It just occurred to me ( offense sucks post)

Optimus25

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Texting a friend, i just realized an unbelievable thing about last week. It sure seemed to me like the offense was designed for a team with a stout offensive line and a pocket passer.

Didn't kap already prove that capers defense can be shredded with a mobile quarterback?

Don't recall a single RO that was legitimate in terms of Russ truly reading the defense vice designed hand off with RO look.

Not one qb boot to get Russ iso'd with a defender in space.

How about a jet sweep with one of the fastest football speed guys in the business, which would keep the ends on their toes instead of smelling blood in the water every single snap?

With this O line, wouldn't you have a plan A scheme which is what you want to do in case the line holds, but have a plan B in the event we can't hold the line for 1 second at a time?. Cause it sure looks like bevell only has a plan A and I'm getting real tired of that getting our butts kicked against the rams every year.

I'm not even kidding, the solution is to practice with 7 on the D line, and normal alignments everywhere else. Force him to design a quick hitting offense.

HOW IN THE HELL DID WE NOT EVEN TRY ONE GD QUICK ROUTE TO JIMMY?

line him up. Three step drop slant. Or out route. They run those in pee wee leagues and it's almost impossible to sack the quarterback and quite frankly, it's also extremely difficult to guard Jimmy. But nah, let's line up our small speedsters and have them run longer developing routes.

The O line sucks but if that's the reality where's the attempt at compensating?
 

cymatica

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Max protect against a dime defense sure wasn't helping. Neither was running out of tight formations. Hey, our line can't block, let's bring the whole defense in and run between the tackle.

Here's an idea: line up Graham as a receiver with 3 others to spread them out then run. Seahawks in 2007 could not run the ball, Holmgren changed to a pass first attack and it worked. Why? We couldn't run block. Remember the 2006 Bears playoff game? We had to run a spread offense to run. It worked. Their defense destroyed us in game 5 but the spread approach changed everything come playoff time.
 
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Optimus25

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cymatica":3d3eshfg said:
Max protect against a dime defense sure wasn't helping. Neither was running out of tight formations. Hey, our line can't block, let's bring the whole defense in and run between the tackle.

Here's an idea: line up Graham as a receiver with 3 others to spread them out then run. Seahawks in 2007 could not run the ball, Holmgren changed to a pass first attack and it worked. Why? We couldn't run block. Remember the 2006 Bears playoff game? We had to run a spread offense to run. It worked. Their defense destroyed us in game 5 but the spread approach changed everything come playoff time.

I agree. To me the second you bring in Jimmy to block you just shot yourself in the foot. There's no fear in the defense when one of the best targets in the game is just mashed into the trenches.
 

FlyingGreg

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They have had Graham onboard for 2+ seasons now. They are not going to suddenly figure it out.

He will have his moments, but he will never reach his elite potential in this offense.
 

netskier

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Optimus25":ej55e2b6 said:
Texting a friend, i just realized an unbelievable thing about last week. It sure seemed to me like the offense was designed for a team with a stout offensive line and a pocket passer.

Didn't kap already prove that capers defense can be shredded with a mobile quarterback?

Don't recall a single RO that was legitimate in terms of Russ truly reading the defense vice designed hand off with RO look.

Not one qb boot to get Russ iso'd with a defender in space.

How about a jet sweep with one of the fastest football speed guys in the business, which would keep the ends on their toes instead of smelling blood in the water every single snap?

With this O line, wouldn't you have a plan A scheme which is what you want to do in case the line holds, but have a plan B in the event we can't hold the line for 1 second at a time?. Cause it sure looks like bevell only has a plan A and I'm getting real tired of that getting our butts kicked against the rams every year.

I'm not even kidding, the solution is to practice with 7 on the D line, and normal alignments everywhere else. Force him to design a quick hitting offense.

HOW IN THE HELL DID WE NOT EVEN TRY ONE GD QUICK ROUTE TO JIMMY?

line him up. Three step drop slant. Or out route. They run those in pee wee leagues and it's almost impossible to sack the quarterback and quite frankly, it's also extremely difficult to guard Jimmy. But nah, let's line up our small speedsters and have them run longer developing routes.

The O line sucks but if that's the reality where's the attempt at compensating?

I am starting to sense that Pete orders Bevel to run the late season offense NOW that is predicated on the line having already learned to play together.

Everyone knows you need quick passing if the line can not pass block. Bevel knows this. So why is he not doing this? Stupid or stubborn, or ordered from above? He is not stupid. He might be stubborn, cf the last play in the second superbowl, not running Marshawn from the one. Or, he might be ordered by Pete to run the offense that Pete wants, which is a strong running game, balanced by explosive deep passes. Neither of these will work while the line is learning to block together.
 

Smellyman

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Graham is a blocker in the Hawk O.

Read Option is forgotten by Bevell.

Bevell plays checkers, everybody else plays chess
 

WmHBonney

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cymatica":12yj5j36 said:
Max protect against a dime defense sure wasn't helping. Neither was running out of tight formations. Hey, our line can't block, let's bring the whole defense in and run between the tackle.

Here's an idea: line up Graham as a receiver with 3 others to spread them out then run. Seahawks in 2007 could not run the ball, Holmgren changed to a pass first attack and it worked. Why? We couldn't run block. Remember the 2006 Bears playoff game? We had to run a spread offense to run. It worked. Their defense destroyed us in game 5 but the spread approach changed everything come playoff time.


"CHANGED" being the key word here.....for whatever stupid reason, we do not change the game plan.
 

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FlyingGreg":a01wccyq said:
They have had Graham onboard for 2+ seasons now. They are not going to suddenly figure it out.

He will have his moments, but he will never reach his elite potential in this offense.


FWIW I kinda suspect Graham isn't that elite to begin with.

He benefited from Brees feeding him in an offense that was passing for 5k a year. It's like Julius Thomas when he left Denver and Manning.

He's a good big target who can win jump balls and settle into zones reasonably well, but I think he's always just been a pretty good oversized slot receiver who was in a situation that made people think of him like an elite TE.

Not a popular opinion, I know, but if Cooks ends up having a mediocre year in New England I think more people will catch on to how Brees and Sean Payton are the real answer to how New Orleans has magically been able to keep subbing in new top flight receiving threats over the last decade.
 

Smellyman

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Popeyejones":rd0f1w7s said:
FlyingGreg":rd0f1w7s said:
They have had Graham onboard for 2+ seasons now. They are not going to suddenly figure it out.

He will have his moments, but he will never reach his elite potential in this offense.


FWIW I kinda suspect Graham isn't that elite to begin with.

He benefited from Brees feeding him in an offense that was passing for 5k a year. It's like Julius Thomas when he left Denver and Manning.

He's a good big target who can win jump balls and settle into zones reasonably well, but I think he's always just been a pretty good oversized slot receiver who was in a situation that made people think of him like an elite TE.

Not a popular opinion, I know, but if Cooks ends up having a mediocre year in New England I think more people will catch on to how Brees and Sean Payton are the real answer to how New Orleans has magically been able to keep subbing in new top flight receiving threats over the last decade.

He is an Elite big WR. Someday Bevell and Pete will figure out that he is not an inline TE
 

IndyHawk

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Optimus25":bo20zpr7 said:
Texting a friend, i just realized an unbelievable thing about last week. It sure seemed to me like the offense was designed for a team with a stout offensive line and a pocket passer.

Didn't kap already prove that capers defense can be shredded with a mobile quarterback?

Don't recall a single RO that was legitimate in terms of Russ truly reading the defense vice designed hand off with RO look.

Not one qb boot to get Russ iso'd with a defender in space.

How about a jet sweep with one of the fastest football speed guys in the business, which would keep the ends on their toes instead of smelling blood in the water every single snap?

With this O line, wouldn't you have a plan A scheme which is what you want to do in case the line holds, but have a plan B in the event we can't hold the line for 1 second at a time?. Cause it sure looks like bevell only has a plan A and I'm getting real tired of that getting our butts kicked against the rams every year.

I'm not even kidding, the solution is to practice with 7 on the D line, and normal alignments everywhere else. Force him to design a quick hitting offense.

HOW IN THE HELL DID WE NOT EVEN TRY ONE GD QUICK ROUTE TO JIMMY?

line him up. Three step drop slant. Or out route. They run those in pee wee leagues and it's almost impossible to sack the quarterback and quite frankly, it's also extremely difficult to guard Jimmy. But nah, let's line up our small speedsters and have them run longer developing routes.

The O line sucks but if that's the reality where's the attempt at compensating?
RW does NOT have a 3 step (fire) pass ..It is one of the things that really pisses me off because at this point he should have learned it.It is a big weakness
 

Jerhawk

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Good point on the read option.

The most outrageous blunder by our offensive playcalling was not calling a draw or HB screen to counteract the aggressive D line for Green Bay.

He continued to go empty set, and it continued to fail.
 

Popeyejones

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Re: the read option, it's not like it just disappeared out of the blue. It wasn't effective last year and the last two QBs in the NFL who were really running it at all (Wilson and Cam) spent all last year banged up.

I just think the math on risk and reward for it has changed to the point where the entire NFL has (correctly) moved away from it.

Guys who made their names on it are now out of the league (RG3, Kaepernick) or converting into pocket passers (Cam, Russ, Tyrod, Mariota, Tannehill).
 

Popeyejones

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Smellyman":392h6e0s said:
Popeyejones":392h6e0s said:
FlyingGreg":392h6e0s said:
They have had Graham onboard for 2+ seasons now. They are not going to suddenly figure it out.

He will have his moments, but he will never reach his elite potential in this offense.


FWIW I kinda suspect Graham isn't that elite to begin with.

He benefited from Brees feeding him in an offense that was passing for 5k a year. It's like Julius Thomas when he left Denver and Manning.

He's a good big target who can win jump balls and settle into zones reasonably well, but I think he's always just been a pretty good oversized slot receiver who was in a situation that made people think of him like an elite TE.

Not a popular opinion, I know, but if Cooks ends up having a mediocre year in New England I think more people will catch on to how Brees and Sean Payton are the real answer to how New Orleans has magically been able to keep subbing in new top flight receiving threats over the last decade.

He is an Elite big WR. Someday Bevell and Pete will figure out that he is not an inline TE

Once you accept him as a big WR though it's hard to argue that he's elite. Julio Jones, AJ Green, Mike Evans, and the retired Johnsons (Calvin and Andre) are elite big bodied WRs. He's more Julius Thomas than Shannon Sharpe.
 
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