Seahawks Could Lose All Their Free Agents...

[LudwigsDrummer]

We should be Seahawk fans 1st and Sherm fans second.
This is a business and everyone knows it. Isn't it possible that Sherm would want just too much $?
With that in mind, JS has until week 6 (IIRC) of this years campaign to sign Sherm long term. If you folks would agree that it is possible that we can't resign him, are you good with letting him walk for nothing more than a compensatory pick?

 

[DavidSeven]

It's sort of annoying that people just assume Sherman is going to ask for an astronomical contract. Why does no one assume Earl will ask for some crazy amount? Or Russell? Because their quiet? It's sad that some people have the same prejudices about his character as the national people who don't know him as well.

Please look at the list of contracts for CBs with guaranteed money. None of them are making franchise QB money. So I ask...what evidence does anyone have that he's going to demand a huge contract besides the fact that he's talkative?

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

It's sort of annoying that people just assume Sherman is going to ask for an astronomical contract. Why does no one assume Earl will ask for some crazy amount? Or Russell? Because their quiet? It's sad that some people have the same prejudices about his character as the national people who don't know him as well.

Please look at the list of contracts for CBs with guaranteed money. None of them are making franchise QB money. So I ask...what evidence does anyone have that he's going to demand a huge contract besides the fact that he's talkative?

This and it's more than annoying. You don't just give away your players because they're entering their second contract. Sign the man for 3-4 years at 12 million if you have concerns.Revis's contract is an outlier not the baseline.

 

[tdlabrie]

Baldwin and Bennett are the most important ones imo. Succeeding in the draft is still the number one key in order to sustain success as Super Bowl winners tend to lose their star free agents.

:13: Plus Hauschka.

 

[cacksman]

Lots of good points being made here.

By everyone but Lady Talon, that is. Sheesh

This

 

[Brithawk]

Sherman & Thomas are both elite. However neither would be as effective without the other.
Thomas can make plays as he has huge trust in the rest of the secondary doing their jobs. Similarly Sherman has the benefit of knowing Earl is behind on the odd occasion he misjudges & gets burned

 

[WestcoastSteve]

We will lose a lot of FAs. That is why happens when you win a Superbowl, your FAs become to expensive. What we will keep is the core, we will spend on them and use our depth and draft replace the rest. If a core player asks for to much we will explore ways of parting with him too. There is a formula of how how many 6 million dollar player one can keep. We have to play a little money ball

I agree with this, I think guys staying to play on a winner is a little overstated. There's a reason the Rams, Patriots and some of these other multiple winners had a hard time keeping things going. Money talks.

However, playing for the Seahawks next year (or any year) should be an honor for any professional, if their true ambition is to improve as a player and win a championship.

I think every fan of a championship team thinks like this but it doesn't make it true. For a lot of these guys winning a ring is on their bucket list, now that they've done it they will want to get paid.

I think it's admirable Tate is willing to stay for less money, I think it's foolish to think even the majority of players think that way.

 

[formido]

The name of the game is economizing. If you can get a player for significantly less than their win probability added, you keep them. That's the Patriots model. If Sherman asks to be paid at the level he played at last year, it will be questionable whether we keep him. If he takes only 12 million, on the other hand, well under his demonstrated value, odds Seattle keeps him are 90+%.

There's little chance of trading Sherman this off-season, assuming PC/JS are rational. Without Sherman, Seattle would no longer be favorites to win the Super Bowl. It would be possible, but Harvin would probably need to not miss many games. Even if Seattle were going to lose Sherman for nothing after this year, which isn't true, his Super Bowl win probability added for next year is greater than the discounted future win probability added of picks we could get in return.

 

[HawkWow]

The Seahawks are going to lose a lot of free agents and will still be the NFL's best team. This is true. The upside of these departures will be a massive number of day 3 compensation picks in 2015.

To me the most critical aspect of free agency is the defensive line. Bennett is a minor star comparable to 2010-2012 Chris Clemons. We already had one championship flushed down the drain when we lost Clemons at Fed Ex, which kinda highlights how important it is to retain Bennett. Almost as important have been McDaniel, McDonald, Mebane and Bryant. The first two are UFA and the latter two might end up potentially traded/released. Expect Seattle to do a lot of bargain shopping on DL this year. McDaniel, Mebane AND Bryant all turn 30 before the next Super Bowl, so if we keep them it would probably only be for one more season. I'm guessing McDonald (age 27) will get Jason Jones money. I think he's worth it.

I hope we keep Tate, but it's only going to happen if he's hugely under-rated by the rest of the league. Going to be pretty interesting to see what they do with Breno, too.

Seattle should shop several of their players in trades. Bryant, Mebane, Lynch, and Sherman should all be shopped to see if a good deal could be had. Sherman is the only one of those three that I think has any real chance of being on the team in 2016, and even he's kinda dicey if he asks for Revis money.

Why would you want to shop Sherman right now? Lynch? Seriously? The team has very good chemistry, the last thing you want is thinking its easy to replace anyone. Our main focus is Thomas & Sherman. I dont think we can keep Bennett. Tate would be too expensive even for a hometown discount, better getting Baldwin. Hauschka & Giacomini should be cheap enough is very important players for the Seahawks.

Consider the roster moves this FO has made in it's short time together....I think I read over 1500. They have churned the entire roster, and in doing so, they gave us one of the best teams ever assembled. So these guys essentially do have a relatively "easy time" replacing people. Look at our depth.

No offense intended, but it drives me nuts when posters / fans find such conversation outlandish, unheard of and/or taboo. Opinions are basically attacked without thought. "You can't trade ML"! "You can't trade Sherman, it would be stupid". Before making such comments, wouldn't it be wise to consider the bigger picture? Like...what if a Cleveland offered us their 2 1s for Sherm...that would be stupid to consider?

What if some franchise, needing asses in seats, offered us a 2nd rd pick for Beastmode? With Michael and Turbin and to degree Harvin in the backfield...would it be stupid to consider that trade, while offloading his contract?

I love these guys. But I am not so sure about how absolutely imperative it is to keep all championship pieces together. Only a handful of teams have ever repeated, and yes, there's many reasons for that, but maybe it's also a matter of not keeping every piece, upgrading, adding younger legs and more hunger or maybe it's even changing things up. Like next year we go 50 pass 50 run.

Hey, if you're not living on the edge, you're taking up too much room. I have total confidence in Pete and his ability to think outside the box. I think his phone is ringing and I think he and John are listening to those calls.

Yes i am looking at the big picture. Richard Sherman is probably the most popular football player right now. You dont just shop a player like that especially after just winning a superbowl. That's the best way to lose trust w/ your players. This isn't a video game where you can just see what you can get without affecting players. How would the fans react trading one of the most popular player for unproven draft picks? Just hearing about it would piss me off. Untouchable players would be Wilson, Thomas, & Sherman in that order. Then maybe Wagner & Okung. Lynch/Harvin are good until their contract ends.

I only have to point to the nightmare that followed the PR dictated Alexander re-signing to counter your "what would the fans think"? question. Fortunately, I don't believe for a second John or Pete will allow the fans to run this franchise...like Ruskell did.... like you're suggesting they should do.

I think this thread has been an excellent read. Both camps making excellent points and none of us know what would be the correct, or incorrect, moves as we go into FA. Debate is healthy and really all I'm saying is nobody (other than Wilson) is absolutely untouchable and no single player (including Wilson) is bigger than team.

I am probably guilty of being old school in my approach to the game and believe a suspect O-line will cost this franchise more than the occasional completed pass / TD.

Run the ball. Protect your QB. Stop the run. Pressure their QB. < That's the recipe.

Most call ours "the greatest secondary ever assembled". If true, that means every other team, to ever win a SB, did so without the greatest secondary ever assembled.

 

[gmor]

The Seahawks are going to lose a lot of free agents and will still be the NFL's best team. This is true. The upside of these departures will be a massive number of day 3 compensation picks in 2015.

To me the most critical aspect of free agency is the defensive line. Bennett is a minor star comparable to 2010-2012 Chris Clemons. We already had one championship flushed down the drain when we lost Clemons at Fed Ex, which kinda highlights how important it is to retain Bennett. Almost as important have been McDaniel, McDonald, Mebane and Bryant. The first two are UFA and the latter two might end up potentially traded/released. Expect Seattle to do a lot of bargain shopping on DL this year. McDaniel, Mebane AND Bryant all turn 30 before the next Super Bowl, so if we keep them it would probably only be for one more season. I'm guessing McDonald (age 27) will get Jason Jones money. I think he's worth it.

I hope we keep Tate, but it's only going to happen if he's hugely under-rated by the rest of the league. Going to be pretty interesting to see what they do with Breno, too.

Seattle should shop several of their players in trades. Bryant, Mebane, Lynch, and Sherman should all be shopped to see if a good deal could be had. Sherman is the only one of those three that I think has any real chance of being on the team in 2016, and even he's kinda dicey if he asks for Revis money.

I'm wondering how many one year contracts, like Bennett's, will come our way. They are usually a good deal for us and the players have a lot to prove. Our success over the last few years might bring them in.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

With the rule changes running the ball is getting less and less important. As recently as 10 years ago you built a team around a running back but now it's all about the quarterback, pass rush and cornerbacks.

 

[Lady Talon]

Lots of good points being made here.

By everyone but Lady Talon, that is. Sheesh

This

Exactly. I don't know how she still is around, I reported her all night.

 

[LudwigsDrummer]

It's sort of annoying that people just assume Sherman is going to ask for an astronomical contract. Why does no one assume Earl will ask for some crazy amount? Or Russell? Because their quiet? It's sad that some people have the same prejudices about his character as the national people who don't know him as well.

Please look at the list of contracts for CBs with guaranteed money. None of them are making franchise QB money. So I ask...what evidence does anyone have that he's going to demand a huge contract besides the fact that he's talkative?

Sorry to annoy you as that is not my intention. I wish to turn your table a bit and ask what evidence do you have that he wont demand a huge contract?
I am positive during this off season that JS will be taking Sherm's temperature regarding an extension. We all know he loves being a Seahawk but sometimes wierd things happen during contract talks.

 

[HawkWow]

The Seahawks are going to lose a lot of free agents and will still be the NFL's best team. This is true. The upside of these departures will be a massive number of day 3 compensation picks in 2015.

To me the most critical aspect of free agency is the defensive line. Bennett is a minor star comparable to 2010-2012 Chris Clemons. We already had one championship flushed down the drain when we lost Clemons at Fed Ex, which kinda highlights how important it is to retain Bennett. Almost as important have been McDaniel, McDonald, Mebane and Bryant. The first two are UFA and the latter two might end up potentially traded/released. Expect Seattle to do a lot of bargain shopping on DL this year. McDaniel, Mebane AND Bryant all turn 30 before the next Super Bowl, so if we keep them it would probably only be for one more season. I'm guessing McDonald (age 27) will get Jason Jones money. I think he's worth it.

I hope we keep Tate, but it's only going to happen if he's hugely under-rated by the rest of the league. Going to be pretty interesting to see what they do with Breno, too.

Seattle should shop several of their players in trades. Bryant, Mebane, Lynch, and Sherman should all be shopped to see if a good deal could be had. Sherman is the only one of those three that I think has any real chance of being on the team in 2016, and even he's kinda dicey if he asks for Revis money.

I'm wondering how many one year contracts, like Bennett's, will come our way. They are usually a good deal for us and the players have a lot to prove. Our success over the last few years might bring them in.

Great observation. Bennett was flippin' clairvoyant. Took less money, won a title and is now going to get paid on top of all that. If not clairvoyant, genius.

As for others doing the same, I (personally) think our immediate needs will not benefit the same as they did with the Bennett deal...and I wouldn't want to gamble on finding another Bennett to replace this Bennett..he has to, IMO, get re-signed.

I think our immediate concern is the O-line. Linemen need time together to work as a unit, much more so than a pocket collapsing D-lineman brought in on a 1 year deal. This O-line has potential, and maybe Unger will bounce back from a less than pro bowl year (IMO), but Okung who is stellar when healthy, is just not always available. All points could be upgraded but counter to popular opinion, I think we need to address LT as soon as possible and not many FA LTs out there, and none that will come in on a Bennett type deal. They just don't have to.

 

[HawkWow]

Lots of good points being made here.

By everyone but Lady Talon, that is. Sheesh

This

Exactly. I don't know how she still is around, I reported her all night.

Damn...so in reality, the lion does care about the opinion of the sheep.

I'm. Just. Stumped.

 

[DavidSeven]

It's sort of annoying that people just assume Sherman is going to ask for an astronomical contract. Why does no one assume Earl will ask for some crazy amount? Or Russell? Because their quiet? It's sad that some people have the same prejudices about his character as the national people who don't know him as well.

Please look at the list of contracts for CBs with guaranteed money. None of them are making franchise QB money. So I ask...what evidence does anyone have that he's going to demand a huge contract besides the fact that he's talkative?

Sorry to annoy you as that is not my intention. I wish to turn your table a bit and ask what evidence do you have that he wont demand a huge contract?
I am positive during this off season that JS will be taking Sherm's temperature regarding an extension. We all know he loves being a Seahawk but sometimes wierd things happen during contract talks.

I understand that, but I've noticed that no one seems to be assuming that Earl Thomas or Russell Wilson will be demanding contracts that are 50-100% above market value, so why Sherman? I operate on the assumption that all three are willing to extend for market value. Looking at the salaries for safeties and cornerbacks, I think we can extend both. Again, I expect Sherman/Thomas to extend for a max cap number of ~$22m. The same amount we spent on Miller/Rice last year. They would both still be the highest paid at their position in this scenario. In terms of contracts with GUARANTEED money, the highest paid safety makes $8-9m and the highest paid CB makes $10-11m. Why would I assume either Sherman or Thomas would demand significantly more than that?

I continue to encourage everyone to ignore Revis's salary. It is NOT GUARANTEED, and he will either be restructured this year or cut next year. Sherman will take a deal with less money PER YEAR, but with a higher guaranty. It won't cripple us.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Because it's easier to assume Sherman all about that coin. Boss. Why would a guy not give the only organization that believed in him and fair chance to sign him to a fair market value extension beneficial to both parties, no that's just crazy talk.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

Again Revis's contract is unique and will be redone in the next year or two or he will be cut. Current market for elite cornerbacks is 10-11 million a year. Sherman and Thomas should cost no more than 22 million combined maybe slightly less.

 

[LudwigsDrummer]

NE was earlier mentioned as a model for using good sense in managing the cap.
They currently have 3 players making 8 figures.
Looking at Okung, and the upcoming contracts for ET, Sherm, and Russell, that would be 4 making 8 figures. That might be a bit much.

 

[DavidSeven]

NE was earlier mentioned as a model for using good sense in managing the cap.
They currently have 3 players making 8 figures.
Looking at Okung, and the upcoming contracts for ET, Sherm, and Russell, that would be 4 making 8 figures. That might be a bit much.

You can stagger the cap hits, so that only a few players are hitting your cap at double digits in any given year through 2016. NE also had Aaron Hernandez hitting them at $7.5m and still had $4m+ in free cap space. The NFL cap goes up a few million in 2014 and is expected to go even higher in 2015 after revenues from CBS TNF are factored in. It will certainly be tight, but that's the reality of any team with championship core. This a good problem.