Were We Asking Too Much of 2022 Hawks D?

[strohmin]

People have amnesia around here. Going into the season. The defense was supposed to be the strength of the team.

They were a top 10 scoring defense as flawed as they were. And the new scheme, with the Additions of Nwosu and Harris was supposed to fix the pass rush and their abysmal 3rd down defense. And with Boom/Bust Wilson gone the defense would no longer be gassed, or so I was told.

It was supposed to be Pete reasserting his philosophy. They were going to run the ball and play great defense, while Geno managed the game.

Instead the exact opposite has taken place. Can't run the ball, can't play defense, and have gotten miraculous top 5 play from their career backup QB bailing out Pete once again in the W-L record of things.

This failure is.now.being passed off as they weren't supposed to be good anyway. As they waste another productive QB season.

Exactly, it was the offense that was suppose to fail but they have actually been what carried this sorry defense. This is why I think Pete has lost his ability to field an nfl level defense.

 

[keasley45]

I don't think this fact has been underscored enough. That was a MASSIVE blow, and ultimately a fatal one for our chances last Sunday.

Yup. You can't take hits like losing your top two Dlineman when D line was a questionable position group to begin the season. As the health of the Dline has gone, so has gone our success.

 

[themunn]

Well, according to Rob Staton….

“5. For all the talk of needing more talent on defense, here’s a quick reminder. Jordyn Brooks and LJ Collier were first round picks. Darrell Taylor and Boye Mafe were second round picks. Cody Barton is a third round pick. They paid to retain Poona Ford and Bryan Mone and Ford has the biggest cap-hit on the team this year. Uchenna Nwosu is the most expensive outside free agent they’ve ever signed. They re-signed Al Woods and brought back Quinton Jefferson. Next year, Jamal Adams and Quandre Diggs are set to account for $36m of Seattle’s cap space. Nwosu and Shelby Harris combine for $25m. This is a defense that has been built and frankly, resources have been squandered. That should be remembered as we discuss whether this is just a situation that can be fixed by these decision makers simply adding more players. They need to do a much better job than they have been doing.”

Some thoughts with the Seahawks season going south – Seahawks Draft Blog

seahawksdraftblog.com

Ppl don’t like Staton but is he really wrong here?

How does that compare to other defenses though (asking honestly)? We haven't selected a defensive player in the top 16 of the draft in over 10 years (Bruce Irvin), and 2 first round picks on the defensive side doesn't sound like a lot to me. Granted we gave up 2 to get Adams whose injuries have been costly and that's unfortunate especially given he's the type of player you build a team around, how would the Rams defense look if Donald was out for the entire season or 49ers if they were missing Bosa?

Among the D-Line, Nwosu and Woods have been excellent, Ford is struggling with a new position and that's unfortunate but for years he's been one of our better players and its his first year in a new scheme. Harris has been a strong pickup, and Taylor blows hot and cold but he also has 11.5 sacks in his first 2 years starting. Outside of that our D-Line has no true playmakers (Mafe is athletic enough and will develop but he's a first year player who we all knew had high upside but would need time to grow into the position). Hell we had to bring in Bruce Irvin off the street for his 3rd stint as a Seahawks just to make up bodies.

In reality we need more like 7 or 8 high quality players on the D-Line and that takes time and trial and error to get there - it took 3 years after Carroll took over to build a line that included Bryant, Clemons, Avril, Bennett, Mebane, McDaniel and McDonald. Those guys would be part of the rotation at any NFL team right now, and aside from all being excellent players on their own, having 7 starter quality players on the D-line means rotation and no tired bodies (which was the struggle on Sunday given TOP).

This defense is in no way comparable to the 2012 defense (which incidentally shat the bed against the Falcons in the playoffs when we needed them to step up in the final 20 seconds), but the only material additions to that team in 2013 were Avril and Bennett, and the defense went from one that was "very good" to an all-time great. Who is to say that without 2 or 3 key additions next year and the return of Adams, that we can't improve immeasurably - we knew this year was going to be rebuilding, and anybody who thought that we were going to have a top 10 defense when we knew we were going to have to start 2 rookies at corner (even before Adams went down for the season) is kidding themselves.

We have the core pieces there - I think with the addition of a top quality LBer, DL and DE will be the missing pieces that bring the defense together, particular as our rookies develop and Adams (*hopefully*) comes back as strong as ever.

 

[SantaClaraHawk]

Bosa and Armistead are the only first round starters in their front 7. Dre Greenlaw is a fifth rounder, Warner is a third. Hell, they even have Kerry Hyder playing defense…the guy released By first them, then us.

 

[RiverDog]

Going backwards, here's a list of Pete's defenses ranked by total yards:

2022 (thru 13 games): 28th
2021: 28th
2020: 22nd
2019: 26th
2018: 16th
2017: 11th
2016: 5th
2015: 2nd
2014: 1st
2013: 1st
2012: 4th
2011: 9th
2010: 27th

So please tell me, am I being unreasonable in expecting more than the 28th ranked defense from a head coach that is supposed to be the best defensive mind of his era?

 

[thegameq]

Well, I'm not an expert by any means and I'm sure someone else will chime in but just for an example Poona Ford was a great breakout player in the old scheme, now he's getting rocked on most plays, he played more of the 1 tech, well now he is playing either the 5/3 tech role, ideally you would want someone who is VERY big VERY tall and VERY athletic, for that position in a 3-4, someone at least well over 6' and 300lbs, Poona is listed at 5'11 and 311lbs so he is probably too short or has short arms, (I don't know his arm length) BUT, Shelby Harris is listed at 289 and 6'2'' but he's from a 3-4 scheme so he has experience and understands the position better than most on that line.

Thanks Polk. I found some good reads for anyone interested

Football 4-3 Defense Vs. 3-4 Defense

www.rookieroad.com

Football 3-4 Eagle Defense

www.rookieroad.com

The second link details the 3-4 eagle defense--don't know if it applies to what the Seahawks are attempting. But some of the cons seem like they apply to the Seahawks defense.

 

[hawks85]

Looks like Barton was fooled yet again and hit the wrong gap

I just watched some tape on some of these losses, and Barton is always hitting the wrong gap or standing there saying which way did he go george which way did he go.

 

[Polk738]

Thanks Polk. I found some good reads for anyone interested

Football 4-3 Defense Vs. 3-4 Defense

www.rookieroad.com

Football 3-4 Eagle Defense

www.rookieroad.com

The second link details the 3-4 eagle defense--don't know if it applies to what the Seahawks are attempting. But some of the cons seem like they apply to the Seahawks defense.

Thats good stuff, I'll probably read that too lol