Run game

[Nunya]

Okay fact time

1st qtr

every series had at least 1 run or more
we ran the ball 7 times

2nd qtr
3 runs
again no series without a run

3rg qtr
3 runs
again no series without at least one run

4th qtr
14 rushes
no series without a run

Personalty, I would not call a QB scramble a run play. Seems a bit dishonest. Sure, they will go down as a run play, but a run was not the intent.

The 1st possession in the 2nd Quarter had no run plays:
1st play - incomplete pass
2nd play - QB scramble for 2 yards.
3rd play - QB sack.

The 2nd possesion in the 3rd Quarter also had no run plays:
1st play - QB scramble for 1 yard
2nd play - incomplete pass
3rd play - incomplete pass.

The Biggest difference between qtrs 1-3 and 4 were
tempo
Wilson running
moving the pocket
non-standard patterns
way less predictable
more run lanes

Now you seem to be just throwing words out there and hope they stick.

Tempo - Tempo did not change much throughout the game.
Wilson running - Wilson had only 2 "rushes" (actually scrambles) that were of any significance. One for 11 yards and one for 16 yards. While they did extend the drive, they are not anything that made a huge shift in the game.
Moving the pocket - Huh??? The pocket was moving the whole game because of breakdown in blocking.
non-standard patterns - What the heck is this even? You will have to provide an example of these "non-standard patterns".
way less predictable - again....Huh????
more running lanes - and again.....HUH????

summation

qtr 1-3 on a lease
4th qtr off the lease

thats not just about Wilson but the offense as whole
In other words back to same old same old. play close to the vest keep it close and then try to win in the end.

Not sure why you think RW was on a leash the 1st half. What exactly is a "leash"? RW was 11/19 in the 1st half and 9/17 in the 2nd half. Considering the 2 big scrambles were pass plays, it appears that RW had as many pass plays called in the 2nd half as the 1st half.

I'm not one to put all success or failure on RW's shoulders, but his accuracy and "some" decision makings do appear to be not as stellar as what we saw early in the season. This could be because of some minor injury RW is playing through, better defensive coverage, bad offensive line performance, or even bad luck. In any case, it seems like the execution by the offense as a whole appears to be off a little. It only takes a failure on the part of one players to cause an offense to stall on their drives. A coach can call a perfect game and have the best QB, but without all 11 players executing the play as they are suppose their skill does not matter.

so now we are not calling a Qb running a run play,, hmm and yet they count in the rushing stats hmm

A QB scramble is NOT a run play....though it will be recorded as such. RW did not run any design run play that I remember. When discussing the number of run plays called vs the number of pass plays, to say a called pass play was a run play just because the QB had to run for their life is a bit dishonest.

 

[LTH]

Okay fact time

1st qtr

every series had at least 1 run or more
we ran the ball 7 times

2nd qtr
3 runs
again no series without a run

3rg qtr
3 runs
again no series without at least one run

4th qtr
14 rushes
no series without a run

Personalty, I would not call a QB scramble a run play. Seems a bit dishonest. Sure, they will go down as a run play, but a run was not the intent.

The 1st possession in the 2nd Quarter had no run plays:
1st play - incomplete pass
2nd play - QB scramble for 2 yards.
3rd play - QB sack.

The 2nd possesion in the 3rd Quarter also had no run plays:
1st play - QB scramble for 1 yard
2nd play - incomplete pass
3rd play - incomplete pass.

The Biggest difference between qtrs 1-3 and 4 were
tempo
Wilson running
moving the pocket
non-standard patterns
way less predictable
more run lanes

Now you seem to be just throwing words out there and hope they stick.

Tempo - Tempo did not change much throughout the game.
Wilson running - Wilson had only 2 "rushes" (actually scrambles) that were of any significance. One for 11 yards and one for 16 yards. While they did extend the drive, they are not anything that made a huge shift in the game.
Moving the pocket - Huh??? The pocket was moving the whole game because of breakdown in blocking.
non-standard patterns - What the heck is this even? You will have to provide an example of these "non-standard patterns".
way less predictable - again....Huh????
more running lanes - and again.....HUH????

summation

qtr 1-3 on a lease
4th qtr off the lease

thats not just about Wilson but the offense as whole
In other words back to same old same old. play close to the vest keep it close and then try to win in the end.

Not sure why you think RW was on a leash the 1st half. What exactly is a "leash"? RW was 11/19 in the 1st half and 9/17 in the 2nd half. Considering the 2 big scrambles were pass plays, it appears that RW had as many pass plays called in the 2nd half as the 1st half.

I'm not one to put all success or failure on RW's shoulders, but his accuracy and "some" decision makings do appear to be not as stellar as what we saw early in the season. This could be because of some minor injury RW is playing through, better defensive coverage, bad offensive line performance, or even bad luck. In any case, it seems like the execution by the offense as a whole appears to be off a little. It only takes a failure on the part of one players to cause an offense to stall on their drives. A coach can call a perfect game and have the best QB, but without all 11 players executing the play as they are suppose their skill does not matter.

so now we are not calling a Qb running a run play,, hmm and yet they count in the rushing stats hmm

A QB scramble is NOT a run play....though it will be recorded as such. RW did not run any design run play that I remember. When discussing the number of run plays called vs the number of pass plays, to say a called pass play was a run play just because the QB had to run for their life is a bit dishonest.

It's not really a designed play but it is part of trying to keep the D on it's heels its a tempo thing ...It is one of the options that Russ has on the designed play...Schotty knows Russ is going to take off when the opportunity arises just to keep the D off balance... so it is kind of a designed thing in that capacity...

LTH

 

[Nunya]

Personalty, I would not call a QB scramble a run play. Seems a bit dishonest. Sure, they will go down as a run play, but a run was not the intent.

The 1st possession in the 2nd Quarter had no run plays:
1st play - incomplete pass
2nd play - QB scramble for 2 yards.
3rd play - QB sack.

The 2nd possesion in the 3rd Quarter also had no run plays:
1st play - QB scramble for 1 yard
2nd play - incomplete pass
3rd play - incomplete pass.



Now you seem to be just throwing words out there and hope they stick.

Tempo - Tempo did not change much throughout the game.
Wilson running - Wilson had only 2 "rushes" (actually scrambles) that were of any significance. One for 11 yards and one for 16 yards. While they did extend the drive, they are not anything that made a huge shift in the game.
Moving the pocket - Huh??? The pocket was moving the whole game because of breakdown in blocking.
non-standard patterns - What the heck is this even? You will have to provide an example of these "non-standard patterns".
way less predictable - again....Huh????
more running lanes - and again.....HUH????



Not sure why you think RW was on a leash the 1st half. What exactly is a "leash"? RW was 11/19 in the 1st half and 9/17 in the 2nd half. Considering the 2 big scrambles were pass plays, it appears that RW had as many pass plays called in the 2nd half as the 1st half.

I'm not one to put all success or failure on RW's shoulders, but his accuracy and "some" decision makings do appear to be not as stellar as what we saw early in the season. This could be because of some minor injury RW is playing through, better defensive coverage, bad offensive line performance, or even bad luck. In any case, it seems like the execution by the offense as a whole appears to be off a little. It only takes a failure on the part of one players to cause an offense to stall on their drives. A coach can call a perfect game and have the best QB, but without all 11 players executing the play as they are suppose their skill does not matter.

so now we are not calling a Qb running a run play,, hmm and yet they count in the rushing stats hmm

A QB scramble is NOT a run play....though it will be recorded as such. RW did not run any design run play that I remember. When discussing the number of run plays called vs the number of pass plays, to say a called pass play was a run play just because the QB had to run for their life is a bit dishonest.

It's not really a designed play but it is part of trying to keep the D on it's heels its a tempo thing ...It is one of the options that Russ has on the designed play...Schotty knows Russ is going to take off when the opportunity arises just to keep the D off balance... so it is kind of a designed thing in that capacity...

LTH

RW has that option on EVERY pass play. Unless someone is claiming that he is told not to scramble in the 1st, 2nd, and/or 3rd quarter and is told to only scramble in the 4th quarter, it is a moot point.

 

[John63]

Okay fact time

1st qtr

every series had at least 1 run or more
we ran the ball 7 times

2nd qtr
3 runs
again no series without a run

3rg qtr
3 runs
again no series without at least one run

4th qtr
14 rushes
no series without a run

Personalty, I would not call a QB scramble a run play. Seems a bit dishonest. Sure, they will go down as a run play, but a run was not the intent.

The 1st possession in the 2nd Quarter had no run plays:
1st play - incomplete pass
2nd play - QB scramble for 2 yards.
3rd play - QB sack.

The 2nd possesion in the 3rd Quarter also had no run plays:
1st play - QB scramble for 1 yard
2nd play - incomplete pass
3rd play - incomplete pass.

The Biggest difference between qtrs 1-3 and 4 were
tempo
Wilson running
moving the pocket
non-standard patterns
way less predictable
more run lanes

Now you seem to be just throwing words out there and hope they stick.

Tempo - Tempo did not change much throughout the game.
Wilson running - Wilson had only 2 "rushes" (actually scrambles) that were of any significance. One for 11 yards and one for 16 yards. While they did extend the drive, they are not anything that made a huge shift in the game.
Moving the pocket - Huh??? The pocket was moving the whole game because of breakdown in blocking.
non-standard patterns - What the heck is this even? You will have to provide an example of these "non-standard patterns".
way less predictable - again....Huh????
more running lanes - and again.....HUH????

summation

qtr 1-3 on a lease
4th qtr off the lease

thats not just about Wilson but the offense as whole
In other words back to same old same old. play close to the vest keep it close and then try to win in the end.

Not sure why you think RW was on a leash the 1st half. What exactly is a "leash"? RW was 11/19 in the 1st half and 9/17 in the 2nd half. Considering the 2 big scrambles were pass plays, it appears that RW had as many pass plays called in the 2nd half as the 1st half.

I'm not one to put all success or failure on RW's shoulders, but his accuracy and "some" decision makings do appear to be not as stellar as what we saw early in the season. This could be because of some minor injury RW is playing through, better defensive coverage, bad offensive line performance, or even bad luck. In any case, it seems like the execution by the offense as a whole appears to be off a little. It only takes a failure on the part of one players to cause an offense to stall on their drives. A coach can call a perfect game and have the best QB, but without all 11 players executing the play as they are suppose their skill does not matter.

so now we are not calling a Qb running a run play,, hmm and yet they count in the rushing stats hmm

A QB scramble is NOT a run play....though it will be recorded as such. RW did not run any design run play that I remember. When discussing the number of run plays called vs the number of pass plays, to say a called pass play was a run play just because the QB had to run for their life is a bit dishonest.

how do you know the intent was not to run? you dont, there were at least 1 I can think of where he hit his back foot and then ran immediately.

 

[Nunya]

how do you know the intent was not to run? you dont, there were at least 1 I can think of where he hit his back foot and then ran immediately.

Easy. Watch the O-Line. If they push forward, it is a design run play. If they hold the line or even drop back, it is a pass play.

Bring up the play you are talking about and we can discuss, but I doubt it was intended that RW scramble from the start.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Carson/Hyde/Penny/Collins. Yes please.
These guys can pound the crap out of the ball, eat up clock and keep the Rams offense on the sidelines.
They start loading the box, sling it. Plus, they just held them to 3 field goals. The Rams, not a single touchdown.

 

[IndyHawk]

Some of the stuff in here..You'd have thought we lost..

 

[SoulfishHawk]

I think I've said that to myself 12 times this season 8)

 

[John63]

how do you know the intent was not to run? you dont, there were at least 1 I can think of where he hit his back foot and then ran immediately.

Easy. Watch the O-Line. If they push forward, it is a design run play. If they hold the line or even drop back, it is a pass play.

Bring up the play you are talking about and we can discuss, but I doubt it was intended that RW scramble from the start.

not true at all. with the advent of running QBs often times oline will act like they are pass blocking so as not to give away it's a run, and the QB picks the best place to run.

 

[Nunya]

how do you know the intent was not to run? you dont, there were at least 1 I can think of where he hit his back foot and then ran immediately.

Easy. Watch the O-Line. If they push forward, it is a design run play. If they hold the line or even drop back, it is a pass play.

Bring up the play you are talking about and we can discuss, but I doubt it was intended that RW scramble from the start.

not true at all. with the advent of running QBs often times oline will act like they are pass blocking so as not to give away it's a run, and the QB picks the best place to run.

Not on a design QB run they don't. They may not push forward immediately, but they do not drop into a pocket protect....especially if the QB is going to start his run once his back foot hits the ground as you claim happened. On QB draws, the OLine normally holds in place for a 2-3 count and then releases. Also, you will also often see the RB run through the hole first if the backfield isn't empty.

Honestly though, do you really believe the play you are talking about was a design QB run???

 

[sutz]

Some of the stuff in here..You'd have thought we lost..

Yes, further manifestations of the NWB Syndrome. NWBS. :laugh:

 

[RolandDeschain]

not sure where you get your info from but your wrong...


LTH

Ok.

 

[John63]

how do you know the intent was not to run? you dont, there were at least 1 I can think of where he hit his back foot and then ran immediately.

Easy. Watch the O-Line. If they push forward, it is a design run play. If they hold the line or even drop back, it is a pass play.

Bring up the play you are talking about and we can discuss, but I doubt it was intended that RW scramble from the start.

not true at all. with the advent of running QBs often times oline will act like they are pass blocking so as not to give away it's a run, and the QB picks the best place to run.

Not on a design QB run they don't. They may not push forward immediately, but they do not drop into a pocket protect....especially if the QB is going to start his run once his back foot hits the ground as you claim happened. On QB draws, the OLine normally holds in place for a 2-3 count and then releases. Also, you will also often see the RB run through the hole first if the backfield isn't empty.

Honestly though, do you really believe the play you are talking about was a design QB run???

actually yes they do exactly what I said it has been discussed alot over the eyar son numerous shows adn ESPN adn other sites.

 

[olyfan63]

Yeah, there were several series where we went pass, pass, SACK, punt.
It wasn't just the run game that wasn't working, but throwing like that helps nothing other than the other team. The trick is to avoid 3rd and long, not guarantee it.

:34853_doh:

FIFY.

 

[olyfan63]

Not quite following you.

If a good QB is only given a limited amount of pass plays, I would say THAT is putting them on a "leash".

However, NO NFL coach is going to design plays or routes that will intentionally hamper or hold back their QB. That is a ridiculous concept.

I know you're right, it's just that it SEEMED that way at times on Sunday. It was like Russell kept looking deep, only deep, running out of time, and getting sacked.

I don't know if that's because the route combinations being called didn't have short and medium check-downs, or if the Rams covered them, or if Russell was so dead-set on hitting DK deep that he didn't use them. It seemed it wasn't until the 4th quarter that Russell started throwing to TEs, RBs, and WRs on shorter routes, and we started moving the chains and scoring.

Was the 3rd qtr 3-and-out futility caused more by Russell's decision-making on where to throw, or Schotty's play-calling?

 

[TreeRon]

WE were missing 50% of our starting line, RT Shell and LG Iupati. Brown and Iupati are a formidable duo on the left side when running the ball. Could that have made a difference?

 

[CalgaryFan05]

Some of the stuff in here..You'd have thought we lost..

no - i didn't say i thought we lost - genuinely happy for the win. I think we gave the the chance to win due to some dumb play calling in a couple of quarters. I'm not really that negative about it other than the fact that: if we're going to run Pete ball. Fing fun Pete ball. Use the run to setup the pass. Don't disconnect the entire process to hand them a chance and pull heroics at the end to win. Play the first half like the 4th quarter, and then you don't have to wonder woman the 4th quarter. But I'm not the first person to say that. We clearly could have lost that game, admittedly to no effect, but why give them the chance. If you're going to lose - rest the starters.

Also, I'm not the first person to say that; there's a couple/few too many times when it's 'that's working - so let's stop doing it'.

 

[olyfan63]

WE were missing 50% of our starting line, RT Shell and LG Iupati. Brown and Iupati are a formidable duo on the left side when running the ball. Could that have made a difference?

IIRC it's Jordan Simmons who fills in for Iupati at G. Simmons is actually a beast in the run game, but not as good a pass blocker as Iupati. We definitely miss Shell when he's not in, he's been very steady for us.

 

[TreeRon]

WE were missing 50% of our starting line, RT Shell and LG Iupati. Brown and Iupati are a formidable duo on the left side when running the ball. Could that have made a difference?

IIRC it's Jordan Simmons who fills in for Iupati at G. Simmons is actually a beast in the run game, but not as good a pass blocker as Iupati. We definitely miss Shell when he's not in, he's been very steady for us.

Iupati's been known as road grader since he came into the league. Frankly the knock on Iupati, even in his All Pro years, was his pass blocking. It's never been BAD, not his forte.

Iupati is the second highest graded lineman behind Damian Lewis.

Iupati's pff grade 67.8
Jordan Simmons' 51.6

"Seattle’s best combo of Brown-Iupati-Pocic-Lewis-Shell has only played five games together." (SB Nation)