Not sure about this math...

[Osprey]

How is Sherman a free agent bargain at this rate? Assuming he's retained next year that's an average of 13 per year which would translate to top 10 money.

Given last years mediocre performance t's easy to make an argument that SF will only be getting two productive years IF he performs next year. Doesn't seem like any kind of bargain to me.

Signed a three-year, $39 million contract in March 2018.

The contract Sherman signed with the 49ers after his release by the Seahawks stirred some controversy, since he represented himself, and some critics thought he might have done better with an agent. San Francisco could have easily moved on from the veteran after a subpar 2018 season, his first since suffering an Achilles tear in Seattle, with Sherman logging a career-low four passes defensed and zero picks. However, neither side is complaining right now, with Sherman providing top-tier play -- 35 tackles, nine passes defensed, three picks and one score through nine games -- and leadership for a franchise that is dominating on defense and allows him twice annual chances for revenge against the Seahawks.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...haquil-barrett-among-top-free-agency-bargains

 

[Popeyejones]

How is Sherman a free agent bargain at this rate? Assuming he's retained next year that's an average of 13 per year which would translate to top 10 money.

Given last years mediocre performance t's easy to make an argument that SF will only be getting two productive years IF he performs next year. Doesn't seem like any kind of bargain to me.

It's confusing because all your numbers are way off.

He's paid this year to be an average #1 CB (17th highest paid CB in the league; 24th highest paid player in the secondary in the NFL), and instead he's graded as the 9th best secondary player (CBs, slot CBs, and safeties) in the entire NFL so far (IIRC he's 4 or 6 for CBs).

Last year he didn't grade out nearly as well on a per target basis, but in 16 games he only gave up 25 receptions: teams completed 1.5 passes on him per game. Last year he was also the 28th highest paid CB in the league, so basically he was paid as if he was one of the worst #1 CBs in the league (and he absolutely wasn't).

Next year he'll be the 18th highest paid CB in the league (although he'll likely end up lower than that w/ new contracts).

So far he has been great value (also worth noting that the younger guys who have been balling out -- Moseley and Witherspoon have also given a lot of credit for that to help from Sherman).

I know the relationship between him and the Seahawks was acrimonious after the Hawks cut him (although that's basically true of all of their defensive stars that they cut), but honestly, he's been a hell of a player and a hell of a teammate on the 49ers so far. A lot of 9ers fans LOVED to hate to Sherman, and I don't know *any* 9ers fans who haven't been won over by him at this point.

 

[Osprey]

So is the 39 mil not correct? Does it include incentives he hasn't/won't achieve?

 

[Popeyejones]

I'm just going off of Over The Cap which is the actual contract and its contract structure.

I really don't know what of the initial reported 39 million was funny money (although all initially reported contracts have a lot of that).

If you want my personal opinion though, I don't think of it as a "great value" contract, as that uses hindsight to ignore all the risk that was built into it (GTD money, an older player coming off of an achilles injury).

TBH I think it's a *very fair* contract: Sherman's outplaying it, but you gotta calculate in the risk cost at time of signing of him WILDLY under-performing it (i.e. when you pay an older injured player to be the 15th best or so player at his position there's not much higher that he can go in terms of performance, but he can go MUCH, MUCH, MUCH lower in performance).

FWIW he's never mentioned the contract or feeling underpaid, although I suppose he definitely could at some point.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

He played back a lot in that game. Is that something they have been doing with him all year? Just curious. I'm so used to him being up on a guy and jamming him at the line. He was playing 10 yards back or almost like a safety on quite a few plays.

 

[Jville]

So is the 39 mil not correct? Does it include incentives he hasn't/won't achieve?

So the answer to your question lies in the quotes below ..............................

Richard Sherman signed a three year, $27.15 million contract

Sherman can earn up to $4 million a year in incentives which would maximize the contract at $39.15 million. The incentives are $1 million for 90% playtime, $1 million for being named to the Pro Bowl, and $2 million for being named to the All Pro team.

Here is a convenient link to Richard's OTC page >>> [urltargetblank]https://overthecap.com/player/richard-sherman/1565/[/urltargetblank]

In my eyes, the Sherman contract was fair and accommodating of the risk associated with a player recovering from injury. It averaged a little under $9 million a year (before incentives). With projected cap costs (before incentives) of $9,800,000 in 2019 and $10,005,000 in 2020.

 

[xray]

a thread on Sherman's $$...so this matters to U ?

 

[Maulbert]

a thread on Sherman's $$...so this matters to U ?

He wasn't taking issue with Sherman's pay, he was questioning the writer of an article's logic in calling him a bargain. No need to jump on him. If you don't care, don't respond.

 

[Marvin49]

I'm just going off of Over The Cap which is the actual contract and its contract structure.

I really don't know what of the initial reported 39 million was funny money (although all initially reported contracts have a lot of that).

If you want my personal opinion though, I don't think of it as a "great value" contract, as that uses hindsight to ignore all the risk that was built into it (GTD money, an older player coming off of an achilles injury).

TBH I think it's a *very fair* contract: Sherman's outplaying it, but you gotta calculate in the risk cost at time of signing of him WILDLY under-performing it (i.e. when you pay an older injured player to be the 15th best or so player at his position there's not much higher that he can go in terms of performance, but he can go MUCH, MUCH, MUCH lower in performance).

FWIW he's never mentioned the contract or feeling underpaid, although I suppose he definitely could at some point.

He's also not paying and agent.

 

[Marvin49]

So is the 39 mil not correct? Does it include incentives he hasn't/won't achieve?

So the answer to your question lies in the quotes below ..............................

Richard Sherman signed a three year, $27.15 million contract

Sherman can earn up to $4 million a year in incentives which would maximize the contract at $39.15 million. The incentives are $1 million for 90% playtime, $1 million for being named to the Pro Bowl, and $2 million for being named to the All Pro team.

Here is a convenient link to Richard's OTC page >>> [urltargetblank]https://overthecap.com/player/richard-sherman/1565/[/urltargetblank]

In my eyes, the Sherman contract was fair and accommodating of the risk associated with a player recovering from injury. It averaged a little under $9 million a year (before incentives). With projected cap costs (before incentives) of $9,800,000 in 2019 and $10,005,000 in 2020.

He also gave Seattle a chance to match it and spoke with the Lions as well.

Nobody hated Sherm more than I did in 2012-2013, but aside from the way he's played on the field, he's been incredible for the young DBs on the team and the attitude of the entire D.

 

[chris98251]

Sherm was betting on himself and won, logic says a veteran of his mileage coming back and being what he was before the injury or incurring another is higher and that's what the front office here saw as well as the amount of resources needed to manage his personality and media appearances and it's effects. It's also a contract that won't break the 49ers that he could see the end of unlike many where players get cut on the bubble year.

 

[Osprey]

Wasn't meant to be a dig on Sherm. Appreciated what he accomplished here even if he did let the SB loss turn into a cancer.

Only brought it up because the other guys on the list looked like super bargains and Sherm's just looks like a fairly even deal.

 

[2_0_6]

Gotta give the man his kudos from coming back from those injuries at his age the way he has

 

[Jac]

What happens next year? Won't he/49ers be in a pretty similar situation as he/Seahawks recently were? (aside from the personal acrimony angle) Would he actually play out the last year of his contract...or will he be looking to renegotiate? With his performance and that defense, he's got a pretty strong case. However, maybe he wants to gamble on himself one more time, and get a post-lockout contract...

 

[Seahawkfan80]

I'm just going off of Over The Cap which is the actual contract and its contract structure.

I really don't know what of the initial reported 39 million was funny money (although all initially reported contracts have a lot of that).

If you want my personal opinion though, I don't think of it as a "great value" contract, as that uses hindsight to ignore all the risk that was built into it (GTD money, an older player coming off of an achilles injury).

TBH I think it's a *very fair* contract: Sherman's outplaying it, but you gotta calculate in the risk cost at time of signing of him WILDLY under-performing it (i.e. when you pay an older injured player to be the 15th best or so player at his position there's not much higher that he can go in terms of performance, but he can go MUCH, MUCH, MUCH lower in performance).

FWIW he's never mentioned the contract or feeling underpaid, although I suppose he definitely could at some point.

He's also not paying and agent.

He is earning that and more in dividends by being a mentor and coach to the other defenders on his team. Teaching is paying off heavily on your team. Experience and teaching thru experience and all the video proof of what he is teaching pays off. Millions are only zeros..but Proof is in the pudding and you got a lot of pudding there and it is paying off.

 

[olyfan63]

Sherman is a super-smart AND a Narcissist PD type of guy. I think he's a bargain for SF. By all accounts he IS mentoring the younger DBs. He is absolutely sincere and dedicated in that mentoring. As the flavor of Narcissist he is, in his worldview, when his efforts in improving others show visible fruit, when his mentees show up big and play well, that improvement, also reflects his own greatness.

I don't have a problem with it and I'm not intending my characterization of Sherman as a Narcissistic PD guy as an insult. He backs it up with his play most of the time. His nature makes his words and actions a bit predictable. His sincere desire, yea, *commitment*, to improve others is a positive reflection of that trait. He also works his ass off to be able to back up his self-image of himself as the greatest.

That said, Sherman had perhaps a 3-year bitter pout after the SB loss. When others disappointed him, and pooped on his moment, his opportunity, the legacy he wanted to be his media storyline, he was bitter for a long time and criticized those he blamed, and became a cancer. Sherman wanted his career storyline to be as part of the Seattle SB48 and SB49 Dynasty, leader of the Legion of Boom, winner, champion, all-around eternal greatness. The change of scenery to SF was the best thing for him, to claim a new narrative. It's still very much within his grasp, with the Niners looking strong enough to make a SB run this year and possibly next year too. Woe be unto JimmyG, the emerging weak link, if he fails Sherman on this one. As I said, Sherman is super-smart, and a Narcissist, and one thing they LOVE is to kill 17 birds with one stone, to hell with only 2. If SF goes on a multi-SB run, with Sherman a big part, playing well, he will have his legacy. He will also be able to thumb his nose at his former team, which he may or may not do publicly; his own emotional satisfaction will probably be enough. Plus, as a winner/champion, it would be unbecoming his greatness to engage further in publicly pooping on his former mates. As I said, Sherman is super-smart.

Whatever the math, in the relevant range we're talking about, Sherman is outplaying his contract, helping make others better, and is a bargain signing for the Niners.

 

[bigskydoc]

I know a lot of fans disagree with me, and I don't want to rehash it here, but I thought the loss of Sherman was a mistake.

There is no doubt in my mind that our secondary would be vastly superior if he was here. He would have taken this crop of DBs under his wing, and brought them up to another level.

He's an emotional guy, but he is playing a role, just like a professional wrestler. Loved or hated, but never ignored. There is no such thing as bad publicity. I have no idea who the real Sherman is, anymore than I know who most of these guys are in real life. I do know that he is a marketing genius.

I once made a meme with his picture, and the word's, "It's not hubris unless I fail." I think it held true. He had a mouth, but he backed it up with his play. He used his emotions and words to make himself a household name across the league. He seems to have mellowed with age, but maybe it has more to do with achieving what he needed to achieve, and no longer needing to play that part.

Did he cross the line with the coaching staff? Absolutely. Were his criticisms valid? Absolutely. He couldn't exactly go advocating for the firing of the worst offensive line coach in team history, but I wonder if his criticisms may have lodged in Carroll's brain, and helped him see how Cable was destroying the team.

I think he has a long career ahead of him as a player representative. Whether that is with the NFLPA, or in some other capacity, I'm not sure. I'm also not sure he has a contemporary that is as devoted to helping out other players.

 

[olyfan63]

Bigskydoc nailed it as usual, re Sherman.

The Pro Wrestler "Kayfabe" analogy is a great one, and so applicable here. The public Richard Sherman plays a character.

I honestly don't know that if Sherman stayed in Seattle that it would have gone well. Maybe your scenario, maybe not. Actually, probably your scenario. Sherman would have made a big production about "rededicating" himself, mending fences, and so forth, and then gone about his business professionally behind the scenes.

The whole thing was awkward with his nasty achilles injury. The guy gives his body for the team, and the team bails on him? That's one view of how it came across, not necessarily my view.