Wagner and Wilson not going to get done this year?

[BuZzB28]

Just heard on KIRO radio that Russ' contract is ready to be signed.

Really? How much $ for wilson will earn 10 or 15 or 20 millions a year? I wonder.

 

[StoneCold]

Only thing I can add to this discussion is there is no way Russell gets ruffled feathers over the deal nor is there a chance that JS/PC convey to him that he is not valued. All this speculation about how dangerous this process is, is completely overblown. We're not dealing with delicate little flowers.

But JS/PC will not screw this up. All parties are well aware of the intricacies of the cap and how to best take care of the players and the team.

SC

 

[Popeyejones]

The Cary Williams deal is clearly a result of a HUGE need given the loss of Maxwell and injuries to Lane and Simon that will sideline them for the offseason and in Lane's case the first part of the season. In addition, the CB market went crazy. The deal they signed with Williams was below market based on what happened after March 10th.

Fair enough, I think we just probably disagree about 1) the size of the need, and more importantly, 2) the cap expenditure needed to fill that need, 3) Williams' ability to fullfill that need (and particularly at that price point), and 4) the expenditure and level of talent that could have fielded that need if they waited later on the market.

We agree that it's effectively 7 million dollars against the cap for Williams on what is likely a one year deal (five million on the cap this year, and 2 million in dead money next year).

Seattle is the dream location for CB's on one-year prove it deals.

Why spend 7 million on Williams when you could have spent 1.5 milion on one year for Sterling Moore, or 2 million on one year for Patrick Robinson, or (likely) 1 million on one year for Tarrel Brown?

Heck, you could have all three of them for four million in cap hit rather than 7 million in cap hit for Williams, or you could just have one of them and still have AT LEAST five million that you don't have to backload on Wagner or Wilson's new deals.


I know we disagree, but I just really don't get their thinking on that one (which only stands out to me b/c I generally feel like I have a pretty good read on their thinking when it comes to player releases & acquisitions through FA and trade; their drafting and how P.C. utilizes players does admittedly flummox me sometimes).

 

[gowazzu02]

First,,, Mitch is a moron,,,

Second... they both get done this year.... if they wait to next year they will get more money though, with next years cap sure to go up and other higher contracts to base theirs off of...... just look at sherm, he's now like the 5th highest paid corner.

 

[m0ng0]

710 is saying a Wilson deal may get done very soon

 

[Mike 4G]

We must pay to Wagner and Wilson. Wagner was a great defense and good leader for us. Wilson got two super bowl for two times. How much $$ worth for Wagner and Wilson? Hope they should stay for us.

Not trying to be rude, but aren't you the same Buzz that posts on the 9ers board as a 9ers fan? Maybe I am confused.

 

[NorCalSeahawk]

I don't pretend to know how the team works their players contracts and salary cap. With that said I would guess the team has a plan in place (shocker) and I would bet at least one them gets done this year and the other next season. I don't see either of them going anywhere (especially Wilson ).

 

[the ditch]

Wagner is better than KJ I feel like it would be pretty shocking if we didn't end up re-signing Bobby.

 

[twisted_steel2]

710 is saying a Wilson deal may get done very soon

Yep.

Brock and Salk talked about it this morning, I think they were talking to Terry Blount?? Saying the contract is very very close to being done. They are just fine tuning a couple points in it.

 

[canfan]

They had 14.1 M in cap space going into today. You need about half of that to cover draft picks, IR, and the PS.

Not to mention that any new deals for Wilson and Wagner will likely have non-substantial 2015 cap increases.

This :13:

 

[Anonymous]

Uhhh, we're not even close to being out of money.

Not sure who it was here, but in another thread a while back there was a nice breakdown of how the new contracts are affecting the cap and how we never even get close because of the contract strategy we employ.

Anybody? 40-oz maybe?

 

[BuZzB28]

I think, Wilson is jealous because he wanted more moneys like Kap. He wanted same with him for contract. .. :roll:

 

[original poster]

I think, Wilson is jealous because he wanted more moneys like Kap. He wanted same with him for contract. .. :roll:

Yeah I agree. Bobner's contract will make Willson jealous as well.

 

[Hyak]

Fair enough, I think we just probably disagree about 1) the size of the need, and more importantly, 2) the cap expenditure needed to fill that need, 3) Williams' ability to fullfill that need (and particularly at that price point), and 4) the expenditure and level of talent that could have fielded that need if they waited later on the market.

We agree that it's effectively 7 million dollars against the cap for Williams on what is likely a one year deal (five million on the cap this year, and 2 million in dead money next year).

Seattle is the dream location for CB's on one-year prove it deals.

Why spend 7 million on Williams when you could have spent 1.5 milion on one year for Sterling Moore, or 2 million on one year for Patrick Robinson, or (likely) 1 million on one year for Tarrel Brown?

Heck, you could have all three of them for four million in cap hit rather than 7 million in cap hit for Williams, or you could just have one of them and still have AT LEAST five million that you don't have to backload on Wagner or Wilson's new deals.


I know we disagree, but I just really don't get their thinking on that one (which only stands out to me b/c I generally feel like I have a pretty good read on their thinking when it comes to player releases & acquisitions through FA and trade; their drafting and how P.C. utilizes players does admittedly flummox me sometimes).

Honestly, I don't recall any one-year prove it deals for CB's. Defensive Linemen for sure. The only guy I recall coming in from outside was Winfield but he was at the end of his career and not looking for huge paydays. All of their other CB's have almost exclusively been drafted and either extended or tendered prior to unrestricted free agency.

I also think they are higher on Williams as a really good fit as opposed to some of the other guys you mentioned. Williams has the size, arm length, and speed that they covet in an outside corner.

As for as it likely being a one-year deal, I am not so sure about that. Its structured that it can be that but it sure sounds like he's in the plans to start.

 

[Hawknballs]

Signing bonus is 5 years or life of the contract whichever is shorter.

(someone asked earlier)

I think there are some things you can and can't defer past the expiration of the current CBA

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

You could give Russ a 6 yr, 124m extension that's works out to 20.5 apy.

Give Russ a gtd boost to 5m this year. 3-4.

Give him a 35-40m roster bonus for 2016 that converts to Signing Bonus.

Give him a base salary that equates out to 13m minus the the 2015 boost to 5m to equal a 10m cap hit.

Then the rest of the contract he takes cap hits of 20, 21, 22, 23, 24 between '17-'21.

Russ is signed thru 2015-2021 and you don't have to worry about him restricting immediate cap space until 2017.

 

[Hyak]

Which is why almost all of Schneider's extensions have been in the player's last contract year with a 4-year extension.

Sherman, Thomas, Chancellor, Lynch (1st time), Unger, Avril, Wright all signed 4-year extensions in this scenario

 

[kidhawk]

Which is why almost all of Schneider's extensions have been in the player's last contract year with a 4-year extension.

Sherman, Thomas, Chancellor, Lynch (1st time), Unger, Avril, Wright all signed 4-year extensions in this scenario

I'm pretty sure Lynch was set to be a free agent when he signed his previous contract with us, but we re-signed him just before free agency. This time we did extend that original contract with a year left though.


John has said that he doesn't like to extend before a year, as it sets a bad precedent which is why Lynch didn't get an extension last year, but got one this year. But you are correct, John likes to extend rookie deals so he can use the last low paying salary year and couple it with the signing bonus to keep the cap under control and the players happy.

 

[Hyak]

You could give Russ a 6 yr, 124m extension that's works out to 20.5 apy.

Give Russ a gtd boost to 5m this year. 3-4.

Give him a 35-40m roster bonus for 2016 that converts to Signing Bonus.

Give him a base salary that equates out to 13m minus the the 2015 boost to 5m to equal a 10m cap hit.

Then the rest of the contract he takes cap hits of 20, 21, 22, 23, 24 between '17-'21.

Russ is signed thru 2015-2021 and you don't have to worry about him restricting immediate cap space until 2017.

I'd be surprised if they used a traditional contract structure like that with a very large signing bonus. Almost all of Schneider's deal have modest signing bonuses combined with higher guaranteed base salaries and/or roster bonuses. It keeps the team paying out cash in line with current production.

I looked at Aaron Rodgers contract from 2008 when Schneider was there and it was structured with minimal signing bonuses too.

Andrew Brandt has some good reference stuff on the whole cash=cap philosophy and Schneider is a product of that.

 

[Hawkfan77]

Why spend 7 million on Williams when you could have spent 1.5 milion on one year for Sterling Moore, or 2 million on one year for Patrick Robinson, or (likely) 1 million on one year for Tarrel Brown?

Because those guys don't fit at all what the Seahawks like from their CBs. Why sign someone who doesn't fit your system or the mold of CB you look for just because they're cheaper? Sure it's better for the cap (not that they are having any kind of cap trouble) but how does that help the team?

Why would they sign a bunch of non-fits?