Saleh on the Seattle way of DEF and changing NFL landscape.

[Spin Doctor]

https://twitter.com/_andrewcallahan/sta ... 76196?s=21

Really interesting bit by Saleh on the Seahawks cover 3 system and how Kyle Shanahan found a way to crack it. He also talks about the evolving nature of the current NFL.

Saleh also talking about how he had to adjust his scheme to find success on the 49ers:

https://ninernoise.com/2021/01/15/sf-49 ... g-ny-jets/

Apparently Quinn has also moved on to a more Cover 1 heavy system from the Cover 3 base.

 

[hawkfan68]

This piece is very telling on the current state of the Seahawk defense -

"One of the problems with Seattle’s Cover 3-like defense is it was designed to essentially stack the box with eight defenders regularly, thereby relying on the pure one-on-one coverage skills of top-level defensive backs. The Seahawks’ former “Legion of Boom” had those players, including current SF 49ers cornerback Richard Sherman, who were all elite in one way or another. As the NFL continued its transition away from a high-number of run-heavy teams towards a more pass-happy league, Cover 3 defenses became obsolete.

Especially if teams didn’t have the back-end talent to make it work."

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Hasn't stopped Russ and the Hawks beating Santa Clara 16 of the last 20 meetings. Yeah, totally figured out.

 

[HawkinNY]

Hasn't stopped Russ and the Hawks beating Santa Clare 16 of the last 20 meetings. Yeah, totally figured out.

Yea I was thinking he hasn’t really figured it out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Now our current defense?? Different conversation........ouch

 

[Sgt. Largent]

You could say this about any defensive scheme, if you don't have the personnel to run it well, then it's going to fail.

So have the Hawks play whatever scheme you want, cover 3, cover 2, cover 4, Bear 46, press man in a 3-4 or 4-3 base.

Doesn't matter when most of your players stink, especially your corners, and D-line that can't get pressure.

Add in the fact that it's VERY apparent that our coaches are having a hard time getting all these moving parts and players on the defensive side of the ball to communicate and be in the proper zones and positions.......and VOILA, you've got yourself the 32nd ranked defense in the league.

 

[Chapow]

https://twitter.com/_andrewcallahan/status/1450923784429576196?s=21

Really interesting bit by Saleh on the Seahawks cover 3 system and how Kyle Shanahan found a way to crack it. He also talks about the evolving nature of the current NFL.

Saleh also talking about how he had to adjust his scheme to find success on the 49ers:

https://ninernoise.com/2021/01/15/sf-49 ... g-ny-jets/

Apparently Quinn has also moved on to a more Cover 1 heavy system from the Cover 3 base.

I've found it pretty interesting how much love Quinn and that Dallas defense are getting this year. I mean, I get that they have generated a lot of turnovers, but aside from that, they really aren't very good. Bottom 10 in the league in total yards allowed per game, 3rd worst in the league passing defense by passing yards allowed (worse than the Seahawks), bottom half of the league in points allowed per game (only 1 spot ahead of the Seahawks). Yet, people are fawning all over Quinn and the Dallas D, while refering to the Seahawks D as the worst in NFL history.

Don't get me wrong, our D sucks and needs a lot of work, but there are literally 11 teams in the NFL that are giving up more points per game than the Seahawks, and the Cowboys are only 1 spot better. Yet somehow we have the worst D in NFL history and the Cowboys D is good? LOL.

 

[Chapow]

You could say this about any defensive scheme, if you don't have the personnel to run it well, then it's going to fail.

So have the Hawks play whatever scheme you want, cover 3, cover 2, cover 4, Bear 46, press man in a 3-4 or 4-3 base.

Doesn't matter when most of your players stink, especially your corners, and D-line that can't get pressure.

Add in the fact that it's VERY apparent that our coaches are having a hard time getting all these moving parts and players on the defensive side of the ball to communicate and be in the proper zones and positions.......and VOILA, you've got yourself the 32nd ranked defense in the league.

By yards allowed per game.

Looks a bit different if you look at points allowed per game.

Which begs the question, why are defenses ranked by yards per game?

What is more important in football, yards or points?


*And no, I'm not defending how poorly our D is playing. They are straight up bad and frustrating as hell to watch.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

You could say this about any defensive scheme, if you don't have the personnel to run it well, then it's going to fail.

So have the Hawks play whatever scheme you want, cover 3, cover 2, cover 4, Bear 46, press man in a 3-4 or 4-3 base.

Doesn't matter when most of your players stink, especially your corners, and D-line that can't get pressure.

Add in the fact that it's VERY apparent that our coaches are having a hard time getting all these moving parts and players on the defensive side of the ball to communicate and be in the proper zones and positions.......and VOILA, you've got yourself the 32nd ranked defense in the league.

By yards allowed per game.

Looks a bit different if you look at points allowed per game.

Which begs the question, why are defenses ranked by yards per game?

What is more important in football, yards or points?


*And no, I'm not defending how poorly our D is playing. They are straight up bad and frustrating as hell to watch.

I think most people use points allowed as the best indicator.

My entire point after I read this article is "so?" Every team in the league uses cover 3, and most of the other schemes I mentioned above. No team JUST uses one scheme, it's fluid depending on the offense you're playing and in game adjustments, etc.

So the narrative that offenses have figured us out because we use cover 3 is just silly. I don't know the snaps per scheme, but I betcha we've used cover 2 as much or more than cover 3 the past couple of years, simply because our DB's have been so bad not having two safeties back is not a good thing when the DB's play as poorly as they have been playing.

 

[Chapow]

You could say this about any defensive scheme, if you don't have the personnel to run it well, then it's going to fail.

So have the Hawks play whatever scheme you want, cover 3, cover 2, cover 4, Bear 46, press man in a 3-4 or 4-3 base.

Doesn't matter when most of your players stink, especially your corners, and D-line that can't get pressure.

Add in the fact that it's VERY apparent that our coaches are having a hard time getting all these moving parts and players on the defensive side of the ball to communicate and be in the proper zones and positions.......and VOILA, you've got yourself the 32nd ranked defense in the league.

By yards allowed per game.

Looks a bit different if you look at points allowed per game.

Which begs the question, why are defenses ranked by yards per game?

What is more important in football, yards or points?


*And no, I'm not defending how poorly our D is playing. They are straight up bad and frustrating as hell to watch.

I think most people use points allowed as the best indicator.

My entire point after I read this article is "so?" Every team in the league uses cover 3, and most of the other schemes I mentioned above. No team JUST uses one scheme, it's fluid depending on the offense you're playing and in game adjustments, etc.

So the narrative that offenses have figured us out because we use cover 3 is just silly. I don't know the snaps per scheme, but I betcha we've used cover 2 as much or more than cover 3 the past couple of years, simply because our DB's have been so bad not having two safeties back is not a good thing when the DB's play as poorly as they have been playing.

You do? You just refered to our D as the 32nd ranked defense in the league, but that ranking is by yards per game, not points per game. By points per game we are the 21st ranked defense. I can't even begin to count how many times I've seen on this board people calling our D the worst D in the NFL, yet at no point have we been giving up the most points per game (not even close actually), so they all must be talking about by yards per game.

Sure seems like the vast majority of people use yards per game to rank defenses, but I do understand that's because that is how the NFL ranks defenses. So I guess my point is, why does the NFL use yards per game to rank defenses, and not points per game? That's never made sense to me.

 

[AROS]

I agree, I think the barometer should be points given up per game not yards but that's just me.

 

[hawkfan68]

I agree, I think the barometer should be points given up per game not yards but that's just me.

I agree with you and Chapow on this one too. Points are a bigger factor than yards in W's and L's. Sort of like Time of Possession. Everyone loves to use that metric, unfortunately. If a team puts up over 30pts and holds the other team to 17pts. They win the game, but lose TOP or total yards battle, who cares.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Hasn't stopped Russ and the Hawks beating Santa Clara 16 of the last 20 meetings. Yeah, totally figured out.

You have to remember that Shanahan also hasn't had a QB to run his scheme. McVey also uses a variation of Shanahan's system and we haven't fared so well against him.

 

[Spin Doctor]

You could say this about any defensive scheme, if you don't have the personnel to run it well, then it's going to fail.

So have the Hawks play whatever scheme you want, cover 3, cover 2, cover 4, Bear 46, press man in a 3-4 or 4-3 base.

Doesn't matter when most of your players stink, especially your corners, and D-line that can't get pressure.

Add in the fact that it's VERY apparent that our coaches are having a hard time getting all these moving parts and players on the defensive side of the ball to communicate and be in the proper zones and positions.......and VOILA, you've got yourself the 32nd ranked defense in the league.

By yards allowed per game.

Looks a bit different if you look at points allowed per game.

Which begs the question, why are defenses ranked by yards per game?

What is more important in football, yards or points?


*And no, I'm not defending how poorly our D is playing. They are straight up bad and frustrating as hell to watch.

I think most people use points allowed as the best indicator.

My entire point after I read this article is "so?" Every team in the league uses cover 3, and most of the other schemes I mentioned above. No team JUST uses one scheme, it's fluid depending on the offense you're playing and in game adjustments, etc.

So the narrative that offenses have figured us out because we use cover 3 is just silly. I don't know the snaps per scheme, but I betcha we've used cover 2 as much or more than cover 3 the past couple of years, simply because our DB's have been so bad not having two safeties back is not a good thing when the DB's play as poorly as they have been playing.

We used our base defense more than any other team not named jacksonville last season.

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat- ... ime-league

 

[suppaball]

I agree, I think the barometer should be points given up per game not yards but that's just me.

Been saying this for a while now. However I also noticed that lots of yards allowed equals lots of points. With this D it seems it beds to allow FG's not TD's.

 

[Fade]

Yards in a way can be just as bad because the defense can't get off the field, and you just slowly watch them bleed out. It might not be as heinous looking as giving up a 50 burger, but the loss against Minny this year was as painful to watch as any game I've seen a PC team play.

 

[BASF]

It is pretty much just laziness. The fact that you can give up points in all three phases makes it a flawed stat for those that never want to dig deeper into how many points you have given up off turnovers and special teams. The only way you can give up yards is while on defense, so that is the barometer. It is actually funny because some teams in history have given up a lot of points the other way and their defense gets looked down upon because of it.