Ways that the 9ers can salvage this season?

[NINEster]

Our run defense is like historically bad...

I assumed you simply weren't playing with a 'run defense'.

If you took out our linebackers and just played with 7 guys on defense I'm sure our numbers would be very similar

Niners should just play with a 5 or 6 man line every down......LBs be damned!!!

 

[xgeoff]

Our run defense is like historically bad...

I assumed you simply weren't playing with a 'run defense'.

If you took out our linebackers and just played with 7 guys on defense I'm sure our numbers would be very similar

Niners should just play with a 5 or 6 man line every down......LBs be damned!!!

Yeah, here is what I don't necessarily understand about the NFL. The whole idea of having a scheme (i.e. 4-3, 3-4, etc) is, IMO, absurd. If I was a Defensive Coordinator, I would have personnel packages. Those packages would include a 3 man front, a 4 man front, a 5 man front, etc. It would include nickel and dime packages.

And my understanding is that most, if not all, NFL defenses have this. So let's say that I have an injury to my top LB (like Novarro Bowman). I may consider utilizing my other personnel packages depending on the strength of my roster. If my roster has 6 really good DB's, I end up playing my dime package most of the time. I want my best players on the field.

Now, within each personnel package, you have different play calls. You have blitzes and coverages and stunts and slants. So if the other team thinks they can just run the ball cause I have 6 DB's in the game, you call slants where the DL plug the gaps.

So I agree with you, if the LB corps of the Niners is bad (and you would know this better than I) then, yeah, don't put them on the field! It doesn't seem like rocket science to me. However, sports does seem to often lack innovation and is all about copying other people who try things first.

Soccer, for instance, is decades behind football in terms of strategy. But don't get me started on that...

 

[GeekHawk]

They could start by apologizing to the Santa Clara Girl Scouts or the local soccer teams or whoever it was they screwed over. That might erase the first part of the karma. A very small part.

 

[SantaClaraHawk]

The team is in shambles right now.

No run defense, no great threats on offense. I remember late in the 2014 season thinking how many awesome LBs the 49ers had and the issue we were gonna have with Bowman, Willis, and Borland having to take two spots. How exciting it would be having Aldon Smith and Aaron Lynch opposite of each other. Now we have essentially none of those guys, and not even a decent NT.

On offense, we got Torrey Smith a year too late but otherwise had a bunch of great ball catchers - Crabtree, Boldin, Stevie Johnson.

No TEs to speak of that at least scare a defense.

Kaepernick is the least of the issues, at least for the short term and winning games. Cowboys coach anonymously admitted he was happy Gabbert played and not him. They remember the last time these two teams met.

Word around the league is SF has bottom 3 level talent. There are maybe 2 or 3 QBs who could transcend that in a meaningful way.

SF has a very good pass protecting OL. They can build off of that if/when they add the playmakers.

They can draft the QB, but not have to rush him out there hopefully. I'm ok with CK out there while the team rebuilds.

They have fixed the ol compared to the Devey/pears/jmart situation but Kaep also relied on defense, which is struggling.

York fired his best head coach, promoted a good Dline coach to a position to be eventually fired, put out a qb who the gm hates...clearly it's Jed but his mom won't pull him

Yeah, all of that is true. Kap's #s have always been buoyed by a top 5 defense, which gives him enough time to make plays that keeps him as a viable starter in even the toughest of games. 2014 where defense started to slip, you saw his issues more pronounced, but nowhere as bad as the last two seasons.

You know, it raises a question I just thought of yesterday:

If it weren't for Harbaugh, how would the 2011+ era have played out?

Looking back at the post-Eddie DeBartolo era, we start with the firing of Mariucci following the 2002 season. For all intents and purposes, that is the official start of the York era IMO.

Hires Dennis Erickson. Lasts two seasons only.....understandable since 2-14 is something that hadn't been tasted since 1979, completely unacceptable in Niner land, and Erickson didn't have the pedigree of a top coach to get away with it in the modern day.

Mike Nolan hired off the Baltimore Ravens staff. Was DC at Baltimore the last 3 years prior to this hiring. A lifelong DC, and having worked with a few HoF to be with the Ravens, was tapped to create Baltimore West, which is pretty much what the modern 2005+ 49ers became. 3-4 defense, drafting monster ILBs and front 7 based talent, a dedication to running the football......all from the Ravens playbook. Despite completely different players from 2005, the 2016 49ers are essentially the same type of team (or tries to be at least). The rise up from 2007-2010 thru Harbaugh, then to Tomsula and now Kelly -- it's the same everything, just with a lot less success.

Nolan chose Alex Smith over Aaron Rodgers. It can be argued that while it was a clear mistake in hindsight, does A-Rod became the all star he is now with Mike McCarthy possibly gone after one season? (and looking at recent Rodgers, maybe he isn't immune to sucking). History showed Nolan was a smart defensive mind but sucked as a player's coach (I heard this direct from a Niner DB of that era), throwing Alex Smith under the bus unfairly. He had decent talent to work with but had a revolving door of offensive coordinators. After awhile the team stopped playing for him and he had to be fired.

Insert the Singletary promotion -- it was done in season. So following the 2008 season going into 2009, it was either extend him or get a new coach. He seemed to like the fire a new coach provides (like a Dan Campbell last year with MIA), and went down this road. Lasted about two years, canned at end of 2010, with Jim Tomsula to finish the last game.

At this point, it seems like York's decisions could be tolerated in hindsight (assuming we could overlook the firing of Steve Mariucci to begin with). I don't recall who was available in 2003 and 2005 for HCs....I believe Holmgren was available in 2005, and story has it that Paraage's moneyball ("rupeeball"?) analytics showed that Singletary would have been a better choice. Totally inexcusable if true.

I would say that starting in 2009, York should have started to be on the proverbial hotseat as an owner (in the sense he had to perform, much like it is an inferno right now).

Erickson, ok. Nolan, fine. But after that, you have to start looking at things differently.

Harbaugh was a really lucky hire. For what it's worth, there have been better owners who have not been as lucky to get such a good coach. The timing, proximity to Stanford, I guess it all lined up in a way it never did prior.

I guess now the only good thing is that since mid 2015 season, York has been put on notice by the fanbase and general media that he's absolute dog s*** as an owner. Despite the Chip Kelly hire which is an improvement over Tomsula, Baalke's garbage roster only makes it seem worse than last year. At some point even Bill Belichick can't save a team (if in theory he only could be HC and not HC/GM).

Hard to say what will happen. I guess I will start doing research on NFL owner histories of your bottom half of NFL franchises to see what's up.

I know Jacksonville has a fairly new owner, I believe their 2nd.

Unfortunately it doesn't appear that owners sell teams because they can't hack it or provide a good product -- they do it for personal reasons.

Extremely well said. This is how most Montana-Rice fans would put it, that it started with Mooch's firing followed by a decade of bad football and all the sudden they were Super Bowl contenders until The Tip.

That year was the first I started watching football for real, for any team. I noticed Phil Dawson would usually win the most points, and How the defense would make that margin possible. Then Jed/Baalke fire Harbs, get rid of Fangio in favor of Tomsula, tell the youth softball league and Great America to take a hike about land use, upsell Kezar-era season ticket holders and then open a stadium that doesn't even have debartalo mall food in it but an abundance of beer, and then Jed tweets that it's all about "winning with class" with him.

You're only new to football once and I decided to,follow the team I liked better. That said, I hate Jed for not allowing the 9ers to be a better rival.

 

[xgeoff]

... I hate Jed for not allowing the 9ers to be a better rival.

Jed York strikes me as one of those guys who is metaphorically born on third base but goes through life believing he's hit a triple.

 

[5_Golden_Rings]

Torrey Smith has been getting wide open MULTIPLE times for touchdowns every game (except possibly Seattle-I don't recall a single pass attempt that traveled past ten yards and haven't look at coach cam). He is NOT one of the problems. Put him with a real QB and he's getting Pro Bowl consideration.

Just think, last game he had one TD, but was missed on two others- and those are the ones Kaepernick actually saw and threw...

 

[Marvin49]

Torrey Smith has been getting wide open MULTIPLE times for touchdowns every game (except possibly Seattle-I don't recall a single pass attempt that traveled past ten yards and haven't look at coach cam). He is NOT one of the problems. Put him with a real QB and he's getting Pro Bowl consideration.

Just think, last game he had one TD, but was missed on two others- and those are the ones Kaepernick actually saw and threw...

While I partially agree, I think you are overstating a bit.

Torrey is not a great route runner and will never be a #1 WR. Thats OK though...thats not what he was signed to be. He was signed to be an outside speed receiver who stretches the field. That he has done very well.

The problem is that we don't have a QB who can get him the ball that deep down the field. I've been to every home game this season and invariably I'll see him streaking down the field on a deep route wide open and Gabbert never even LOOKED at him much less threw it to him. Gabbert almost never had his eyes more than 10 yards downfield and that was a HUGE source of Torreys frustration.

He isn't a pro bowler though. Thats not his game. He's a one dimensional player, but its an important dimension that he was signed specifically to fulfill.

The 49ers need a true #1 WR to go along with Kerley in the slot (nice surprise find) and Torrey over the top...and of course the biggest thing is a QB able to make those throws down the field.

 

[rlkats]

Positions of need. In order of importance.

#1. New CEO
#2. New GM
#3. New QB
#4. A #1 receiver
#5. A stud DE
#6. A bad ass LB and Bowman.


Torrey while I like him is a one trick poney. Him and Kearly are fine though. We need a stud #1 pass catcher to get open. Oh also I'd love to say Goodbye to Kap and Gab. As QB's they are garbage. I'm sick of seeing wide open throws off target. So here is the question.

If both Kap and Gab played like this in college do they get drafted? I'd say no. They both are horrible.

And another thing our D coordinator sucks major poop. He is horrible.

 

[Marvin49]

Positions of need. In order of importance.

#1. New CEO
#2. New GM
#3. New QB
#4. A #1 receiver
#5. A stud DE
#6. A bad ass LB and Bowman.


Torrey while I like him is a one trick poney. Him and Kearly are fine though. We need a stud #1 pass catcher to get open. Oh also I'd love to say Good yes to Kap and Gab. As QB's they are garbage. I'm sick of seeing wide open throws off target. So here is the question.

If both Kap and Gab played like this in college do they get drafted? I'd say no. They both are horrible.

And another thing our D coordinator sucks major poop. He is horrible.

Agreed....but you know #1 will never happen.

 

[theENGLISHseahawk]

#1. New CEO
#2. New GM
#3. New QB
#4. A #1 receiver
#5. A stud DE
#6. A bad ass LB and Bowman.

... and a Partridge in a Pear tree.

 

[chris98251]

Some things should not be salvaged but be left in their place of rest, I get the feeling that when you say salvage you think something can be redeemed, if they keep Baalke, Kelly and lose out and get the 1st pick, is there any confidence that you could draft players that are going to be stars and big contributors with Baalke and Kelly leading that draft room?

Then there is the whole York thing, does he have the Naads to fire his buddy, also there is the whole who do we replace him with and that dilemma. Given choices to date of York, watching that unfold will be drama for the whole off season.

 

[SantaClaraHawk]

Lisa DeBartolo's Tweet was encouraging. And Eddie is taking a more public view since becoming HOF. Intrafamily pressure is the only factor that could oust Jed.

Jed could well oust Baalke as a business decision or "promote" Baalke to a insignificant position as happened with Maarthe. But Jed's top priority wouldn't be team statistics, rather it would be acting like BFFs with Jed. He'd rather that person do both, but will factor the BFF factor first.

Fact is, Jed would rather go 2-14 with someone he likes than go 14-2 with someone he doesn't.

 

[NINEster]

Lisa DeBartolo's Tweet was encouraging. And Eddie is taking a more public view since becoming HOF. Intrafamily pressure is the only factor that could oust Jed.

Jed could well oust Baalke as a business decision or "promote" Baalke to a insignificant position as happened with Maarthe. But Jed's top priority wouldn't be team statistics, rather it would be acting like BFFs with Jed. He'd rather that person do both, but will factor the BFF factor first.

Fact is, Jed would rather go 2-14 with someone he likes than go 14-2 with someone he doesn't.

The fact that your last sentence is probably true is so mind boggling and heartbreaking.

I can understand being a rich spoiled kid being nonchalant about owning an NFL team, but this little punk literally grew up with the dynasty 49ers. The pictures of him standing next to Walsh and Eddie in pre-game warmups, playing with the kids of Niner players back then, etc....he should be more representative of a typical Niner fan than he is. Way more.

If you took all 32 NFL owners/CEOs and had to rank them in terms of passion to their team, he should in theory be at least top 10. Outside of your Maras (Giants), Rooneys (Steelers), Hunts (Chiefs), McCaskeys (Bears), Davis (Raiders), Browns (Bengals), no other owner has had family ties going back to the late '70s like York. And outside of Jerry Jones who is a bit of an anomaly for an NFL owner in terms of personality, he should be just as much into the team as any of them. Eddie D. had no ties to the 49ers and treated the team like they were his children from the start, literally.

If you're a Niners fan or Seahawks fan thinking of the '90s, think of the hurt you experience when the team sucks, and now imagine you're freaking responsible for it? Unbearable. How could you live with yourself sucking, especially when fans call your name out in public. Jed can't pretend to be ignorant any longer, if he was ignorant to begin with.

I honestly think there's no way I couldn't be a worse 49er owner than York is right now. 90% of Niner fans in my mind in Jed's shoes would not have screwed up the Harbaugh situation.

If my uncle was a HoF owner, I'd put my chance of success as at least an "average" owner at 99.999999%.

F'n idiot.

 

[NINEster]

Double post.

EDIT: To add on....

Eddie D could go to the HoF alone for how he responded to the '93 NFCC loss to Dallas after two straight years.

Jed was more focused on the new stadium opening than how to take down the Seahawks in 2014. You just get the sense that even as much as Baalke has underwhelmed, Eddie D could have made even him better during his Niner tenure.

 

[xgeoff]

...I honestly think there's no way I couldn't be a worse 49er owner than York is right now. 90% of Niner fans in my mind in Jed's shoes would not have screwed up the Harbaugh situation.

If my uncle was a HoF owner, I'd put my chance of success as at least an "average" owner at 99.999999%.

F'n idiot.

Yep, completely agree. It's mind boggling. It's almost like he treats the Niners more like his little toy than anything else. Everything flows down from the top. Hard to win with bad ownership.

 

[James in PA]

They totally screwed up when they told Hairball to take a hike. Couldn't stand the guy, but he could coach. Should have canned the GM instead.


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