in the 4.3-range in the 40, though he only ran a 4.51 at his Pro Day due to a knee injury. He was one of the Top 5 best kickoff returners in the league last season.

Cunningham had a somewhat quiet preseason as a RB, running for only 33 yards on 14 carries (2.4 yards per carry) with no TDs. He had 66 carries for 246 yards (3.7 yards per carry) with 3 TDs during the 2014 season. He had two lost fumbles in two consecutive games to end the season, including Thomas's chop. Excellent hands as a receiver out of the backfield.

Here, Cunningham powered in a shovel pass for a TD in their Week 7 victory:


Built kind of like Robert Turbin, he is better as a receiver in space than he is running through the tackles. Though he did have a nice run here against us in Week 17:

Another nice run by Cunningham through a big hole up the middle (against the Eagles):

In addition to Cunningham, the Rams have Isaiah Pead (5'10, 204, 4.47 40, missed 2014 due to an ACL injury) and Chase Reynolds (6'0, 204, 4.60 40, zero career carries). They traded away Zac Stacy a few months ago for a 7th Round pick.

 

[hawknation2015]

Here was Cunningham's season-high 75-yard kickoff return against the Seahawks:

If you take a look at the coaches' film, you can see what happened here:


It appears Ricardo Lockette was responsible for the outside lane, but he is easily re-directed onto the sideline and around the returner. Earl Thomas takes the inside lane, which I am left to assume was by design, but was blocked out of the play. Kevin Pierre-Louis missed the initial tackle, and Jermaine Kearse is left to save us from the TD.