Serious Question

[poly1274]

I think you need to run but IMO the new NFL and part of the Pats sucess is the RB position being a very good receiving outlet. You need a dynamic back in todays NFL

I don't agree with the run, but I agree what you wrote about Pats sucess is the RB position being a very good receiving outlet.

Like Clemente Eagles RB 4 Catches 100 Yards 1 TD.
Danny Woodhead.
I still like Mike Davis, Rawls, CJ Prosise, JD MCkissic as RB catching the ball.

 

[RCATES]

Easy answer. RW is not capable of this plain and simple. What has this team done since Lynch left? Jack shit.

 

[original poster]

Easy answer. RW is not capable of this plain and simple. What has this team done since Lynch left? Jack shit.

Just so we're clear, capable of what, exactly? What is 'this' that you refer to?

 

[Hawknballs]

Hi! Welcome to Football.

Let me answer your question for you:

1.) The Clock


That's all, have a great day and you're welcome!

 

[poly1274]

IMO I want to use a few examples why Pass 100% might work.

The first example I want to say is that if you want to beat Seattle at home, you have to abandon the run. Just pass the ball, and you can win that. Seattle is very good at defending the run. The only game I remember when Seattle gave up so much yards @ Home was against that Rams team this year when they killed us.

Look at 2017 Schedule @ Home.

Cards, Rams, Falcons, Washington, They all won by throwing the ball and not really running it.


Example 2: If Aaron Rodgers or Brady was throwing the ball all the time, they would still win. It doesn't matter if you're one dimensional. Any Elite QB's can just win the game by passing. Many at Seahawks.Net fans believe that RW is a top tier QB. RW and Rodgers have better scrambling for yards than Brady or (Peyton at his prime) and I think that benefits them, as they can sometimes run and get 4-5 yards.

Example 3: The last reasoning why I believe that you don't need to pay for RB's and just sign up rookie's or give them minimum veteran salary. ( Just like Marcel Reece). Instead of paying for a good RB why not sign an decent DL like Sheldon.

 

[poly1274]

Hi! Welcome to Football.

Let me answer your question for you:

1.) The Clock


That's all, have a great day and you're welcome!

You still can kill the clock by getting 1st down. Most teams try to run the ball and after failing it 3x running the ball they Punt the ball and lose. I never seen an aggressive teams try to march the field or try to Pass the ball 3x. to get a 1st down.

That Texans v Patriots when Texans tried to kill the clock running it 3x, and they gave Brady enough time just to score a TD.

1st and 10 at NE 27
(3:23 - 4th) (Shotgun) L.Miller left tackle to NE 20 for 7 yards (K.Van Noy).

2nd and 3 at NE 20
(2:41 - 4th) L.Miller right guard to NE 18 for 2 yards (K.Van Noy).

(2:34 - 4th) Timeout #1 by NE at 02:34.

3rd and 1 at NE 18
(2:34 - 4th) (Shotgun) L.Miller up the middle to NE 18 for no gain (M.Brown, L.Guy). measurement

(2:28 - 4th) Timeout #1 by NE at 02:28.

4th and 1 at NE 18
(2:24 - 4th) K.Fairbairn 36 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-J.Weeks, Holder-S.Lechler.

 

[original poster]

If totally abandoning the run was a good idea and passing 100% of the time is the solution to failing teams problems, why don’t they do it?

With just how deep teams go into analysis and research, do you not think they’d have figured it out by now?

 

[mrt144]

If totally abandoning the run was a good idea and passing 100% of the time is the solution to failing teams problems, why don’t they do it?

With just how deep teams go into analysis and research, do you not think they’d have figured it out by now?

No team has the balls to do things at the min or max limits nor are there enough games in a season to robustly test ideas out.

As much as we like to imagine coaches are imbued with an almost predatory instinct towards solving the game of football, nothing could be further from the truth. Football coaches absolutely don't play the percentages as a whole, don't recursively evaluate their decisions and in fact let their emotions get the best of them at integral inflection points.

The myth that football coaches as a whole are extraordinary game players needs to die - they aren't and the constant gap between optimal play by statistical observation and NFL coaching decisions is profound. You might find individual cases where the coach beats alpha (that being league average results over tenure) but most of the people coaching in the NFL got there by connection, putting up with bullshit that most of us wouldn't, investing in a career that has narrow and specific opportunities, honing their craft with technique as position coaches before getting coordinator opportunities, managing the logistics of team coordination and congruency and many things that have nothing to do with simply being better at making better choices at the right moment.

I have more faith in chess players figuring out football than football coaches figuring out chess, if that makes sense. The 2nd line of yours makes it seem like the NFL is currently operating at perfect football coaching efficiency rather than operating at an acceptable entertaining equilibrium. If football has been figured out so thoroughly by the myriad coaches in the NFL, or if team outcomes are trivially impacted by coaching aptitude when it comes to strategic and tactical choices, then what explains the various levels of team outcomes from coach to coach - team talent alone?

That invokes a weird possibility - Bevell was actually infallible.

 

[mrt144]

100% pass might work on the following basis:

Opposing team is terrible against the pass.
Your QB can hit a variety of ranges and designs at roughly a 67% completion rate and at 70 Attempts per game (this isn't insignificant). This might depend on having 2 QBs in fact.
Your RBs are both good at blocking and pass catching which could allow for TEs to sub in that role
You have RBs that clown on LBs covering them in Man
You utilize passes that function like runs i.e. 3-4 yard gains that are very high percentage on completion

FWIW, I think the biggest problem with 100% pass is that there are diminishing returns at some point - if you could get the same output from 80% pass as with 100% pass, why wouldn't you opt to a slightly more flexible option? Or 70%. Also getting buy in from players on this might be hard and monotonous.

 

[TwistedHusky]

At some point, it depends on what you are good at and what the other team is good at.

Running the ball works better right now because most of the rules of the game are structured to assist the passer. The average QB is passing for close to 100 yards a game more now than a comparable QB in the 1980s. Because the ability to defend the passer is curtailed and penalties extend drives.

So how is that helpful to running the ball? Because everything is about stopping the passer. So defenses are lighter and faster, but that means a physical run game can tire them or simply bull through them.

But....

A team that specifically focused on passing the ball, would barely need to run it. In fact, the WCO was very close to that. Passes worked like runs in that offense and it worked. I actually imagine the Run and Shoot will make a comeback with some wrinkles soon too.

You don't need to run the ball if you have a way of making sure the defense cannot victimize you when they know you are going to pass.

And I think eventually, with more rule changes that inevitably result, there will be teams that find that they are more effective with some crazy CFL type of offense than running the ball. We already have offenses that 'only' pass, you see them all the time - the 2 minute offense. So we know it works. The other team knows it is coming, and they still often cannot stop the progress. Mike Leach could probably build an offense that works like that for a full game. Chip Kelly came close.

 

[AF_BASS_MAN]

Because being 1 dimensional is always a great idea.

 

[chris98251]

So you go Bandit plus and flood the passing lanes and rush three from different spots all the time, there goes your passing game and it becomes a interception fest.

 

[poly1274]

If totally abandoning the run was a good idea and passing 100% of the time is the solution to failing teams problems, why don’t they do it?

With just how deep teams go into analysis and research, do you not think they’d have figured it out by now?

No team has the balls to do things at the min or max limits nor are there enough games in a season to robustly test ideas out.

As much as we like to imagine coaches are imbued with an almost predatory instinct towards solving the game of football, nothing could be further from the truth. Football coaches absolutely don't play the percentages as a whole, don't recursively evaluate their decisions and in fact let their emotions get the best of them at integral inflection points.

The myth that football coaches as a whole are extraordinary game players needs to die - they aren't and the constant gap between optimal play by statistical observation and NFL coaching decisions is profound. You might find individual cases where the coach beats alpha (that being league average results over tenure) but most of the people coaching in the NFL got there by connection, putting up with bullshit that most of us wouldn't, investing in a career that has narrow and specific opportunities, honing their craft with technique as position coaches before getting coordinator opportunities, managing the logistics of team coordination and congruency and many things that have nothing to do with simply being better at making better choices at the right moment.

I have more faith in chess players figuring out football than football coaches figuring out chess, if that makes sense. The 2nd line of yours makes it seem like the NFL is currently operating at perfect football coaching efficiency rather than operating at an acceptable entertaining equilibrium. If football has been figured out so thoroughly by the myriad coaches in the NFL, or if team outcomes are trivially impacted by coaching aptitude when it comes to strategic and tactical choices, then what explains the various levels of team outcomes from coach to coach - team talent alone?

That invokes a weird possibility - Bevell was actually infallible.

I'm an 1850 IN USCF raiting for Chess
and I'm 2100+ Rating strength for bughouse.

 

[poly1274]

So you go Bandit plus and flood the passing lanes and rush three from different spots all the time, there goes your passing game and it becomes a interception fest.

If they try to stop the passing game by rushing 3, I would have RW scramble to get 7-8 yards per carry. by running straight to the middle and slide.

 

[Sox-n-Hawks]

So you go Bandit plus and flood the passing lanes and rush three from different spots all the time, there goes your passing game and it becomes a interception fest.

If they try to stop the passing game by rushing 3, I would have RW scramble to get 7-8 yards per carry. by running straight to the middle and slide.

No rushing. Passing only.

 

[chris98251]

So you go Bandit plus and flood the passing lanes and rush three from different spots all the time, there goes your passing game and it becomes a interception fest.

If they try to stop the passing game by rushing 3, I would have RW scramble to get 7-8 yards per carry. by running straight to the middle and slide.

One problem, Russell isn't going to out run CB's and Safeties faster then he is especially coming at him and slide, that will work sometimes but knowing that's what he will do they will close and all it takes is one combo hit or needing to get a first down and take a full hit and he will be in IR by the third game.

 

[mrt144]

So you go Bandit plus and flood the passing lanes and rush three from different spots all the time, there goes your passing game and it becomes a interception fest.

If they try to stop the passing game by rushing 3, I would have RW scramble to get 7-8 yards per carry. by running straight to the middle and slide.

No rushing. Passing only.

Making this a constraint thought exercise is entertaining.

Like, if any rushing, including scrambles are off the table... how would you design plays, read hierarchy, personnel, etc etc to make it function. Like even the most pass happy teams don't cross a 70% threshold, but what if they did.

 

[mrt144]

So you go Bandit plus and flood the passing lanes and rush three from different spots all the time, there goes your passing game and it becomes a interception fest.

If they try to stop the passing game by rushing 3, I would have RW scramble to get 7-8 yards per carry. by running straight to the middle and slide.

One problem, Russell isn't going to out run CB's and Safeties faster then he is especially coming at him and slide, that will work sometimes but knowing that's what he will do they will close and all it takes is one combo hit or needing to get a first down and take a full hit and he will be in IR by the third game.

So what you're saying is potentially having multiple QBs involved. Holy crap, we're making full contact basketball.

 

[poly1274]

So you go Bandit plus and flood the passing lanes and rush three from different spots all the time, there goes your passing game and it becomes a interception fest.

If they try to stop the passing game by rushing 3, I would have RW scramble to get 7-8 yards per carry. by running straight to the middle and slide.

No rushing. Passing only.

QB scrambling =/ running the ball. IMO They scramble when all WR's are covered.

 

[IndyHawk]

All it will take to flush your brilliant idea down the toilet is injuries and turnovers.
Once you cannot pass like planned then the losses will pile up.
The defense can't save you as you really don't seem to care about that end.
No matter the cap hits probaly took care of that anyway.
25-35 million @QB..That is before you pay for the good OL/WR you need.