Carroll second to Belichick?

[LawlessHawk]

No worries, PC will jump ahead of Belichick right after the Hawks complete their three-peat in Santa Clara.

 

[Tech Worlds]

Number 2? No respect I tell you!

 

[Feed the Hawk]

Belichick went 11-5 with Matt Cassel at QB. Nuff said.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I wonder how the same GM ranked Belichick. Its not as if his schemes are innovative.

Actually Belichick is one of the most innovative schemers in NFL history, and is the strongest part of his coaching philosophy.

He's mastered taking away his opponents biggest strength, and pioneered the mastery of the bringing in practice squad players for the sheer purpose of mimicking his weekly opponents. Just to name a few.

I love Pete, but his innovations have been more on the HOW to coach and get the best out players side, rather than the X's and O's scheming of the game.

Here are a few links talking about Belichick's strategies and schemes

http://dbjpq4m8xws63.cloudfront.net/gal ... hart-image

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Englan ... s_strategy

 

[Meeker]

I wonder how the same GM ranked Belichick. Its not as if his schemes are innovative.

Actually Belichick is one of the most innovative schemers in NFL history, and is the strongest part of his coaching philosophy.

He's mastered taking away his opponents biggest strength, and pioneered the mastery of the bringing in practice squad players for the sheer purpose of mimicking his weekly opponents. Just to name a few.

I love Pete, but his innovations have been more on the HOW to coach and get the best out players side, rather than the X's and O's scheming of the game.

Here are a few links talking about Belichick's strategies and schemes

Belichick is a very good X's and O's coach, but thats not the same as innovative. What exactly about his defenses has been innovative? Also, the bolded has nothing to do with schemes, which is the only thing I'm talking about.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I wonder how the same GM ranked Belichick. Its not as if his schemes are innovative.

Actually Belichick is one of the most innovative schemers in NFL history, and is the strongest part of his coaching philosophy.

He's mastered taking away his opponents biggest strength, and pioneered the mastery of the bringing in practice squad players for the sheer purpose of mimicking his weekly opponents. Just to name a few.

I love Pete, but his innovations have been more on the HOW to coach and get the best out players side, rather than the X's and O's scheming of the game.

Here are a few links talking about Belichick's strategies and schemes

Belichick is a very good X's and O's coach, but thats not the same as innovative. What exactly about his defenses has been innovative? Also, the bolded has nothing to do with schemes, which is the only thing I'm talking about.

Bringing in practice squad players for the specific purpose of scheming against your opponents is innovative, and Belichick was adept at managing his roster during the year to maximize that.

He'd pull in guys off the street that were carbon copies of certain key players on his opponents teams, when most teams would try to find guys on their own roster, which rarely works because it's not the same type of player. So IMO that is very innovative.

Have you guys really never read or heard that Belichick is one of the great schemers? I thought that was common knowledge.

 

[Meeker]

I wonder how the same GM ranked Belichick. Its not as if his schemes are innovative.

Actually Belichick is one of the most innovative schemers in NFL history, and is the strongest part of his coaching philosophy.

He's mastered taking away his opponents biggest strength, and pioneered the mastery of the bringing in practice squad players for the sheer purpose of mimicking his weekly opponents. Just to name a few.

I love Pete, but his innovations have been more on the HOW to coach and get the best out players side, rather than the X's and O's scheming of the game.

Here are a few links talking about Belichick's strategies and schemes

Belichick is a very good X's and O's coach, but thats not the same as innovative. What exactly about his defenses has been innovative? Also, the bolded has nothing to do with schemes, which is the only thing I'm talking about.

Bringing in practice squad players for the specific purpose of scheming against your opponents is innovative, and Belichick was adept at managing his roster during the year to maximize that.

He'd pull in guys off the street that were carbon copies of certain key players on his opponents teams, when most teams would try to find guys on their own roster, which rarely works because it's not the same type of player. So IMO that is very innovative.

Have you guys really never read or heard that Belichick is one of the great schemers? I thought that was common knowledge.

Again, simulating your opponent, which may have been innovative, has nothing to do with the scheme being run so has no factor in what I'm talking about. And again, being a great X's and O's guy (aka schemer) does not require innovation and does not make a coach innovative. Its like when you hear people say how revolutionary Jimmy Graham or Shannon Sharpe were as TEs. Sure they are very good at what they do and that may make them HOFers (obviously not in Graham's case yet), but that doesn't make them revolutionary, as far as I know Kellen Winslow did that.

 

[MadSweeney]

The most amazing part is that with the job they've done turning over the roster and brilliantly finding/adapting players with depth behind them and competitive spirit...that neither Pete or John have won their respective OY awards.

 

[253hawk]

Not far off from #1.

The 6 that voted for Fisher are smoking some serious dope.

 

[Sarlacc83]

Belichek has helped himself to innovation by taping other team's practices. I mean, no one cares, but it goes to show the NFL doesn't, either.

Probably still a very good coach and number one by accomplishment, but his methods tend to be dubious at best.

 

[HansGruber]

Belichek has helped himself to innovation by taping other team's practices. I mean, no one cares, but it goes to show the NFL doesn't, either.

Probably still a very good coach and number one by accomplishment, but his methods tend to be dubious at best.

As bogus as the claims that Seattle cheated with PEDs or holding.

How would anyone benefit by taping a practice? You build your game plan days or weeks before walk-throughs by watching film of their tendencies. By the time teams are doing walk throughs, they've already set their schemes and practiced for them. So you're going to ignore months worth of film and scouting because you saw your opponent practicing some plays you've already seen on film, at half speed, against their practice squad?

Fans just can't admit when some team is better than theirs so the excuses come out. We hate repeat winners. We root for underdogs and pray that the bad guys lose.

Cheating is the excuse of losers.

 

[Scottemojo]

Pretty stunning how relatively far down the list the Harbaughs are.

 

[mikeak]

Bellicheck the coach also has to overcome the failures of Bellicheck the GM. PC benefits from having JS as GM

 

[kearly]

Surprised to see Reid at #4. I think he's arguably top ten, but seeing him at #4 really surprised me.

Jeff Fisher to me is Ken Wisenhunt with more tenure. Actually, I think I would like Wisenhunt more as a coach, if not for the team outright quitting on him in 2012.

 

[Sarlacc83]

Belichek has helped himself to innovation by taping other team's practices. I mean, no one cares, but it goes to show the NFL doesn't, either.

Probably still a very good coach and number one by accomplishment, but his methods tend to be dubious at best.

As bogus as the claims that Seattle cheated with PEDs or holding.

How would anyone benefit by taping a practice? You build your game plan days or weeks before walk-throughs by watching film of their tendencies. By the time teams are doing walk throughs, they've already set their schemes and practiced for them. So you're going to ignore months worth of film and scouting because you saw your opponent practicing some plays you've already seen on film, at half speed, against their practice squad?

Fans just can't admit when some team is better than theirs so the excuses come out. We hate repeat winners. We root for underdogs and pray that the bad guys lose.

Cheating is the excuse of losers.

Oh, is that why the NFL fined them and took away a draft pick? Wow. You sure got me. (However, Goodell destroyed the tapes, because there are no vacated wins in the NFL. I understand the reason, even if I don't agree with it.) As for how that would benefit a team, that's such a ludicrous statement. I mean, it's not like teams have ever installed a different part of the playbook or trick plays in practice.

There are excuses, and then there are facts. I don't even know why it would be whining, seeing as Seattle didn't play them. Furthemore, you're obviously offended because you want to put Billy above coaches like Walsh or Lombardi, so you need to handwave the punishment away because it severely undermines your argument. Too bad, it happened. Mangini, who worked for Belicheck, was the one who called him out for it. I imagine he had something like inside knowledge. After all, it's not like the Patriots have failed to win a championship after the spy scandal or anything - lending zero credence to the accusations, right?

Look, Belicheck is still a very good coach, and I've said such. However, I doubt without the spying, he lands in the top 10 coaches all time.

And just for the hell of it, even though you've already been thoroughly whupped here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Natio ... ontroversy

Yeah, just like the accusations of holding. Not.

 

[kearly]

I actually respect a coach who finds sneaky ways to cheat just a bit. Baseball is infamous for finding ways to cheat and get away with it. There is a lot of that in the NFL too, and it's usually the smartest coaches that explore ways to gain an edge or exploit loopholes. It's not a coincidence that the two best coaches in the NFL have been accused of being cheaters.

I would much rather have a coach who is constantly looking for ways to give his team an edge and occasionally runs afoul of the rules than a sanctimonious type who lacks imagination (Jeff Fisher, etc).

 

[chris98251]

Innovation? takes CB's that are deemed to big, a too small FS and a LB for a SS and builds the best modern era backfield, takes a too short QB and he matches Mannings records and wins a Super Bowl.

Pete takes very fast and big athletes and puts them in a system that is about execution and discipline and teaches them technique. You don't have to be extravagant with a certain player that if lost ruins your system if you build with youth and good habits and techniques and bring out the best in players.

This is the dumb like a Fox approach.

 

[MrCarey]

The Matt Cassel season is another great reason why he should be #1 on top of the 3 rings.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Another day, another list, geezus this season needs to start!

I'm just glad Pete is the coach of the SuperbOwl Champions.

 

[olyfan63]

Well, considering that Belichick is the best NFL coach in the history of the game, it's a flattering spot to place Carroll.

While I don't disagree with your post in spirit, Bill Walsh is probably actually the best NFL coach ever. He made the passing game extremely viable at the pro level, building on what Don Coryell did at SDSU.

Pete Carroll spent tremendous amounts of time and energy learning everything he could from Bill Walsh, including organization-building wisdom. Carroll was part of the 49er organization in the mid-90s when Walsh was on staff as a consultant. Pete writes about his efforts to learn from Walsh quite a bit in his book "Win Forever".

One of Pete's other key mentors has been John Wooden, though not so much in person as with Walsh, as through Wooden's books.

It looks like USC's 54-10 victory over Oklahoma in the 2005 Orange Bowl for the national championship was Pete's blueprint for the 2014 Super Bowl! The Youtube highlights evoke a similar feel: destruction.
Pete's mentor Bill Walsh wrote a nice piece on Pete and that win here:
http://smartfootball.com/grab-bag/bill- ... Xshnx.dpbs

Quoting Bill Walsh:
"Pete Carroll is the most dynamic coach in all of football right now. He’s able to motivate men and bring them together, assemble a top coaching staff, and he has so much enthusiasm and energy. He also has incredible knowledge of the game. He’s been one of the top defensive coordinators in the NFL, and he’s got a great football mind. - See more at: http://smartfootball.com/grab-bag/bill- ... Xshnx.dpuf"