We are thin at DT...literally

So I'm all for the "next man up" philosophy, but doesn't that mean there needs to be a man to step up? At DT right now we have precisely 3 bodies:

Kevin Williams
Tony McDaniel
Jordan Hill

All of these guys are serviceable DTs, but only one is really a 1-Tech like Mebane(Jordan Hill), and so far he hasn't been the epitome of durability. I know Caroll said Williams would help fill in, but he's spent most of his career at 3-Tech. I also know that Bennett slides inside, but he is not remotely a 1-Tech. Doesn't it make at least a little sense to bring a 4th guy in for depth if nothing else, especially when we've seen how much more effective our DL is when we keep them in a rotation?

I trust Schneider, and I know there likely isn't an All Pro DT sitting in FA just waiting to be signed, but I can't believe there aren't a few guys who can't suit up and play for half a season.

Here's a list from Walter Football. Aubrayo Franklin might at least provide some relief specifically at NT (Mebane's position) on early downs and short yardage situations. He's old, but there are younger options as well.

I'm okay with Hill and Williams holding down the fort. However, I think once the LB corp is back to full strength they may have to compensate for Mebane's absence with creativity at the LB position.

The combo of no Mebane and Wagner right now spells trouble for our run D inside.

Mebane was amazing at using his leverage to get off the ball and penetrate to allow LB's to hit their gaps quickly to make plays. I fear for our interior run D against some very good running teams coming up.

I think Doug Baldwin also played some one tech in Pop Warner....(hee hee)

We do have some good linebackers and the secondary. Maybe we can rotate keep the fresh ones at DT in there and be OK.

I pray.

JS has been so focused on finding 3tech DT's in the draft or free agency he didn't plan for who would adequately back up Mebane if he went down to injury. At least that is how I see it right now.

They are also supposedly getting Tukuafu some reps in the rotation as well, so he'll be available as that 4th guy when necessary.

Creativity at LB is ok, I guess, but you still need a guy who can, if nothing else, clog up the middle running lanes and occasionally provide some disruption. Not only that, I'm seriously worried about wear and tear on the guys we have.

We need another wide body. I don't think Takuafu provides that.

MysterMatt":1aom7vym said:

Creativity at LB is ok, I guess, but you still need a guy who can, if nothing else, clog up the middle running lanes and occasionally provide some disruption. Not only that, I'm seriously worried about wear and tear on the guys we have.

We need another wide body. I don't think Takuafu provides that.

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We will likely have to wait for Luke Willson to get healthy again before we can entertain bringing in any help on the D-Line. Right now, we have to overload our TE position due to all the injuries. I think once Willson is back, they may cut whichever player they feel provides the least between Moeaki and Allen and bring in some D-Line help. Other than that, I really don't see any place on the roster where we could feasibly release someone to add D-line depth right now.

kidhawk":3ru7quf8 said:

We will likely have to wait for Luke Willson to get healthy again before we can entertain bringing in any help on the D-Line. Right now, we have to overload our TE position due to all the injuries. I think once Willson is back, they may cut whichever player they feel provides the least between Moeaki and Allen and bring in some D-Line help. Other than that, I really don't see any place on the roster where we could feasibly release someone to add D-line depth right now.

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I think you're right. Given how shite Willson has played so far this season, I'd be tempted to put him on IR, but I suppose there are rules against that, sadly. Even when he comes back, he needs to step it up in a big way.

Change to a 3-4 defense.... :stirthepot:

KW played NT last year for the Vikings and did well. He played a lot of snaps too.

"Williams was a productive player in 2013, grading out as a top-30 defensive tackle by ... The Vikings haven't ruled out re-signing free agent DT Kevin Williams."

www.rotoworld.com/recent/nfl/1204/kevin-williams


More info on KW

"Kevin Williams wants to retire a Viking (and avoid nose tackle)"

"Nevertheless, a few more games like last week's, and Williams could help his bargaining position. In a 34-27 win over Washington on Nov. 7, Williams had his first multi-sack game since 2009.

But those big plays didn't come at Williams' usual defensive tackle spot. They were at nose tackle, a position the six-time Pro Bowler says he doesn't like."

http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_245 ... avoid-nose

Hawkfish":15vxlm5a said:

Change to a 3-4 defense.... :stirthepot:

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1. You don't make a major scheme change halfway through the season. Running the 3-4 takes months and months of training camp technique teaching, some say even years.

2. Who are you putting in the middle? We have no big body 3-4 nose tackle. If we did, Mebane was it.

3. We're already thin at LB, now you're adding a 4th LB?

What about Jimmy Staten? Dude was a 5th rounder and we are getting to the emergency zone. Why not give him a shot?

ivotuk":1z5krgnh said:

KW played NT last year for the Vikings and did well. He played a lot of snaps too.

"Williams was a productive player in 2013, grading out as a top-30 defensive tackle by ... The Vikings haven't ruled out re-signing free agent DT Kevin Williams."

http://www.rotoworld.com/recent/nfl/1204/kevin-williams


More info on KW

"Kevin Williams wants to retire a Viking (and avoid nose tackle)"

"Nevertheless, a few more games like last week's, and Williams could help his bargaining position. In a 34-27 win over Washington on Nov. 7, Williams had his first multi-sack game since 2009.

But those big plays didn't come at Williams' usual defensive tackle spot. They were at nose tackle, a position the six-time Pro Bowler says he doesn't like."

http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_245 ... avoid-nose

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He was one of the player press conferences this week and was asked about the move multiple times. He didn't seem excited about the move, but gave all the right answers about doing whatever he's asked, and how when you play d-line, it really doesn't matter where you line up, it's just different angles you have to take in your blocks etc.

I know he came here because he knew we had Mebane and a did a good amount of rotating, so he could stay fresh and extend his career. That worked great for half the season, but I'm sure he'll be fine.

Missing_Clink":2q9gs0m1 said:

What about Jimmy Staten? Dude was a 5th rounder and we are getting to the emergency zone. Why not give him a shot?

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They still may, when we have the roster space. Right now, we are holding an extra tight end, because Wilson is unlikely to play this week and Helfet has a banged up knee (although he is expected to play). If we can get our Tight End situation straightened out they may cut one to make room for another DT.

Wags may be back next week.

In the meantime, another DL injury on the interior pushes us to emergency mode if it isn't there already.

Hawkblogger has some thoughts on KW at NT and he has some good links to stories about KW's success at NT

http://www.hawkblogger.com/2014/11/some ... s-and.html

Didnt Dobbs play a lot at DT against the Giants?

I agree They need to start looking for help. One injury with either Williams or McDaniel's and they are in big trouble. I like the idea of bringing up Staten to the 53 man roster.

ensett":3jx33h9o said:

Didnt Dobbs play a lot at DT against the Giants?

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Only in pass rushing situations (he plays around 285 lbs). The concern with losing Mebane is with the base defense against the run.

Sgt. Largent":27rljh28 said:

Hawkfish":27rljh28 said:

Change to a 3-4 defense.... :stirthepot:

Click to expand...

1. You don't make a major scheme change halfway through the season. Running the 3-4 takes months and months of training camp technique teaching, some say even years.

2. Who are you putting in the middle? We have no big body 3-4 nose tackle. If we did, Mebane was it.

3. We're already thin at LB, now you're adding a 4th LB?

Click to expand...

We showed some 3-4 looks against the Raiders and Giants. Early in both games you can see base personnel with 3 guys down and 4 LB's standing up.....I think Avril may be up as a LB. Pete has always said he plays 3-4 with 4-3 personnel. I would not be surprised if you see 3-4 looks especially with passing personnel on the field.