Its not Bevells fault

Hes not the issue, ive been a known bevell hater. But he is not the main problem even though sometimes he makes some dumb play calls.


Its petes and johns fault, be honest here. What is bevell supposed to do with this offense? There is no protection, most plays he calls will fail because the o line gets shredded like swiss cheese and any successful play call will mostly likely be broken down and everyone just points the finger at him and screams how bad his play calling is. If he was given an o line with actual protection, he could be a decent play caller and he has shown he can be. Hes not kyle shanahan but he can be good.

Ive even notice on replays some of the play designs arent even that bad, its the protection breaking down 1 second after the ball is snapped. And thats on pete and john for willingly refusing to protect the franchise QB for years now.

Agreed. Everbody plays a part - they are all at fault.

wrote it somewhere else but that was the blame bevel thread

Screens, roll-outs - moving the pocket, slowing down the defense, quick routes, mixed tempo all works when you have a bad o-line and wasn't done all that much

with that said the first half up to 2 minute drill in the TN game was stymied because of bad QB play. RW killed at least three series with bad throws - 1 tipped to Richardsson, 1 high to Graham and 1 way beyond Baldwin (for huge game). He settled in later but some drives there would have helped a lot.

Bevell was not the issue against TN but that doesn't mean he isn't an issue

It's ultimately on Pete and John for deviating from the identity they wanted. They got cute on offense and failed

He clearly is part of the issue.

I would list responsibility to what we are seeing in this order.

1) Pete
2) Cable
3) Bevell
4) Schnieder

RussB":16ff4f8t said:

Hes not the issue, ive been a known bevell hater. But he is not the main problem even though sometimes he makes some dumb play calls.


Its petes and johns fault, be honest here. What is bevell supposed to do with this offense? There is no protection, most plays he calls will fail because the o line gets shredded like swiss cheese and any successful play call will mostly likely be broken down and everyone just points the finger at him and screams how bad his play calling is. If he was given an o line with actual protection, he could be a decent play caller and he has shown he can be. Hes not kyle shanahan but he can be good.

Ive even notice on replays some of the play designs arent even that bad, its the protection breaking down 1 second after the ball is snapped. And thats on pete and john for willingly refusing to protect the franchise QB for years now.

Click to expand...

Respectfully disagree that Bevell's not at fault. Gameplanning and playcalling are very much his fault.
MikeAK upthread named the things you can do with a bad O-line and still have success.

Sports Hernia":1d9tqocx said:

RussB":1d9tqocx said:

Hes not the issue, ive been a known bevell hater. But he is not the main problem even though sometimes he makes some dumb play calls.


Its petes and johns fault, be honest here. What is bevell supposed to do with this offense? There is no protection, most plays he calls will fail because the o line gets shredded like swiss cheese and any successful play call will mostly likely be broken down and everyone just points the finger at him and screams how bad his play calling is. If he was given an o line with actual protection, he could be a decent play caller and he has shown he can be. Hes not kyle shanahan but he can be good.

Ive even notice on replays some of the play designs arent even that bad, its the protection breaking down 1 second after the ball is snapped. And thats on pete and john for willingly refusing to protect the franchise QB for years now.

Click to expand...

Respectfully disagree that Bevell's not at fault. Gameplanning and playcalling are very much his fault.
MikeAK upthread named the things you can do with a bad O-line and still have success.

Click to expand...

yes you can call certain plays to hide a weak line, but this line is another level of terrible. i dont think the right play calls can even help them, i remember either in the tennesse or SF game bevell called some quick passing plays to get the ball out quick wilson still got huge pressure on him and it was useless.

not saying bevell is at zero fault, but the FO and pete are the biggest problems here, after them, its cable, then bevell.

Bevell can't seem to make in game, half time adjustments.

Hawkfish":1vaiy5yx said:

Bevell can't seem to make in game, half time adjustments.

Click to expand...

Agree.
I wonder if someone Bevelled his edge?

How is he not a huge issue ? His play calling lacks innovation, it's extremely predictable and he is terrible at making in game adjustments. Other teams have o lines as bad, and when I watch them... it's 10x better then whatever we put out there... and we have talent... we just refuse to run a offense tailored to it.

I remember watching the GB game and it was 2nd down and 22 yards to go

We ran it up the middle for 3 yards

And I thought to myself - that Bevell he sure is a smart guy...........

Remember the Holmgren thing? Incomplete pass, followed by a draw on 2nd and 10. Over and over and over again.

Or the Chuck Knox thing. Run left, run right, pass.

The Bevell thing has been run in to the ground. Been wanting him gone for years, I just am convinced it may never happen. Ugh

We could still win games even with Bevell's stupidity if we had an offensive line.

Cable gets most of the blame, and Pete for not replacing him yet.

Sports Hernia":376lr2ax said:

RussB":376lr2ax said:

Hes not the issue, ive been a known bevell hater. But he is not the main problem even though sometimes he makes some dumb play calls.


Its petes and johns fault, be honest here. What is bevell supposed to do with this offense? There is no protection, most plays he calls will fail because the o line gets shredded like swiss cheese and any successful play call will mostly likely be broken down and everyone just points the finger at him and screams how bad his play calling is. If he was given an o line with actual protection, he could be a decent play caller and he has shown he can be. Hes not kyle shanahan but he can be good.

Ive even notice on replays some of the play designs arent even that bad, its the protection breaking down 1 second after the ball is snapped. And thats on pete and john for willingly refusing to protect the franchise QB for years now.

Click to expand...

Respectfully disagree that Bevell's not at fault. Gameplanning and playcalling are very much his fault.
MikeAK upthread named the things you can do with a bad O-line and still have success.

Click to expand...

Mike also mentioned that Bevell wasn't the problem against TN, and it's precisely because Bevell was doing the things Mike cited. He doesn't roll that gameplan out consistently, but is that on him or on Pete?

But here's the thing: just because Bevell isn't the problem doesn't mean that replacing him can't be a solution. Even a solid gameplan can be predictable. A fresh set of eyes could really recharge this offense.

Bumped for self pleasing humorous positioning on site.

Optimus25":1afg5s27 said:

Bumped for self pleasing humorous positioning on site.

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I'll admit, I got a kick out of seeing that.

RussB":201a3roe said:

What is bevell supposed to do with this offense? There is no protection, most plays he calls will fail because the o line gets shredded like swiss cheese and any successful play call will mostly likely be broken down and everyone just points the finger at him and screams how bad his play calling is.

Ive even notice on replays some of the play designs arent even that bad, its the protection breaking down 1 second after the ball is snapped. And thats on pete and john for willingly refusing to protect the franchise QB for years now.

Click to expand...

This is a 'chicken or the egg' argument... Pete and John have drafted a number of o-lineman over the years - All with genuine potential. We've signed o-linemen and successfully converted/created two (Sweezy and Fant). More than ever, o-lineman require a lot of coaching to adjust to the pro level, with lots of high picks failing to succeed, but the best coaching staffs are already working around that.

Forgive me if this has been said above, but scheme (Cable) and play-calling (Bevell) ARE the primary problems. If you replace Cable with Dante Scarnecchia (Patriots) and Bevell with Josh McDaniels (Patriots), are we still having this discussion?

Case study...

Patriots O-line 2016

Entering the season, PFF had the Pats o-line ranked 18th overall. Here was their makeup:

There are only a few blue-chip linemen on the Patriots’ roster: Solder was a first-round pick, and Vollmer a second-rounder. The rest are a mix of fourth- and fifth-rounders, and undrafted players, including Andrews, the rookie center from Georgia who started 11 games.

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-Peter King, SI | MMQB Jan. 20th, 2016

They won the Superbowl in 2016, so how did that o-line work for them?

Solder’s season ended with a biceps injury after four games. Stork missed the first seven games after suffering a concussion in training camp. Vollmer, Kline, Mason and fellow rookie guard Tre’ Jackson all missed games with injuries. But even early in the season, before Solder was lost for the year, the Patriots were using an unorthodox tactic of rotating guards and tackles between drives—sometimes in the middle of a drive, like hockey players changing shifts midstream. In one game they made 23 such rotations.

[In the 2016 regular season] the Patriots have used five left tackles, five left guards, two centers, seven right guards and five right tackles. Vollmer, who earned a Super Bowl ring at right tackle last season, is playing left tackle. Stork has played every position along the line except left tackle.

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-Peter King, SI | MMQB Jan. 20th, 2016

Have we really had it worse?

To a stunning degree, the Patriots have used 13 different starting lineups on their offensive line, the most of any NFL team over the last 22 years, which is as far back as STATS research goes. But that’s just the surface; the Patriots have spent much of the season rotating linemen during games like teams normally change out skill-position players. By this reporter’s unofficial count, New England has used 37 different offensive line combinations this season. To put that number into context, consider this: The Vikings used one lineup—the same five offensive linemen—for all but 14 snaps this season.

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-Peter King, SI | MMQB Jan. 20th, 2016

Sound familiar? McDaniels didn't care who the front 5 were, he couldn't with all those changes. Now imagine him here; turning Baldwin into the next Welker/Edelman, Graham into Gronk, and Russ into, alright I won't go that far, but Russ -unless he legitimately can't see his targets from inside the pocket - would be taking shorter drops and getting the ball out a lot quicker... like that old, lead-footed guy with the weak arm.

So how do you turn that chicken stuff into chicken soup?

It’s impossible to overstate the effect the return of longtime O-line coach Dante Scarnecchia has had on this unit, which was a major problem for the team a year ago. RT Marcus Cannon has gone from a liability to a second-team All-Pro, and RG Shaquille Mason has undergone a similar transformation when it comes to pass protection.

Click to expand...

-Nick Ziegler Fansided Jan. 2017

The Seahawks and Patriots front offices/coaching staffs share similar values in o-lineman: athleticism, intelligence, versatility. Both have been dealt similar hands related to injuries, inexperience, and position shuffling.

The difference? Scheme and execution.

-Snake

Who was calling the plays on the first drive of the second half? There was a good mix of run/pass and using different personnel. The drive was a thing of beauty and is what this team COULD be with THESE players. Then, Tennessee responds and all of a sudden Bevell goes back to same 'ol same 'ol. Why? Why not stay with what works? He does this shit all the time. Something works and yet he changes it up for something that doesn't work. I don't care if you run the same play over and over and over. If the defense can't stop it, then why change it?