Some Perspective

Statistics can, of course, be highly misleading. But, statistically, this is one of the best offenses in the league currently. Insane to even think about, but clear when looking at their first half performances.

They can run it. They can pass it. They just need to string it together somewhat consistently. This is Shane Waldron's first quarter of his first year as playcaller, and his start has been relatively promising.

The defense is terrible. No getting around it. With some marginal improvements, they can become at least somewhat passable. We saw it last season, and they started off just as badly, if not worse. Clean up the scheme, maybe fire KNJ (lol as if), and this team can at least make it to the dance again... with a more sustainable offense! It's far from guaranteed, but this offense is built better for the playoffs than 2020's.

Maybe Bless and Sidney can inject some life into the defensive backfield?

Pie in the sky? Sure. Not outside the realm of possibility though.

Still big decisions looming large in the future, but this could be salvagable.

As bad as it feels, and it's bad........still 14 games left.

Some pretty good 1-2 teams right now. Unfortunately, this looks like an average team. For now at least. Not sure I'm confident much will change under this current coaching staff.

SoulfishHawk":1cqn7bpl said:

As bad as it feels, and it's bad........still 14 games left.

Some pretty good 1-2 teams right now. Unfortunately, this looks like an average team. For now at least. Not sure I'm confident much will change under this current coaching staff.

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There's some really promising stuff there on offense. The run game looks dangerous, like they could really get going down the stretch. Russ is marginally better. Turnovers haven't hit yet.

If they figure out the second half wall they hit on offense, then they'll be in every single game, especially if they tighten the defense up just a bit.

The only stat that matters is the draft position. Currently the Hawks would be picking 10th.

I like Adams a lot but 3 young shut down DBs would have been nice too!

With the 10th pick, I think the scales tip towards the Jets getting the better deal.

Spohawks":25m3lpku said:

The only stat that matters is the draft position. Currently the Hawks would be picking 10th.

I like Adams a lot but 3 young shut down DBs would have been nice too!

With the 10th pick, I think the scales tip towards the Jets getting the better deal.

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:laugh: Worrying about draft position in September. :laugh:

Not to worry. I predict we'll draft in the 20's again, like always. :twisted:

I didn't think our defense could be worse than the start of last year but they must have taken that as a challenge & they are.

We can't use the injury, no training camp, they made the big play when needed excuse, they just plain can't stop anybody. The opposing offense doesn't even look the least bit confused about what to do. They know exactly what they're gonna do & they know it will easily work barring drops or turnovers. I don't know about anybody else but I'm getting tired of guys getting an extra 5 yards on a play because we have multiple tacklers trying to strip the ball instead of just tackling the guy.

To counteract the horrendous defense, our offense has decided to continue losing the time of possession battle by a wide margin, putting the defense in a terrible position, but instead of putting up points too quickly they've decided not to waste our time & just not even look like they're capable of moving the ball in the 2nd half of games.

At least there seemed to be some hope last year as 1 side of the ball was working at least but the last 2 games you just knew they weren't gonna change the momentum back in their favor.

There's still time to turn this around, on both sides of the ball, but we'd better start next week because we will be buried if we wait until week 8 or 9 like last year.

Hockey Guy":18vl4dxi said:

I didn't think our defense could be worse than the start of last year but they must have taken that as a challenge & they are.

We can't use the injury, no training camp, they made the big play when needed excuse, they just plain can't stop anybody. The opposing offense doesn't even look the least bit confused about what to do. They know exactly what they're gonna do & they know it will easily work barring drops or turnovers. I don't know about anybody else but I'm getting tired of guys getting an extra 5 yards on a play because we have multiple tacklers trying to strip the ball instead of just tackling the guy.

To counteract the horrendous defense, our offense has decided to continue losing the time of possession battle by a wide margin, putting the defense in a terrible position, but instead of putting up points too quickly they've decided not to waste our time & just not even look like they're capable of moving the ball in the 2nd half of games.

At least there seemed to be some hope last year as 1 side of the ball was working at least but the last 2 games you just knew they weren't gonna change the momentum back in their favor.

There's still time to turn this around, on both sides of the ball, but we'd better start next week because we will be buried if we wait until week 8 or 9 like last year.

Click to expand...

Part of the problem with TOP is the defense thrmselves. They are giving up 7 minute drives almost everytime in the 2nd half.

Captain Obvious time: A win on Sunday flat out changes the season. Just my opinion.

The word of the day is "systemic."

As in these issues and problems, especially on the defensive side of the ball have been a systemic issue for going on 5-6 years.

- Pete and John's failures to find difference makers in the draft, and when they have sorta drafted well with guys like Griffin and Reed, they haven't been able to keep the players.

- Red flags continue that your head coach who is supposed to be a defensive/defensive back guru cannot figure out how to develop his defenders into a cohesive at LEAST serviceable unit to compliment his offense.

- bad trades. We are now stuck with a glorified tackling safety who can't do the one thing we need him to do right now, pressure and cover. But Adams is very good at chasing down wide open receivers and tight ends making those gains only 15 yards and not 25 yards or more.

I am not asking for anyone to be fired, replaced, whatever. Because IMO Jody Allen doesn't have the stomach nor the football acumen to make any wholesale changes now, or even after another disappointing year.

She has entrusted Pete and John to run this team for the foreseeable future. So we are stuck with these systemic issues until Russell finally figures out how to get enough leverage to force his way out.

SoulfishHawk":2a06ppyi said:

Captain Obvious time: A win on Sunday flat out changes the season. Just my opinion.

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Yup, we need to see something.

John63":2dd6y0ve said:

Hockey Guy":2dd6y0ve said:

I didn't think our defense could be worse than the start of last year but they must have taken that as a challenge & they are.

We can't use the injury, no training camp, they made the big play when needed excuse, they just plain can't stop anybody. The opposing offense doesn't even look the least bit confused about what to do. They know exactly what they're gonna do & they know it will easily work barring drops or turnovers. I don't know about anybody else but I'm getting tired of guys getting an extra 5 yards on a play because we have multiple tacklers trying to strip the ball instead of just tackling the guy.

To counteract the horrendous defense, our offense has decided to continue losing the time of possession battle by a wide margin, putting the defense in a terrible position, but instead of putting up points too quickly they've decided not to waste our time & just not even look like they're capable of moving the ball in the 2nd half of games.

At least there seemed to be some hope last year as 1 side of the ball was working at least but the last 2 games you just knew they weren't gonna change the momentum back in their favor.

There's still time to turn this around, on both sides of the ball, but we'd better start next week because we will be buried if we wait until week 8 or 9 like last year.

Click to expand...

Part of the problem with TOP is the defense thrmselves. They are giving up 7 minute drives almost everytime in the 2nd half.

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You think.

I think I very succinctly covered that in the first 2 sentences of my post.

Sgt. Largent":r6suflji said:

The word of the day is "systemic."

As in these issues and problems, especially on the defensive side of the ball have been a systemic issue for going on 5-6 years.

- Pete and John's failures to find difference makers in the draft, and when they have sorta drafted well with guys like Griffin and Reed, they haven't been able to keep the players.

- Red flags continue that your head coach who is supposed to be a defensive/defensive back guru cannot figure out how to develop his defenders into a cohesive at LEAST serviceable unit to compliment his offense.

- bad trades. We are now stuck with a glorified tackling safety who can't do the one thing we need him to do right now, pressure and cover. But Adams is very good at chasing down wide open receivers and tight ends making those gains only 15 yards and not 25 yards or more.

I am not asking for anyone to be fired, replaced, whatever. Because IMO Jody Allen doesn't have the stomach nor the football acumen to make any wholesale changes now, or even after another disappointing year.

She has entrusted Pete and John to run this team for the foreseeable future. So we are stuck with these systemic issues until Russell finally figures out how to get enough leverage to force his way out.

Click to expand...

Agreed.

Sgt. Largent":yh5g8yd1 said:

I am not asking for anyone to be fired, replaced, whatever. Because IMO Jody Allen doesn't have the stomach nor the football acumen to make any wholesale changes now, or even after another disappointing year.

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As soon as the team quits making money (could be this year), she'll sell the club. Honestly, she needs to.

pittpnthrs":2zyp631i said:

Sgt. Largent":2zyp631i said:

I am not asking for anyone to be fired, replaced, whatever. Because IMO Jody Allen doesn't have the stomach nor the football acumen to make any wholesale changes now, or even after another disappointing year.

Click to expand...

As soon as the team quits making money (could be this year), she'll sell the club. Honestly, she needs to.

Click to expand...

It'll be interesting to see how this shakes out.

No one but Jody Allen knows this, but it's safe to assume she isn't super passionate about being a pro sports team owner, this team was handed to her. Which is why the first thing she did was give both Pete and John extensions so could just let them run the team.

So long term? Yes, I do think she probably will sell. But we have no idea when, my guess is it'll take years for her to work out all the particulars of Allen's estate, especially something as complicated as being an NFL team owner.

Which is why I said we're stuck with Pete and John at least through the end of their extensions, as I would be SHOCKED if Jody Allen fired them.

Sgt. Largent":3amvn1jx said:

The word of the day is "systemic."

As in these issues and problems, especially on the defensive side of the ball have been a systemic issue for going on 5-6 years.

- Pete and John's failures to find difference makers in the draft, and when they have sorta drafted well with guys like Griffin and Reed, they haven't been able to keep the players.

- Red flags continue that your head coach who is supposed to be a defensive/defensive back guru cannot figure out how to develop his defenders into a cohesive at LEAST serviceable unit to compliment his offense.

- bad trades. We are now stuck with a glorified tackling safety who can't do the one thing we need him to do right now, pressure and cover. But Adams is very good at chasing down wide open receivers and tight ends making those gains only 15 yards and not 25 yards or more.

I am not asking for anyone to be fired, replaced, whatever. Because IMO Jody Allen doesn't have the stomach nor the football acumen to make any wholesale changes now, or even after another disappointing year.

She has entrusted Pete and John to run this team for the foreseeable future. So we are stuck with these systemic issues until Russell finally figures out how to get enough leverage to force his way out.

Click to expand...

Sadly, this is exactly it.

Since we are in positions to do anything about it, except for maybe not purchasing merchandise, game tickets, and it watching the games in TV itself, maybe we just gotta accept the fact that Carroll is here to stay for as long as Jody owns the team.

Jody is not a football person and probably doesn’t even care so looks like we are in for some MORE really frustrating years to come.

This really sucks, man…

In my view our drafting issue is predominantly due to a lack of draft capital. Of course that doesn't take the FO off the hook, since they are the ones trading away that draft capital. With each passing game the Adams trade looks like an increasingly uphill battle to justify. If we are looking for a bright spot it is that if the deal ever does look justified then Adams is going to be killing it.

On defense overall I don't think the scheme in the main issue. In my view our corner play has been bad but our LB play has also been surprisingly inadequate. That's the biggest problem in my view, as getting bad corner play from a unit that you aren't paying anything to should be expected. Whereas we have a ton of money wrapped up at LB, Brooks and Barton were relatively early picks, and many of those screens we've been struggling against are the LBs responsibility. I think there's a good chance that we are 3-0 right now with KJ Wright instead of Brooks, and that's a big problem. Getting OK safety play from enormously paid safeties is also a problem.

On offense there are certainly the pieces in place to be excited about, but it remains completely inexplicable to me how they can look creative and efficient in the first half only to completely shut down in the second half. I will give Waldron the benefit of the doubt here for at least the first half of this season as a first time play caller, but there are guys out there who are good football minds but not cut out for calling plays.

As far as team construction goes I do not want to see any trades for a CB that would involve giving up draft capital. We should have higher expectations for the offense given the discrepancy in payroll and the way this team makes the playoffs is the 2019 Chiefs model where we win some moderately high scoring games.

Outside of CB they do not have a talent issue on defense. This should be a middle of the pack defense at worst talent wise.

They have a scheme & system issue. Pete is playing checkers, and the field has lapped him.

They are a poorly coached team on defense. There is a difference.

This isn't a poorly coached defense.

This is a terribly coached defense.

The rest I agree with, this should be, a middle-of-the-pack defense by roster makeup.

Pete is handing advantages to his opponents and it is screwing the players that have to play on this defense.

SoulfishHawk":1lpibxcy said:

Captain Obvious time: A win on Sunday flat out changes the season. Just my opinion.

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It does. This week is more important than next week. If you think the Rams are what people think, you have to win this week. A loss is bad. A loss that looks the same as the last 2 weeks, you might as well flush it. I can't imagine the pressure if they go into the Rams game 1-3.

Sgt. Largent":383n4b6z said:

The word of the day is "systemic."

As in these issues and problems, especially on the defensive side of the ball have been a systemic issue for going on 5-6 years.

- Pete and John's failures to find difference makers in the draft, and when they have sorta drafted well with guys like Griffin and Reed, they haven't been able to keep the players.

- Red flags continue that your head coach who is supposed to be a defensive/defensive back guru cannot figure out how to develop his defenders into a cohesive at LEAST serviceable unit to compliment his offense.

- bad trades. We are now stuck with a glorified tackling safety who can't do the one thing we need him to do right now, pressure and cover. But Adams is very good at chasing down wide open receivers and tight ends making those gains only 15 yards and not 25 yards or more.

I am not asking for anyone to be fired, replaced, whatever. Because IMO Jody Allen doesn't have the stomach nor the football acumen to make any wholesale changes now, or even after another disappointing year.

She has entrusted Pete and John to run this team for the foreseeable future. So we are stuck with these systemic issues until Russell finally figures out how to get enough leverage to force his way out.

Click to expand...

I think they have a technique problem at CB. Pete always liked the long physical corners for a reason. Their length could affect the play on the ball and they could be physical. You can't play corner like that anymore. You could barely do it back then. How many flags did we garner on our secondary during those years. These days it would be a steady march down the field on PI/holding penalties. Corners have to be ultra athletic now with speed. You can't touch these guys now. You need quick/fast point guards out there now. you have to able to make up ground in a hurry. I just don't think Pete has a handle on what that 'guy' looks like anymore.

As usually, all of these trends start in the college game and trickle up. Linebackers are the same way now. You need ligher faster hybrid guys that can cover sideline to sideline cause offenses are making defenses cover the field horizontally and vertically at the same time. The perfect example is Alabama and Saban. He had to change the body type he was pulling at linebacker and d end to some extent. I think it's the main reason the Rams are such a problem for us. Even as good as Bobby and KJ have been. They just weren't fast enough or quick enough to deal with all that horizontal action in the passing game.