Did a certain scheme make the LOB great?

[Lords of Scythia]

Or was it just personell.

 

[DomeHawk]

Excuse me it was cover 1 & cover 3, man-free. Corners utilizing kick-step.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Or was it just personell.

The Seahawks ran a pretty basic scheme. Pretty much cover 3 and cover 1 with a aggressive secondary that made it hard for wide receivers to get a free release. They also had a rangey safety in Thomas that could cover a lot of ground. This allowed guys like Kam Chancellor to play closer to the LOS, almost like another linebacker.

We used base defense more than just about anyone, but the big wrinkle here was the front we used. It was a hybrid between 3-4 and 4-3. Red Bryant was switched from DT to DE, which if you look at Red Bryant -- he wasn't anything like any a traditional 4-3 DE. We also used a stand-up pass rusher that was undersized, Irvin and Clemons played this role. It was a mix between one gap and two gap.

Nothing Carroll did was particularly groundbreaking. What was unique about his approach was the personnel he employed. Big corners such as Sherman and Browner were rare. Carroll had these guys play up close to receivers and maul them. It was hard for receivers to get off of the LOS.

 

[Spin Doctor]

Cover 2

It was more cover 1 and cover 3 based under the LOB days.

 

[Lords of Scythia]

Carrol liked SF's bump-and-run in eighties, with Lott.

 

[QWERTY]

Or was it just personell.

When you have a good DL

Red Bryant
Chris Clemons
Michael Bennett
Cliff Avril
Brandon Mebane
Bruce Irvin

They can stop the run and apply pressure.

Prime
Kj Wright
Bobby Wagner
Malcom Smith

Guys that can cover TE and RB”s

This roster was perfect. If Seattle missed playoffs in 2014, they would had win it in 2015 with a good season rest.

 

[DomeHawk]

It was more cover 1 and cover 3 based under the LOB days.

Yeah, I edited that to 1 and 3. For some reason I had cover 2 in my head

 

[seahawks08]

We had great coaches like Gus and Dan who were in their prime with being DCs that then left to become HCs. They were not coaches in the learning which helped scheming and calling plays along with coaching fundamentals. Our staff was strong in defensive side of thinks where everyone was skilled on doing their part. When you promote a line coach there is a lot more to keep an eye on breadth wise rather than depth. The coaches and players learning along with skill gaps need attention. Pete literally needs to sit with the entire organization to makes sure there is a consistent message

 

[Spin Doctor]

Yeah, I edited that to 1 and 3. For some reason I had cover 2 in my head

It makes sense that you said that though, he was mentored by Monte Kiffin afterall. It's why he kept Gus Bradley around even after Mora got fired. I've caught myself doing the same thing before.

 

[mrblitz]

from what some people were saying/writing about that defense at the time (2012-2013), was that they were all very 'assignment correct' as well. ... little or no blown assignments or freelancing..

 

[mrblitz]

oh and chancellor was a football genius, with instant pattern recognition of the offensive intentions.

 

[FrodosFinger]

Secondary play is largely contingent on how good your D line is

 

[HawkRiderFan]

I thought it was great players in a scheme that maximised their talent. Not a lot of disguising coverage, multiple looks sets. They were simply better than you and beat you.

That's why I was optimistic going into the SB vs Manning. Manning thrives on pre-snap recognition. Well the Hawks weren't going to try and fool him so it took that part of his game away.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Talent first, but they also bought in to the system and how to play it.

 

[Mad Dog]

It was a great defensive scheme for the time. Before the NFL made touching WR's a criminal offence. Sadly Kam Chancellor could not exist in the modern NFL. But in those days, his presence alone kept the middle of the defense clear of traffic.

Now the modern defense has to have quick cover guys and quick pass rusher guys and still hope to have enough beef to stop the run. But midfield enforcers are a dying breed.

Our defense has primarily failed with the DL. Not enough beef to stop the run, not enough penetration to frighten the QB. I think we've got cover guys. I think we could use some better LB's. But really it's the DL where all the failure starts (and where all the Niner's success begins)

 

[TheLegendOfBoom]

It was a perfect storm for Seattle, really.

Everything at that time for this secondary.

The NFL rules allowed certain play styles.

Carroll, knew college talent and he had the early jump on them.

Seattle, chose to use “bigger” corners that at that time wasn’t really a market for.

The simplicity of defensive coverage allowed the secondary to play without “thinking” too much.

Seattle had speed and instincts at free safety.

A very high IQ HOF corner with size.

A very intelligent strong safety that inflicted punishment and intimidated practically anyone running into his zone.

A front seven that was consistently pressuring QBs with just four down lineman and maybe sometimes would occasionally blitz a linebacker.

All these elements rolled into a single cohesive unit that dominated at that time and overwhelmed offenses to the point where they had to change defensive rules.

It was pretty much a perfect storm at the perfect time that allowed Seattle’s defense as a whole to control the entire tempo and flow of opposing offenses.

The NFL finally discovered this during the Super Bowl against the Broncos, which is why they set new rules in place to prevent defenses from pretty much stopping any kind of high octane offense, because offense is the money maker for the NFL not defense.

The 2012 Seahawks defense, quite literally, reshaped the NFL landscape and what you see offensively now in the NFL is the direct result of the impact of just how great the 2012 Seahawks defense was.

One of the greatest defense of all-time!

Absolutely and unquestionably, Legendary.

 

[irfuben32]

The LOB didn't really take off until the arrival of Avril and Bennett.

I don't care how good your DB's are if you have no pass rush.

 

[kidhawk]

Superstars will always stand out, but if you want to have a great defense, superstars are never enough. IMO, the key to having a good defense is having teammates who can communicate consistently and each individual player playing their position properly. Often times you see players trying to make plays that are "out of their zone", and sometimes that looks like a spectacular play, and others (more often than not) it leaves a big hole in the defense for the offense to take advantage of. When you have 11 guys on defense communicating and each doing their jobs, you have a good defense. Mix in a few superstars on there and you can turn that good defense into a great one.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

We had great coaches like Gus and Dan who were in their prime with being DCs that then left to become HCs. They were not coaches in the learning which helped scheming and calling plays along with coaching fundamentals. Our staff was strong in defensive side of thinks where everyone was skilled on doing their part. When you promote a line coach there is a lot more to keep an eye on breadth wise rather than depth. The coaches and players learning along with skill gaps need attention. Pete literally needs to sit with the entire organization to makes sure there is a consistent message

Gus Bradley was a LB coach at Tampa for two years before coming here for the DC job. No previous NFL DC experience.

Quinn was the D-line coach here, then the DC at Florida before being named the DC here. Again, no previous NFL DC experience.

I know we're all trying to perpetuate some fire Clint Hurtt narrative because he had no DC experience, but he had as much, or even more NFL coaching experience than both Quinn and Bradley. Seven years of LB/D-line NFL coaching experience.

 

[chris98251]

It was a perfect storm for Seattle, really.

Everything at that time for this secondary.

The NFL rules allowed certain play styles.

Carroll, knew college talent and he had the early jump on them.

Seattle, chose to use “bigger” corners that at that time wasn’t really a market for.

The simplicity of defensive coverage allowed the secondary to play without “thinking” too much.

Seattle had speed and instincts at free safety.

A very high IQ HOF corner with size.

A very intelligent strong safety that inflicted punishment and intimidated practically anyone running into his zone.

A front seven that was consistently pressuring QBs with just four down lineman and maybe sometimes would occasionally blitz a linebacker.

All these elements rolled into a single cohesive unit that dominated at that time and overwhelmed offenses to the point where they had to change defensive rules.

It was pretty much a perfect storm at the perfect time that allowed Seattle’s defense as a whole to control the entire tempo and flow of opposing offenses.

The NFL finally discovered this during the Super Bowl against the Broncos, which is why they set new rules in place to prevent defenses from pretty much stopping any kind of high octane offense, because offense is the money maker for the NFL not defense.

The 2012 Seahawks defense, quite literally, reshaped the NFL landscape and what you see offensively now in the NFL is the direct result of the impact of just how great the 2012 Seahawks defense was.

One of the greatest defense of all-time!

Absolutely and unquestionably, Legendary.

And yet another rule implemented due to what Seattle had done, Peyton embarrassed on World Wide TV, the league embarrassed due to them thinking he was going to be a ambassador for them, instead they got Marshawn and Richard mostly, which by NFL league standards was like Charles Manson being a Camp counselor for them. Additionally we had more fans there and it was by the players quotes almost like a home game. Yes the League was pissed about that also.

I looked at it this way, we had the Bettis Bowl where officiating was so blatantly skewed to stop us from winning along with the League making Detroit a Pittsburgh home field for the Bettis Bowl. Blowing out Peyton and the number 1 best offense ever in Goodells home town with our fans and the players we had was payback you can't script. Oh and the money lost on the betting line had to be billions as well.