Russell Wilson last 6 years-$156 million and 3 playoff wins

[OrangeGravy]

Orange,

I think the fact the organization has not made a single supporting statement or even an interview 'we are committed to working with Russell to make this work for both side' type of non-statement...tells you all there is to know.

The organization is doing nothing to show their support. The silence is actually deafening.

Which means someone is being petty and emotional, likely on both sides at this point, but it means the chance at resolution is likely nil.

Only Pete Carroll could be short sighted enough not to realize that he is going to put himself in a circumstance where he has to take a 20M-30M cap hit because he refused to at least give the illusion of kowtowing to his star QB.

Maybe or maybe giving the illusion won't change anything other than fan sentiment one way or another. I suspect the "team" is trying to figure out if this salvageable or not. If they talked to Russ's people and he wants out, why would they say anything until they've secured the most favorable exit plan they can? If it is salvageable and they don't put anything out there soon, I agree they might have reached their line. I find it interesting.

I think they put themselves in a bad spot. They should've drove a hard bargain on Russ with the extension and traded him for a haul if wouldn't relent. I understand it would've been a tough move to talk yourself into, but I don't think Russ can maintain that high level of play consistently enough throughout a season to hand the keys over to him completely like you would Brady or Peyton. I don't think going to another situation would magically cure any of the apparent limitations we've seen in his game while here. I think his issues are his. They won't be fixed by scheme or approach significantly enough to put Russ permanently in that room with Brady/Peyton. I still Russell's best situation is strong running game and let him hit the shots. He wants to be Mahomes and that's fine too. It's his career, but he's not gonna get that here.

 

[Tinamedina]

And pete carroll was the coach this whole time. What does that say about pete Carroll? Russell Wilson does his job, pete carroll should have done his. 2014 bowl was lost because of PETE CARROLLS play call, and yall are still being cowards too afraid to call pete out.

 

[chris98251]

Tony Dungy had the Tampa Two when he coached, it was a great defense, the Bucs and then later with the Colts kicked ass until the playoffs.

There were better QB's and OC's I think then that were allowed to do their thing. Teams used the WCO and guys like Manning moved the ball at will because of of screens, underneath routes and spreading the field and running.

Teams were patient and said ok we will take 5, 8, 10, 15 yards, YAC and broken tackles were the break away TD's.

Brady and the Bucs were patient and played two deep on defense, why they looked so dominant.

Chiefs did not adjust and were impatient wanting it deep and then behind not running the ball.

Sound familiar?

 

[IndyHawk]

Said this on his first contract. Glorified game manger with deep ball accuracy. Once teams switched to 2-deep safety look he's just a game manager. Not going to move the ball down the field consistently with just his arm. First SB win swooed all the fans into thinking he was Elite.

So you are saying that it took teams 9 years to figure out Wilson couldn't play against 2 deep safeties?

That seems like something you'd figure out week 6. Clearly we need far better DC's in this league if that was the case.

It's the gameplan that beats 2 deep safeties, not the QB. If teams are going to play a light box, you need to be able to take advantage of that with screens, running plays and some TE throws. I can't recall us using TE's or screens to any significant degree and that's not on the QB.

There is a reason Schotty was fired. He couldn't adapt to the 2 deep safety looks because his offense is too rudimentary. Pete Ball wasn't the problem, Marty Ball was.

You cannot tell me Russ doesn't have pass options on every play
besides just deep..I see the vids people post showing plenty of
open WR's and Russ will not see them because?????

 

[chris98251]

Said this on his first contract. Glorified game manger with deep ball accuracy. Once teams switched to 2-deep safety look he's just a game manager. Not going to move the ball down the field consistently with just his arm. First SB win swooed all the fans into thinking he was Elite.

So you are saying that it took teams 9 years to figure out Wilson couldn't play against 2 deep safeties?

That seems like something you'd figure out week 6. Clearly we need far better DC's in this league if that was the case.

It's the gameplan that beats 2 deep safeties, not the QB. If teams are going to play a light box, you need to be able to take advantage of that with screens, running plays and some TE throws. I can't recall us using TE's or screens to any significant degree and that's not on the QB.

There is a reason Schotty was fired. He couldn't adapt to the 2 deep safety looks because his offense is too rudimentary. Pete Ball wasn't the problem, Marty Ball was.

You cannot tell me Russ doesn't have pass options on every play
besides just deep..I see the vids people post showing plenty of
open WR's and Russ will not see them because?????

There are a couple answers and on any given play they may both be true.

Russ can't see across the field because he is short. He should know where Receivers will be on the filed to glance and see them however so I don't buy this as a regular occurrence.

Russ refuses to concede a play and wants chunk or Pete wants Chunk plays and not take what is given.

This is where I am settling at.

Other wise a quicker passing game would have evolved whether it was 3 step drops or designed roll out and passing quickly for a RAC gain.

 

[Torc]

Yeah from a fan perspective, it'd be cool if Russell shorted himself and took like 20 million a season. But let's face it, no QB other than Brady has done that (and he has a supermodel wife who has more money than him). Even Carson Wentz, who was terrible last year, is going to count 31 million against the cap next year. If some of you guys want another QB and don't hit a home run in the draft...you basically HAVE to overpay to get someone who is even average to good. That's the reality.

The Seattle Times had an article about the percentage of the cap that QBs are using that was pretty interesting. This was published back when Russell signed his current contract.

But now, after his famous midnight “hey Seattle, we got a deal’’ contract agreement with the Seahawks, Wilson is set to take up 13.36% of the team’s cap this season (2019), more than any QB of any team that has won a Super Bowl since 1994.

The current high is Steve Young’s 13.1% with the 49ers in 1994, the year the cap was first instituted (Brady took up 12.21% of the Patriots’ cap last season).

Wilson rises to 16.13% next season (2020) before then dropping to 13.26% and 11.40% in 2021 and 2022, respectively (all numbers from Spotrac.com and OvertheCap.com, and also all based on projections of the cap going forward).

(bolding is mine)



So in 2019 he was already paid more (in terms of cap percentage) than any SB winning QB ever, and then increased that number even more in 2020. By comparison, Tom Brady made 12.2% of the Tampa Bay cap this year.

This is always going to be an issue in a salary cap era. If Russell is getting these dollars partly because his escapability lets him make do with a lower paid and less skilled O-line, but he's aged out of that ability, where is he left? Those cap dollars have to come from somewhere - where would he prefer they be taken from? Bobby Wagner?

Basically, Wilson wants to have his cake and eat it too. When you negotiate with the goal of being the highest paid QB in the game, the team has to cut costs other places to make that happen. That reduces the chances of getting to the Super Bowl.


Edit: The cap numbers I quoted above came from two different sources, Wilson's from the Times and Brady's from overcap.com. Wilson's numbers for the past couple of years from overcap: 2019 - 13.8%, 2020 - 15.5%, 2021 - 17.6%. Brady's historical numbers are here. Note that with the patriots, Brady was often below or at 10% of the cap.

 

[TwistedHusky]

The statistics are interesting but irrelevant. Whether Wilson can make another SuperBowl is another argument. Because Wilson at least wants the chance to compete for it without one hand tied behind his back.

Carroll's archaic offense is enough to overcome. But since he is supposedly at least supposed to make it up with great defense? When the defense is average or below, he isn't making up for the incredible waste of effectiveness he is in almost every other area as a coach.

And it isn't about SuperBowls specifically.

The issue is playoff legacy not just SuperBowls.

Pete Carroll is destroying Wilson's success % in the playoffs with Pete's own idiocy.

He is locked into a style and philosophy that no longer works or even matters.

All it does is hold his own QB back.

And guess what?

When you pay your QB 1/5 of your cap, and make your entire franchise dependent on his success? Then you have no choice but to march to his tune. Period. The QB now gets a seat at the table, gets a vote, and gets to make decisions.

And the amusing thing is it won't matter.

Wilson now knows the power he holds. And he will exercise it. You can like it and reap the benefits. Or disdain it, resist it, and wallow in failure. Because hitching your wagon to Carroll is hitching your wagon to fading effectiveness, outdated philosophy, if not creeping senility.

Carroll had one value. He develops talent and he makes that talent love him. The moment the greatest players he has developed or enabled no longer will suffer him? He has no value.

 

[nwHawk]

Since the last 26 seasons show a pattern, I would not dismiss it as irrelevant.

Every year it feels like the Seahawks are a piece or two away from the super bowl. Very good, not excellent. The question has always been how to get over the hump and bring home another championship.

 

[OrangeGravy]

The statistics are interesting but irrelevant. Whether Wilson can make another SuperBowl is another argument. Because Wilson at least wants the chance to compete for it without one hand tied behind his back.

Carroll's archaic offense is enough to overcome. But since he is supposedly at least supposed to make it up with great defense? When the defense is average or below, he isn't making up for the incredible waste of effectiveness he is in almost every other area as a coach.

And it isn't about SuperBowls specifically.

The issue is playoff legacy not just SuperBowls.

Pete Carroll is destroying Wilson's success % in the playoffs with Pete's own idiocy.

He is locked into a style and philosophy that no longer works or even matters.

All it does is hold his own QB back.

And guess what?

When you pay your QB 1/5 of your cap, and make your entire franchise dependent on his success? Then you have no choice but to march to his tune. Period. The QB now gets a seat at the table, gets a vote, and gets to make decisions.

And the amusing thing is it won't matter.

Wilson now knows the power he holds. And he will exercise it. You can like it and reap the benefits. Or disdain it, resist it, and wallow in failure. Because hitching your wagon to Carroll is hitching your wagon to fading effectiveness, outdated philosophy, if not creeping senility.

Carroll had one value. He develops talent and he makes that talent love him. The moment the greatest players he has developed or enabled no longer will suffer him? He has no value.

You can like it and reap the benefits

Not guaranteed to reap benefits, but I agree that the mistake they made was paying him that much money. They should've traded him then.