Restructure Red, Clemons, sign Allen and let Bennet Walk

[MizzouHawkGal]

So does everyone else but will it actually happen? Remember we're the Seahawk fanbase and a more negative one there isn't beyond.... not even Cleveland.

 

[Vetamur]

DEs that get pressure and get sacks are vital, but are semi-common, and a rush from the outside can be manufactured to an extent. In the case we are talking about, letting Clemmons go, and putting Irvin back at DE would probably result in roughly the same amount of pressure for less money. A year off from rushing, playing LB has also improved Irvins ability against the run and overall feel for the game so he wouldnt be a liability against the run I believe. We have depth at LB and LBs are fairly easy to find. With Smith emerging we already have 3 starting quality LBs.

A DT that gets pressure and sacks is a more rare breed. Bennett is one of those. Its those rare producers that I believe JS and PC want to spend their money on and I agree with it. Keeping Bennett is vital, its not likely we could replace the production we get from him at DT, plus of course we has flexibility to play outside when we want a BUNCH of pass rushers on the field at the same time.

"Moneyball" is difficult to do in the NFL, but there are certain moves that operate on its principles and I think this is one of them.

Well, never mind..according to reports Irvin is staying at LB where we will be stacked with very good LBs (none great in my opinion).

So our LB's are just good and our WR's are just pedestrian...what next? Our quarterback is barely above average? What? They actually said this already about our WR's and quarterback.... really?

So, youre of the opinion that if you win the Super Bowl every member is an all star? You think KJ Wright is an All Pro caliber LB? Irvin is? How many impact plays did you see from Irvin this past season? Im not insulting our LB corps. They are good. But lets keep a grip on reality. They arent all stars, and thats in a sense by design. Our scheme depends on a solid DL and DBs, with the LBers being asked to fill in the gaps. Yes, thats a simplification. LBs have become sort of like RBs on some teams.. find a capable guy and put them in there. Our front office is just extremely good at finding the players with the skill sets needed for our defense. Thats their genius. But dont start believing that every single player on our team is an All Pro.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Heck no sir. I just disagree with your assessment that our linebackers are below average.

 

[AgentDib]

He was our best defensive lineman no doubt but I don't think that anyone would be able to argue that Allen would have had a much better season. You are talking about a guy that finished with 11 and a half sacks on a defense full of nobodies.

There is a lot wrong with this. Jared Allen is an edge rusher while Bennett provides interior pressure. They are not substitutes for each other.

Furthermore, plenty of edge rushers pile up sacks when they are playing on bad defenses because they get the lion's share of their teams sacks. Look at how Clemons' stats dropped off this season with McDaniel and Bennett providing pressure inside and Avril providing additional edge rush. Defense is a team effort and the Seahawks had much better pressure this year with pressure coming from everywhere despite the lower numbers of the individuals.

I never said the sky is falling. Just saying I'd rather keep Red and Clem at reduced cost and find a good plug and play guy like Allen who has something to play for rather than overpaying for a guy that may just have been playing for a contract.

You are still talking about "plugging in" a DE for a DT.

 

[mikeak]

The Cap is $6 million higher than expected. Several teams are rolling over large amounts of money. Last year was a down year for free agents which is how we got Avril & Bennet at a good rental rate.

Rather resign than open competition against everyone else

 

[BlueBlood]

Heck no sir. I just disagree with your assessment that our linebackers are below average.

I agree with you..

We all need to remember that the scheme we play can affect the way certain player's are seen in the box score. Linebacker, D Line on defense are similarly lower statistically as is the quarterback, tight ends and recievers are on offense.

Just because they look "pedestrian" doesn't mean they are. Each of those positions contributed to what was an amazing championship team by doing exactly what was asked of them schematically which obviously took some statistical sacrifice.

Power running and a top flight pass defense with a standard four man rotating pass rush made those other positions look weaker statistically.

Ask linebackers go, I think we have one of the better units in the NFL. They are young, fast, hit hard and do exactly what they're told while sacrificing personal accolades for the greater good.

Yes, the greater good.

 

[BlueBlood]

He was our best defensive lineman no doubt but I don't think that anyone would be able to argue that Allen would have had a much better season. You are talking about a guy that finished with 11 and a half sacks on a defense full of nobodies.

There is a lot wrong with this. Jared Allen is an edge rusher while Bennett provides interior pressure. They are not substitutes for each other.

Furthermore, plenty of edge rushers pile up sacks when they are playing on bad defenses because they get the lion's share of their teams sacks. Look at how Clemons' stats dropped off this season with McDaniel and Bennett providing pressure inside and Avril providing additional edge rush. Defense is a team effort and the Seahawks had much better pressure this year with pressure coming from everywhere despite the lower numbers of the individuals.

I never said the sky is falling. Just saying I'd rather keep Red and Clem at reduced cost and find a good plug and play guy like Allen who has something to play for rather than overpaying for a guy that may just have been playing for a contract.

You are still talking about "plugging in" a DE for a DT.

I'd rather have Allen on the edge than Bennett inside. Pressure is pressure and a sack is a sack. With Allen on the edge the interior will be even softer.

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

Let Bennett walk and our D-line will likely go back to how it was before he got here. You know, not consistent or good enough.

Clemons is another year older, and he might be gone.

So Avril is our best pass rusher, and the knock on him is that he shows up big in bunches and then disappears.

So, sounds like our line before Bennett got here.

Funny, how you say our line is not good enough and how it all must be because of Bennett.

If Clemons or even Jason Jones played that in that Atlanta play-off game, its probably a different story and the Seahawks are playing the NFC CF in San Fran. And who knows what happens after.

Michael Bennett is a very good player, very quality player, but let's not like he was the only one our D-Line doing anything.

Bennett wasn't even our best D-Line player last season it was Brandon Mebane.

Bennett also wasn't even our most productive D-Line player last year. Sure, he led the team in sacks with 8.5 but it was Cliff Avril with 8.0 sacks, and 5 or 6 Forced Fumbles and doing it in less games/snaps than Bennett . The strip sack: something Avril has done his whole career.

If anyone deserves to get 5 yr, 40-50 million contracts its Cliff Avril.

Also, Dan Quinn and by extension Travis Jones are the most valuable persons in terms of D-Line on this team. Quinn is the real reason why the D-Line were playing out of their minds this year not just because of Bennett. As long as we have Quinn, I'm confidence our D-Line will be astounding and prepared. And it will be Dan Quinn that pushes John Schnieder to sign Bennett at all costs if Quinn feels Bennet cannot be replaced through this draft, through this roster, or in free agency.

 

[Vetamur]

Heck no sir. I just disagree with your assessment that our linebackers are below average.

??? I called them "very good". You must be using a different English than me that "very good" = "below average"....

 

[BlueBlood]

Let Bennett walk and our D-line will likely go back to how it was before he got here. You know, not consistent or good enough.

Clemons is another year older, and he might be gone.

So Avril is our best pass rusher, and the knock on him is that he shows up big in bunches and then disappears.

So, sounds like our line before Bennett got here.

Funny, how you say our line is not good enough and how it all must be because of Bennett.

If Clemons or even Jason Jones played that in that Atlanta play-off game, its probably a different story and the Seahawks are playing the NFC CF in San Fran. And who knows what happens after.

Michael Bennett is a very good player, very quality player, but let's not like he was the only one our D-Line doing anything.

Bennett wasn't even our best D-Line player last season it was Brandon Mebane.

Bennett also wasn't even our most productive D-Line player last year. Sure, he led the team in sacks with 8.5 but it was Cliff Avril with 8.0 sacks, and 5 or 6 Forced Fumbles and doing it in less games/snaps than Bennett . The strip sack: something Avril has done his whole career.

If anyone deserves to get 5 yr, 40-50 million contracts its Cliff Avril.

Also, Dan Quinn and by extension Travis Jones are the most valuable persons in terms of D-Line on this team. Quinn is the real reason why the D-Line were playing out of their minds this year not just because of Bennett. As long as we have Quinn, I'm confidence our D-Line will be astounding and prepared. And it will be Dan Quinn that pushes John Schnieder to sign Bennett at all costs if Quinn feels Bennet cannot be replaced through this draft, through this roster, or in free agency.

Boooooom baby, said it way better than I did!

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Heck no sir. I just disagree with your assessment that our linebackers are below average.

??? I called them "very good". You must be using a different English than me that "very good" = "below average"....

You said great, which is so variable to interpretation. I believe Chancellor is great at least and likely a game changer and Wagner above average, if Irvin works out at WLB it will be unfair.

 

[The Radish]

:1:

 

[Veilside]

My off season wish is pretty much the opposite of this....

Cut Clemons and Red

Sign Bennett and Allen

Well that's a pipe dream. Maybe Im just overly concerned about being able to sign alllllll the guys I really want to keep.

Are people really that opposed to keeping Reds presence on the line? It's not like after the Superbowl he instantly aged 5 years and is washed up. He's a huge reason why we've been able to stop the run. I'll go on record as saying I want the guy back at a reduced rate because I believe he makes people around him better.

I really don't see it as being that out of the realm of possibility. I don't think we'll have to break the bank to keep Bennett and I wouldn't be surprised to see Allen sign an affordable deal. You know that guy's chomping at the bit to get on a contender plus he had an off year. I don't have a problem with Red staying but not at his current deal.

 

[Zebulon Dak]

Forgive Jo, she's drinkin rum and cokes tonight.

 

[The Radish]

Forgive Jo, she's drinkin rum and cokes tonight.

I'd wager she has better taste in alcohol than that.

:roll:

 

[plyka]

I'm not sure what left field you are living in but Bennet is the guy that made the D line go. He didn't always get sacks but even the talking heads agreed his pushing the pocket into QBs made all the difference.

He kept Peyton Manning with "happy feet" all day in the SuperB owl, what more can you say?

He was the missing piece that finally gave Seattle a true pass rush. All this talk about $10 million is just that, talk. None of us know what his figure is and are going to have to wait until we hear what is going on between the team and his agent.

Trust me, if you could lose anyone from that line its Big Red. Makes me sad to say that too but its true. To continue to possibly another championship we need Bennet or someone of his caliber. Easier to replace Red than Bennet.

:les:

This post i feel is a bit absurd. Even the OP admitted that Bennett was our best defensive linemen this year (something I disagree with) --but you went to the extreme that he is the sole driver, that he was the indispensable player, perhaps Reggie White reincarnate. Let's not go crazy. He is a very good player. But the Hawks have 4 new defensive linemen -the two Mcd's and of course Avril/Bennett. This idea that the difference between this year and last year is entirely due to Bennett, implicitly saying that Avril and the two Mcd's are average players, is ridiculous. I have no idea where it comes from.

I would easily rather get rid of Red than Bennett. But the heights to which Bennett has grown is becoming ludicrous. On another board someone claimed Bennett was the equal of Geno freakin Atkins, and now the post above. Bennet is a very good player. If he stays or goes, this team will be fine. He is not indispensable, he is not Geno Atkins, he is not Reggie White or Lawrence Taylor. He is a damn good player that we hope is here, but that really wont be missed if he goes to greener pastures because the coaching staff can replace him.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Forgive Jo, she's drinkin rum and cokes tonight.

I'd wager she has better taste in alcohol than that.

:roll:

Correct. He's on the right track though. Think a bit more "minty".

Also I do post from a phone and just decided to have a bit of fun tonight regardless.

 

[BlueBlood]

I post from a Phablet, HTC One Maxx to be honest, however unsure WTF that has to do with anything. :17:

 

[scutterhawk]

We've done the old veteran thing before, prefer not to go down that road ever again.

You bet, that's like a cheap Band-Aid that seems to keep falling off when you least expect it to.

 

[BlueBlood]

We've done the old veteran thing before, prefer not to go down that road ever again.

You bet, that's like a cheap Band-Aid that seems to keep falling off when you least expect it to.

Oh like Bennett.. He's no spring chicken and Allen is being called a band aid???? He's more like icing on the cake. Bennett isn't coming back anyway.