Sonics/NHL/New arena thread

[pinksheets]

It's over. The NBA wants us to have an arena up first in the next city they move to. The best way to do that would be to amend the MOU and get hockey in here first. Hansen won't, so the NBA will go elsewhere. I get why Hansen won't, but them's the facts.

This is just kicking the dirt out of frustration that we won't get winter sports immediately. Reopening the MOU would be the most dangerous thing Hansen could do. His focus is, as it should be, on getting through the process of the EIS and having a shovel ready arena plan. If the NHL wants to come here on spec, they can. If an NHL group wants to take a huge chunk of the city's risk AND most of Hansen's risk (that he would pay back in if/when the NBA team comes), I'm sure it'd be an easy proposition, but it doesn't pencil out financially at all. All Hansen did today was reiterate what he was saying when he was pushing this arena deal initially, "Be patient. We're in this for the long haul. Let's continue to put our best foot forward. Oh, and my group has no interest in owning a hockey team."

But other places have arenas or are building them, like KC and Las Vegas. The latter is more attractive to the NBA, as the NBA's modus operandi is to find cities that only have them as a pro team since those cities are easier to hold hostage for a new arena. See Sacramento, moving from Seattle to Oklahoma City, the numerous teams that are alone in their cities like Sacramento, San Antonio, Orlando, OKC, etc.

The NBA wants an arena first (as does the NHL, to be fair). Other cities are doing that and we are not. I mean, this isn't a temper tantrum. I want hockey here badly, but I'm pretty sobered about the chances of that happening through the SoDo arena, which I honestly don't think will get built.

KC built their arena and has been entirely ignored by the NBA. By your thinking, the arena was never going to get built, since it was contingent on a team, so it's not now 'over', it never started.

If the NBA turns down a shovel ready arena in Seattle for Vegas, which they could, this market will be scorched earth for an entire generation at least, and hockey will never be the catalyst to get an arena built here. Not without a deal even better than the one Hansen has offered, which makes no financial sense for any side with an NHL team as the only tenant.

 

[Smelly McUgly]

KC doesn't have an ownership group, necessarily, but if the Bucks are in trouble, who knows? Same thing with Vegas. I definitely think Las Vegas is more attractive to the league than Seattle for the reason I mentioned - they are much easier to hold hostage.

The NBA doesn't care about killing the market here. Silver made sure to point out that ratings from this city for the NBA are strong. They don't care, I don't think, unless we play ball the way they want us to. Arena first, then beg for a shot at a team in trouble.

Frankly, I fear that I am right, but I hope that you are right. Bellevue is probably my best shot for a NHL team if this SoDo thing doesn't work out, and they have shown less than zero interest in putting up any significant portion of a hockey-only arena cost. I think we'll be stuck at two pro teams for the foreseeable future. But hey, if I'm wrong, I will more than gladly admit that you were right the whole time.

 

[Throwdown]

I honestly don't know what to think, it wouldn't surprise me if the nba went elsewhere with the Bucks. But it also wouldn't surprise me if Silver's first big move was to bring Seattle back in. And if the word about him from the people with connections to the league are right that Silver loves he big markets, then it's gotta be Seattle over LV, KC, and Louisville. If he's as dirty as Stern, he'd probably want Seattle over Milwaukee.

That's why I dunno what to think, I could see both scenarios play out. But I'm an eternal optimist, so I choose to trust in Hansen. I think we'll get the bucks in 2 years, Milwaukee looks like it doesn't care to build a new arena and the team blows.

 

[Sports Hernia]

I don't think Vegas is a viable option due to the sports betting and sports books in the city. Stern Junior (Silver) will insist that Vegas take the NBA off the 'books, which won't happen because the casinos and local government thru taxes make too much money off wagering on the NBA games. Vegas is just a another "pawn" to play for the NBA if they ever lose the "Seattle pawn", taking any potential leverage away from Hanson/Balmer if they threaten to walk away from the NBA.

Hanson and Balmer's mistake was "playing nice and being truthful", their other big mistake was not going "scorched earth" and sueing the beejesus out of the POS league called the NBA and go after their antitrust status after the Sacramento abortion. The NBA doesn't deserve an ownership group like H/B, I am hoping someday they get so pissed at the NBA and go "all in" on the NHL and stick it to the NBA by having a successful NHL team, a longshot I know, but it would be nice and take away a huge REAL pawn away from the NBA, and leave them with their faux pawn (Vegas).

 

[Throwdown]

I dunno how connected this Kevin Nesgoda dude is from SonicsRising but heres a little something

http://www.sonicsrising.com/2014/4/4/55 ... agues-list

NBA has no interest in Vegas and Seattle is the only city on the list of cities that the NBA wants a team in? Be cool if true, I dunno though.

 

[Sports Hernia]

Meh, the SR guys are wrong as much as they are right. Don't get me wrong, their hearts are in the right place, but they are speculating just like we are. As for the NBA wanting to make Seattle "whole" that's hogwash. If that were the case they would have years ago

Seattle will forever be used as a pawn by that crap league as long as we allow it!

 

[chris98251]

I think it now comes down to buying existing team at some point, the NBA has shown their hand at how they are going to leverage us, teams get into trouble every couple of years and that will be the best case scenerio now. Hansen and Balmer have been thru the baptism by fire and now know how they have to play the game, once already approved as owners which they were essentially with Sacramento they can go in and play the game and not show all the cards till the last minute. Precidence has been set now and knowing how the table is set before you sit down has it's advantages.

 

[Subzero717]

They need to retract back down to 26 teams.

 

[chris98251]

I think there are plenty of players out there that can play, it's the damn highlight reel players that teams have been focusing on since the Jordon era that has made the league so uninspiring, they look good on ESPN but team basketball needed a different skill set from different positions, defense as well. It's the style of basketball that is hurting basketball, not lack of players. They pull players world wide now and yet the desperity is still there.

Maybe it's too young of players or maybe it's lack of developing all around players, I know the game has been lacking a lot for a while.

 

[IndyHawk]

There is too many teams in the NBA even Lebron agrees... Smelly mentioned how the NBA likes to be the only game in town so they can get what they want from the cities in ways of new Arenas..I hadn't noticed that but great observation..This kind of crap among others is what turned me away..So they expect us to build them a new arena ,pay expansion or relocation fees(Huge$$$) and whatever else that has to be done to make it happen but...After this arena and all the funds and groundwork are ready..There is nothing in stone that they will expand or allow another team to come to Seattle..Am I missing anything?Because if I'm not then it has to be a dual purpose arena..Hockey/nba because you can't count on the nba for anything..You may well end up with an arena thats obsolete in 20 yrs and they will cry about that .A la Stern..I would go there to see hockey..I'll never see another nba game anywhere..I understand the younger guys want to see it (nba) and want whatever it takes to get it..Most of us are basketball fans and I wish there was a way that we all could be happy with but it's a difficult situation with what happened (Sonics) and the nba on how they operate..So with that I hope the hockey happens and the nba can come when they see the light..

 

[IndyHawk]

I think there are plenty of players out there that can play, it's the damn highlight reel players that teams have been focusing on since the Jordon era that has made the league so uninspiring, they look good on ESPN but team basketball needed a different skill set from different positions, defense as well. It's the style of basketball that is hurting basketball, not lack of players. They pull players world wide now and yet the desperity is still there.

Maybe it's too young of players or maybe it's lack of developing all around players, I know the game has been lacking a lot for a while.

Good point(s) Chris..I agree..Jordan was a highlight reel by himself but they try to make all these other guys into one..Theres only 2-3 superstars every 10-15 yrs but the nba would have you think theres one on every team..It's pathetic

 

[Blitzer88]

Here is the Sonics logo but made with pokemon:

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

I'm betting you will be wrong or partially wrong. Seattle will get a team first or they will both get a team at the same time (see expansion). Just my .05 worth though.

That would be cool. I don't see us getting basketball anytime soon though. I hear Silver is just as crooked as Stern was.

 

[Sports Hernia]

I'm betting you will be wrong or partially wrong. Seattle will get a team first or they will both get a team at the same time (see expansion). Just my .05 worth though.

That would be cool. I don't see us getting basketball anytime soon though. I hear Silver is just as crooked as Stern was.

Been telling my brother who is a die hard Sonics fan this for over a year now. Silver is Stern's hand picked henchman, and so far has proved me right. He is Stern 2.0.

 

[chris98251]

Well when he was working for Stern it was easy to make overtures and open ended promises, now he works for the owners and again we see how things work.

 

[Throwdown]

I'm betting you will be wrong or partially wrong. Seattle will get a team first or they will both get a team at the same time (see expansion). Just my .05 worth though.

That would be cool. I don't see us getting basketball anytime soon though. I hear Silver is just as crooked as Stern was.

Been telling my brother who is a die hard Sonics fan this for over a year now. Silver is Stern's hand picked henchman, and so far has proved me right. He is Stern 2.0.

What exactly has to done to be stern 2.0? He just got the job in February, only thing he's had to do is sign his name on basketballs. To see how he really is, we gotta look at Milwaukee's situation, he let them know that if there is no new arena the team leaves, it's completely in the hands of Milwaukee if they keep the team or not. Is that really all that bad? There's rumor that there's a buyer, and it isn't Hansen.

 

[Sports Hernia]

Silver had a chance to make Seattle whole by expansion, which SILVER already shot down. His playbook is the same as Stern's, use Seattle for leverage to get struggling teams new areans on the taxpayers dime. The only difference that I've seen between the 2 is that Silver is slightly less douchey than Stern. I'd love to see him prove me wrong because that means the Sonics are back = new arena = NHL, but he won't.

 

[Throwdown]

Giving expansion when you got a team in dire straits with its arena and losing money fast is not good business. It take away any threat, Seattle being the biggest threat to any team with an arena problem. We don't like it, but it's smart. No takes Las Vegas as a serious NBA city, and Kansas City has no possible owners.

 

[chris98251]

Giving expansion when you got a team in dire straits with its arena and losing money fast is not good business. It take away any threat, Seattle being the biggest threat to any team with an arena problem. We don't like it, but it's smart. No takes Las Vegas as a serious NBA city, and Kansas City has no possible owners.

There are always possible owners, just becasue they are not made public doesn't mean they are not there, that and may not have been givin the blessing yet for some reason.

Remember there are at least three ownership groups that were in the Sonics situation, they were ignored and or deemed to late to the party.

 

[Throwdown]

I'm just trying to say, it doesn't make sense at this point with a situation like Milwaukee to announce expansion out the pure kindness of his heart, even if it was to right a wrong, I wouldn't even do that, it takes a big boogy monster that everyone knows the league wants to fix out of the picture. I really think we have to wait for this Milwaukee thing to get resolved before we can even think about a team coming to Seattle, whether its expansion or the Bucks coming here.

I get people are angry with the NBA, I'm just annoyed with how we don't put more blame on the people in charge here in WA/Seattle. They royally blew it so hard by not even trying to work it out with Stern. I get the anger, I don't like him either because I feel like he gave up on us so easily, and didn't even lift a finger when those emails leaked that were between Bennett and his guys that they weren't serious about keeping the team here. It should've never even gotten to that point, I don't get how the bummy Mariners can get a stadium (from what I recall, people didn't even want to have a Safeco Field they had the go ahead from the people to leave), and the Seahawks when they hadn't been anything for years in the 90's could get new stadiums, but when it was the Sonics everyone wants to tell them to piss off (SEATTLE EVEN PASSED A LAW TO TELL 'EM TO GO TO HELL!) and that the NBA brought nothing to the table here. Now look at us because of those local leaders, we got nothing to do watch on the weekdays from Oct to June (well there is the Mariners if you're still on that ship that smells like rotten greed and stale ideas, and moldy promo nights). But for folks like me? I got no sports on weekdays, I just have the Seahawks on mondays and thursdays when they schedule those, and it sucks, and I barely watch the Huskies basketball because I just don't all the time.

This whole situation has really tainted my view on Seattle, and I'm from here, born in Renton, and grew up in a mix of Federal Way, Tacoma, and Spanaway. Seattle just kinda sucks because of it in my opinion. They didn't want to even make this arena deal with Hansen, and if you don't think they signed off on it because of pressure from the public, you're sadly mistaken, ask Richard Conlin how it went when he tried to stand in the way, ask Peter Steinbruek how his mayoral campaign went when he was in kahoots with the Port to derail the arena plan. People want their Sonics back, and they want the extra sweetener of an NHL team, and Seattle leaders didn't even want to do it. I bet if they had their way there would be a Tampa Bay Mariners and a Los Angeles Seahawks, they already played a major factor in the beginning of the OKC Thunder.

I get people want to believe Stern has his hand up Silver's ass, but he's only been commish for 2 months, and its stupid business to announce expansion when you got a team in a situation like the Bucks. It just is, if you're looking for something to be handed to you from the jump, you're being unrealistic of the entire situation, the NBA is bigger than Seattle and it can survive without it, and Seattle can survive without the NBA. But I know Seattle wants the NBA, and I got a feeling that the NBA wants Seattle. Its going to take time, this whole thing that was started by Hansen wasn't about getting it done fast. The Kings thing happened quickly when the Maloofs realized they wanted out, couldn't find a local buyer or they were being spiteful, whatevz, I don't know and I don't care seeing as it didn't happen and its over. I think it was the right thing to do for the NBA to give Sacramento a chance to keep their team, means that they learned from the mess that happened here. But I do think Stern tried to protect his first big move when he took over (Moving the Royals to Sacramento to become the Kings) before he left out the door, he couldn't go out like that, his little big ego couldn't take a hit like that, he needed that small town move to work? yes I do.

I dunno take my opinions as you may, i dunno /rant.