The Front Office Rolled The Dice With The OL And ...

[chet380]

snake-eyes came up -- an injured, ineffectual bunch with no prospect in the near future and very little in the long-term AND their ineffectiveness has led to our once-in-a-generation QB being injured to an extent that we may never again see the elite speed, skill and evasiveness that made him so special.

My vote -- sit RW until he has completely recovered, play the rookie backup with the OL mediocrities and take our lumps -- DO NOT trade a draft pick for a short-term fix.

 

[TwistedHusky]

+1

 

[theENGLISHseahawk]

snake-eyes came up -- an injured, ineffectual bunch with no prospect in the near future and very little in the long-term AND their ineffectiveness has led to our once-in-a-generation QB being injured to an extent that we may never again see the elite speed, skill and evasiveness that made him so special.

My vote -- sit RW until he has completely recovered, play the rookie backup with the OL mediocrities and take our lumps -- DO NOT trade a draft pick for a short-term fix.

What would you have done differently in the off-season regarding the OL?

That's not a snarky question by the way, I'm interested.

It's just because they took a first round OL and it's not like Okung is playing brilliantly in Denver (and might've decided to move on whatever the situation because of his whole 'saving face' on the agent thing).

I want to know what the gamble was. For me, they were left trying to find solutions to a bad situation that was kind of inevitable.

 

[Pie Romania]

snake-eyes came up -- an injured, ineffectual bunch with no prospect in the near future and very little in the long-term AND their ineffectiveness has led to our once-in-a-generation QB being injured to an extent that we may never again see the elite speed, skill and evasiveness that made him so special.

My vote -- sit RW until he has completely recovered, play the rookie backup with the OL mediocrities and take our lumps -- DO NOT trade a draft pick for a short-term fix.

So then, my question for you is, who is the long-term fix? After this year of Boykin taking lumps behind mediocrities, where do you expect we focus to solve the issue at LT? Free Agency? One of the worst classes of potential free agent LT's I can remember with Andrew Whitworth, a 34 year old veteran heading the class. The projected free agent list will likely be even slimmer pickins as we get closer to the FA period. The Draft? Unless you plan on trading up into the Top 8-10, we're going to have to end up making a Justin Britt-esque reach in the first. Even if you trade up to the 8th pick, that might not be enough either. Teams will recognize that they can't solve their own issues at the position in FA or later in the draft either without the odds being against them. I know Britt was chosen at the back end of the 2nd, but that is essentially what we'll be doing again, just a round earlier in a horrible class for OT's.

Look, I'm the person who is usually taking your stance when it comes to trading a high draft pick for an aging veteran who is already on the wrong side of 30, but you have to play the cards you're dealt and this front office has dealt themselves into a corner. If you wait, you risk losing this championship window. Tough situation either way. We have a championship level defense with an offense that has a ton of talent everywhere except the offensive line and an offensive coordinator who is always on one end of the spectrum or the other.

 

[FlyingGreg]

They have no choice.

With a salary cap, and having to pay a franchise QB and our defense all that money, plus $10 million to our tight end... extensions for Baldwin and Kearse....we can't afford a line.

Have to go cheap somewhere.

 

[Coug_Hawk08]

They have no choice.

With a salary cap, and having to pay a franchise QB and our defense all that money, plus $10 million to our tight end... extensions for Baldwin and Kearse....we can't afford a line.

Have to go cheap somewhere.

Well, we have made mistakes and you named one. Extending kearse. Dead money from Williams, Harvin. Signing webb. All damaging in terms of keeping or signing a real line.

 

[MagnificentSeven]

Its been said much more eloquently before, but just what more could we have gotten for the few million in cap space we have? Didn't we all snicker when Sweezy was signed for $32.5 million by Tampa? If a C+ Serviceable Guard like Sweezy was worth $30 Million in the open market, who were we going to land?

The Seahawks have the least invested in their OL, that's true.

What's also true is the line is par, to sub-par by NFL standards, and we are probably getting better value out of it then some other teams, when the spending is factored in.

The real issue, I think, is the ZBS. There is nothing more counter-intuitive for a 310 lb. man then to awkwardly launch himself at another equally large man's legs. I can't count the number of times I've seen one of our guys whiff on a backside cut-block because that's what the "scheme" calls for him to do. Gilliam did it today, only to have the DE easily avoid him and knock down the pass.

I honestly don't have any answers, none that will help much mid-year anyway.

 

[FlyingGreg]

They have no choice.

With a salary cap, and having to pay a franchise QB and our defense all that money, plus $10 million to our tight end... extensions for Baldwin and Kearse....we can't afford a line.

Have to go cheap somewhere.

Well, we have made mistakes and you named one. Extending kearse. Dead money from Williams, Harvin. Signing webb. All damaging in terms of keeping or signing a real line.

Where would Kearse's money gone? To who?

 

[OkieHawk]

Where would Kearse's money gone? To who?

I'd glad have taken it. Not to play of course, just to spend.

 

[seahawkfreak]

JS refuses to pay or draft OL that are not worth the pay or the draft pick. He's on record that he believes that the Tackle market is severely bloated and the talent of OL coming out of college is watered down and there are rare occasions when some are worth high first round grades (paraphrasing).

I remember when drafting linemen use to be almost a sure thing, now not so much. So unless we can find gems, this organization absolutely refuses to overpay OL and probably wont change until PC and JS are gone.

 

[CodeWarrior]

Retain Okung, never sign Webb, have Ifedi playing RT.

 

[NFSeahawks]

They have no choice.

With a salary cap, and having to pay a franchise QB and our defense all that money, plus $10 million to our tight end... extensions for Baldwin and Kearse....we can't afford a line.

Have to go cheap somewhere.

Didn't need to resign Kearse fwiw.

I like him, just looks like it was the wrong spot to pay.

Pete's problem is he trys to make everyone happy when it's unrealistic to having a winning team.

 

[Thepeelsessions]

I may be in the minority when I say that I like the future outlook of this O-line, for the most part. I think the interior is good, and if they can stay healthy, they will grow nicely together. I've said that before. Laugh all you want, but I think Fant is the LT of the future. And don't even talk to me about him having no experience, because he's getting it now. I think him being inexperienced is a good thing. He has no bad habits. Cable (or whoever his replacement might be) can mold him into a cornerstone. He's big, strong, and quick. That leaves Gilliam. He's awful. Truly awful. He is the only one that I'm OK with seeing being replaced. I wouldn't mind seeing Ifedi slide over to RT, Britt sliding to RG, and Hunt stepping in at C. That may be contradictory to what I said earlier about the interior, but I digress. I don't think Britt playing well has to do with his move to C, but more to do with him just evolving into a better lineman. I think he gets it now.

Look, the line isn't much worse than it was in the first half of last year. Russ' injuries could've happened at anytime over the past few years. The ankle injury was fluky. Suh is a mastodon that broke through the line, which will happen. He's amazing. It's unfortunate he stepped on Russ' ankle. The knee injury could've can be chalked up to unfortunate. Russ was scrambling and was already outside the pocket. He was drug down awkwardly, and his knee got caught. The pec injury was a blatant whiff of a block by Gilliam (or Sowell? Can't remember). He's hasn't been sacked nearly as much as last year. All things considered, this line is the best it's been in awhile.

I'm gladly putting all this on record.

 

[Reaneypark]

Well one thing is clear, having Jimmy Graham on this team is like a guy who parks his Ferrari in a garage with a leaky roof. It's a luxury that we just can't afford until we take care of the OLine.

 

[Pie Romania]

I may be in the minority when I say that I like the future outlook of this O-line, for the most part. I think the interior is good, and if they can stay healthy, they will grow nicely together. I've said that before. Laugh all you want, but I think Fant is the LT of the future. And don't even talk to me about him having no experience, because he's getting it now. I think him being inexperienced is a good thing. He has no bad habits. Cable (or whoever his replacement might be) can mold him into a cornerstone. He's big, strong, and quick. That leaves Gilliam. He's awful. Truly awful. He is the only one that I'm OK with seeing being replaced. I wouldn't mind seeing Ifedi slide over to RT, Britt sliding to RG, and Hunt stepping in at C. That may be contradictory to what I said earlier about the interior, but I digress. I don't think Britt playing well has to do with his move to C, but more to do with him just evolving into a better lineman. I think he gets it now.

Look, the line isn't much worse than it was in the first half of last year. Russ' injuries could'be happened anytime. The ankle injury was fluky. Suh is a mastodon that broke through the line, which will happen. He's amazing. It's unfortunate he stepped on Russ ankle. The knee injury could've can be changed up to unfortunate. Russ was scrambling and was already outside the pocket. He was dragged down awkwardly, and his knee got caught. The pec injury was a blatant did of a block by Gilliam (or Sowell? Can't remember). He's hasn't been sacked nearly as much as last year.

I'm gladly putting all this on record.

I like Fant too and I think all things considered with him, he has performed well aside from the penalties. Even though I don't want to trade for a veteran LT, one of the upsides of it is that it gives an outstanding veteran who can not only give Fant time to learn off the field, but also someone who can help mold him. I mean, what more could you really want? An athletic freak with essentially no experience & bad habits developed over time that could have an elite left tackle embed their knowledge, tricks of the position, technique do's & dont's, etc....

While it would be a short-term solution most likely for 2-3 years with someone like Joe Thomas/Joe Staley, we could transition Ifedi to RT in the offseason with Fant playing a backup role at both OT spots, and then look to the draft to bring in talent at guard, a position with a couple prospects I REALLY like in Quenton Nelson (Notre Dame) & Dan Feeney (Indiana).

 

[chet380]

@ ENGLISH --

You pose a fair question -- what could have been done?

In truth, I can't offer specific alternatives as to players who might have been drafted or signed, but I do believe that the effects of the Front Office attempts to "hit a home run" with Harvin and Graham have come home to roost this year in terms of money that would have been otherwise available, the loss of Unger and Okung and particularly the loss of a 1st and 3rd for PH and a 1st for JG. I actually hate "shoulda, coulda, woulda", but you asked, and I have done my best to answer.

 

[WindCityHawk]

Well one thing is clear, having Jimmy Graham on this team is like a guy who parks his Ferrari in a garage with a leaky roof. It's a luxury that we just can't afford until we take care of the OLine.

I would gladly cut Graham to buy an O-line at this point. The Unger trade has been a disaster.

 

[TwistedHusky]

I will always believe that if we had kept Unger, we might still have had Lynch.

I know that with Unger, we would have gone farther last year - and considering the competition, probably would have had another SB win.

The stupidity of the Graham trade will always bother me. Not because he isn't a great player, but because we were never going to use him to his ability anyway. We are paying him like he is a top 5 contributor on our offense and we all know that, but for a few sporadic flashes where in one game or another he takes over, he has pretty much contributed very little to the offense. Not because he is not able, but because we give him precious few opportunities and near NO opportunities in the EZ.

 

[nategreat]

Well one thing is clear, having Jimmy Graham on this team is like a guy who parks his Ferrari in a garage with a leaky roof. It's a luxury that we just can't afford until we take care of the OLine.

I would gladly cut Graham to buy an O-line at this point. The Unger trade has been a disaster.

But it shouldn't be. Besides being hurt half the season last year and having a remarkable recovery, it's only been a disaster when we don't get Jimmy involved in the game. Throw the ball in his relative vacinity and he puts up monster games and makes unbelievable catches. And Britt has been a bright spot at center. I blame the gameplan and the playcalling, not the trade. (I do love Unger though)

 

[CodeWarrior]

The combined cap hit of Graham and Baldwin is $17M. That's almost twice what we pay the entire offensive line, which comes in at $9.047M for all 10 OL personnel. If you reduce it to just the starters all we pay the OL is $4.66M.

Yes we effectively pay Graham and Baldwin 4x what we pay the starting offensive line.