Christine Michael

[Seahawk Sailor]

When the best argument for a running back is that he had a few very nice blocks, the writing's on the wall.

 

[sutz]

When the best argument for a running back is that he had a few very nice blocks, the writing's on the wall.

Pretty much. It's nice, yes, but not enough. The fumble alone is kind of ominous. I actually kind of like him, because he has some speed and decent moves, but ball security is a big thing for Pete. That's a big negative to overcome.

:229031_shrug:

 

[fridayfrenzy]

The negativity can be directed towards the OL instead of Michael. The Seattle RBs averaged less than three yards a carry. This wasn't a Christine Michael issue.

 

[formido]

Michael is in an impossible situation. When he dominates the Packer's first string defense in the preseason, folks say he played the back-ups and that he's a "preseason hero". When he fumbles in the preseason, suddenly the preseason is super important, even though Michael's regular season fumble rate is totally par. When Michael blocks poorly, that's why he can't get on the field. When he blocks well, "if that's the best you can say for him, etc."

Fact is, Michael is never put into a position to show off what he does best, which is run with the football. During the regular season, he is ONLY given runs in short yardage situations. He never gets to run on a 1st and 10 or 2nd and 5 with the 1st team offensive line--i.e., high value opportunities where his talent shines explosively. The only time he did last year was when Turbin fumbled against NY and Michael was subbed in; he immediately broke off a 50 yard run down to the goal line. He got a great hole that Turbin would have turned into 10 or 15 yards and he made it 50. That's what Michael would do regularly if he got legit touches.

IIRC, even with his sucky low value touches he led our RBs in YPC!

Obviously, Michael's days are numbered here. Whether's it's this made-up ball switching criticism or a personality conflict or whatever, he's not being played to his strengths for a reason. He's gonna run roughshod somewhere, though, where they care about actual fumble rate and value added, rather than flaws that are more imaginary than consequential. If he goes to Dallas, the numbers he puts up will be insane. They'll let him carry the ball in whichever hand he wants. Carry it in both hands, for God's sake, he'll still run further than Turbin.

Michael's the only RB besides Lynch on the team right now with enough talent to do more than just squander plays as a feature back in this system. If it weren't for the mutually reinforcing dynamic of Lynch and Wilson's legs, I shudder to think how pathetic the run game would look.

 

[QuahHawk]

Michael is in an impossible situation. When he dominates the Packer's first string defense in the preseason, folks say he played the back-ups and that he's a "preseason hero". When he fumbles in the preseason, suddenly the preseason is super important, even though Michael's regular season fumble rate is totally par. When Michael blocks poorly, that's why he can't get on the field. When he blocks well, "if that's the best you can say for him, etc."

Fact is, Michael is never put into a position to show off what he does best, which is run with the football. During the regular season, he is ONLY given runs in short yardage situations. He never gets to run on a 1st and 10 or 2nd and 5 with the 1st team offensive line--i.e., high value opportunities where his talent shines explosively. The only time he did last year was when Turbin fumbled against NY and Michael was subbed in; he immediately broke off a 50 yard run down to the goal line. He got a great hole that Turbin would have turned into 10 or 15 yards and he made it 50. That's what Michael would do regularly if he got legit touches.

IIRC, even with his sucky low value touches he led our RBs in YPC!

Obviously, Michael's days are numbered here. Whether's it's this made-up ball switching criticism or a personality conflict or whatever, he's not being played to his strengths for a reason. He's gonna run roughshod somewhere, though, where they care about actual fumble rate and value added, rather than flaws that are more imaginary than consequential. If he goes to Dallas, the numbers he puts up will be insane. They'll let him carry the ball in whichever hand he wants. Carry it in both hands, for God's sake, he'll still run further than Turbin.

Michael's the only RB besides Lynch on the team right now with enough talent to do more than just squander plays as a feature back in this system. If it weren't for the mutually reinforcing dynamic of Lynch and Wilson's legs, I shudder to think how pathetic the run game would look.

The fumble was bad. I still feel like every time Michael has the ball in his hands he could break one, I don't want to go into a season where we expect to make a deep playoff run with Turbin as the best option behind Lynch. If Lynch went down for a few games this season, the combo of Michael & Turbine is actually pretty good. I actually worry more about ball security when Turbine has the ball.

 

[SauceTownHawk]

I wonder how michael would do on the cowboys?

 

[hawk45]

I definitely think our run game tanks without a back with something special. Turbin runs for nothing behind this line. So fumbles or not it's not an easy decision to make IMO.

 

[Sports Hernia]

We need to ship him off and get as much as we can for him now...That wouldn't be much at the moment, but something is better than nothing and if he keeps fumbling throughout the preseason, nothing will be right around the corner.

If you can't hold on to the ball and you are still trying to learn consistency, blocking and doing the little things in year three? Hmmm. Cut your loses. He strikes me as someone who thought he could make it on athletic ability alone. Doesn't work that way in the NFL.

He still has some upside (young, athletic, quick, powerful) which could potentially garner a conditional 5th round pick or so, but the more he shows he really hasn't changed much in his NFL career, the less chance we get a decent pick for him in a trade.

Turbin doesn't rock my world either (I'm spoiled with Lynch but aren't we all?) but at least he shows an overall better consistency in his game.

Kind of what I was thinking. If you trade him you control where he goes. I think with a good offensive line he can be effective, but we don't have that.

 

[Seaswab]

He's still an idiot...

 

[kearly]

Michael's fumble was a trainwreck. But he did have two hands on it. He has shown some improvement transferring the ball to the outside hand. He still needs to improve on five points of contact, I would assume.

Even still, Seattle has always had a policy of saving the last few roster spots for the most talented players. For Michael to be beat out by Rawls or Smith, it would require that those guys prove themselves to have greater or equal talent to Michael. At this time, I don't think Rawls is talented enough to unseat Michael. Smith looks like an NFL player, if he has a monster preseason he has a decent shot I think.

 

[Scottemojo]

Michael is in an impossible situation. When he dominates the Packer's first string defense in the preseason, folks say he played the back-ups and that he's a "preseason hero". When he fumbles in the preseason, suddenly the preseason is super important, even though Michael's regular season fumble rate is totally par. When Michael blocks poorly, that's why he can't get on the field. When he blocks well, "if that's the best you can say for him, etc."

Fact is, Michael is never put into a position to show off what he does best, which is run with the football. During the regular season, he is ONLY given runs in short yardage situations. He never gets to run on a 1st and 10 or 2nd and 5 with the 1st team offensive line--i.e., high value opportunities where his talent shines explosively. The only time he did last year was when Turbin fumbled against NY and Michael was subbed in; he immediately broke off a 50 yard run down to the goal line. He got a great hole that Turbin would have turned into 10 or 15 yards and he made it 50. That's what Michael would do regularly if he got legit touches.

IIRC, even with his sucky low value touches he led our RBs in YPC!

Obviously, Michael's days are numbered here. Whether's it's this made-up ball switching criticism or a personality conflict or whatever, he's not being played to his strengths for a reason. He's gonna run roughshod somewhere, though, where they care about actual fumble rate and value added, rather than flaws that are more imaginary than consequential. If he goes to Dallas, the numbers he puts up will be insane. They'll let him carry the ball in whichever hand he wants. Carry it in both hands, for God's sake, he'll still run further than Turbin.

Michael's the only RB besides Lynch on the team right now with enough talent to do more than just squander plays as a feature back in this system. If it weren't for the mutually reinforcing dynamic of Lynch and Wilson's legs, I shudder to think how pathetic the run game would look.

Totally. Our coaching staff is too stupid to use C-mike more often and properly, I hate those guys.

I kid dude. But his ball handling issues are not imaginary. he looks like he is carrying a porcupine. He switched hands last night during a run and looked like he was taking an SAT exam while doing it.

 

[hawkfan68]

The Michael pick was a head scratcher in 2012 and it still is. It wouldn't have been a questionable pick had Michael panned out on special teams but because he hasn't done much there it now is. Now that Lockett is proving he's a bonafide candidate to take over returns, there's no need to hang on to Michael. I'd be in favor of using his spot for a more deserving player in other positions, for example an extra wide receiver, DL, or DB.

 

[kearly]

Michael is in an impossible situation. When he dominates the Packer's first string defense in the preseason, folks say he played the back-ups and that he's a "preseason hero". When he fumbles in the preseason, suddenly the preseason is super important, even though Michael's regular season fumble rate is totally par. When Michael blocks poorly, that's why he can't get on the field. When he blocks well, "if that's the best you can say for him, etc."

Fact is, Michael is never put into a position to show off what he does best, which is run with the football. During the regular season, he is ONLY given runs in short yardage situations. He never gets to run on a 1st and 10 or 2nd and 5 with the 1st team offensive line--i.e., high value opportunities where his talent shines explosively. The only time he did last year was when Turbin fumbled against NY and Michael was subbed in; he immediately broke off a 50 yard run down to the goal line. He got a great hole that Turbin would have turned into 10 or 15 yards and he made it 50. That's what Michael would do regularly if he got legit touches.

IIRC, even with his sucky low value touches he led our RBs in YPC!

Obviously, Michael's days are numbered here. Whether's it's this made-up ball switching criticism or a personality conflict or whatever, he's not being played to his strengths for a reason. He's gonna run roughshod somewhere, though, where they care about actual fumble rate and value added, rather than flaws that are more imaginary than consequential. If he goes to Dallas, the numbers he puts up will be insane. They'll let him carry the ball in whichever hand he wants. Carry it in both hands, for God's sake, he'll still run further than Turbin.

Michael's the only RB besides Lynch on the team right now with enough talent to do more than just squander plays as a feature back in this system. If it weren't for the mutually reinforcing dynamic of Lynch and Wilson's legs, I shudder to think how pathetic the run game would look.

I see it just as you do. If Michael were shipped to the Cowboys tomorrow he would be one of the guys I couldn't leave a fantasy draft without.

But to be fair, it's Michael's fault that he hasn't given the haters a reason to shut up. Ball security shouldn't be as hard as he has made it, and he has too much size to struggle in pass pro. I'm not giving up on Michael at all, in fact I am seeing some slow signs of progress. I just think it might ultimately prove to be too slow.

 

[AgentDib]

Whether's it's this made-up ball switching criticism or a personality conflict or whatever, he's not being played to his strengths for a reason. He's gonna run roughshod somewhere, though, where they care about actual fumble rate and value added, rather than flaws that are more imaginary than consequential.

I'll agree that as fans we don't know for sure what CMike's ceiling is. It's a huge stretch to also claim our coaching staff isn't playing to CMike's strengths for a "made-up" criticism, a "personality conflict" or "imaginary" flaws. It's so much more likely that a player who has been slow to produce in our rushing offense has been mostly responsible for that himself. Maybe another scheme or set of priorities would see CMike flourish but that isn't a reason to pass the buck on his contributions.

 

[ZorntoLargent]

I finally saw him switch the ball to the outside arm yesterday.

 

[jammerhawk]

That fumble was ugly, yet you watch Michael and he looks to be improved in key areas of his game.he has had ball security issues since being drafted and that is unpardonable in Pete's grand scheme. He's likely the most physically talented Rb on the team,save for Lynch, and even there Michael's athleticism is arguably better, Lynch is in a different talent zone as far as making his talent translate on the field and his ability to make yardage w/o assistance is unparalleled. No doubt Michael has been a disappointment here but seems to need to feel it before he gets rolling as a RB yet disappoints enough to deprive him of the opportunity to stay in the game long enough.

I've thought that Michael would have showed us enough by now to pass Turbin,a steady predictable back-up, who isn't anywhere as physically talented; but Turbin effectively pass blocks, is consistently dependable, and is mentally superior to Michael. The coaches have reasons why Michael hasn't been given the ball more often and we see some of them shown to us when he is on the field. Perhaps Michael is difficult to coach, or practices poorly, don't know. I'm still wanting to see more from him but agree his chances are running out here. I thought even with the fumble he was better than Rawls who does look like a CFL back, was left wanting to see more from Smith who looked interesting. To me Michael is challenging to assess b/c he flashes his exceptional abilities enough to be kept around however he's had three seasons to show something and so far hasn't been able to make the next step. Perhaps he needs a different scheme or situation? To me he's got the rest of camp and three more preseason games left but I could see him being kept.

 

[Ozzy]

Michael's physical skills are as good as any in the entire league. I know it sounds crazy saying that but it's true. I don't fault fans for giving up on him but he still has a chance to be special. I don't think Pete will give up on that until he is sure he won't succeed, especially with lynch possibly in his last year.

It will be almost impossible to replace lynch but like it or not Michael is one of a very small group who has the talent to possibly do that IF he can figure it all out.

 

[HawkGA]

It wouldn't surprise me if the team tries to go into the season with just 2 running backs and Rawls on the practice squad. Frees up a roster spot for an WR. The only danger is that Rawls shows too much or gets talked up too much and gets poached by another team.

 

[sam1313]

Good article on how WELL Christine played against Denver here: http://12thmanrising.com/2015/08/17...ly&utm_source=FanSided+Daily&utm_medium=email

Interesting quotes:

"If you remove the fumble play from his stat line, Michael’s stat line becomes 6 carries for 28 yards. That’s 4.7 yards per carry, which is phenomenal considering how poor the blocking was four of those six carries."

"Lets not let one fumble cloud our judgement on a very gifted player. We don’e need another Ahman Green situation."

It is pretty easy to get down on Christine, but I hope that this article and some of the prior posts are correct and he can break through soon.

 

[c_hawkbob]

Michael's physical skills are as good as any in the entire league.

No, his physical attributes are. His Physical skills are what is lacking somewhat.