Much rather have Tate then Harvin

[Natethegreat]

Banging on Tate who wanted to stay here but was offered a FAR lower contract is low imo. I am not a guy who thinks Tate is the greatest(just that Harvins' cost is/was way to much) but I'm pretty sure if you could make 3 million more somewhere else you would do it.

 

[brettb3]

I'm disappointed in Tate's reaction to this situation. I realize he has an ego like every professional athlete, but he needs a reality check. At some level he has to understand that the Seahawks are operating under a hard salary cap, and they can't afford to pay everyone what they're worth. And him claiming that a large # of 12's have turned on him based on some tweets is just laughable. He could learn something from Big Red, who handled his departure much more maturely and gracefully.

 

[BamKam]

Lol some of you guys are pretty ruthless regarding Tate. I am sure most of you have been in a career decision where you had to decide between 6 mill/year and 3.5 mill/year.

Please stop acting like he said he would play here for free. That is the one thing that has really irritated me throughout this whole deal, people keep bringing up that interview where he said he would like to play for a winner and take "a little less" right after he won the Super Bowl and emotions were high.

 

[Largent80]

And believing what he says is gospel right?

I'm glad he went to Detroit where he will feel appreciated, and BTW, I was one of his biggest fans, I met him at the rookie symposium in La Costa with some maple bars and spent over an hour telling him about Seattle. Don't tell me I'm low for feeling the way I do.

 

[hawknation2014]

Of course, the contract offered had to be several million dollars less than the $6.2 million offered by Detroit. We could not afford more than $3-4 million per year. I would guess we offered nearly half of what Detroit was willing to pay. $3 million is laughable in comparison to $6 million, but it wasn't unjustified. Calvin Johnson is making $400k less than Harvin this year. We're paying our slot receiver $13.4 million this year and will soon have to sign Thomas, Wilson, and Sherman to long-term deals. With an understanding of the situation, it was best for everyone to part ways.

 

[WilsonMVP]

The more I think about it the more sick I get .

Tate is better then Harvin . I know Harvin is more explosive and blah blah blah . The guy just can't stay healthy .
Trading for Harvin is by far the worst move John S has ever made .

Just imagine for a moment that we had Tate for 5/31m and Cordelle Patterson on the rookie pay scale . We would still have 7m a year in cap room to extend the likes of Sherman/Thomas/Wilson/Wright/Wagner/Okung and the list goes on .

I love when people immediately assume the Seahawks would have drafted Cordarrelle Patterson just because he wound up going to the Vikings.

Well it's not entirely out of the realm of possibility that if we didn't acquire Harvin, we might have taken Patterson ahead of the Vikings.

A better argument is Patterson isn't even in the same class as Harvin. Dude played 16 games, and only had 450 yards and 4 TD's. So to think we'd have the same production out of a 6'2'' WR vs. a guy like Harvin who when healthy is going to be involved in like 30-40% of our offensive plays? Ludicrous.

Except Patterson was like 3rd or 4th on the depthchart and it took until the last 5-6 games for Musgrave to actually use him like they used Harvins with Runs and what not. He had 3 rushing TDs in the last 5 games. I think Harvin will have better Stats than Patterson this year but Patterson will have a pretty good year IMO.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

I'm disappointed in Tate's reaction to this situation. I realize he has an ego like every professional athlete, but he needs a reality check. At some level he has to understand that the Seahawks are operating under a hard salary cap, and they can't afford to pay everyone what they're worth. And him claiming that a large # of 12's have turned on him based on some tweets is just laughable. He could learn something from Big Red, who handled his departure much more maturely and gracefully.

Exactly. Be happy that a team valued you and had the cap space to give you a very nice contract. And in an offense that will maximize his chances for a good 3rd contract.

 

[scutterhawk]

I think a lot of people here have tied the Percy Harvin signing, to the releasing of Golden Tate, and I don't believe that's the case at all.
Tying the acquisition of Harvin to the releasing of Tate is only exacerbating the issue.
If anything, I believe Baldwins 2013 kick butt Season, and the way that Kearse played lights out after his obviously successful eye surgery, made keeping Tate less of a necessity, especially for the kind of money that was thrown at him by the Detroit Lions.
Percy Harvin stays healthy, and plays as good for us as he did for the Vikings, the money he gets, will justified.
There's also another silly notion that is being plugged around here, and that is, we are a "Run First" Offense, and that we really don't have a need for a true #1 Receiver because of it, and that's absurd.
That's like saying that Wilson is great at just handing the ball off, and that he really only needs to throw the ball on rare occasions.
The Seahawks aren't a 65% run to 35% pass, and the only way you keep the Defenses from consistently stacking the box, is by having great Receivers to keep their asses off balance, so I say we need to find a replacement for Tate, someone that's as feisty and durable.
ALSO, this comparison of Tate's Numbers as a Seahawk, to Harvin's numbers as a Viking is bogus, as the two teams have two entirely different Coaching philosophies.

 

[Largent80]

Bottom line is money. Gotta get those millions. This sucks for fans, makes it hard to like these PLAYERS.

Glad we finally won a title. With all the greed, it seems like a once in a lifetime affair.

Edited by chris98251

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I think a lot of people here have tied the Percy Harvin signing, to the releasing of Golden Tate, and I don't believe that's the case at all.

Maybe not ENTIRELY separate. They do both play WR, so having 20M tied up into two WR isn't smart for a run first team.

It's all about need and philosophy when it comes to spending cap space. We're a defense 1st, run 1st team, so that's where our cap dollars are going to go. Like Pete said, Harvin was a special kind of player, which is why we broke the bank to get him.

Now he has to produce.

 

[drdiags]

I'm disappointed in Tate's reaction to this situation. I realize he has an ego like every professional athlete, but he needs a reality check. At some level he has to understand that the Seahawks are operating under a hard salary cap, and they can't afford to pay everyone what they're worth. And him claiming that a large # of 12's have turned on him based on some tweets is just laughable. He could learn something from Big Red, who handled his departure much more maturely and gracefully.

I doubt Big Red was catching any flak on twitter about being cut (plus he probably is smart and avoided having an acct on twitter). The dude said in the heat of the moment that he would take a little less to remain in Seattle is now being spun as a liar. His immaturity has cost him in the past. New lesson learned. Don't ever allow a reporter to trap you into making statements you will regret later.

He didn't like the Seahawks offer. Detroit gave him a better one. Leave it at that, stay off twitter or just block all the folks flipping you crap and move on with life. I think any active pro needs to think twice about how active they are with twitter. You saw it with BMW and his reaction to getting attack by the fans when he let them down. Same applies here. If ADB is smart, he should prepare for the same type of reaction. Same with Wilson, ETIII and any of the other Seahawks players. Some of the fan adulation can turn to scorn. Pros have to know this and learn to count to 10, block the idiots and move on.

At the end of the day, Tate got his money and a potentially more fruitful offense and a closer to home geographical location. What ever mixed feelings he had about leaving his buddies in the locker room have to be quelled by the backlash from some of his once adoring fans.

 

[onanygivensunday]

Detroit overpaid.

Tate would be better off if he suspended his twitter account until the regular season starts.

 

[RolandDeschain]

Tate would be better off if he suspended his twitter account until the regular season starts.

Actually, it sounds like you would be the one better off if he suspended his Twitter account.

 

[Seeker]

Harvin misses about the average number of games a running back does over the course of a season, he just gets put on the shelf more because smart coaches with lots of depth understand the importance of not wasting him in games. he was literally put on the shelf for almost the entire season and in the two times he ran the ball back he had a 60 yard return and a 99 yard touchdown in the superbowl.

 

[jammerhawk]

This is a rather silly thread, b/c we can only have Harvin.

Many of the responses are I'd rather have them both. To that I'd say, "me too"!!! Forced with a choice I'm taking Percy every day but will miss GT.

Most that are negative about PH probably haven't watched too much of him when he was at Minnie. Either that or they are relying on what some others have written negatively about PH. His injury situation is nothing he can control but most of the negativity around it is quite overblown. Prior to the high ankle sprain that happened against us in 2012 his only missed games were to his migraines which were figured out with some diet and medication changes. Since 2012 with few touches his YP touch numbers are amazing.

Just so you know PC and JS are very excited about the dynamic must cover options that PH brings to the O. Their opinion is more informed than any here and they know what he can do. He was a factor in our SB win even with the limited number of plays he had last season. He is nothing less than an opposing DC's worst nightmare as Harvin can take over a game and instantly hit a home run if not controlled. There was a reason that he was considered for OPOY even when he missed 6 games the year before he came to us. If he's lined up in the backfield he requires attention, and freaky fast getting to the edge. If he's in the slot or on the edge he requires double coverage. The reality of him being on the field forces opposing D's to focus multiple coverages to him and away from other players. When he gets the ball he's simply dangerous and that isn't always true of Tate. Healthy Percy's potentially a top ten player in the whole league, Tate isn't.

I'm glad we have have him, and am hoping to see some wonderful things from him next season.

 

[brettb3]

Bottom line is money. Gotta get those millions. This sucks for fans, makes it hard to like these Players.

Glad we finally won a title. With all the greed, it seems like a once in a lifetime affair.

Why? I don't like some of the comments Tate made, but he would have been stupid to take a much lesser deal from Seattle. Every fan would have done the same thing. It also doesn't change our prospects for winning a title one bit. It works out for both sides.

 

[kearly]

I love Tate and feared the day would come that we'd lose him in his prime. But doesn't it just say it all when Pete trades away the better part of a draft and $11 million in cap space for Harvin and then lowballs the shit out of Tate?

Tate is a great player who has some similarities to Harvin. But Tate does not terrify defenses on kickoffs and fly sweeps like Harvin does. Harvin changes an entire offense. Tate is great, but he's a supporting cast kind of guy. I think Tate will make us regret losing him, but let's not downplay how crucial Harvin is out to our team going forward. IMO, he's the Earl Thomas of our offense. He's not around the ball a ton, but his mere presence on the field makes everyone else's job much easier.

 

[Hawks46]

Tate has been fortunate to not be injured. Odds are that he will eventually. And I would believe that Harvin would have demolished Tates production if he played as much. That runback in the SB was worth a years production in my eyes.

I also think people are way too worried about cap money. It is what it is.

I'd disagree with this slightly. Harvin's return *emotionally* was worth the lack of production, but only because Hawk fans were catching so much crap about Harvin being out from other jealous fan bases. Honestly, we really didn't even need that return. Sure, that killed the Broncos spirit the rest of the way, but a long drive for a TD would've done the same thing; and if anyone thinks we weren't scoring on that opening drive, they're crazy. That return was icing on the cake.

Harvin's biggest contribution was both of those sweeps. You could just see it; Denver was totally unprepared for the first one, and Harvin's speed terrified pretty much everyone on that side of the ball, except Pot Roast. He was just confused. The 2nd sweep, the Broncos saw that one coming, but still couldn't adjust for Harvin's speed. I think that did the most to open up the offense a bit.

I agree with the OP's sentiment. Tate has been more consistent than Harvin, and it's not just this year. I don't remember a time when Tate was ever injured, and with his playing style, that's saying something. As for McGruff's post about Tate's inconsistencies and disappearing in the playoffs; I agree with the disappearing act as a WR, but to break it down to only his receiving numbers is a bit myopic, Tate is a hell of a blocker and he routinely seals his guy (either inside or his CB to the outside) on running plays and TE receptions out his side.

He was also one of the most consistent punt returners in the NFL. When Tate was on the field, you ALWAYS got something. And Tate was always on the field. So in that aspect, he has Harvin beat.

I'm not thrilled with Harvin's contract, but in going with Harvin, you're taking a gamble. It's higher risk/higher reward than going with Tate (both performance and contractually). We can afford to do that because ....A. Harvin fits our offense better, with his versatility out of the backfield, and B. we're a run first team that doesn't rely consistently on the pass, and C. we also live by the big play on offense. We plod away with runs and body blows to the defense, then uppercut with big plays and score our points. Harvin is the ultimate big play at any given time; it doesn't have to be scripted, it can be a routine slant, sweep, etc.

We're deep enough that we can afford Harvin to not always carry us. We're going to need more of Harvin now that Tate is gone, but I think if we draft another quality WR we'll be ok.

 

[jewhawk]

Banging on Tate who wanted to stay here but was offered a FAR lower contract is low imo.

+1

The fact is Tate is worth more to the Lions than he is to us right now. They had Megatron and no secondary targets. We have two good, cheap #2s to fill Tate's role for less money. I like Tate and hope he does well in Detroit, but it doesn't make sense for a team with Baldwin and Kearse making peanuts to pay $6M+ a year for another similar player.

To the original topic, there is just no comparison to Harvin. Tate is a very good #2; Harvin is one of the league's most dynamic weapons who completely changes the way teams have to defend us.

 

[Seahawk Sailor]

He says everything about Seattle was awesome, but the contract offered was laughable. This is not a contradiction at all. Seattle was awesome. He loved it here and wanted to stay. And the contract they offered him was considerably lower than Detroit's offer. Sounds to me like he was hurt and pissed he couldn't have stayed here. Sounds to me like it was a damned-if-you-do/damned-if-you-don't scenario for him. Either take almost half your salary pay cut which is far under market value, or head out to Detroit.

And it seems to me the same fans that are calling him greedy and worse, are the same ones who rail against corporations for not paying a fair salary because they won't raise the minimum wage.