Mina Kimes ranks Pete Carroll at #10 among coaches

[scutterhawk]

Did you watch that response? Pete above all is a compassionate person. He was giving Russ praise and thanks and taking the high road.

This was in a climate where their relationship was broken. Russ was lashing out publicly, questioning coaching criticizing the defense, etc.

Pete was trying to build a bridge and make it known that he still supported his qb, because Russ cant take criticism. Thats been established x100 over. Its what started his whole meltdown in the years before his trade when he realized through his agent that seattle wasblooking to move him. Russ went from team guy to going on a crusade to elevate himself above the team. In 2021 it blew up publicly on the field and in the press room. You act as if that's some sort of admission that Russ made Pete.

It's no different than the interview he gave to Wyman and Bob after they closed out the season with a huge win. Russ played well within the system, something he'd refused to do all season long. And when Wyman asked with skepticism whether Pete felt Russ would be back, he optimistically responded yes. That Russ would see the light and find his way back to happiness here.

Pete was doing what he always did - placating Russ.

Look at the post trade press conference with Pete and John. Even THEN, Pete was ho hum and seemingly regretful that things didn't work.

All of that, until Russ gave his own presser and accused Seattle of blindsiding him, saying he was happy to be with a team that wanted to win, etc.

Pete was Russ's biggest champion. Inflating his ego, protecting him to his own detriment.

But he woke up. It's why there are quotes now from Pete about how Geno is coachable... that he works within the system. That he gets it. That he's a team guy, that he makes everything easy... all of that when asked what's different between Russ and Geno. Not because he has I'll will, but because he woke up and realized that you can't make a narcissist happy.

Pete flipped a switch. It's plainly obvious he realized the mistake he made and is as enthusiastic and determined now that they've moved on to show what the team can do and might have done before as he has ever been.

Pete taking "The High Road" Perfectly explains how it went down without Pete having to throw Wilson under the bus = 'Coach Speak'
All you gotta do to verify how Pete REALLY felt about Russ quitting on him and going to Denver with his 'Now Let ME Show You How it's Done' demeanor, and Pete's reaction to the Seahawks victory over the Denver Wilsons' in Seattle at the beginning of last year...The all out Foofaraw celebration in the locker room by Pete & his TEAM PLAYERS after they'd handed Russ his first loss of the season pretty much showed how Pete REALLY felt.

 

[scutterhawk]

Cool story

Not just "Cool" but also TRUE.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Super cute. Are you gonna' fold your arms and kick your legs up in the air now?
You claim you "ignore" me, but here you are spouting off in CAPS.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

You are still concentrating solely on Wilson. Take him out of the equation totally. I'm asking why the other QB's, excluding Wilson, were atop the sack list under Carroll? Its not just a Wilson issue.

Because your entire premise for whatever you're trying to prove here is laughable, that's why.

Pete develops and gets the very best out of his QB's, end of story. All Pro's, top 10 QB's, possible future HOF'er in Wilson and Heisman trophy winners all over the place.

To hyper focus on one issue about protection only proves one thing pitt, that you're desperate to prove a fallacy about Pete not being a good coach.....and that's barely even worth debating. But here we are.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Pete is an all time great coach, period. While I wouldn't mind them eventually moving on from him, he has more than earned the right to stay as long as he wants.

 

[CallMeADawg]

Pete is an all time great coach, period. While I wouldn't mind them eventually moving on from him, he has more than earned the right to stay as long as he wants.

Pete has been coaching football longer than most of his detractors here have been alive. I find their criticism of his ability to coach football to be the single most laughable pile of biased armchair bs around here. Second place goes to the Russell Wilson paladins that rush in on a white horse to shine every turd he's ever made.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Pete has been coaching football longer than most of his detractors here have been alive. I find their criticism of his ability to coach football to be the single most laughable pile of biased armchair bs around here. Second place goes to the Russell Wilson paladins that rush in on a white horse to shine every turd he's ever made.

But if his QB's were better protected, he'd be an even MORE amazing coach. Don't you get it man!??

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Dear God, I feel bad for the horse

 

[keasley45]

Dear God, I feel bad for the horse

You mean the Bronco?

 

[SoulfishHawk]

solid ^

 

[bileever]

Yeah, he also paid and gave Reggie Bush a house which landed USC a two year bowl game ban, a loss of 30 scholarships, and a forfeiture of two years of victories. We're talking about the NFL though.

The USC thing gets brought up a lot, without anyone bothering to find out the facts. You should at least read the Wikipedia entry on the issue:

University of Southern California athletics scandal - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

USC wasn't doing anything that every other major college football program was doing. Bush was paid by an agent--the payment wasn't for the purpose of getting Bush to play at USC, it was to get Bush as a client for the agent. There is consensus at this point that the NCAA targeted USC to make an example out of them. The motive isn't clear, but it's believed that many people hated Pete's empowerment of players and the celebrity circus that surrounded USC.

The focus was never on Pete Carroll, but Todd McNair, an assistant coach.

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profo...nquiry-focuses-on-reggie-bushs-position-coach

As a moral issue, we all realize now that college players should be compensated. These sanctions were the death throes of the NCAA attempting to maintain the status quo and keep their foot on the throat of the players and use them as free labor. There was a lawsuit later by Todd McNair against the NCAA, and a judge ruled that the NCAA had been malicious in its investigation of USC, and the NCAA ended up having to pay him.

 

[chris98251]

You mean the Bronco?

Bucko I believe is his name, part of the reason I think they Drafted Elway, both had the same smile.

 

[keasley45]

The USC thing gets brought up a lot, without anyone bothering to find out the facts. You should at least read the Wikipedia entry on the issue:

University of Southern California athletics scandal - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

USC wasn't doing anything that every other major college football program was doing. Bush was paid by an agent--the payment wasn't for the purpose of getting Bush to play at USC, it was to get Bush as a client for the agent. There is consensus at this point that the NCAA targeted USC to make an example out of them. The motive isn't clear, but it's believed that many people hated Pete's empowerment of players and the celebrity circus that surrounded USC.

The focus was never on Pete Carroll, but Todd McNair, an assistant coach.

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profo...nquiry-focuses-on-reggie-bushs-position-coach

As a moral issue, we all realize now that college players should be compensated. These sanctions were the death throes of the NCAA attempting to maintain the status quo and keep their foot on the throat of the players and use them as free labor. There was a lawsuit later by Todd McNair against the NCAA, and a judge ruled that the NCAA had been malicious in its investigation of USC, and the NCAA ended up having to pay him.

Thank you for postng this. Unfortunately, Pete came into town under a cloud of disinformation and general hostility as a result of his success, his style, and his positive, but rather passive personality. It was all undeserved. And he's had to wade through it and live through snubs for COTY and just getting the recognition he deserved.

When he declined to bring saftey T Mayes on board (for every good reason one could imagine) and was accused of giving him 'bad coaching advice' that Taylor blamed for his drop in the draft, rather than being looked at as a smart football move, he was again labeled a phony for havning promised his guy a spot and then betrayng him. In fact, Pete saying he would draft Taylor wasnt a gurantee, it was a statement that he was talented enough to be drafted. But when ET3 dropped to us, Pete grabbed him. And Pete giving Taylor advice that was contrary to the profile of player we ended up taking wasnt bad advice.

Taylor just wasnt cut out to make it, but with Pete's help, he ended up being a high profile pick regardless, but only lasted 5 years, none of which were noteworthy. He was just another player that benefited immensely from Pete's coaching.

Byron Maxwell
Malcolm Smith
Walter Thurmond
Mark sanchez
...

The list if guys he ended up helping get paydays above their talent is long. The list of guys he helped to max out their potential - longer.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I think Carroll leaving USC had far more to do with going 9-4 in 2009, and seeing the decline of his program..........and yes, not wanting to deal with any impending sanctions.

Did he know about the Bush situation? Maybe. Probably.

But IMO Pete jumping ship to the NFL had far more to do with him wanting a new challenge, and the new challenge was proving he could win in the NFL. Which he's proven in spades.

 

[rcaido]

im glad he did. Got us our first Superbowl and made the Seahawks relevant for a decade again.

 

[Crizilla]

Don't care. I hate rankings from x sports writer.

 

[pittpnthrs]

Because your entire premise for whatever you're trying to prove here is laughable, that's why.

Pete develops and gets the very best out of his QB's, end of story. All Pro's, top 10 QB's, possible future HOF'er in Wilson and Heisman trophy winners all over the place.

To hyper focus on one issue about protection only proves one thing pitt, that you're desperate to prove a fallacy about Pete not being a good coach.....and that's barely even worth debating. But here we are.

It has nothing to do with how good of a coach or how bad of a coach Pete Carroll is. It was a point brought up that every QB under Pete Carroll takes an enormous amount of sacks and it wasn't just Russell Wilson. As somebody mentioned before, the sack numbers could be due to Carrolls philosophy that its better to take a sack than turn the ball over, who knows, but the numbers are there. My premise stands that a better job of protecting the QB could be done, but for whatever reason, that doesnt appear to be a high priority with Pete Carroll because the sacks keep coming or he has failed at fixing that area of concern.

 

[scutterhawk]

Russell Wilson & several other QB's who've played a similar style of play requires mobility to stay upright, While young & twitchy, there's a LOT of upside, but age is a factor that has to be accounted for, and Wilson needed to expand on his repertoire to counter...He didn't do enough.
Hell, maybe Payton can conjure up a better protection for Russ, but it's going to REQUIRE that he get the ball OUT of his hands a lot faster...Also, the plays will have to develop a lot quicker in that process.
Geno's style of play, is more of a mixture of traditional & Mobility, & calls for a completely different style of Coaching prep.
Pass Protection for a more Pocket Passer type QB, calls for an entirely different Offensive line play, the last two Drafts are proof of how Pete has been Retooling for the Differences between RW & Geno Smith/Drew Lock.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

It has nothing to do with how good of a coach or how bad of a coach Pete Carroll is. It was a point brought up that every QB under Pete Carroll takes an enormous amount of sacks and it wasn't just Russell Wilson. As somebody mentioned before, the sack numbers could be due to Carrolls philosophy that its better to take a sack than turn the ball over, who knows, but the numbers are there. My premise stands that a better job of protecting the QB could be done, but for whatever reason, that doesnt appear to be a high priority with Pete Carroll because the sacks keep coming or he has failed at fixing that area of concern.

How can something that results in Pro Bowls and a high level of play be a "level of concern?"

This is your disconnect, you're applying a subjective pre-conceived biased concept and trying to state it as a factual negative, when the larger picture tells you it's not a concern because Pete still develops and coaches up his QB's to Pro Bowl level of play.

And it's not even a premise most of us agree with, since the sample size is literally 11 years of the same QB who's been sacked a bajillion times over his college and pro career, including outside of Seattle.

 

[CallMeADawg]

How can something that results in Pro Bowls and a high level of play be a "level of concern?"

This is your disconnect, you're applying a subjective pre-conceived biased concept and trying to state it as a factual negative, when the larger picture tells you it's not a concern because Pete still develops and coaches up his QB's to Pro Bowl level of play.

And it's not even a premise most of us agree with, since the sample size is literally 11 years of the same QB who's been sacked a bajillion times over his college and pro career, including outside of Seattle.

My refrigerator quit working because Pete Carroll can't coach ball well enough. He better fix the offense line otherwise my coffee maker might be next.