Pretty clear

TwistedHusky · Oct 25, 2021

Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

Bigpumpkin · Oct 25, 2021

The worst of all is that we are in a complete downward spiral!

Danny Darko · Oct 25, 2021

without a good QB most coaches are in that scenario and Pete is the most successful coach in the franchise. Don't get me wrong, this needs to be his last year and he isn't what he used to be, but also most coaches would have stuck with Flynn and his contract instead of going with the talent... the problem is that's not the Pete we have anymore.

Keep Russ and JS and ditch possibly everyone else other than Solari (who's done what he could with the weird non spending on line- don't forget Pete has a big say on that).

John63 · Oct 25, 2021

TwistedHusky":1blr0g92 said:
Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

Fyi in the NFL as a HC without Wilson, PC is sub 500.

emurri · Oct 25, 2021

John63":1dewmlg1 said:
TwistedHusky":1dewmlg1 said:

Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

Click to expand...

Fyi in the NFL as a HC without Wilson, PC is sub 500.

Absolutely! Pete needs to go back to USC. Please God let it happen. And send John with him.

HawkRiderFan · Oct 25, 2021

I disagree that all teams would be in the same boat. This same opponent came in to Seattle 2 years ago without Drew Brees and Teddy Bridgwater starting and won convincingly. In fact they went 3-1 or something without Brees. The top coaches find a way.
Geno is struggling but we need other parts of our team to step. No bad situational awareness like launching at a QB with your helmet or jumping offside on a FG. Can't miss field goals.

The maddening thing about our playing calling was the one or two times when it would have made sense to be conservative...where losing yards either takes us out of FG range or makes it really long we don't get conservative and takes sacks. And I think it all starts cause paying attention to that stuff is not important to Pete. So it trickles down. You can get away with it when you are more talented than the other teams. Not any more

Shanegotyou11 · Oct 26, 2021

TwistedHusky":1vo6i5ha said:
Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

Dont look now but so is Bill at NE without Brady

Shanegotyou11 · Oct 26, 2021

HawkRiderFan":2obacxgi said:
I disagree that all teams would be in the same boat. This same opponent came in to Seattle 2 years ago without Drew Brees and Teddy Bridgwater starting and won convincingly. In fact they went 3-1 or something without Brees. The top coaches find a way.
Geno is struggling but we need other parts of our team to step. No bad situational awareness like launching at a QB with your helmet or jumping offside on a FG. Can't miss field goals.

The maddening thing about our playing calling was the one or two times when it would have made sense to be conservative...where losing yards either takes us out of FG range or makes it really long we don't get conservative and takes sacks. And I think it all starts cause paying attention to that stuff is not important to Pete. So it trickles down. You can get away with it when you are more talented than the other teams. Not any more

Bill is 12 games under .500 without Tom. PC is 14 without Russ.

John63 · Oct 26, 2021

Shanegotyou11":c6ufic0w said:
TwistedHusky":c6ufic0w said:

Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

Click to expand...

Dont look now but so is Bill at NE without Brady

Good but we are not talking about bill. We are talking about PC you know the coach who admitted without Wilson he would not be here. Huge difference.

John63 · Oct 26, 2021

Shanegotyou11":rgytrm6o said:
HawkRiderFan":rgytrm6o said:

I disagree that all teams would be in the same boat. This same opponent came in to Seattle 2 years ago without Drew Brees and Teddy Bridgwater starting and won convincingly. In fact they went 3-1 or something without Brees. The top coaches find a way.
Geno is struggling but we need other parts of our team to step. No bad situational awareness like launching at a QB with your helmet or jumping offside on a FG. Can't miss field goals.

The maddening thing about our playing calling was the one or two times when it would have made sense to be conservative...where losing yards either takes us out of FG range or makes it really long we don't get conservative and takes sacks. And I think it all starts cause paying attention to that stuff is not important to Pete. So it trickles down. You can get away with it when you are more talented than the other teams. Not any more

Click to expand...

Bill is 12 games under .500 without Tom. PC is 14 without Russ.

To bad we are not talking about Bill. We are talking g PC who admitted without Wilson he would not be here.

Northwest Seahawk · Oct 26, 2021

It's pretty clear Wilson's ability to evade the rush and throw on the run is best in NFL history this o-line is very very bad has been for years. It's also obvious Wilson did in fact carry the offense for the last 6 years. So where does that leave us , now that Pete and John's draft failure's have caused the steady decline of the franchise . I don't know this franchise is falling apart right now and there are no silver bullets .

WmHBonney · Oct 26, 2021

HawkRiderFan":1pbgb6fo said:
I disagree that all teams would be in the same boat. This same opponent came in to Seattle 2 years ago without Drew Brees and Teddy Bridgwater starting and won convincingly. In fact they went 3-1 or something without Brees. The top coaches find a way.
Geno is struggling but we need other parts of our team to step. No bad situational awareness like launching at a QB with your helmet or jumping offside on a FG. Can't miss field goals.

The maddening thing about our playing calling was the one or two times when it would have made sense to be conservative...where losing yards either takes us out of FG range or makes it really long we don't get conservative and takes sacks. And I think it all starts cause paying attention to that stuff is not important to Pete. So it trickles down. You can get away with it when you are more talented than the other teams. Not any more

Agreed. Other coaches adjust their game plan when using their backup QB. Pete does not. "Keep it close and use heroics to win at the end" doesn't work with a backup.

John63 · Oct 26, 2021

WmHBonney":2ieidgnh said:
HawkRiderFan":2ieidgnh said:

I disagree that all teams would be in the same boat. This same opponent came in to Seattle 2 years ago without Drew Brees and Teddy Bridgwater starting and won convincingly. In fact they went 3-1 or something without Brees. The top coaches find a way.
Geno is struggling but we need other parts of our team to step. No bad situational awareness like launching at a QB with your helmet or jumping offside on a FG. Can't miss field goals.

The maddening thing about our playing calling was the one or two times when it would have made sense to be conservative...where losing yards either takes us out of FG range or makes it really long we don't get conservative and takes sacks. And I think it all starts cause paying attention to that stuff is not important to Pete. So it trickles down. You can get away with it when you are more talented than the other teams. Not any more

Click to expand...

Agreed. Other coaches adjust their game plan when using their backup QB. Pete does not. "Keep it close and use heroics to win at the end" doesn't work with a backup.

Problem is that is his game plan eve with Wilson. keep it a close win, in the end, true hero ball that PC uses as part of his game plan and has admitted to. NO matter how you slice it PC is the problem. 1 never adjusting to anything, 2 not building around and for the talent, he has specifically HOF QB.

NCJag79 · Oct 26, 2021

At least with BB and Brady you got 6 Super Bowls. You got ONE SB and a stupid interception at the goal line of a winnable game of the second one with Carroll.

Shanegotyou11":30w0nlkz said:
HawkRiderFan":30w0nlkz said:

I disagree that all teams would be in the same boat. This same opponent came in to Seattle 2 years ago without Drew Brees and Teddy Bridgwater starting and won convincingly. In fact they went 3-1 or something without Brees. The top coaches find a way.
Geno is struggling but we need other parts of our team to step. No bad situational awareness like launching at a QB with your helmet or jumping offside on a FG. Can't miss field goals.

The maddening thing about our playing calling was the one or two times when it would have made sense to be conservative...where losing yards either takes us out of FG range or makes it really long we don't get conservative and takes sacks. And I think it all starts cause paying attention to that stuff is not important to Pete. So it trickles down. You can get away with it when you are more talented than the other teams. Not any more

Click to expand...

Bill is 12 games under .500 without Tom. PC is 14 without Russ.

John63 · Oct 26, 2021

NCJag79":32kyzajh said:
At least with BB and Brady you got 6 Super Bowls. You got ONE SB and a stupid interception at the goal line of a winnable game of the second one with Carroll.

Shanegotyou11":32kyzajh said:

HawkRiderFan":32kyzajh said:

I disagree that all teams would be in the same boat. This same opponent came in to Seattle 2 years ago without Drew Brees and Teddy Bridgwater starting and won convincingly. In fact they went 3-1 or something without Brees. The top coaches find a way.
Geno is struggling but we need other parts of our team to step. No bad situational awareness like launching at a QB with your helmet or jumping offside on a FG. Can't miss field goals.

The maddening thing about our playing calling was the one or two times when it would have made sense to be conservative...where losing yards either takes us out of FG range or makes it really long we don't get conservative and takes sacks. And I think it all starts cause paying attention to that stuff is not important to Pete. So it trickles down. You can get away with it when you are more talented than the other teams. Not any more

Click to expand...

Bill is 12 games under .500 without Tom. PC is 14 without Russ.

Click to expand...

You forgot a lead with 30 seconds or less left in the NFC only for the supposed best defense to give up the game.

Chapow · Oct 26, 2021

TwistedHusky":267immpm said:
Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

How about you post a list of all the Head Coaches that were highly successful without a franchise QB?

I am also ready to move on from Pete at this point, but this narrative that Pete deserves absolutely zero credit for any success this team has seen since he's been here is absurd.

John63 · Oct 26, 2021

Chapow":1o48pdlq said:
TwistedHusky":1o48pdlq said:

Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

Click to expand...

How about you post a list of all the Head Coaches that were highly successful without a franchise QB?

I am also ready to move on from Pete at this point, but this narrative that Pete deserves absolutely zero credit for any success this team has seen since he's been here is absurd.

Well since u want it how about u do it. I posted how Bill did when Brady did not play due to injury and suspension. I believe it was 11-4. Neither of the QBs were franchise qbs either. Heck one is not even in the NFL anymore. U saw how good the rams were with Goff and he is not a franchise qb. I can go on, but since u want it you should get it.

Chapow · Oct 26, 2021

John63":1l79p00z said:
Chapow":1l79p00z said:

TwistedHusky":1l79p00z said:

Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

Click to expand...

How about you post a list of all the Head Coaches that were highly successful without a franchise QB?

I am also ready to move on from Pete at this point, but this narrative that Pete deserves absolutely zero credit for any success this team has seen since he's been here is absurd.

Click to expand...

Well since u want it how about u do it. I posted how Bill did when Brady did not play due to injury and suspension. I believe it was 11-4. Neither of the QBs were franchise qbs either. Heck one is not even in the NFL anymore. U saw how good the rams were with Goff and he is not a franchise qb. I can go on, but since u want it you should get it.

As you already know, Belichick has a below .500 winning percentage as an NFL Head Coach without Brady, and I'm not sure that McVay qualifies as a highly successful Head Coach since he hasn't won a Super Bowl and the 1 time he made it to the Super Bowl his team scored a whopping 3 points.

But my point, that you are pretending to not get, is that Head Coaches in the NFL generally aren't very successful without a good/great QB, because QB is by far the most important position in football and it's nearly impossible to be consistently successful without a very good one.

So yeah, I agree that Carroll likely would have been a below .500 HC without Wilson. Just like how Belichick is a below .500 HC without Brady. It's not really a criticism, it's just how things generally work.

John63 · Oct 26, 2021

Chapow":1rr9n2pl said:
John63":1rr9n2pl said:

Chapow":1rr9n2pl said:

TwistedHusky":1rr9n2pl said:

Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

Click to expand...

How about you post a list of all the Head Coaches that were highly successful without a franchise QB?

I am also ready to move on from Pete at this point, but this narrative that Pete deserves absolutely zero credit for any success this team has seen since he's been here is absurd.

Click to expand...

Well since u want it how about u do it. I posted how Bill did when Brady did not play due to injury and suspension. I believe it was 11-4. Neither of the QBs were franchise qbs either. Heck one is not even in the NFL anymore. U saw how good the rams were with Goff and he is not a franchise qb. I can go on, but since u want it you should get it.

Click to expand...

As you already know, Belichick has a below .500 winning percentage as an NFL Head Coach without Brady, and I'm not sure that McVay qualifies as a highly successful Head Coach since he hasn't won a Super Bowl and the 1 time he made it to the Super Bowl his team scored a whopping 3 points.

But my point, that you are pretending to not get, is that Head Coaches in the NFL generally aren't very successful without a good/great QB, because QB is by far the most important position in football and it's nearly impossible to be consistently successful without a very good one.

So yeah, I agree that Carroll likely would have been a below .500 HC without Wilson. Just like how Belichick is a below .500 HC without Brady. It's not really a criticism, it's just how things generally work.

And what u aren't getting and I showed when bill did not have Brady for those 15 games he still found a way to go.11-4. Also Bill never said he just needs a qb to manage the game and not make mistakes. PC did. So when u say it back it up. PC can't. And he said it. Keep in mind he could have said if not for Wilson or another qb of his level. But he did not he said specifically Wilson. It's amazing the HC admits it but still you can't expect it. And again Goff us not a franchise QB and yet the rams were good with him.

chris98251 · Oct 26, 2021

Chapow":l67zxlmk said:
TwistedHusky":l67zxlmk said:

Carrol likely would have been a .500 or below coach without Wilson.

Without Scott AND Wilson, he probably would have washed out of the NFL.

He better send Wilson flowers every week, because of Wilson - people think he was a good coach.

Now we see Seattle without Wilson playing the Pete Carrol way.

It is garbage.

Click to expand...

How about you post a list of all the Head Coaches that were highly successful without a franchise QB?

I am also ready to move on from Pete at this point, but this narrative that Pete deserves absolutely zero credit for any success this team has seen since he's been here is absurd.

Since we are talking about what people call Franchise QB's Holmgren didn't do to bad with Hass, you know that guy in the Ring, or how about Knox both here and in LA.

That's just one team I know, or how about the Dolphins with Greise all the accolade went to Marino as a Franchise guy, in fact Shula got to the playoffs with some guy named Earl Morrall.

Then you have guys like Stabler, Bradshaw how people don't think are Franchise guys with Madden and Noll but hey............

They were recognized after the fact not while they played.

Pretty clear

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