Penny And Past Hawks Backs

[Chapow]

I'm not sure why he want to put on more weight he doesn't seem like a guy that can truck people. I hate that Brock compared him to Shaun Alexander, the softest back in history.

Get outta here with that garbage.

You don't average over 300 carries and 1500 yards per season for 5 straight seasons in the NFL if you're soft.

We would be extremely fortunate if Penny becomes the next Shaun Alexander.

I could have ran for 1200 yards a year behind that OL. Alexander was soft as they come but he did other things well.

:roll: I doubt you could have run for 100 yards a year behind that OL in the NFL, but whatever.

We had arguably the best LT ever, a very very good LG, and 3 other guys that were adequate to good, but nothing special. Believe it or not, Alexander often ran to the right as well. It wasn't even close to always running behind Big Walt and Hutch.

The OL absolutely deserves some credit for Alexanders success, but so does Alexander.

 

[KitsapGuy]

Let's stay on topic here.

 

[Spin Doctor]

I'm not sure why he want to put on more weight he doesn't seem like a guy that can truck people. I hate that Brock compared him to Shaun Alexander, the softest back in history.

Get outta here with that garbage.

You don't average over 300 carries and 1500 yards per season for 5 straight seasons in the NFL if you're soft.

We would be extremely fortunate if Penny becomes the next Shaun Alexander.

I could have ran for 1200 yards a year behind that OL. Alexander was soft as they come but he did other things well.

:roll: I doubt you could have run for 100 yards a year behind that OL in the NFL, but whatever.

We had arguably the best LT ever, a very very good LG, and 3 other guys that were adequate to good, but nothing special. Believe it or not, Alexander often ran to the right as well. It wasn't even close to always running behind Big Walt and Hutch.

The OL absolutely deserves some credit for Alexanders success, but so does Alexander.

Alexander had very good vision and was very shifty at the LOS. It was hard to get a hand on him there. He could find the smallest of creases and take it for a huge gain.

 

[vin.couve12]

Had Penny as one of my top 2 available backs with Michel, given where Barkley was going to go. I didn't know Michel's knee was bone on bone so we won out there.

Also said I wasn't even considering Guice in the first or second round due to the outlook of him always being injured at the NFL level with that style. Torn ACL and out for the season.

Penny was the right pick.

 

[hawk45]

Had Penny as one of my top 2 available backs with Michel, given where Barkley was going to go. I didn't know Michel's knee was bone on bone so we won out there.

Also said I wasn't even considering Guice in the first or second round due to the outlook of him always being injured at the NFL level with that style. Torn ACL and out for the season.

Penny was the right pick.

Yeah, any other year I might've griped about spending a first rounder at that position where we've seen later rounders able to perform.

But however much I like Carson, he got injured number one, and number two we just saw Rawls beast out one year then fizzle the next. I think Carson > Rawls, but this is a team that wants to get back to running the ball. Spending a bit of capital to build a stable isn't unwarranted.

 

[Thepeelsessions]

Had Penny as one of my top 2 available backs with Michel, given where Barkley was going to go. I didn't know Michel's knee was bone on bone so we won out there.

Also said I wasn't even considering Guice in the first or second round due to the outlook of him always being injured at the NFL level with that style. Torn ACL and out for the season.

Penny was the right pick.

I had Penny and Royce Freeman as 1 and 2 coming out. I think their styles and hard nosed running is the best suited for the NFL. What I loved most about Penny was he was doing it ALL at SDSU. Running through guys, running over guys, running away from guys, making them miss, and all at an insane rate. I think people forget that Ladanisn Tomlinson and Marshall Faulk came from the same school with the same level of competition. I hate, hate, hate Barkley's game. I see BUST written all over him. He is too white collar as a perceived feature back. He was absolutely atrocious at gaining yards after initial contact. His game is built around making people miss, which he won't always be able to do. If he couldn't run through guys on the college level, I can't see him being able to do it at the pro level. I'm probably in the minority, but I refuse to buy the mass Barkley hype.

After reading all the replies and looking over his replays I feel much better about his potential. If he's given the opportunity to get 15-20+ touches a game, I think we'll see why he was number one on John and Pete's board. He is a very talented and tough RB.

 

[toffee]

8 carries for 16 yds.

2 rec 7 yds.

10 touches 23 yds.

Stats, shmats.

The context is what matters. His opportunities in the open field, against the #2 defenders is what disappointed me. Being tackled in the backfield I won't hold that against him, in the open field though he didn't do much. I see why he is #2 on the depth chart, and hardly been covered by the media.

I am with Fade here. I want Penny to be very successful, but so far he hasn't done anything to make me jumping with joy and excitement.

 

[chris98251]

I'm not sure why he want to put on more weight he doesn't seem like a guy that can truck people. I hate that Brock compared him to Shaun Alexander, the softest back in history.

Get outta here with that garbage.

You don't average over 300 carries and 1500 yards per season for 5 straight seasons in the NFL if you're soft.

We would be extremely fortunate if Penny becomes the next Shaun Alexander.

Reason why Watters started Shauns Rookie year he was soft and would not pass block, reason we telegraphed 3rd and long was because Shaun often pulled and would not pass block so we went with the other back or the FB draw play. Shaun only was tough when inside the 20, or when we played Washington that game and actually got pissed off and took over. Best game I ever seen him play all around. Wish he could have had that mentality every game, he would be in Canton and eclipsed Tomlinson easily.

The Washington game showed he had it in him, he left a lot more on the table and could have been another level kind of back if his heart or mentality was in it.

OK. So a guy that averaged well over 300 carries per season, 1500 yards per season, and 17 TDs per season for 5 straight seasons, in the NFL, left "a lot more on the table" and didn't have his heart or mentality in it?

How much more do you think he left on the table? Because that was one hell of a half decade he put in for this team. You think if only his heart and mentality were in it and he weren't soft he would've averaged, what? 400 carries per season? 2000 yards per season? 20 TDs per season? For 5 straight seasons?

I get that many fans are butthurt about the "stabbed me in the back" comment and that he wasn't able to play well through multiple injuries like a broken bone in his foot and a broken wrist (though he did try) after 2005, but good lord. Just mind boggling to me that so many cannot appreciate or respect what he did for this team for those 5 years.

I got news for you, he was "another level kind of back" whether you're willing to admit it or not.

He left a shit load of receptions on the table because he was not playing in passing situations, he left a shit load of fight for yards on the table. He could have been easily a 2000 yd back and 500 yard reception guy in Holmgren's offense with a Ricky Watters attitude.

That's the next level guy.

 

[vin.couve12]

Speaking from experience, RBs get hurt most often while fighting for extra yards. Check Guice's last run as an example. You get held up by 2 or more defenders and you need to hit the deck. Hell, Carson was an example of that last year. Leg injuries are quite common in that scenario. Lynch wasan exception, not the rule.

 

[scutterhawk]

Truly looked like JAG out there. Nothing he did was particularly impressive. Had one nice run but it wasn’t anything that any other NFL-caliber RB wouldn’t have done

I know that you're considering him being a Rookie, and not getting anywhere near enough touches to get into a rhythm with the #1 O-Line.
Also, it's WAAAY too small a sample size to be evaluating what this kid is capable of.
If Pete is working with him being a more complete RB by getting him to be a better blocker, then I'd say that they have him on the right track, because if he can value up on helping his Quarterback, he'll be a more complete weapon for the Offense. :2thumbs:

 

[chris98251]

Speaking from experience, RBs get hurt most often while fighting for extra yards. Check Guice's last run as an example. You get held up by 2 or more defenders and you need to hit the deck. Hell, Carson was an example of that last year. Leg injuries are quite common in that scenario. Lynch wasan exception, not the rule.

Also speaking from experience, delivering a blow instead of always receiving one is the way to go, always told my kids go thru one, go for the angle on two, when three or more go down once your stopped. But finish the run with power.

How Walter Payton ran, Jim Brown ran, Lynch Ran, Csonka Ran, Riggins ran.

Be the punching bag or be the fist.

 

[Chapow]

He left a shit load of receptions on the table because he was not playing in passing situations, he left a shit load of fight for yards on the table. He could have been easily a 2000 yd back and 500 yard reception guy in Holmgren's offense with a Ricky Watters attitude.

That's the next level guy.

There is no such thing as being able to easily rush for 2000 yards and receive for 500 yards in the NFL. Much less for 5 straight years. If you truly believe that Alexander could have easily done that, you must think he was the greatest RB in NFL history. That's not the next level guy, that's the greatest of all time guy.

 

[scutterhawk]

How much more do you think he left on the table? Because that was one hell of a half decade he put in for this team. You think if only his heart and mentality were in it and he weren't soft he would've averaged, what? 400 carries per season? 2000 yards per season? 20 TDs per season? For 5 straight seasons?

Yeah I don't know about projecting what Shaun might have been with a different running style. And from a production standpoint he was prolific.

But I also don't quibble with the "soft" label. Backs in the NFL who won't block and don't fight for extra yardage get that label hung on them.

"Finesse" would be the less pejorative word to use here but that ship sailed when we saw SA slide like a QB to avoid contact. I mean that sort of display would get parents yelling at their peewee league daughters.

It doesn't diminish his greatness for me, but it makes it much more difficult to form an emotional fan connection with a player. As opposed to a guy like Lynch who would leave his arm behind if it meant getting back to the LOS.

Why then was SA MONEY in the Red Zone, & ML so meh?, and don't give me this crap about Shaun Alexander having big Walt & Hutchinson springing him for all those TD's? truth is, SA ran a LOT to the Right side of the line for many of those TD's, and DESERVES CREDIT for that.
ALSO, ML was caught behind the LOS MANY MANY TIMES.
Truth is, this is an extremely brutal & violent game, and them that don't play with SOME semblance of finesse, and self preservation, won't be playing for long nowdays, as Defenders are getting faster & stronger than ever....just ask Kam Chancellor how just ONE bad angle can end a career.

 

[vin.couve12]

Speaking from experience, RBs get hurt most often while fighting for extra yards. Check Guice's last run as an example. You get held up by 2 or more defenders and you need to hit the deck. Hell, Carson was an example of that last year. Leg injuries are quite common in that scenario. Lynch wasan exception, not the rule.

Also speaking from experience, delivering a blow instead of always receiving one is the way to go, always told my kids go thru one, go for the angle on two, when three or more go down once your stopped. But finish the run with power.

How Walter Payton ran, Jim Brown ran, Lynch Ran, Csonka Ran, Riggins ran.

Be the punching bag or be the fist.

That goes without saying, but you're talking about a different aspect of running. Delivering a blow and driving with guys draped all over you are two different things. The latter is a double edged sword and is career inhibiting unless you're an extreme select few.

Never cared for Alexander's game btw. He and Emmitt Smith had OLs that basically gave them a red carpet.

 

[chris98251]

He left a shit load of receptions on the table because he was not playing in passing situations, he left a shit load of fight for yards on the table. He could have been easily a 2000 yd back and 500 yard reception guy in Holmgren's offense with a Ricky Watters attitude.

That's the next level guy.

There is no such thing as being able to easily rush for 2000 yards and receive for 500 yards in the NFL. Much less for 5 straight years. If you truly believe that Alexander could have easily done that, you must think he was the greatest RB in NFL history. That's not the next level guy, that's the greatest of all time guy.

With the line he had, he could have I believe. Why I am so down on him about how he played, he never dared to be great, just was happy to be good.

 

[vin.couve12]

Also, given the name change of the thread, Penny isn't really like Alexander. Penny is a much better athlete, for starters. The only way they are really alike is the setting up their own open field blocks. It's a common trait among real successful NFL backs, but that doesn't make them similar.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Also, given the name change of the thread, Penny isn't really like Alexander. Penny is a much better athlete, for starters. The only way they are really alike is the setting up their own open field blocks. It's a common trait among real successful NFL backs, but that doesn't make them similar.

"much better athlete" is pushing it. Shaun Alexander was clocked at 4.58, but he was also clocked as quick as 4.48. Shaun Alexander was elite talent when he came out of Alabama. Shaun Alexander had very similar combine numbers. They clocked in at around the same weight and Alexander ran a similar 40 at his fastest. I don't know where this "much better athlete" nonsense is coming from.

I don't understand why people are hating on Alexander. Sure, he ran behind Walter Jones, and Steve Hutchinson. Even so, there have been many backs that had fantastic lines and most of them have not been able to touch his four year run that he had from 2001 to 2005. There has only been one other back to top his record setting 2005 season, and that was Ladanian(sp?) Tomlinson. It should be an honor that Penny is being compared to a borderline HOF player. If he has a career as good as Shaun Alexander did we'll very be lucky.

Rashad Penny's running style is actually very similar to Shaun Alexanders. That isn't a bad thing. Alexander had a knack for finding even the smallest creases and taking it for huge gains. He was also able to beat penetration and really set up his blocks with his wicked cutback. He ran with a fluidity that you don't see in many running backs, Penny has that same fluid motion, deceptive speed and vision.

Here are a few Alexander videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wu5NhLhhMcU (College in the iron bowl)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0TGqou81T0 (Rookie and second year)

 

[toffee]

Also, given the name change of the thread, Penny isn't really like Alexander. Penny is a much better athlete, for starters. The only way they are really alike is the setting up their own open field blocks. It's a common trait among real successful NFL backs, but that doesn't make them similar.

"much better athlete" is pushing it. Shaun Alexander was clocked at 4.58, but he was also clocked as quick as 4.48. Shaun Alexander was elite talent when he came out of Alabama. Shaun Alexander had very similar combine numbers. They clocked in at around the same weight and Alexander ran a similar 40 at his fastest. I don't know where this "much better athlete" nonsense is coming from.

I don't understand why people are hating on Alexander. Sure, he ran behind Walter Jones, and Steve Hutchinson. Even so, there have been many backs that had fantastic lines and most of them have not been able to touch his four year run that he had from 2001 to 2005. There has only been one other back to top his record setting 2005 season, and that was Ladanian(sp?) Tomlinson. It should be an honor that Penny is being compared to a borderline HOF player. If he has a career as good as Shaun Alexander did we'll very be lucky.

Rashad Penny's running style is actually very similar to Shaun Alexanders. That isn't a bad thing. Alexander had a knack for finding even the smallest creases and taking it for huge gains. He was also able to beat penetration and really set up his blocks with his wicked cutback. He ran with a fluidity that you don't see in many running backs, Penny has that same fluid motion, deceptive speed and vision.

Here are a few Alexander videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wu5NhLhhMcU (College in the iron bowl)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0TGqou81T0 (Rookie and second year)

Thanks for sharing Shaun's rookie and second year video, I couldn’t help but wonder if Russell Wilson was the QB of that team, with that line, with Shaun, ..... I shall have sweet dreams tonight just thinking of that hypothetical.

 

[vin.couve12]

Been going to draftscout, have you? Yeah, those low and high numbers aren't real. They make up and range out of thin air based, in this case, off of a 4.58.

Both Carson and Penny are clearly better athletes and that's fine. Alexander was a N/S runner who could flip gears specifically so he could set up his own blocks. That might be one of the most important aspects of being a RB.

Now, if you want to get defensive about it, there are literally tons and tons of backs that are much better athletes and that's the truth. Cristine Michael is still the top SPARQ scoring back to this day. What does that mean? Not much in his case.

 

[hawknation2018]

Penny looked as expected. He’s still a bit raw. He goes down too easily on contact. But he also flashed some potential, beating the defender to the corner and running through some arm tackles. At this point, we are not relying on him to start, which is a good thing.