Do the Eagles really even have a chance?

[5_Golden_Rings]

Yeah I don't get how people think the game is rigged in the Pats favor. Comes across as pure saltiness.

Also, if the Seahawks can scheme to mitigate the Eagles pressure, then the Pats sure as hell can. Philly gonna have to come up with something new.

Can Brady run like Russ? Eagles put plenty of pressure on Russell but he was able to run around and they couldn't get to him. Brady isn't doing that.

Anyways, as it's been said...the key for the Eagles is getting pressure on Brady UP THE MIDDLE, never mind the edges. Edge pressure doesn't bother him too much since he's a master at stepping up in the pocket and delivering. It's when you come up the middle at him and put the pressure in his face is when he gets a little rattled.

Eagles obviously have Fletcher Cox/Timmy Jernigan coming up the middle so I like the Eagles chances to be able to do that.

The other thing I like for the Eagles here is the fact that Bill Belichick is a MASTER at taking away the one thing you do best on offense. So what is the one thing the Eagles do best on offense? There isn't one thing.

If he wants to take out Zach Ertz, fine. Then what about Alshon/Torrey/Nelson/Burton and the RBs? Belichick is great at that and teams that have one primary weapon (see Fournette two weeks ago) that spells some trouble.

The Eagles have such a balanced attack in all phases on offense, I'm curious to see what Bill tries to take away and how the Eagles counteract it.

Eagles 30
Patriots 27

Probably the run pass option.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Yeah I don't get how people think the game is rigged in the Pats favor. Comes across as pure saltiness..

Yes, it's saltiness, and there's now a long history of the Patriots winning over and over..........with some questionable calls.

But part of that is they play with such discipline mistake free clutch football, that yes most of the time there is a big disparity in penalties and mistakes. But that's a credit to Belichick, not some grand league conspiracy.

If deflategate showed us anything, it's that the "league" is VERY tired of the Patriots.

To play the devils advocate, it wouldn’t take a grand conspiracy. All it would take is a few key officials being Pats fans or friends with Pats players.

Refs are human, but to think they'd compromise their integrity and careers playing favorites is ludicrous to me...........especially during the biggest most watched and scrutinized games of the year, including the SB.

 

[chris98251]

Yeah I don't get how people think the game is rigged in the Pats favor. Comes across as pure saltiness.

Also, if the Seahawks can scheme to mitigate the Eagles pressure, then the Pats sure as hell can. Philly gonna have to come up with something new.

Can Brady run like Russ? Eagles put plenty of pressure on Russell but he was able to run around and they couldn't get to him. Brady isn't doing that.

Anyways, as it's been said...the key for the Eagles is getting pressure on Brady UP THE MIDDLE, never mind the edges. Edge pressure doesn't bother him too much since he's a master at stepping up in the pocket and delivering. It's when you come up the middle at him and put the pressure in his face is when he gets a little rattled.

Eagles obviously have Fletcher Cox/Timmy Jernigan coming up the middle so I like the Eagles chances to be able to do that.

The other thing I like for the Eagles here is the fact that Bill Belichick is a MASTER at taking away the one thing you do best on offense. So what is the one thing the Eagles do best on offense? There isn't one thing.

If he wants to take out Zach Ertz, fine. Then what about Alshon/Torrey/Nelson/Burton and the RBs? Belichick is great at that and teams that have one primary weapon (see Fournette two weeks ago) that spells some trouble.

The Eagles have such a balanced attack in all phases on offense, I'm curious to see what Bill tries to take away and how the Eagles counteract it.

Eagles 30
Patriots 27

Foles, Bill is a master DC also, get to him, confuse him, make him panic in the pocket. The stage is huge he is going to have butterflies anyway, make him make a mistake early and possibly take his confidence away.

 

[Jerhawk]

If the NFL wants to keep fan interest going into the offseason, a Patriots loss would be much more beneficial.

Our society loves seeing a giant toppled. David vs Goliath. Most of the country wants an Eagles win.

 

[NINEster]

Yeah I don't get how people think the game is rigged in the Pats favor. Comes across as pure saltiness.

Also, if the Seahawks can scheme to mitigate the Eagles pressure, then the Pats sure as hell can. Philly gonna have to come up with something new.

Can Brady run like Russ? Eagles put plenty of pressure on Russell but he was able to run around and they couldn't get to him. Brady isn't doing that.

Anyways, as it's been said...the key for the Eagles is getting pressure on Brady UP THE MIDDLE, never mind the edges. Edge pressure doesn't bother him too much since he's a master at stepping up in the pocket and delivering. It's when you come up the middle at him and put the pressure in his face is when he gets a little rattled.

Eagles obviously have Fletcher Cox/Timmy Jernigan coming up the middle so I like the Eagles chances to be able to do that.

The other thing I like for the Eagles here is the fact that Bill Belichick is a MASTER at taking away the one thing you do best on offense. So what is the one thing the Eagles do best on offense? There isn't one thing.

If he wants to take out Zach Ertz, fine. Then what about Alshon/Torrey/Nelson/Burton and the RBs? Belichick is great at that and teams that have one primary weapon (see Fournette two weeks ago) that spells some trouble.

The Eagles have such a balanced attack in all phases on offense, I'm curious to see what Bill tries to take away and how the Eagles counteract it.

Eagles 30
Patriots 27

I like this reasoning.

In the lead up to last year's SB I felt Belichick would be unable to scheme for all of the Falcons weapons and Kyle Shanahan's offense. Having Julio Jones was merely a luxury in a very multi-faceted offensive attack.

And I was mostly right. He had no answer until fatigue and/or poor decisions undermined that offense, but in many ways you can argue that the Falcon offense was never answered schematically.

It was the same with the 49ers at Gillette a few years ago. Niners got up to 31-3 and then didn't add more points until the Patriots tied the game, then pulled away to win.

That 2012 49er offense could run the ball, pass protect well and had 2 good WRs (Crabtree & Moss) and 2 very good TEs (Davis & Walker). With enough legitimate receiving threats and a decent ground game, the kneeler was hard to stop (4 TDs).

 

[Hasselbeck]

Of course they have a chance. The Patriots never blow anyone out in a Super Bowl.

Ultimately it will come down to how the Eagles manage the game. All too often, the Patriots get in opponents heads without doing a single thing.

 

[Uncle Si]

If the NFL wants to keep fan interest going into the offseason, a Patriots loss would be much more beneficial.

Our society loves seeing a giant toppled. David vs Goliath. Most of the country wants an Eagles win.

I disagree...

Our society loves Goliath in sports. Sure, they love to root for the underdog. But to have that, you must have Goliath. An Eagles win will be fun (i think they will win). But it is not going to increase or maintain any level of interest in the NFL that a Patriots win would inspire.

I'd even suggest that a Pats win would do better for the offseason. "will someone please beat this team already"

 

[original poster]

If the NFL wants to keep fan interest going into the offseason, a Patriots loss would be much more beneficial.

Our society loves seeing a giant toppled. David vs Goliath. Most of the country wants an Eagles win.

I disagree...

Our society loves Goliath in sports. Sure, they love to root for the underdog. But to have that, you must have Goliath. An Eagles win will be fun (i think they will win). But it is not going to increase or maintain any level of interest in the NFL that a Patriots win would inspire.

I'd even suggest that a Pats win would do better for the offseason. "will someone please beat this team already"

I agree.

If the Eagles win fans will just shrug their shoulders and move on. If the Pats win they'll whine and moan about it until the 2018 season starts up.

 

[hawk45]

If the formula for beating the Patriots is for the Eagles front 7 to get to Brady, that doesn't bode well for the Eagles IMO.

I have unassailable logic for my opinion: Darrell freaking Bevell was able to design a quick-pass game plan heavy with rub routes to mitigate the Eagle rush and exploit man coverage.

Let that sink in for a minute.

Now realize they are playing Bill Belichick and Tom Brady whose pictures are in the dictionary next to rub-routes and using short passes to mitigate pass rush.

I do believe the Eagles have a chance because Superbowls are weird, but we'll either need to see a defensive game plan and ability to adjust that we were not seeing midway through the season from the Eagles, or there will have to be some monster personnel mismatch that is so overwhelming it can't be schemed around by Belichick.

Also, an Eagle win would depend upon Nick Foles overcoming Belichick's ability to change his defense to take away what you do best. This is no Atlanta juggernaut with too many weapons to contain and Matt Ryan.

 

[Uncle Si]

If the formula for beating the Patriots is for the Eagles front 7 to get to Brady, that doesn't bode well for the Eagles IMO.

I have unassailable logic for my opinion: Darrell freaking Bevell was able to design a quick-pass game plan heavy with rub routes to mitigate the Eagle rush and exploit man coverage.

Let that sink in for a minute.

Now realize they are playing Bill Belichick and Tom Brady whose pictures are in the dictionary next to rub-routes and using short passes to mitigate pass rush.

I do believe the Eagles have a chance because Superbowls are weird, but we'll either need to see a defensive game plan and ability to adjust that we were not seeing midway through the season from the Eagles, or there will have to be some monster personnel mismatch that is so overwhelming it can't be schemed around by Belichick.

Also, an Eagle win would depend upon Nick Foles overcoming Belichick's ability to change his defense to take away what you do best. This is no Atlanta juggernaut with too many weapons to contain and Matt Ryan.

A much better defense in MN got wiped clean by Nick Foles

 

[hawk45]

If the formula for beating the Patriots is for the Eagles front 7 to get to Brady, that doesn't bode well for the Eagles IMO.

I have unassailable logic for my opinion: Darrell freaking Bevell was able to design a quick-pass game plan heavy with rub routes to mitigate the Eagle rush and exploit man coverage.

Let that sink in for a minute.

Now realize they are playing Bill Belichick and Tom Brady whose pictures are in the dictionary next to rub-routes and using short passes to mitigate pass rush.

I do believe the Eagles have a chance because Superbowls are weird, but we'll either need to see a defensive game plan and ability to adjust that we were not seeing midway through the season from the Eagles, or there will have to be some monster personnel mismatch that is so overwhelming it can't be schemed around by Belichick.

Also, an Eagle win would depend upon Nick Foles overcoming Belichick's ability to change his defense to take away what you do best. This is no Atlanta juggernaut with too many weapons to contain and Matt Ryan.

A much better defense in MN got wiped clean by Nick Foles

You make a rock-solid point.

I will say that Belichick's ability to game plan specifically for a single team is in his favor when the team he faces isn't loaded with weapons. And that this all relies upon Nick Foles playing out of his freaking mind on the largest stage in the world for 2 straight weeks, which I have a difficult time seeing.

The Foles thing is the toughest thing for me to weigh by far. I mean obviously if he brings the level of play that torched Minnesota we have to give him a chance. I guess my cynicism leads me to think he had a once-in-a-lifetime performance, or that something about that matchup made all points converge for him. The alternative is that it was a light-bulb moment and this is who Nick Foles is from now on? At least for this post-season? Man I struggle with that.

 

[RolandDeschain]

Refs are human, but to think they'd compromise their integrity and careers playing favorites is ludicrous to me...........especially during the biggest most watched and scrutinized games of the year, including the SB.

A lot of people don't understand basic human psychology. You're biased, period. I'm biased. EVERYBODY is biased. Even when you try not to be, it's extremely difficult to truly remove bias from your perspective on anything.

You should read some of the studies done on how beliefs dictate both actions and your perception of the physical world. Seriously, what you believe quite literally impacts what you see.

 

[Uncle Si]

If the formula for beating the Patriots is for the Eagles front 7 to get to Brady, that doesn't bode well for the Eagles IMO.

I have unassailable logic for my opinion: Darrell freaking Bevell was able to design a quick-pass game plan heavy with rub routes to mitigate the Eagle rush and exploit man coverage.

Let that sink in for a minute.

Now realize they are playing Bill Belichick and Tom Brady whose pictures are in the dictionary next to rub-routes and using short passes to mitigate pass rush.

I do believe the Eagles have a chance because Superbowls are weird, but we'll either need to see a defensive game plan and ability to adjust that we were not seeing midway through the season from the Eagles, or there will have to be some monster personnel mismatch that is so overwhelming it can't be schemed around by Belichick.

Also, an Eagle win would depend upon Nick Foles overcoming Belichick's ability to change his defense to take away what you do best. This is no Atlanta juggernaut with too many weapons to contain and Matt Ryan.

A much better defense in MN got wiped clean by Nick Foles

You make a rock-solid point.

I will say that Belichick's ability to game plan specifically for a single team is in his favor when the team he faces isn't loaded with weapons. And that this all relies upon Nick Foles playing out of his freaking mind on the largest stage in the world for 2 straight weeks, which I have a difficult time seeing.

The Foles thing is the toughest thing for me to weigh by far. I mean obviously if he brings the level of play that torched Minnesota we have to give him a chance. I guess my cynicism leads me to think he had a once-in-a-lifetime performance, or that something about that matchup made all points converge for him. The alternative is that it was a light-bulb moment and this is who Nick Foles is from now on? At least for this post-season? Man I struggle with that.

Agreed. I wouldn't put my money on Foles. But... I think that defense can keep the Pats at bay, maybe even steal some points. What Foles does I think will be the game

 

[Grahamhawker]

What was key to the Giants' SB victories over the Pats? Beyond the Tyree and Manningham catches, I remember D-Line effort and play at an amazing level. So there's that.

 

[hawk45]

Refs are human, but to think they'd compromise their integrity and careers playing favorites is ludicrous to me...........especially during the biggest most watched and scrutinized games of the year, including the SB.

A lot of people don't understand basic human psychology. You're biased, period. I'm biased. EVERYBODY is biased. Even when you try not to be, it's extremely difficult to truly remove bias from your perspective on anything.

You should read some of the studies done on how beliefs dictate both actions and your perception of the physical world. Seriously, what you believe quite literally impacts what you see.

Sgt seems to me to be referring to deliberate steering of games because that would involve a conscious decision to compromise their careers.
I think he's right on that point.

Your point about unconscious bias is true as well, but that's going to be a lower grade of steering that may or may not be noticeable.

 

[RolandDeschain]

Sgt seems to me to be referring to deliberate steering of games because that would involve a conscious decision to compromise their careers.
I think he's right on that point.

Your point about unconscious bias is true as well, but that's going to be a lower grade of steering that may or may not be noticeable.

You don't notice subconscious bias, which means you're making choices affected by it without even realizing it. That's more dangerous, not less.

 

[hawk45]

I think subconscious bias is more dangerous in an echo chamber where no one near you is calling you on it like media (right or left).

For NFL refs it's the opposite of an echo chamber. Any bias small enough to be subconscious are more likely to be subsumed by their desire not to be trashed by millions and by history for one sided officiating. Thus, absent deliberate intent to put finger in scale, the effect will be smaller.

Sarge and I don't disagree with you because we require education about conscious vs subconscious bias. We disagree on the merits of your viewpoint.

 

[hawk45]

I think subconscious bias is more dangerous in an echo chamber where no one near you is calling you on it like media (right or left).

For NFL refs it's the opposite of an echo chamber. Any bias small enough to be subconscious are more likely to be subsumed by their desire not to be trashed by millions and by history for one sided officiating. Thus, absent deliberate intent to put finger in scale, the effect will be smaller.

Sarge and I don't disagree with you because we require education about conscious vs subconscious bias (well I should only speak for myself, perhaps Sarge will say your tutelage has changed his whole position). We disagree on the merits of your viewpoint. It's a tad condescending to assume otherwise and engage lecture mode.

 

[RolandDeschain]

We disagree on the merits of your viewpoint. It's a tad condescending to assume otherwise and engage lecture mode.

And therein lies the rub. Can't account for or compensate for something when you don't agree that it matters.

 

[Sox-n-Hawks]

An underdog team playing with a chip on their shoulder... get some.