Sgt. Largent":2qy7nd63 said:I'm a child of the 80's, so it's hard for me to say this, it's Lebron.
Jordan took basketball into the new age and made it the global juggernaut that it is. But Lebron changed the ACTUAL game of basketball, a freak of nature that can play all five positions, dominate at any one of them, and has done it for what.............15 years now?
Jordan never had that longevity of dominance.
Scary part is Lebron's not even close to done, he can play for another 4-5 years.
Uncle Si":1cdmd605 said:Sgt. Largent":1cdmd605 said:I'm a child of the 80's, so it's hard for me to say this, it's Lebron.
Jordan took basketball into the new age and made it the global juggernaut that it is. But Lebron changed the ACTUAL game of basketball, a freak of nature that can play all five positions, dominate at any one of them, and has done it for what.............15 years now?
Jordan never had that longevity of dominance.
Scary part is Lebron's not even close to done, he can play for another 4-5 years.
Not saying this sways the argument either way, but the era's of basketball should be included here. the physical era of the 80s and 90s, with 7 foot plus big men patrolling the paint, have been replaced by power forwards running the diagonals and point guards turning into shooting guards. Much of this was because of Lebron (he's not the only big man doing this) and has helped him excel. But Lebron is playing in the league that Jordan created, not Lebron. It was a league of bruisers and brutes, post ups and pick and rolls. Jordan played beyond the arc, in the paint and above the rim. Once he beat the Pistons, that era of basketball was over. Lebron would certainly be a force in the Jordan-era, but he's not really had to deal with a set up (including rules) that challenge him.
I never really see anyone post the opposite: how would Jordan do in this era?
Lebron has really changed the way I thought of him the last 2-3 years. He's become "that guy" instead of part of a group of guys. I still think Jordan walks into this iteration of the NBA and dominates offensively, much in the way Kobe was, and his defensive presence makes him an easy MVP candidate. I can't say the same about Lebron in the 90s.
I guess they are 1a and 1b. But I think time has forgot what Jordan really was, night in and night out, and how challenged he was by the league. I think i'd take that over Lebron, but its not automatic anymore.
Uncle Si":2x79x4gz said:But Lebron is playing in the league that Jordan created, not Lebron.
Uncle Si":jbwtosx1 said:Sgt. Largent":jbwtosx1 said:I'm a child of the 80's, so it's hard for me to say this, it's Lebron.
Jordan took basketball into the new age and made it the global juggernaut that it is. But Lebron changed the ACTUAL game of basketball, a freak of nature that can play all five positions, dominate at any one of them, and has done it for what.............15 years now?
Jordan never had that longevity of dominance.
Scary part is Lebron's not even close to done, he can play for another 4-5 years.
Not saying this sways the argument either way, but the era's of basketball should be included here. the physical era of the 80s and 90s, with 7 foot plus big men patrolling the paint, have been replaced by power forwards running the diagonals and point guards turning into shooting guards. Much of this was because of Lebron (he's not the only big man doing this) and has helped him excel. But Lebron is playing in the league that Jordan created, not Lebron. It was a league of bruisers and brutes, post ups and pick and rolls. Jordan played beyond the arc, in the paint and above the rim. Once he beat the Pistons, that era of basketball was over. Lebron would certainly be a force in the Jordan-era, but he's not really had to deal with a set up (including rules) that challenge him.
I never really see anyone post the opposite: how would Jordan do in this era?
Lebron has really changed the way I thought of him the last 2-3 years. He's become "that guy" instead of part of a group of guys. I still think Jordan walks into this iteration of the NBA and dominates offensively, much in the way Kobe was, and his defensive presence makes him an easy MVP candidate. I can't say the same about Lebron in the 90s.
I guess they are 1a and 1b. But I think time has forgot what Jordan really was, night in and night out, and how challenged he was by the league. I think i'd take that over Lebron, but its not automatic anymore.
Jeremy517":3q233nar said:Uncle Si":3q233nar said:But Lebron is playing in the league that Jordan created, not Lebron.
That isn't really true at all. The game is completely different than when Jordan played.
Jordan shot relatively few threes. For his career, he averaged fewer than two per game, even if we throw out the poor seasons with the Wizards. 265 guys shot more threes this year per game than Jordan's career average with the Bulls, and 132 players shot more threes per game this year than Jordan's highest season. 150 guys made threes at a higher percentage than Jordan.
The road to the current state of the NBA, in my opinion, was started by Gregg Popovich. He was the one that showed the league how valuable corner threes are. Corner threes are almost two feet closer than other threes, yet worth the same amount of points. Most coaches eventually realized that long twos are the worst shot in basketball. Why take an 18-20 foot jumper, when you can step back a few feet and get 50% more points for a make? This led to shot charts like this being the norm:
That is way different than the Jordan-era of the NBA. That isn't to say that Jordan couldn't play in the current era; obviously he could. However, the league now isn't the one that Jordan created.
Sgt. Largent":3bolkusb said:Uncle Si":3bolkusb said:Sgt. Largent":3bolkusb said:I'm a child of the 80's, so it's hard for me to say this, it's Lebron.
Jordan took basketball into the new age and made it the global juggernaut that it is. But Lebron changed the ACTUAL game of basketball, a freak of nature that can play all five positions, dominate at any one of them, and has done it for what.............15 years now?
Jordan never had that longevity of dominance.
Scary part is Lebron's not even close to done, he can play for another 4-5 years.
Not saying this sways the argument either way, but the era's of basketball should be included here. the physical era of the 80s and 90s, with 7 foot plus big men patrolling the paint, have been replaced by power forwards running the diagonals and point guards turning into shooting guards. Much of this was because of Lebron (he's not the only big man doing this) and has helped him excel. But Lebron is playing in the league that Jordan created, not Lebron. It was a league of bruisers and brutes, post ups and pick and rolls. Jordan played beyond the arc, in the paint and above the rim. Once he beat the Pistons, that era of basketball was over. Lebron would certainly be a force in the Jordan-era, but he's not really had to deal with a set up (including rules) that challenge him.
I never really see anyone post the opposite: how would Jordan do in this era?
Lebron has really changed the way I thought of him the last 2-3 years. He's become "that guy" instead of part of a group of guys. I still think Jordan walks into this iteration of the NBA and dominates offensively, much in the way Kobe was, and his defensive presence makes him an easy MVP candidate. I can't say the same about Lebron in the 90s.
I guess they are 1a and 1b. But I think time has forgot what Jordan really was, night in and night out, and how challenged he was by the league. I think i'd take that over Lebron, but its not automatic anymore.
Couple good points.
Jordan definitely played in a more physical time of the league, but make no mistake he as well as other big stars got a LOT of calls, just as Lebron and the stars of today do.
I'd also say that Lebron is one of the most physically dominant players in the game, so I have no doubt he'd do just fine playing in Jordan's time of having to work harder and be tougher/more physical. Dude could play TE in the NFL if he wanted to, he's such a physical freak.
IMO you nailed the more fair comparison Si, to me it's always been Kobe vs Jordan, same style and physical build. IMO there is no comparison for Lebron for style and physical makeup.
2_0_6":3f2fje6b said:I think the main factor between the two time periods is the athletes themselves. Jordan never faced a 6'9" 260lb guy that had a sweet jumper, could dunk over anyone, had the abilities to play PG, and the stamina of a racehorse.
Compare the NFL of today to the NFL of the 80's, and I would bet that most good teams today would wipe the floors with the good teams from back then. Guys are just bigger, stronger, faster and train year round as opposed to a portion of a year.
IndyHawk":cpl5bnrf said:2_0_6":cpl5bnrf said:I think the main factor between the two time periods is the athletes themselves. Jordan never faced a 6'9" 260lb guy that had a sweet jumper, could dunk over anyone, had the abilities to play PG, and the stamina of a racehorse.
Compare the NFL of today to the NFL of the 80's, and I would bet that most good teams today would wipe the floors with the good teams from back then. Guys are just bigger, stronger, faster and train year round as opposed to a portion of a year.
The famous crutch words come out....
Uncle Si":2d5p90gp said:You're only strengthening the argument 2_0_6...