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KiwiHawk

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mrt144":3fu1ciqa said:
KiwiHawk":3fu1ciqa said:
mrt144":3fu1ciqa said:
*2018*

Game 1-2: "Wow, this is similar level of bad, soul arresting football."
How ironic - those two games were using the passing offense you want, yet you found them soul-arresting and bad.

I'll tell you when the Hawks are using a pass offense I want. Simply passing doesn't qualify. You keep assigning some brain dead, huck it chuck it footbaw, paradigm to what I want and it's not apt.
You claim to be a pantry chef - we tried the passing offense with our pantry and it sucked. So we ran, and it worked.

Keep in mind this is a rebuilding/retooling/reloading (use your definition, I will not argue over semantics) team - we're down 7 pro-bowlers vs last year - with first-year coordinators and OL coach but with the disadvantage of not having sucked enough to get the kind of draft picks the Rams enjoyed.

No one, with the possible exception of you and a few others on this board, expected 2018 to be a deep playoff run, if indeed it was even to be a playoff year full stop.

And honestly if Fluker and Sweezy were healthy vs Dallas the outcome would have been different.

Yes, we're low on OL replacements, but we just got done having the worst OL practically in league history and that's not a headache you get over in one year.

Surprisingly, OL dictates what you do on offense. Unless you have a drag-the-pile kind of back, without a good OL you can't run, and without a good OL you can't pass. We looked into the pantry and guess what we found? A drag-the-pile back in the form of Chris Carson. So we ran the ball.

Expect some changes on the OL and expect some depth signings that will bore the tears out of you and you will think are lame-ass choices, but who will form the depth we so desperately need so that we don't go from OK to stink when Fluker gets hurt.

Once the OL takes shape, THEN we'll see what kind of offense can be run.

You MUST build from the inside out. Build the line and the rest comes right.
 

Scorpion05

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The narrative over games 1-2 is so overblown. We didn't have Fluker, or Baldwin. Brandon Marshall had some major key drops, which is why he was released. Field Gulls did an article highlighting that the first two games spoke more about Marshall's failures than anything else.

But, the media and everyone else decided to go with the lazy "We tried passing and it failed" narrative. Not to mention, the Broncos and Bears were the two best passing defenses in the league this year. Good lord, can we get some perspective here


Like I've always said, how you see this team depends on your perspective. If you believe Russell Wilson is an all world talent who will retire a Hall of Famer, and Pete Carroll to be a Top 5 coach in the league, there's no way you imagined us finishing under .500.

On the other hand, if you see Russ as merely a "good" QB, that the team can only succeed with defense, and that Lynch and LOB were responsible for 90% of our success, your expectations were low. The way I see it, this team under achieved this year. I didn't watch that Cowboys game and think "Golly, well we did our best." That Cowboys game felt like something we lost, due to decisions and play calling. We've made the playoffs 6 out of the last 7 years. That's amazing. That we lost in the divisional round, rather than make the NFC Championship even year is a silly thing to complain about all things considered. This team can win a championship next year with a few tweaks, and there's not a team in the Final 4 left that we're incapable of beating on a given Sunday
 
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mrt144

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KiwiHawk":1ex9k5j0 said:
mrt144":1ex9k5j0 said:
KiwiHawk":1ex9k5j0 said:
mrt144":1ex9k5j0 said:
*2018*

Game 1-2: "Wow, this is similar level of bad, soul arresting football."
How ironic - those two games were using the passing offense you want, yet you found them soul-arresting and bad.

I'll tell you when the Hawks are using a pass offense I want. Simply passing doesn't qualify. You keep assigning some brain dead, huck it chuck it footbaw, paradigm to what I want and it's not apt.
You claim to be a pantry chef - we tried the passing offense with our pantry and it sucked. So we ran, and it worked.

Keep in mind this is a rebuilding/retooling/reloading (use your definition, I will not argue over semantics) team - we're down 7 pro-bowlers vs last year - with first-year coordinators and OL coach but with the disadvantage of not having sucked enough to get the kind of draft picks the Rams enjoyed.

No one, with the possible exception of you and a few others on this board, expected 2018 to be a deep playoff run, if indeed it was even to be a playoff year full stop.

And honestly if Fluker and Sweezy were healthy vs Dallas the outcome would have been different.

Yes, we're low on OL replacements, but we just got done having the worst OL practically in league history and that's not a headache you get over in one year.

Surprisingly, OL dictates what you do on offense. Unless you have a drag-the-pile kind of back, without a good OL you can't run, and without a good OL you can't pass. We looked into the pantry and guess what we found? A drag-the-pile back in the form of Chris Carson. So we ran the ball.

Expect some changes on the OL and expect some depth signings that will bore the tears out of you and you will think are lame-ass choices, but who will form the depth we so desperately need so that we don't go from OK to stink when Fluker gets hurt.

Once the OL takes shape, THEN we'll see what kind of offense can be run.

You MUST build from the inside out. Build the line and the rest comes right.

So in your estimation then, are some of the small things I'm pining for that TwistedHawk laid out worth pursuing by the team next season conditionally on player talent in the stable? If I'm reading you right, you don't have a strong leaning on what you want on offense other than a mesh with the talent we have, which I totally get and appreciate to the extent that if there's a redux of this next season I won't get too huffy if you insist "We still didn't have the talent to see the introduction or expansion of elements you enjoy".

FWIW, I didn't expect a deep playoff run - but I did expect to see a little more... intellectual fire? once we were in the playoffs. That's my bag though - I'm always going to be harder on coaches than anyone else on the team because if I was to insert myself into an NFL franchise that's probably where I'd reside and it's ultimately what I'm keen on. I am not on any 'fire' anyone bandwagon at this point and in fact, I am more fine with everything now than I was earlier in the season.

I just want these goobers to do some things I think are absolutely capable of with the team in the pursuit of making them more dynamic and less brittle. We already have some elements in hand like play action - a concept the staff itself touts as being central, now it's a matter of honing play action into more lethal concepts within the plays themselves and part of an arsenal of plays that leverage off one another. What if we ran PA on first down maybe only 25% more than we do now? That wouldn't be a giant leap into things, would it?

Why not ease into some of the stuff we aren't doing while we're at it? Maybe sluggo routes can be a bridge to actual slants? Just get the WRs and RW comfortable with the timing, angles and the breaks and then potentially leverage them into an explosive PA pass play OR as a short banger when the box is stacked. Look man, I'm just spitballballing some pretty basic stuff that I think is there for the taking. I get risk aversion and protecting weaker elements of the team like the OL by not putting the full fulcrum of a completely robust passing and fleshed out passing game on their back.

I know that the team has masters of the universe who know way more about why we do and don't do certain things who aren't even the coaches calling stuff themselves. I get it, I'm just a dude with lots of time, interest and some rudimentary tools. I know the team doesn't play for my sole delight and ego indulgence (which is why I try to refuse to make predictions - that stuff is ego indulgence if you aren't getting paid to do it). But...

I'm just impatient and the assurances that this season was almost 'not for realsies' makes me sick. Yes, even a 5 year old should give it their all if they were thrust into combat with a lion, not tell the audience "wait till I'm 6, I'll be slaying lions all day erry day". I want to believe that we won't just have a shinier version of this offense next season. I want to see wrinkles, if not a new freckle or beauty mark. Yes, RW had his best season in a lot of ways but...I'm afraid of what feels like capitulation next season. I don't want to lose a game in part because we played two injured Gs which speaks to the need for depth you mentioned, but I also don't want to lose a game in part we played two injured Gs and THEN proceed to call inside runs that hugely depended on them. I know, sometimes thems the breaks and you can't help but drown, but I hate that mentality for people playing a game.

I wish I enjoyed defensive tactics more so I could diversify my thought and not be so self indulgent with the offense. But having played mostly on the defensive side of the ball at safety and CB, I care more about technique, awareness and athleticism when I'm watching. On D Line I really love seeing stunts and coordinated moves but not even as much as I love seeing athleticism set up a play and then awesome technique bring it home. Think a DE getting super sideways and dipping around a mountain of a man - it defies the eyes that someone that's like 6'3" and 280 can twist their body, move at that speed and not lose their balance while making some hapless tackle look extra foolish in comparison. Don't worry, I do have pet ideas on how to improve the defense. Rest assured though that I haven't perfected splicing people with wild animals but I'm getting close. ;)

Crap, you know what I realized in all of this - Pete Carroll hooked me on his team building and stellar defense that came about through his eye and tutelage but I respect offenses that make defenses look foolish by design because it feels like you're pulling one over on the other team in the most nerdy way possible and in a way that might not be easily countered by the other team. "Yeah, we might not have the talent on hand, but we know how to beat your superior defensive talent with our brains. " Yes, I love Revenge of the Nerds and that new wave song they had at the talent show was sick.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that I have a latent predisposition towards wanting to be clever on offense to defeat the exact kind of defense I want which is 11 Alligator-Shark-Men with 8 eyes and scary intense attitudes and drive. I want the answer to the problem I create for other people only to hold it over their heads and laugh.
 

chris98251

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Some of you would bitch if someone set you up with 3 tens, Blonde ,Redhead, Brunette and then would bitch that they were not all one hair color.
 

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Some of you would bitch if someone set you up with 3 tens, Blonde ,Redhead, Brunette and then would be happy that you can't make a pass on them.
 

Jville

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mrt144":28egkfg8 said:
So in your estimation then, are some of the small things I'm pining for that TwistedHawk laid out worth pursuing by the team next season conditionally on player talent in the stable? If I'm reading you right, you don't have a strong leaning on what you want on offense other than a mesh with the talent we have, which I totally get and appreciate to the extent that if there's a redux of this next season I won't get too huffy if you insist "We still didn't have the talent to see the introduction or expansion of elements you enjoy".

FWIW, I didn't expect a deep playoff run - but I did expect to see a little more... intellectual fire? once we were in the playoffs. That's my bag though - I'm always going to be harder on coaches than anyone else on the team because if I was to insert myself into an NFL franchise that's probably where I'd reside and it's ultimately what I'm keen on. I am not on any 'fire' anyone bandwagon at this point and in fact, I am more fine with everything now than I was earlier in the season.

I just want these goobers to do some things I think are absolutely capable of with the team in the pursuit of making them more dynamic and less brittle. We already have some elements in hand like play action - a concept the staff itself touts as being central, now it's a matter of honing play action into more lethal concepts within the plays themselves and part of an arsenal of plays that leverage off one another. What if we ran PA on first down maybe only 25% more than we do now? That wouldn't be a giant leap into things, would it?

Why not ease into some of the stuff we aren't doing while we're at it? Maybe sluggo routes can be a bridge to actual slants? Just get the WRs and RW comfortable with the timing, angles and the breaks and then potentially leverage them into an explosive PA pass play OR as a short banger when the box is stacked. Look man, I'm just spitballballing some pretty basic stuff that I think is there for the taking. I get risk aversion and protecting weaker elements of the team like the OL by not putting the full fulcrum of a completely robust passing and fleshed out passing game on their back.

I know that the team has masters of the universe who know way more about why we do and don't do certain things who aren't even the coaches calling stuff themselves. I get it, I'm just a dude with lots of time, interest and some rudimentary tools. I know the team doesn't play for my sole delight and ego indulgence (which is why I try to refuse to make predictions - that stuff is ego indulgence if you aren't getting paid to do it). But...

I'm just impatient and the assurances that this season was almost 'not for realsies' makes me sick. Yes, even a 5 year old should give it their all if they were thrust into combat with a lion, not tell the audience "wait till I'm 6, I'll be slaying lions all day erry day". I want to believe that we won't just have a shinier version of this offense next season. I want to see wrinkles, if not a new freckle or beauty mark. Yes, RW had his best season in a lot of ways but...I'm afraid of what feels like capitulation next season. I don't want to lose a game in part because we played two injured Gs which speaks to the need for depth you mentioned, but I also don't want to lose a game in part we played two injured Gs and THEN proceed to call inside runs that hugely depended on them. I know, sometimes thems the breaks and you can't help but drown, but I hate that mentality for people playing a game.

I wish I enjoyed defensive tactics more so I could diversify my thought and not be so self indulgent with the offense. But having played mostly on the defensive side of the ball at safety and CB, I care more about technique, awareness and athleticism when I'm watching. On D Line I really love seeing stunts and coordinated moves but not even as much as I love seeing athleticism set up a play and then awesome technique bring it home. Think a DE getting super sideways and dipping around a mountain of a man - it defies the eyes that someone that's like 6'3" and 280 can twist their body, move at that speed and not lose their balance while making some hapless tackle look extra foolish in comparison. Don't worry, I do have pet ideas on how to improve the defense. Rest assured though that I haven't perfected splicing people with wild animals but I'm getting close. ;)

Crap, you know what I realized in all of this - Pete Carroll hooked me on his team building and stellar defense that came about through his eye and tutelage but I respect offenses that make defenses look foolish by design because it feels like you're pulling one over on the other team in the most nerdy way possible and in a way that might not be easily countered by the other team. "Yeah, we might not have the talent on hand, but we know how to beat your superior defensive talent with our brains. " Yes, I love Revenge of the Nerds and that new wave song they had at the talent show was sick.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that I have a latent predisposition towards wanting to be clever on offense to defeat the exact kind of defense I want which is 11 Alligator-Shark-Men with 8 eyes and scary intense attitudes and drive. I want the answer to the problem I create for other people only to hold it over their heads and laugh.

A brief off-topic remark: We should all be cognizant that posting is publishing for all to see.

From time to time a post appears whose content redirects to a narration of it's author's feelings of reflection and sometimes self absorption. Although, such confessions may be useful for an author's diary or personal therapist. There is a time and place for everything. Most of us are attracted to this forum because of our over arching interest in it's subject .... the Seattle Seahawks.

Just a well meaning observation accompanied with a reminder,

Jville
 

Seymour

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Where would we be without the self appointed "Forum Patrol" to tell us what we should and should post here. Thanks "Dad". :roll:
 
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mrt144

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Jville":3isxlcv7 said:
mrt144":3isxlcv7 said:
So in your estimation then, are some of the small things I'm pining for that TwistedHawk laid out worth pursuing by the team next season conditionally on player talent in the stable? If I'm reading you right, you don't have a strong leaning on what you want on offense other than a mesh with the talent we have, which I totally get and appreciate to the extent that if there's a redux of this next season I won't get too huffy if you insist "We still didn't have the talent to see the introduction or expansion of elements you enjoy".

FWIW, I didn't expect a deep playoff run - but I did expect to see a little more... intellectual fire? once we were in the playoffs. That's my bag though - I'm always going to be harder on coaches than anyone else on the team because if I was to insert myself into an NFL franchise that's probably where I'd reside and it's ultimately what I'm keen on. I am not on any 'fire' anyone bandwagon at this point and in fact, I am more fine with everything now than I was earlier in the season.

I just want these goobers to do some things I think are absolutely capable of with the team in the pursuit of making them more dynamic and less brittle. We already have some elements in hand like play action - a concept the staff itself touts as being central, now it's a matter of honing play action into more lethal concepts within the plays themselves and part of an arsenal of plays that leverage off one another. What if we ran PA on first down maybe only 25% more than we do now? That wouldn't be a giant leap into things, would it?

Why not ease into some of the stuff we aren't doing while we're at it? Maybe sluggo routes can be a bridge to actual slants? Just get the WRs and RW comfortable with the timing, angles and the breaks and then potentially leverage them into an explosive PA pass play OR as a short banger when the box is stacked. Look man, I'm just spitballballing some pretty basic stuff that I think is there for the taking. I get risk aversion and protecting weaker elements of the team like the OL by not putting the full fulcrum of a completely robust passing and fleshed out passing game on their back.

I know that the team has masters of the universe who know way more about why we do and don't do certain things who aren't even the coaches calling stuff themselves. I get it, I'm just a dude with lots of time, interest and some rudimentary tools. I know the team doesn't play for my sole delight and ego indulgence (which is why I try to refuse to make predictions - that stuff is ego indulgence if you aren't getting paid to do it). But...

I'm just impatient and the assurances that this season was almost 'not for realsies' makes me sick. Yes, even a 5 year old should give it their all if they were thrust into combat with a lion, not tell the audience "wait till I'm 6, I'll be slaying lions all day erry day". I want to believe that we won't just have a shinier version of this offense next season. I want to see wrinkles, if not a new freckle or beauty mark. Yes, RW had his best season in a lot of ways but...I'm afraid of what feels like capitulation next season. I don't want to lose a game in part because we played two injured Gs which speaks to the need for depth you mentioned, but I also don't want to lose a game in part we played two injured Gs and THEN proceed to call inside runs that hugely depended on them. I know, sometimes thems the breaks and you can't help but drown, but I hate that mentality for people playing a game.

I wish I enjoyed defensive tactics more so I could diversify my thought and not be so self indulgent with the offense. But having played mostly on the defensive side of the ball at safety and CB, I care more about technique, awareness and athleticism when I'm watching. On D Line I really love seeing stunts and coordinated moves but not even as much as I love seeing athleticism set up a play and then awesome technique bring it home. Think a DE getting super sideways and dipping around a mountain of a man - it defies the eyes that someone that's like 6'3" and 280 can twist their body, move at that speed and not lose their balance while making some hapless tackle look extra foolish in comparison. Don't worry, I do have pet ideas on how to improve the defense. Rest assured though that I haven't perfected splicing people with wild animals but I'm getting close. ;)

Crap, you know what I realized in all of this - Pete Carroll hooked me on his team building and stellar defense that came about through his eye and tutelage but I respect offenses that make defenses look foolish by design because it feels like you're pulling one over on the other team in the most nerdy way possible and in a way that might not be easily countered by the other team. "Yeah, we might not have the talent on hand, but we know how to beat your superior defensive talent with our brains. " Yes, I love Revenge of the Nerds and that new wave song they had at the talent show was sick.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that I have a latent predisposition towards wanting to be clever on offense to defeat the exact kind of defense I want which is 11 Alligator-Shark-Men with 8 eyes and scary intense attitudes and drive. I want the answer to the problem I create for other people only to hold it over their heads and laugh.

A brief off-topic remark: We should all be cognizant that posting is publishing for all to see.

From time to time a post appears whose content redirects to a narration of it's author's feelings of reflection and sometimes self absorption. Although, such confessions may be useful for an author's diary or personal therapist. There is a time and place for everything. Most of us are attracted to this forum because of our over arching interest in it's subject .... the Seattle Seahawks.

Just a well meaning observation accompanied with a reminder,

Jville

This is the perfect time and place for me to own my feelings and thoughts on the matter. Understanding the basis for my consternation might just save everyone even more self indulgent posts down the road. I don't need you guys to tell me this, I need to work through it on my own and hopefully pursue it in a way that gets chuckle or two. It's the freaking off season - what else is there to do?
 

Sgt. Largent

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mrt144":2f9moq4s said:
. It's the freaking off season - what else is there to do?

From looking at the main forum, apparently kneejerk and overreact.
 

TwistedHusky

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It really is easier just to accept that this is a team that will be fun to watch in the regular season.

It will tend to get more wins than most Seahawks teams over the history of the franchise have gotten. And for the most part, it will be able to play competitively against the best teams in the league - maybe even beating some of them (at home).

Expecting anything past that is fool's gold but that is a lot of weekends to enjoy and games to attend that are going to payoff.

My challenge is that we have been conditioned to see that in a game that slants everything to give advantages to the QB, getting a great QB can literally give you better chances against even the better teams in the playoffs. The caveat is that you have to use that great QB. We won't. Or we won't until it is too late.

So it is hard to go into the playoffs knowing you could be better and just watch the same mistakes being made. But if you accept that is how this team is going to roll, and the result you will get? It could be worse.

This is a team that will finally be fun to watch in the regular season. It won't do much else but things could be much worse.

Still, I get looking at the potential and looking at how enjoyable the playoffs are. So I get some of the long posts of frustration - it is cathartic. I do it.

These boards are for discourse and exploration but I will be the first to admit I sometimes just need to vent because it IS frustrating to squander so much potential. But, it is what it is. The things that make us good in the regular season often make us hopeless in the post-season.

You have to take the strengths with the weaknesses though.
 
D

DomeHawk

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Seymour":2t7cqvz0 said:
Where would we be without the self appointed "Forum Patrol" to tell us what we should and should post here. Thanks "Dad". :roll:

^^^^Yep
 
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mrt144

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TwistedHusky":1usd2p4c said:
It really is easier just to accept that this is a team that will be fun to watch in the regular season.

It will tend to get more wins than most Seahawks teams over the history of the franchise have gotten. And for the most part, it will be able to play competitively against the best teams in the league - maybe even beating some of them (at home).

Expecting anything past that is fool's gold but that is a lot of weekends to enjoy and games to attend that are going to payoff.

My challenge is that we have been conditioned to see that in a game that slants everything to give advantages to the QB, getting a great QB can literally give you better chances against even the better teams in the playoffs. The caveat is that you have to use that great QB. We won't. Or we won't until it is too late.

So it is hard to go into the playoffs knowing you could be better and just watch the same mistakes being made. But if you accept that is how this team is going to roll, and the result you will get? It could be worse.

This is a team that will finally be fun to watch in the regular season. It won't do much else but things could be much worse.

Still, I get looking at the potential and looking at how enjoyable the playoffs are. So I get some of the long posts of frustration - it is cathartic. I do it.

These boards are for discourse and exploration but I will be the first to admit I sometimes just need to vent because it IS frustrating to squander so much potential. But, it is what it is. The things that make us good in the regular season often make us hopeless in the post-season.

You have to take the strengths with the weaknesses though.

Right? I feel a lot better about everything after talking it out, explaining where I'm coming from on some of this and having actual conversations with folks. Imagine that!
 

chris98251

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TwistedHusky":3fbluor7 said:
It really is easier just to accept that this is a team that will be fun to watch in the regular season.

It will tend to get more wins than most Seahawks teams over the history of the franchise have gotten. And for the most part, it will be able to play competitively against the best teams in the league - maybe even beating some of them (at home).

Expecting anything past that is fool's gold but that is a lot of weekends to enjoy and games to attend that are going to payoff.

My challenge is that we have been conditioned to see that in a game that slants everything to give advantages to the QB, getting a great QB can literally give you better chances against even the better teams in the playoffs. The caveat is that you have to use that great QB. We won't. Or we won't until it is too late.

So it is hard to go into the playoffs knowing you could be better and just watch the same mistakes being made. But if you accept that is how this team is going to roll, and the result you will get? It could be worse.

This is a team that will finally be fun to watch in the regular season. It won't do much else but things could be much worse.

Still, I get looking at the potential and looking at how enjoyable the playoffs are. So I get some of the long posts of frustration - it is cathartic. I do it.

These boards are for discourse and exploration but I will be the first to admit I sometimes just need to vent because it IS frustrating to squander so much potential. But, it is what it is. The things that make us good in the regular season often make us hopeless in the post-season.

You have to take the strengths with the weaknesses though.

We have a formula that wins, Coaching decisions and health are the wild card, most top 10 teams have these same issues, even the Patriots. The difference is Belichek has no beating heart, he's Dracula, he will suck you dry, he will cut your throat, his players throat and do whatever it takes to gain an advantage, then move on to the next player and team he faces. Brady being the exception, and his time is coming, only so many transfusions can be made to someone. There is already the rumor mill happening about riffs between the two.
 

Jville

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mrt144":3aghjx86 said:
Jville":3aghjx86 said:
mrt144":3aghjx86 said:
So in your estimation then, are some of the small things I'm pining for that TwistedHawk laid out worth pursuing by the team next season conditionally on player talent in the stable? If I'm reading you right, you don't have a strong leaning on what you want on offense other than a mesh with the talent we have, which I totally get and appreciate to the extent that if there's a redux of this next season I won't get too huffy if you insist "We still didn't have the talent to see the introduction or expansion of elements you enjoy".

FWIW, I didn't expect a deep playoff run - but I did expect to see a little more... intellectual fire? once we were in the playoffs. That's my bag though - I'm always going to be harder on coaches than anyone else on the team because if I was to insert myself into an NFL franchise that's probably where I'd reside and it's ultimately what I'm keen on. I am not on any 'fire' anyone bandwagon at this point and in fact, I am more fine with everything now than I was earlier in the season.

I just want these goobers to do some things I think are absolutely capable of with the team in the pursuit of making them more dynamic and less brittle. We already have some elements in hand like play action - a concept the staff itself touts as being central, now it's a matter of honing play action into more lethal concepts within the plays themselves and part of an arsenal of plays that leverage off one another. What if we ran PA on first down maybe only 25% more than we do now? That wouldn't be a giant leap into things, would it?

Why not ease into some of the stuff we aren't doing while we're at it? Maybe sluggo routes can be a bridge to actual slants? Just get the WRs and RW comfortable with the timing, angles and the breaks and then potentially leverage them into an explosive PA pass play OR as a short banger when the box is stacked. Look man, I'm just spitballballing some pretty basic stuff that I think is there for the taking. I get risk aversion and protecting weaker elements of the team like the OL by not putting the full fulcrum of a completely robust passing and fleshed out passing game on their back.

I know that the team has masters of the universe who know way more about why we do and don't do certain things who aren't even the coaches calling stuff themselves. I get it, I'm just a dude with lots of time, interest and some rudimentary tools. I know the team doesn't play for my sole delight and ego indulgence (which is why I try to refuse to make predictions - that stuff is ego indulgence if you aren't getting paid to do it). But...

I'm just impatient and the assurances that this season was almost 'not for realsies' makes me sick. Yes, even a 5 year old should give it their all if they were thrust into combat with a lion, not tell the audience "wait till I'm 6, I'll be slaying lions all day erry day". I want to believe that we won't just have a shinier version of this offense next season. I want to see wrinkles, if not a new freckle or beauty mark. Yes, RW had his best season in a lot of ways but...I'm afraid of what feels like capitulation next season. I don't want to lose a game in part because we played two injured Gs which speaks to the need for depth you mentioned, but I also don't want to lose a game in part we played two injured Gs and THEN proceed to call inside runs that hugely depended on them. I know, sometimes thems the breaks and you can't help but drown, but I hate that mentality for people playing a game.

I wish I enjoyed defensive tactics more so I could diversify my thought and not be so self indulgent with the offense. But having played mostly on the defensive side of the ball at safety and CB, I care more about technique, awareness and athleticism when I'm watching. On D Line I really love seeing stunts and coordinated moves but not even as much as I love seeing athleticism set up a play and then awesome technique bring it home. Think a DE getting super sideways and dipping around a mountain of a man - it defies the eyes that someone that's like 6'3" and 280 can twist their body, move at that speed and not lose their balance while making some hapless tackle look extra foolish in comparison. Don't worry, I do have pet ideas on how to improve the defense. Rest assured though that I haven't perfected splicing people with wild animals but I'm getting close. ;)

Crap, you know what I realized in all of this - Pete Carroll hooked me on his team building and stellar defense that came about through his eye and tutelage but I respect offenses that make defenses look foolish by design because it feels like you're pulling one over on the other team in the most nerdy way possible and in a way that might not be easily countered by the other team. "Yeah, we might not have the talent on hand, but we know how to beat your superior defensive talent with our brains. " Yes, I love Revenge of the Nerds and that new wave song they had at the talent show was sick.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that I have a latent predisposition towards wanting to be clever on offense to defeat the exact kind of defense I want which is 11 Alligator-Shark-Men with 8 eyes and scary intense attitudes and drive. I want the answer to the problem I create for other people only to hold it over their heads and laugh.

A brief off-topic remark: We should all be cognizant that posting is publishing for all to see.

From time to time a post appears whose content redirects to a narration of it's author's feelings of reflection and sometimes self absorption. Although, such confessions may be useful for an author's diary or personal therapist. There is a time and place for everything. Most of us are attracted to this forum because of our over arching interest in it's subject .... the Seattle Seahawks.

Just a well meaning observation accompanied with a reminder,

Jville

This is the perfect time and place for me to own my feelings and thoughts on the matter. Understanding the basis for my consternation might just save everyone even more self indulgent posts down the road. I don't need you guys to tell me this, I need to work through it on my own and hopefully pursue it in a way that gets chuckle or two. It's the freaking off season - what else is there to do?

I just now returned from delivering "wheels on meals" deliveries to local seniors in need.

With regards to what else is there to do, there are so many in need that go wanting for help from others. Too many Infants, children and elderly go wanting for food and clothing and shelter .... especially this time of year. Clean water and proper sewerage solutions go wanting for attention. We are surrounded by so many needs and so little help. Volunteering provides huge rewards. Everyone can supplement and fill their days with meaningful contributions ........ just like Russell Wilson and other Seahawks who volunteer as a way of life.

It's in keeping with becoming "All IN" as a Seahawk ...... helping other become the best they can be ..... and in the process build a better community.
 

KiwiHawk

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mrt144":15xiyngb said:
This is the perfect time and place for me to own my feelings and thoughts on the matter. Understanding the basis for my consternation might just save everyone even more self indulgent posts down the road. I don't need you guys to tell me this, I need to work through it on my own and hopefully pursue it in a way that gets chuckle or two. It's the freaking off season - what else is there to do?
So it's either agree with you or plod through more self-indulgent, entitlement-based exposition?
 
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mrt144

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Jville":n9hbtt6e said:
mrt144":n9hbtt6e said:
Jville":n9hbtt6e said:
mrt144":n9hbtt6e said:
So in your estimation then, are some of the small things I'm pining for that TwistedHawk laid out worth pursuing by the team next season conditionally on player talent in the stable? If I'm reading you right, you don't have a strong leaning on what you want on offense other than a mesh with the talent we have, which I totally get and appreciate to the extent that if there's a redux of this next season I won't get too huffy if you insist "We still didn't have the talent to see the introduction or expansion of elements you enjoy".

FWIW, I didn't expect a deep playoff run - but I did expect to see a little more... intellectual fire? once we were in the playoffs. That's my bag though - I'm always going to be harder on coaches than anyone else on the team because if I was to insert myself into an NFL franchise that's probably where I'd reside and it's ultimately what I'm keen on. I am not on any 'fire' anyone bandwagon at this point and in fact, I am more fine with everything now than I was earlier in the season.

I just want these goobers to do some things I think are absolutely capable of with the team in the pursuit of making them more dynamic and less brittle. We already have some elements in hand like play action - a concept the staff itself touts as being central, now it's a matter of honing play action into more lethal concepts within the plays themselves and part of an arsenal of plays that leverage off one another. What if we ran PA on first down maybe only 25% more than we do now? That wouldn't be a giant leap into things, would it?

Why not ease into some of the stuff we aren't doing while we're at it? Maybe sluggo routes can be a bridge to actual slants? Just get the WRs and RW comfortable with the timing, angles and the breaks and then potentially leverage them into an explosive PA pass play OR as a short banger when the box is stacked. Look man, I'm just spitballballing some pretty basic stuff that I think is there for the taking. I get risk aversion and protecting weaker elements of the team like the OL by not putting the full fulcrum of a completely robust passing and fleshed out passing game on their back.

I know that the team has masters of the universe who know way more about why we do and don't do certain things who aren't even the coaches calling stuff themselves. I get it, I'm just a dude with lots of time, interest and some rudimentary tools. I know the team doesn't play for my sole delight and ego indulgence (which is why I try to refuse to make predictions - that stuff is ego indulgence if you aren't getting paid to do it). But...

I'm just impatient and the assurances that this season was almost 'not for realsies' makes me sick. Yes, even a 5 year old should give it their all if they were thrust into combat with a lion, not tell the audience "wait till I'm 6, I'll be slaying lions all day erry day". I want to believe that we won't just have a shinier version of this offense next season. I want to see wrinkles, if not a new freckle or beauty mark. Yes, RW had his best season in a lot of ways but...I'm afraid of what feels like capitulation next season. I don't want to lose a game in part because we played two injured Gs which speaks to the need for depth you mentioned, but I also don't want to lose a game in part we played two injured Gs and THEN proceed to call inside runs that hugely depended on them. I know, sometimes thems the breaks and you can't help but drown, but I hate that mentality for people playing a game.

I wish I enjoyed defensive tactics more so I could diversify my thought and not be so self indulgent with the offense. But having played mostly on the defensive side of the ball at safety and CB, I care more about technique, awareness and athleticism when I'm watching. On D Line I really love seeing stunts and coordinated moves but not even as much as I love seeing athleticism set up a play and then awesome technique bring it home. Think a DE getting super sideways and dipping around a mountain of a man - it defies the eyes that someone that's like 6'3" and 280 can twist their body, move at that speed and not lose their balance while making some hapless tackle look extra foolish in comparison. Don't worry, I do have pet ideas on how to improve the defense. Rest assured though that I haven't perfected splicing people with wild animals but I'm getting close. ;)

Crap, you know what I realized in all of this - Pete Carroll hooked me on his team building and stellar defense that came about through his eye and tutelage but I respect offenses that make defenses look foolish by design because it feels like you're pulling one over on the other team in the most nerdy way possible and in a way that might not be easily countered by the other team. "Yeah, we might not have the talent on hand, but we know how to beat your superior defensive talent with our brains. " Yes, I love Revenge of the Nerds and that new wave song they had at the talent show was sick.

I guess what I'm getting at here is that I have a latent predisposition towards wanting to be clever on offense to defeat the exact kind of defense I want which is 11 Alligator-Shark-Men with 8 eyes and scary intense attitudes and drive. I want the answer to the problem I create for other people only to hold it over their heads and laugh.

A brief off-topic remark: We should all be cognizant that posting is publishing for all to see.

From time to time a post appears whose content redirects to a narration of it's author's feelings of reflection and sometimes self absorption. Although, such confessions may be useful for an author's diary or personal therapist. There is a time and place for everything. Most of us are attracted to this forum because of our over arching interest in it's subject .... the Seattle Seahawks.

Just a well meaning observation accompanied with a reminder,

Jville

This is the perfect time and place for me to own my feelings and thoughts on the matter. Understanding the basis for my consternation might just save everyone even more self indulgent posts down the road. I don't need you guys to tell me this, I need to work through it on my own and hopefully pursue it in a way that gets chuckle or two. It's the freaking off season - what else is there to do?

I just now returned from delivering "wheels on meals" deliveries to local seniors in need.

With regards to what else is there to do, there are so many in need that go wanting for help from others. Too many Infants, children and elderly go wanting for food and clothing and shelter .... especially this time of year. Clean water and proper sewerage solutions go wanting for attention. We are surrounded by so many needs and so little help. Volunteering provides huge rewards. Everyone can supplement and fill their days with meaningful contributions ........ just like Russell Wilson and other Seahawks who volunteer as a way of life.

It's in keeping with becoming "All IN" as a Seahawk ...... helping other become the best they can be ..... and in the process build a better community.

Ummm, I have volunteered my time to the homeless as recently as December - what a flaccid self promoting non point to just say you find me tiresome.
 

Jville

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For all of us there is always something more to attend to. That is the daily focus of Pete Carroll, Russell Wilson and all Seahawks. Building up and helping others.
 

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mrt144":20ca29by said:
Ummm, I have volunteered my time to the homeless as recently as December - what a flaccid self promoting non point to just say you find me tiresome.

Oh no there is a point. His point is to show how much better he is than others. :pukeface:
 
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KiwiHawk":3bj8n7j7 said:
mrt144":3bj8n7j7 said:
This is the perfect time and place for me to own my feelings and thoughts on the matter. Understanding the basis for my consternation might just save everyone even more self indulgent posts down the road. I don't need you guys to tell me this, I need to work through it on my own and hopefully pursue it in a way that gets chuckle or two. It's the freaking off season - what else is there to do?
So it's either agree with you or plod through more self-indulgent, entitlement-based exposition?

You had a somewhat more thoughtful response at a certain point that I liked and ran with it. You didn't agree with me, you don't agree with me, I don't expect you to agree with me, and I don't care if you do agree with me or not. I care that you keep probing at my thoughts and have a laugh or two along the way to understand why I have the opinions and desires I do.

I have undercut my own opinions and arguments numerous times in the hope of conveying that I am self indulgent (because I like to write, believe it or not) but not self important. There is a distinction and I wish I did a better job of making that clear to you but I didn't.

And you know why I've gone to great self-indulgent lengths? Because you specifically, among others, have taken to beating a strawman likeness of me instead of actually engaging me and understanding some of the rationales in play. I'm a curious dude, you're acting like I have all the answers (wrong ones but ones all of them none the less) and am seriously put out by my diktats not being carried out by the team. I'm not - I'm frustrated at times like anyone. I don't tend to share when I'm happy because I tend to exhibit happiness only during the game when I let my brain off the hook from thinking about the game in terms of a game wholly. When I'm not watching, I put on my thinking and analysis cap. I'm a weird nerd, I admit it, treat me like I'm a weird nerd, not some entitled football bro who only accepts my vision as true and is seriously put out by it and will physically fight you for not wanting to see play action more on first down.

For a bunch of dudes that self select to talk football, the curiosity of why we arrive to the thoughts seems completely bereft here at times, like some of you think that your opinions on football are self contained and there's no rhyme or reason why we feel the things we do in relation to football. Some of you are super basic, but please please please, if you find my verbosity off putting to the extent that every reply is a variation of "shut up", just put me on "foe" and be done with it.

I swear, If I wrote a paper on my relationship with Chocolate or something frivolous some of you would be like "Why are you so mad at chocolate, bro!? Chocolate is great, everyone knows this" mistaking my thorough, if not silly, opinions as entitled and commanding chocolate to up its game lest I boo chocolate forever. I'm not the adversary you want me to be or imagine. I know that a lot of conversation on the internet is couched in adversarial terms but that's not me and maybe you'd enjoy my posts more if you stopped reading them that way.
 
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