As of now is RW top 5 QB?

[SoulfishHawk]

Great points, and it's simple.....many flat out refuse to give the guy credit. Not because he's not a great QB, but they just don't like him, how he plays or how he looks :roll:

 

[RCATES]

Before last year I would have said yes. There's something extremely troubling about his inability to not get anything going until the 4th quarter last year. Especially at this stage of his Career. Although the Offensive line still wasn't great it was much improved the second half of the season ranking in the top 15 the last 6 games of the year. Yet RW still struggled mightily. Everyone want's to point at Bevell and that could be the case. I see something quite different though. I see a League that has adapted to limit Wilson's skill set and expose his inability to be a pure pocket QB due to his height. Some teams have the players to do this and other's do not. Sadly the one's that are equipped to do so are the one's standing in the Hawks way to reach another SB. Which is the main reason I believe the Hawks are done.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

:34853_doh:

 

[Uncle Si]

Before last year I would have said yes. There's something extremely troubling about his inability to not get anything going until the 4th quarter last year. Especially at this stage of his Career. Although the Offensive line still wasn't great it was much improved the second half of the season ranking in the top 15 the last 6 games of the year. Yet RW still struggled mightily. Everyone want's to point at Bevell and that could be the case. I see something quite different though. I see a League that has adapted to limit Wilson's skill set and expose his inability to be a pure pocket QB due to his height. Some teams have the players to do this and other's do not. Sadly the one's that are equipped to do so are the one's standing in the Hawks way to reach another SB. Which is the main reason I believe the Hawks are done.

i felt like the OC was responsible for alot of RW's predictability last year. Rarely asked to roll out, no run option, and I never really saw first half play calls that let RW play to his strengths. The lack of run game hurt in setting any pass game up as well

I think Bev and that poor running game was more responsible for RW becoming a pocket passer than any particular team (outside that 2nd Rams game).

That's the hope atleast.

 

[original poster]

I wouldn't be at all surprised if Russ puts any doubters firmly in their place as of next season, with new coaches in his ear calling him out when he makes mistakes, I'd expect him to thrive.

Don't be surprised if he's the MVP in a 1 QB race next season. Improvements to the offensive line and running game will be the final piece to the puzzle.

 

[fenderbender123]

As of now, he's a top 5 QB of all time. But as of now, he's not even a top 5 QB in the NFL as of now.

 

[hawkman]

I really don't get the questioning of Russell Wilson. My god, what does he have to do!?!?

Having the ability to throw consistently to the middle of the field would be a great start. Moving up in the pocket and throwing the ball would be cool to.

Yeah he absolutely sucks throwing to the middle of the field... :roll:

Watch the all 22 tape. There have consistently been guys open in the middle the last two two years, but the ball rarely goes to that part of the field. Cherry picking stats doesn’t change what the tape clearly shows.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Keep telling yourself that. Your blind hatred gets in the way, as always. But you are also the one who said Hass is TWICE the QB that Russ will ever be. :roll:

 

[hawkman]

Keep telling yourself that. Your blind hatred gets in the way, as always. But you are also the one who said Hass is TWICE the QB that Russ will ever be. :roll:

I will. And you keep telling yourself he is the greatest thing going. Then look a our record over the next two years and see who is closer to right.

 

[RCATES]

Keep telling yourself that. Your blind hatred gets in the way, as always. But you are also the one who said Hass is TWICE the QB that Russ will ever be. :roll:

I will. And you keep telling yourself he is the greatest thing going. Then look a our record over the next two years and see who is closer to right.

Soulfish is always taking the "glass half full" approach on Wilson. That is fine. But like you said the eye test hasn't looked good on Wilson for quite some time. If he struggles again this year and Hawks only win 7 games then maybe some of these Homers will begin to see that maybe Wilson isn't a top 5 qb. To me he simply isn't.

 

[Uncle Si]

Keep telling yourself that. Your blind hatred gets in the way, as always. But you are also the one who said Hass is TWICE the QB that Russ will ever be. :roll:

I will. And you keep telling yourself he is the greatest thing going. Then look a our record over the next two years and see who is closer to right.

Soulfish is always taking the "glass half full" approach on Wilson. That is fine. But like you said the eye test hasn't looked good on Wilson for quite some time. If he struggles again this year and Hawks only win 7 games then maybe some of these Homers will begin to see that maybe Wilson isn't a top 5 qb. To me he simply isn't.

Just out of curiosity, since you're tossing around pejorative terms at fans who look at something different than you.. if Soulfish or others who see the data believe Wilson is a top 5 QB are "Homers" and you don't see it that way and believe the "Hawks are done" (your words)..

well what are you then?

or are you capable of discussing the topic without pigeon-holing people with condescending terminology?

 

[TwistedHusky]

We have no idea what we have in Wilson.

He has been hamstrung with some severely stupid strategic and tactical directives. Remember we fired the OC because he was so terrible. Obviously that is going to affect the QB if the OC is substandard.

That said, some of it is not the OC and some Wilson has to own.

What I do know is that we are very likely conserving money to be able to pay him later. (As Seymour pointed out) And Wilson firing on all cylinders (when he went on that crazy tear scoring all those TDs with Baldwin) barely got us into a Wildcard.

Stripping this team down to pay Wilson is probably going to doom us for a while because while Wilson can carry a team for a quarter, he sure as hell cannot carry a team for multiple games. And without the defense to bail him out for 3 quarters that is going to be our only hope.

What we do know about Wilson is he is really good at doing things most even great QBs cannot. But he isn't consistent. And that is going to have to change or this team is just going to circle the drain.

 

[Uncle Si]

We have no idea what we have in Wilson.

He has been hamstrung with some severely stupid strategic and tactical directives.

That said, some of it is not the OC and some Wilson has to own.

What I do know is that we are very likely conserving money to be able to pay him later. (As Seymour pointed out) And Wilson firing on all cylinders (when he went on that crazy tear scoring all those TDs with Baldwin) barely got us into a Wildcard.

Stripping this team down to pay Wilson is probably going to doom us for a while because while Wilson can carry a team for a quarter, he sure as hell cannot carry a team for multiple games. And without the defense to bail him out for 3 quarters that is going to be our only hope.

What we do know about Wilson is he is really good at doing things most even great QBs cannot. But he isn't consistent. And that is going to have to change or this team is just going to circle the drain.

Best post i've read on the subject in some time. Popeye's also pretty well hit it

 

[Seymour]

Watch the all 22 tape. There have consistently been guys open in the middle the last two two years, but the ball rarely goes to that part of the field. Cherry picking stats doesn’t change what the tape clearly shows.

That is not "cherry picking stats". That is posting direct evidence that what you are saying is complete BS. You cannot own that, therefore it is senseless to discuss with you. I could show you "reels of tape" where Rodgers or Brady miss wide open targets over the middle too. Does that mean they suck? :roll:

 

[hawkman]

Watch the all 22 tape. There have consistently been guys open in the middle the last two two years, but the ball rarely goes to that part of the field. Cherry picking stats doesn’t change what the tape clearly shows.

That is not "cherry picking stats". That is posting direct evidence that what you are saying is complete BS. You cannot own that, therefore it is senseless to discuss with you. I could show you "reels of tape" where Rodgers or Brady miss wide open targets over the middle too. Does that mean they suck? :roll:

Over the past two seasons he has averaged #12 in qbr. If those stats you mentioned are not cherry picked neither are mine. Clearly RW is not top 5, more like number 12.

 

[Uncle Si]

RW was #10 last year. Just behind Drew Brees.

Is Drew Brees not a top 5 QB?

Carson Wentz was #1, Case Keenum #2.

Are those the best two QBs in the NFL?

Which doesnt answer the question about whether he can throw over the middle

 

[Seymour]

Watch the all 22 tape. There have consistently been guys open in the middle the last two two years, but the ball rarely goes to that part of the field. Cherry picking stats doesn’t change what the tape clearly shows.

That is not "cherry picking stats". That is posting direct evidence that what you are saying is complete BS. You cannot own that, therefore it is senseless to discuss with you. I could show you "reels of tape" where Rodgers or Brady miss wide open targets over the middle too. Does that mean they suck? :roll:

Over the past two seasons he has averaged #12 in qbr. If those stats you mentioned are not cherry picked neither are mine. Clearly RW is not top 5, more like number 12.

And you know better then HOF QB Kurt Warner and other professionals that are paid 100's of thousands per year to evaluate this?

Damn.....wish there was a safety net on this turnip truck. :snack:

 

[oldhawkfan]

I remember Hass having a good year then a bad year for about 4-5 seasons and he lost the game for us a few times
Everybody makes mistakes but with Hass you never got the feeling when we were behind we were still in it and Russ brings that in spades
Reading about cables blocking techniques and knowing some of Solaris I feel we can be a much better team with just that change right there so I am just exited we can have a chance to see our oline improve dramatically with the same guys and for Britt to turn around and do so well is a statement to good he may be and I know I'm gonna love brown cuz that guys a monster which I hope in turn leads us to a viable run game
I should bet some money on our potential to turn things around , can't wait to see it
Go Hawks
:irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers:

The difference between Hass and Russ is that with Hass you hoped he could bring the team back. With Russ, you just know he will.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Well, hate him or not, he's gonna' be here for awhile. Sorry that will ruin your football experience. And yes he's by far the best QB in team history, and it's not close.

 

[hawkman]

Watch the all 22 tape. There have consistently been guys open in the middle the last two two years, but the ball rarely goes to that part of the field. Cherry picking stats doesn’t change what the tape clearly shows.

That is not "cherry picking stats". That is posting direct evidence that what you are saying is complete BS. You cannot own that, therefore it is senseless to discuss with you. I could show you "reels of tape" where Rodgers or Brady miss wide open targets over the middle too. Does that mean they suck? :roll:

Over the past two seasons he has averaged #12 in qbr. If those stats you mentioned are not cherry picked neither are mine. Clearly RW is not top 5, more like number 12.

And you know better then HOF QB Kurt Warner and other professionals that are paid 100's of thousands per year to evaluate this?

Damn.....wish there was a safety net on this turnip truck. :snack:

So just to be clear, you put up a stat it proves you right. I put up a stat and it means nothing! I totally understand! You RW apologists are a special breed :lol: