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Wilson’s head is the issue not his finger

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  • pittpnthrs wrote:
    OrangeGravy wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:Yup.

    Was hoping the game tape was already posted but most likely won't be until tomorrow. Eager to look at a few plays

    I'd interested to know what he saw presnap that lead him to check into that double covered deep shot to DK


    The one where Metcalf dropped that was right in his hands? He probably saw his 6' 4" WR having an advantage over smaller secondary guys and wanted to give him a chance to make a play. Ball was right there and he dropped it like he does so many other times. If he would have caught the ball like he should, the play wouldnt even be brought up.


    i think his point was why take a play to a double covered WR way down field when you have an easier play elsewhere?

    The job of the QB is to quickly asses risk and reward, understand the situation, how many yards are needed and look at situations where if one of his WR is doubled, seeing where the open guy might be. Thats the entire plotline of criticism against Russ. Its the chess match that is football. take away one guy or two, leaves someone else open. You can critique DK for not making a highlight catch, or you can critique Russ for choosing to throw a ball that only gets caught if his guy make a highlight catch, when the chess play is finding what the defense just gave you.
    keasley45
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  • I'm all for giving DK some chances, but throwing a post into a single high safety has about as low chance of completion as you can get.
    Tical21
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:ImageScreenshot_20211124-105811_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    I added more arrows and bubbles to show you the assignments the safeties had on this play that they were committed to and were obvious the entire time. They were covering the areas of the field Russ goes 99% of the time regardless of the read... DK and Lockett outside and leaving the middle open.

    Dissly has covered 17 yards. The only safety capable of making the play has dropped 11 and is still dropping

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105909_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    This is as close as that safety would have been if the ball was thrown to Dissly if the ball was released when Dissly was 17 yards down field. This is of course hypothetical because the play was over by then. point being a safety running backward and outside wouldnt have had an angle to make this play at any point the pass could have been completed.


    So you ate saying they can't plant there foot and get to the ball in time for that throw? Deep safety is maybe five yards off hash where dissly is and other safety is probably 8 yards off opposite hash...your saying they wouldn't get there?


    yes. thats exactly what I'm saying. If Dissly isnt open on that play, then theres never in the hostory of theleague been a wr that is open. It takes energy to stop a back pedal and close on a guy thats running full speed. Its not as though the safety was over the top of Dissly. if he was, I'd give it to you and say yeah. Risky, because for every step Dissly makes he's running into coverage. but the safety is moving upfield and away and his priority is being able to close on Lockett... hes fading that way and has surrendered the middle because if he plays the middle he knows Russ hits Lockett. He's caught in between two routes and would have to see the ball coming out before he even makes the decision of which way to go. no wayhe makes that play. But Russ wanted Lockett, which is why when he sees the safety fading outside to double Lockett, he pulled the ball down.

    This is obvious and what Russ does over and over. His first read which is Lockett is covered. This he could have seen pretty quickly from the snap becuase the safety is constantly moving that direction and with every step, leaving Dissly more and more open. And Russ leaves it.
    keasley45
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Omg no. You are going back and forth between your pics.
    Throw with anticipation and safety will turn and drop on it because it is not going to be a laser. Both safeties are watching russ the whole time.

    The laser I'm talking about is the pic from behind russ showing dissly going open in-between three linebackers. A laser may work there because lb going to cover Collins is breaking back and out.

    You loft the pass over the lbs I gurantee you one safety drops onto it which is what happened. Safety right was going deep and stopped, turned and faced russ leaning toward middle pass to dissly. The safety your calling flat footed is going deep with lockett, but also leaning middle pass on dissly while back pedaling.

    Your underrating coverages and game speeds of players on a freeze frame.

    The whole time russ is looking dissly...doesn't see Collins and doesn't see blitz from right. Chandler got there in an instant. However, Russ could have gone second or third read and got ball out. Dissly was not open. Your talking one te in the middle of 5(3 lbs and 2 safeties).


    Bro, i put in yellow arrows to show you where the safeties went. They were moving away from the play the entire time. AWAY. There's NO way on God's green earth that either of those safeties make the play. They would have to literally be not of this earth to do so. Its not physically possible. They are dropping to outside coverage leaving WHAT wide open? The middle.

    The safeties were fading backward at nearly the same pace Dissly was running forward. Scroll to the top. Im not underrating anything. If the play was as close to being covered as you claim i wouldnt even had called it out.


    And the thing you say about throwing with anticipation doesn't really make sense. A throw with anticipation is exactly the thing that gets passes completed in even great coverage (which this play was actually beatable coverage) because the defenders dont get a jump on a wr because by the time they are immediately open, the ball is on the way. And again, thats the point. You watch the Bucs, the Chargers, The Rams, GB, Dallas, KC... you watch ANY of those offenses run and you will see balls being squeezed between zones, over zones, to a wr just coming out of his break when the defender is in tight man... because the QB pulls the trigger based on reading the coverage and knows where to put the ball precisely when the player will be open. The ball should have been in Dissly's hands 2 steps after he turned around. It wasnt a hard throw, didnt have to be a laser. The LB was beat, the other lb to that side was covering everett to Russ left, and the LB to the right of the play was scrambling to cover Collins.
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  • The pass would have been a standard type pass not a high arc, not a laser since he was going away, pass was easy, catch going away was harder he would have had to look the ball into his hands, that was all.

    Ball is in the air a couple seconds really, not enough time for a defender to change direction and come up and make a play on it.
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Omg no. You are going back and forth between your pics.
    Throw with anticipation and safety will turn and drop on it because it is not going to be a laser. Both safeties are watching russ the whole time.

    The laser I'm talking about is the pic from behind russ showing dissly going open in-between three linebackers. A laser may work there because lb going to cover Collins is breaking back and out.

    You loft the pass over the lbs I gurantee you one safety drops onto it which is what happened. Safety right was going deep and stopped, turned and faced russ leaning toward middle pass to dissly. The safety your calling flat footed is going deep with lockett, but also leaning middle pass on dissly while back pedaling.

    Your underrating coverages and game speeds of players on a freeze frame.

    The whole time russ is looking dissly...doesn't see Collins and doesn't see blitz from right. Chandler got there in an instant. However, Russ could have gone second or third read and got ball out. Dissly was not open. Your talking one te in the middle of 5(3 lbs and 2 safeties).


    Bro, i put in yellow arrows to show you where the safeties went. They were moving away from the play the entire time. AWAY. There's NO way on God's green earth that either of those safeties make the play. They would have to literally be not of this earth to do so. Its not physically possible. They are dropping to outside coverage leaving WHAT wide open? The middle.

    The safeties were fading backward at nearly the same pace Dissly was running forward. Scroll to the top. Im not underrating anything. If the play was as close to being covered as you claim i wouldnt even had called it out.


    And the thing you say about throwing with anticipation doesn't really make sense. A throw with anticipation is exactly the thing that gets passes completed in even great coverage (which this play was actually beatable coverage) because the defenders dont get a jump on a wr because by the time they are immediately open, the ball is on the way. And again, thats the point. You watch the Bucs, the Chargers, The Rams, GB, Dallas, KC... you watch ANY of those offenses run and you will see balls being squeezed between zones, over zones, to a wr just coming out of his break when the defender is in tight man... because the QB pulls the trigger based on reading the coverage and knows where to put the ball precisely when the player will be open. The ball should have been in Dissly's hands 2 steps after he turned around. It wasnt a hard throw, didnt have to be a laser. The LB was beat, the other lb to that side was covering everett to Russ left, and the LB to the right of the play was scrambling to cover Collins.


    And he didn't pull the trigger on this play. Which indicates he didn't think dissly was open. Just because you think he was in hindsight looking at freeze frames doesn't mean he did. within the matter of milliseconds it takes to make that play he didn't think so...you would rather him throw the pick so you have an actual reason to b!@ch.

    Dissly was safety squeezed with linebackers underneath and you are saying he would have been wide open. No. Safeties are better athletes then you give them credit for and the one thing you are ignoring is what russ actually sees and feels sitting in the pocket. I gurantee this whole play happened in less than 4 seconds from snap to sack. One because Collins was barely open by the time sack happened and dissly ran a straight go. Safeties started in cover two and no gurantee from presnap which direction they would go.

    You are assuming dissly running directly into 3 lbs and passed into 2 Safeties that he is open. Your wrong. In the two seconds he reads that Chandler Jones is already in the backfield as soon as russ hits back foot. That is clear in picture. Then your saying he saw lockett, not open, dissly not open so he should have stepped up and ran with probably less than 1 sec to sacked. Doesn't happen man.

    Again, overly critical of 1 player vs everything that is breaking down.
    jamescasey1124
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Omg no. You are going back and forth between your pics.
    Throw with anticipation and safety will turn and drop on it because it is not going to be a laser. Both safeties are watching russ the whole time.

    The laser I'm talking about is the pic from behind russ showing dissly going open in-between three linebackers. A laser may work there because lb going to cover Collins is breaking back and out.

    You loft the pass over the lbs I gurantee you one safety drops onto it which is what happened. Safety right was going deep and stopped, turned and faced russ leaning toward middle pass to dissly. The safety your calling flat footed is going deep with lockett, but also leaning middle pass on dissly while back pedaling.

    Your underrating coverages and game speeds of players on a freeze frame.

    The whole time russ is looking dissly...doesn't see Collins and doesn't see blitz from right. Chandler got there in an instant. However, Russ could have gone second or third read and got ball out. Dissly was not open. Your talking one te in the middle of 5(3 lbs and 2 safeties).


    Bro, i put in yellow arrows to show you where the safeties went. They were moving away from the play the entire time. AWAY. There's NO way on God's green earth that either of those safeties make the play. They would have to literally be not of this earth to do so. Its not physically possible. They are dropping to outside coverage leaving WHAT wide open? The middle.

    The safeties were fading backward at nearly the same pace Dissly was running forward. Scroll to the top. Im not underrating anything. If the play was as close to being covered as you claim i wouldnt even had called it out.


    And the thing you say about throwing with anticipation doesn't really make sense. A throw with anticipation is exactly the thing that gets passes completed in even great coverage (which this play was actually beatable coverage) because the defenders dont get a jump on a wr because by the time they are immediately open, the ball is on the way. And again, thats the point. You watch the Bucs, the Chargers, The Rams, GB, Dallas, KC... you watch ANY of those offenses run and you will see balls being squeezed between zones, over zones, to a wr just coming out of his break when the defender is in tight man... because the QB pulls the trigger based on reading the coverage and knows where to put the ball precisely when the player will be open. The ball should have been in Dissly's hands 2 steps after he turned around. It wasnt a hard throw, didnt have to be a laser. The LB was beat, the other lb to that side was covering everett to Russ left, and the LB to the right of the play was scrambling to cover Collins.


    And he didn't pull the trigger on this play. Which indicates he didn't think dissly was open. Just because you think he was in hindsight looking at freeze frames doesn't mean he did. within the matter of milliseconds it takes to make that play he didn't think so...you would rather him throw the pick so you have an actual reason to b!@ch.

    Dissly was safety squeezed with linebackers underneath and you are saying he would have been wide open. No. Safeties are better athletes then you give them credit for and the one thing you are ignoring is what russ actually sees and feels sitting in the pocket. I gurantee this whole play happened in less than 4 seconds from snap to sack. One because Collins was barely open by the time sack happened and dissly ran a straight go. Safeties started in cover two and no gurantee from presnap which direction they would go.

    You are assuming dissly running directly into 3 lbs and passed into 2 Safeties that he is open. Your wrong. In the two seconds he reads that Chandler Jones is already in the backfield as soon as russ hits back foot. That is clear in picture. Then your saying he saw lockett, not open, dissly not open so he should have stepped up and ran with probably less than 1 sec to sacked. Doesn't happen man.

    Again, overly critical of 1 player vs everything that is breaking down.


    You said it he didn't think he was open, the real issue is he didn't trust the player or himself to make the throw and may have a turnover if Dissly misplayed the ball and tipped it up, he over through it somehow. That has been his issue no matter the receiver. Thats wide ass open for any QB of worth other then Wilson.
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:Omg no. You are going back and forth between your pics.
    Throw with anticipation and safety will turn and drop on it because it is not going to be a laser. Both safeties are watching russ the whole time.

    The laser I'm talking about is the pic from behind russ showing dissly going open in-between three linebackers. A laser may work there because lb going to cover Collins is breaking back and out.

    You loft the pass over the lbs I gurantee you one safety drops onto it which is what happened. Safety right was going deep and stopped, turned and faced russ leaning toward middle pass to dissly. The safety your calling flat footed is going deep with lockett, but also leaning middle pass on dissly while back pedaling.

    Your underrating coverages and game speeds of players on a freeze frame.

    The whole time russ is looking dissly...doesn't see Collins and doesn't see blitz from right. Chandler got there in an instant. However, Russ could have gone second or third read and got ball out. Dissly was not open. Your talking one te in the middle of 5(3 lbs and 2 safeties).


    Bro, i put in yellow arrows to show you where the safeties went. They were moving away from the play the entire time. AWAY. There's NO way on God's green earth that either of those safeties make the play. They would have to literally be not of this earth to do so. Its not physically possible. They are dropping to outside coverage leaving WHAT wide open? The middle.

    The safeties were fading backward at nearly the same pace Dissly was running forward. Scroll to the top. Im not underrating anything. If the play was as close to being covered as you claim i wouldnt even had called it out.


    And the thing you say about throwing with anticipation doesn't really make sense. A throw with anticipation is exactly the thing that gets passes completed in even great coverage (which this play was actually beatable coverage) because the defenders dont get a jump on a wr because by the time they are immediately open, the ball is on the way. And again, thats the point. You watch the Bucs, the Chargers, The Rams, GB, Dallas, KC... you watch ANY of those offenses run and you will see balls being squeezed between zones, over zones, to a wr just coming out of his break when the defender is in tight man... because the QB pulls the trigger based on reading the coverage and knows where to put the ball precisely when the player will be open. The ball should have been in Dissly's hands 2 steps after he turned around. It wasnt a hard throw, didnt have to be a laser. The LB was beat, the other lb to that side was covering everett to Russ left, and the LB to the right of the play was scrambling to cover Collins.


    And he didn't pull the trigger on this play. Which indicates he didn't think dissly was open. Just because you think he was in hindsight looking at freeze frames doesn't mean he did. within the matter of milliseconds it takes to make that play he didn't think so...you would rather him throw the pick so you have an actual reason to b!@ch.

    Dissly was safety squeezed with linebackers underneath and you are saying he would have been wide open. No. Safeties are better athletes then you give them credit for and the one thing you are ignoring is what russ actually sees and feels sitting in the pocket. I gurantee this whole play happened in less than 4 seconds from snap to sack. One because Collins was barely open by the time sack happened and dissly ran a straight go. Safeties started in cover two and no gurantee from presnap which direction they would go.

    You are assuming dissly running directly into 3 lbs and passed into 2 Safeties that he is open. Your wrong. In the two seconds he reads that Chandler Jones is already in the backfield as soon as russ hits back foot. That is clear in picture. Then your saying he saw lockett, not open, dissly not open so he should have stepped up and ran with probably less than 1 sec to sacked. Doesn't happen man.

    Again, overly critical of 1 player vs everything that is breaking down.


    This is not to mention over-critical of one player when other players of the same position do it too but they are okay to do it.
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  • What you are also not looking at is the drop step wilson took. Is that play design or do you think he did that himself?
    Gurantee it is designed because they practice formational plays where they have dedicated amount of drop steps. 3 5 and 7. Not Russell's fault Chandler Jones beat him there. Cards ran a good defensive play. Also Chandler timed that up really well. I would suspect there is another problem. You don't see that though and everything is Russell's reads or mis-reads.
    jamescasey1124
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  • John63 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    Bro, i put in yellow arrows to show you where the safeties went. They were moving away from the play the entire time. AWAY. There's NO way on God's green earth that either of those safeties make the play. They would have to literally be not of this earth to do so. Its not physically possible. They are dropping to outside coverage leaving WHAT wide open? The middle.

    The safeties were fading backward at nearly the same pace Dissly was running forward. Scroll to the top. Im not underrating anything. If the play was as close to being covered as you claim i wouldnt even had called it out.


    And the thing you say about throwing with anticipation doesn't really make sense. A throw with anticipation is exactly the thing that gets passes completed in even great coverage (which this play was actually beatable coverage) because the defenders dont get a jump on a wr because by the time they are immediately open, the ball is on the way. And again, thats the point. You watch the Bucs, the Chargers, The Rams, GB, Dallas, KC... you watch ANY of those offenses run and you will see balls being squeezed between zones, over zones, to a wr just coming out of his break when the defender is in tight man... because the QB pulls the trigger based on reading the coverage and knows where to put the ball precisely when the player will be open. The ball should have been in Dissly's hands 2 steps after he turned around. It wasnt a hard throw, didnt have to be a laser. The LB was beat, the other lb to that side was covering everett to Russ left, and the LB to the right of the play was scrambling to cover Collins.


    And he didn't pull the trigger on this play. Which indicates he didn't think dissly was open. Just because you think he was in hindsight looking at freeze frames doesn't mean he did. within the matter of milliseconds it takes to make that play he didn't think so...you would rather him throw the pick so you have an actual reason to b!@ch.

    Dissly was safety squeezed with linebackers underneath and you are saying he would have been wide open. No. Safeties are better athletes then you give them credit for and the one thing you are ignoring is what russ actually sees and feels sitting in the pocket. I gurantee this whole play happened in less than 4 seconds from snap to sack. One because Collins was barely open by the time sack happened and dissly ran a straight go. Safeties started in cover two and no gurantee from presnap which direction they would go.

    You are assuming dissly running directly into 3 lbs and passed into 2 Safeties that he is open. Your wrong. In the two seconds he reads that Chandler Jones is already in the backfield as soon as russ hits back foot. That is clear in picture. Then your saying he saw lockett, not open, dissly not open so he should have stepped up and ran with probably less than 1 sec to sacked. Doesn't happen man.

    Again, overly critical of 1 player vs everything that is breaking down.


    This is not to mention over-critical of one player when other players of the same position do it too but they are okay to do it.


    I don't care if kyler Murray or anybody else can't make that throw. He's not our franchise qb.
    keasley45
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  • chris98251 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    Bro, i put in yellow arrows to show you where the safeties went. They were moving away from the play the entire time. AWAY. There's NO way on God's green earth that either of those safeties make the play. They would have to literally be not of this earth to do so. Its not physically possible. They are dropping to outside coverage leaving WHAT wide open? The middle.

    The safeties were fading backward at nearly the same pace Dissly was running forward. Scroll to the top. Im not underrating anything. If the play was as close to being covered as you claim i wouldnt even had called it out.


    And the thing you say about throwing with anticipation doesn't really make sense. A throw with anticipation is exactly the thing that gets passes completed in even great coverage (which this play was actually beatable coverage) because the defenders dont get a jump on a wr because by the time they are immediately open, the ball is on the way. And again, thats the point. You watch the Bucs, the Chargers, The Rams, GB, Dallas, KC... you watch ANY of those offenses run and you will see balls being squeezed between zones, over zones, to a wr just coming out of his break when the defender is in tight man... because the QB pulls the trigger based on reading the coverage and knows where to put the ball precisely when the player will be open. The ball should have been in Dissly's hands 2 steps after he turned around. It wasnt a hard throw, didnt have to be a laser. The LB was beat, the other lb to that side was covering everett to Russ left, and the LB to the right of the play was scrambling to cover Collins.


    And he didn't pull the trigger on this play. Which indicates he didn't think dissly was open. Just because you think he was in hindsight looking at freeze frames doesn't mean he did. within the matter of milliseconds it takes to make that play he didn't think so...you would rather him throw the pick so you have an actual reason to b!@ch.

    Dissly was safety squeezed with linebackers underneath and you are saying he would have been wide open. No. Safeties are better athletes then you give them credit for and the one thing you are ignoring is what russ actually sees and feels sitting in the pocket. I gurantee this whole play happened in less than 4 seconds from snap to sack. One because Collins was barely open by the time sack happened and dissly ran a straight go. Safeties started in cover two and no gurantee from presnap which direction they would go.

    You are assuming dissly running directly into 3 lbs and passed into 2 Safeties that he is open. Your wrong. In the two seconds he reads that Chandler Jones is already in the backfield as soon as russ hits back foot. That is clear in picture. Then your saying he saw lockett, not open, dissly not open so he should have stepped up and ran with probably less than 1 sec to sacked. Doesn't happen man.

    Again, overly critical of 1 player vs everything that is breaking down.


    You said it he didn't think he was open, the real issue is he didn't trust the player or himself to make the throw and may have a turnover if Dissly misplayed the ball and tipped it up, he over through it somehow. That has been his issue no matter the receiver. Thats wide ass open for any QB of worth other then Wilson.


    No it's not in the time given. Didnt trust himself? Really to throw a potential 5050. Your right...I would have held it too. Besides no one on the hawks this year has show they can easily win a jump ball. Wonder why he questions those throws.
    jamescasey1124
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    John63 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    And the thing you say about throwing with anticipation doesn't really make sense. A throw with anticipation is exactly the thing that gets passes completed in even great coverage (which this play was actually beatable coverage) because the defenders dont get a jump on a wr because by the time they are immediately open, the ball is on the way. And again, thats the point. You watch the Bucs, the Chargers, The Rams, GB, Dallas, KC... you watch ANY of those offenses run and you will see balls being squeezed between zones, over zones, to a wr just coming out of his break when the defender is in tight man... because the QB pulls the trigger based on reading the coverage and knows where to put the ball precisely when the player will be open. The ball should have been in Dissly's hands 2 steps after he turned around. It wasnt a hard throw, didnt have to be a laser. The LB was beat, the other lb to that side was covering everett to Russ left, and the LB to the right of the play was scrambling to cover Collins.


    And he didn't pull the trigger on this play. Which indicates he didn't think dissly was open. Just because you think he was in hindsight looking at freeze frames doesn't mean he did. within the matter of milliseconds it takes to make that play he didn't think so...you would rather him throw the pick so you have an actual reason to b!@ch.

    Dissly was safety squeezed with linebackers underneath and you are saying he would have been wide open. No. Safeties are better athletes then you give them credit for and the one thing you are ignoring is what russ actually sees and feels sitting in the pocket. I gurantee this whole play happened in less than 4 seconds from snap to sack. One because Collins was barely open by the time sack happened and dissly ran a straight go. Safeties started in cover two and no gurantee from presnap which direction they would go.

    You are assuming dissly running directly into 3 lbs and passed into 2 Safeties that he is open. Your wrong. In the two seconds he reads that Chandler Jones is already in the backfield as soon as russ hits back foot. That is clear in picture. Then your saying he saw lockett, not open, dissly not open so he should have stepped up and ran with probably less than 1 sec to sacked. Doesn't happen man.

    Again, overly critical of 1 player vs everything that is breaking down.


    This is not to mention over-critical of one player when other players of the same position do it too but they are okay to do it.


    I don't care if kyler Murray or anybody else can't make that throw. He's not our franchise qb.


    It's not just kyler. The only qb that makes this throw you are talking about is rodgers. Maybe. Even then it is questionable and it would have to be d. Adams running the route and not a slower dissly.
    jamescasey1124
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:What you are also not looking at is the drop step wilson took. Is that play design or do you think he did that himself?
    Gurantee it is designed because they practice formational plays where they have dedicated amount of drop steps. 3 5 and 7. Not Russell's fault Chandler Jones beat him there. Cards ran a good defensive play. Also Chandler timed that up really well. I would suspect there is another problem. You don't see that though and everything is Russell's reads or mis-reads.


    I think I mentioned that A. If the qb reads a defense and in the first steps back sees a wr is going to be open he can modify his drop to hit the play - Anticipation. The notion that a qb is going to forego a gimme play because coach said to take a 5 step drop is absurd and it wasn't that. AND Russ's read despite the safety dropping g wide and Dissly breaking free right away was Lockett. When that was covered, play was over. Obvious read was Dissly as soon as the safety over Dissly fades outside. LITERALLY FOOTBALLE 101. B the pocket was an easy read, step up and right and the field is open to Dissly still or Collins.

    And honestly, if Russ can't make that read and sees it as being as difficult as you do, there's no hope for this offense or this team.
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    John63 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    And he didn't pull the trigger on this play. Which indicates he didn't think dissly was open. Just because you think he was in hindsight looking at freeze frames doesn't mean he did. within the matter of milliseconds it takes to make that play he didn't think so...you would rather him throw the pick so you have an actual reason to b!@ch.

    Dissly was safety squeezed with linebackers underneath and you are saying he would have been wide open. No. Safeties are better athletes then you give them credit for and the one thing you are ignoring is what russ actually sees and feels sitting in the pocket. I gurantee this whole play happened in less than 4 seconds from snap to sack. One because Collins was barely open by the time sack happened and dissly ran a straight go. Safeties started in cover two and no gurantee from presnap which direction they would go.

    You are assuming dissly running directly into 3 lbs and passed into 2 Safeties that he is open. Your wrong. In the two seconds he reads that Chandler Jones is already in the backfield as soon as russ hits back foot. That is clear in picture. Then your saying he saw lockett, not open, dissly not open so he should have stepped up and ran with probably less than 1 sec to sacked. Doesn't happen man.

    Again, overly critical of 1 player vs everything that is breaking down.


    This is not to mention over-critical of one player when other players of the same position do it too but they are okay to do it.


    I don't care if kyler Murray or anybody else can't make that throw. He's not our franchise qb.


    It's not just kyler. The only qb that makes this throw you are talking about is rodgers. Maybe. Even then it is questionable and it would have to be d. Adams running the route and not a slower dissly.


    Are you kidding?? You're turning a gimme read and a gimme throw into something only 1 qb in the league can make??

    LMAO.
    keasley45
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    John63 wrote:
    This is not to mention over-critical of one player when other players of the same position do it too but they are okay to do it.


    I don't care if kyler Murray or anybody else can't make that throw. He's not our franchise qb.


    It's not just kyler. The only qb that makes this throw you are talking about is rodgers. Maybe. Even then it is questionable and it would have to be d. Adams running the route and not a slower dissly.


    Are you kidding?? You're turning a gimme read and a gimme throw into something only 1 qb in the league can make??

    LMAO.


    You claim THIS PLAY IS COVERED AND RISKY AND THEN IM SURE WILL DEFEND THE BS PASSES INTO OBVIOUS SOUBLE COVERAGE. Over and over and over.

    LMAO
    keasley45
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  • Again, the qb that routinely throws balls that have incredibly low chances of completion at times, and has his fans rally to his defense, looks at this throw and thinks it's too hard.

    That's a problem.

    Forget the fact that the read was simple as soon as the safety moved outside and Dissly didnt have anyone in front of him within 20 yards.
    keasley45
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:What you are also not looking at is the drop step wilson took. Is that play design or do you think he did that himself?
    Gurantee it is designed because they practice formational plays where they have dedicated amount of drop steps. 3 5 and 7. Not Russell's fault Chandler Jones beat him there. Cards ran a good defensive play. Also Chandler timed that up really well. I would suspect there is another problem. You don't see that though and everything is Russell's reads or mis-reads.


    I think I mentioned that A. If the qb reads a defense and in the first steps back sees a wr is going to be open he can modify his drop to hit the play - Anticipation. The notion that a qb is going to forego a gimme play because coach said to take a 5 step drop is absurd and it wasn't that. AND Russ's read despite the safety dropping g wide and Dissly breaking free right away was Lockett. When that was covered, play was over. Obvious read was Dissly as soon as the safety over Dissly fades outside. LITERALLY FOOTBALLE 101. B the pocket was an easy read, step up and right and the field is open to Dissly still or Collins.

    And honestly, if Russ can't make that read and sees it as being as difficult as you do, there's no hope for this offense or this team.



    Nah...its more of because he doesn't make dumb decisions like you. Will take a sack over turnover and doesn't throw plays you wish he would in hindsight. Doesn't matter man...you going to believe what you want and not what is reality. Your talking about modifying drop steps in the middle of looking at a completely different reciever. Oh yeah cuz that makes sense. Supposedly modify a drop step to reciever your not even looking for. Hmmm...seems funny. I guess no one wants to be wrong huh.
    jamescasey1124
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  • keasley45 wrote:Again, the qb that routinely throws balls that have incredibly low chances of completion at times, and has his fans rally to his defense, looks at this throw and thinks it's too hard.

    That's a problem.

    Forget the fact that the read was simple as soon as the safety moved outside and Dissly didnt have anyone in front of him within 20 yards.


    I've already proved safeties were within 20 yards. You can stop saying that. The pass itself would have be 20 yards if it was completed to dissly and your saying the safeties weren't with in 20 yards? Well that would put them on the sidelines homie. Your just wrong dude. Accept this L.
    jamescasey1124
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  • LTH wrote:
    12th Dimension wrote:He had a bad game. It happens. His mental mistakes far outweighed his physical issues.

    Even with all that, I thought it was a game we had a chance to win.



    Well the way I see it is that this was gthe issue last year... Russ just has this thing to where he wants to be a gun slinger and he is forcing balls into double coverage not because he is being selfish its because he believes he can make the play and Defenses have adjusted to him but he keeps throwing into double coverage and throwing INT's instead of taking what the D gives him and forcing the D to adjust to him again... The big plays will happen if he is patient but he is not.. he needs to wait until he gets a one on one with Metcalf or Lockett and that's not going to happen unless he adjusts to what the D is doing...


    People want to blame Carroll but its not Carroll or Waldron it's the decisions Russ is making... Geno is not as good a QB as Russ physically but I think he would have had a better game than Russ did purely because of his decision making...



    LTH


    ^^^^THIS^^^^
    I've been saying this for a LONG time. Wilson is a backyard gun slinging QB. He doesn't know how to and is very very bad at reading a defense and making the right decisions. He can't pick a defense apart whatsoever and his foot speed is sloppy and extremely bad. These are staples to operating a west coast offense properly. Look at Montana in SB23. A 1:53 left on the clock and drove that niners team down the field 90 something yards and pick that defense apart without throwing a single pass over 20 yards and scored the winning touchdown to Taylor on a slant route. That's a west coast QB in a west coast offense and that's what Wilson should be doing. Instead Wilson drops back a million miles and just chucks it up to the furthest WR in double coverage with guys clearly open in the flat and in the middle of the field. The other issue is that Wilson is very religious and thinks all things are possible through Christ, well he needs to have a sit down the Jesus and re-evaluate.
    hawks85
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:Again, the qb that routinely throws balls that have incredibly low chances of completion at times, and has his fans rally to his defense, looks at this throw and thinks it's too hard.

    That's a problem.

    Forget the fact that the read was simple as soon as the safety moved outside and Dissly didnt have anyone in front of him within 20 yards.


    I've already proved safeties were within 20 yards. You can stop saying that. The pass itself would have be 20 yards if it was completed to dissly and your saying the safeties weren't with in 20 yards? Well that would put them on the sidelines homie. Your just wrong dude. Accept this L.


    I said in front of him. Clearly. Point to the player that's even 30 yards in front of him on the line he's running.
    keasley45
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  • hawks85 wrote:
    LTH wrote:
    12th Dimension wrote:He had a bad game. It happens. His mental mistakes far outweighed his physical issues.

    Even with all that, I thought it was a game we had a chance to win.



    Well the way I see it is that this was gthe issue last year... Russ just has this thing to where he wants to be a gun slinger and he is forcing balls into double coverage not because he is being selfish its because he believes he can make the play and Defenses have adjusted to him but he keeps throwing into double coverage and throwing INT's instead of taking what the D gives him and forcing the D to adjust to him again... The big plays will happen if he is patient but he is not.. he needs to wait until he gets a one on one with Metcalf or Lockett and that's not going to happen unless he adjusts to what the D is doing...


    People want to blame Carroll but its not Carroll or Waldron it's the decisions Russ is making... Geno is not as good a QB as Russ physically but I think he would have had a better game than Russ did purely because of his decision making...



    LTH


    ^^^^THIS^^^^
    I've been saying this for a LONG time. Wilson is a backyard gun slinging QB. He doesn't know how to and is very very bad at reading a defense and making the right decisions. He can't pick a defense apart whatsoever and his foot speed is sloppy and extremely bad. These are staples to operating a west coast offense properly. Look at Montana in SB23. A 1:53 left on the clock and drove that niners team down the field 90 something yards and pick that defense apart without throwing a single pass over 20 yards and scored the winning touchdown to Taylor on a slant route. That's a west coast QB in a west coast offense and that's what Wilson should be doing. Instead Wilson drops back a million miles and just chucks it up to the furthest WR in double coverage with guys clearly open in the flat and in the middle of the field. The other issue is that Wilson is very religious and thinks all things are possible through Christ, well he needs to have a sit down the Jesus and re-evaluate.


    Two problems with this...

    Who said seahawks were west coast offense? Are you saying russ has never picked a defense apart?
    jamescasey1124
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  • hawks85 wrote:
    LTH wrote:
    12th Dimension wrote:He had a bad game. It happens. His mental mistakes far outweighed his physical issues.

    Even with all that, I thought it was a game we had a chance to win.



    Well the way I see it is that this was gthe issue last year... Russ just has this thing to where he wants to be a gun slinger and he is forcing balls into double coverage not because he is being selfish its because he believes he can make the play and Defenses have adjusted to him but he keeps throwing into double coverage and throwing INT's instead of taking what the D gives him and forcing the D to adjust to him again... The big plays will happen if he is patient but he is not.. he needs to wait until he gets a one on one with Metcalf or Lockett and that's not going to happen unless he adjusts to what the D is doing...


    People want to blame Carroll but its not Carroll or Waldron it's the decisions Russ is making... Geno is not as good a QB as Russ physically but I think he would have had a better game than Russ did purely because of his decision making...



    LTH


    ^^^^THIS^^^^
    I've been saying this for a LONG time. Wilson is a backyard gun slinging QB. He doesn't know how to and is very very bad at reading a defense and making the right decisions. He can't pick a defense apart whatsoever and his foot speed is sloppy and extremely bad. These are staples to operating a west coast offense properly. Look at Montana in SB23. A 1:53 left on the clock and drove that niners team down the field 90 something yards and pick that defense apart without throwing a single pass over 20 yards and scored the winning touchdown to Taylor on a slant route. That's a west coast QB in a west coast offense and that's what Wilson should be doing. Instead Wilson drops back a million miles and just chucks it up to the furthest WR in double coverage with guys clearly open in the flat and in the middle of the field. The other issue is that Wilson is very religious and thinks all things are possible through Christ, well he needs to have a sit down the Jesus and re-evaluate.


    That's exactly what he did on the play to DK later in the game. Dropped back 10 yards. Stood their patting the ball. Had two WR deep, both doubled, and chucked it anyway when he had his RB in the flat with yards and yards of space in front of him.

    Bit the throw 50 yards downfield to a bracketed DK
    He's OK with, and the gimme read and gimme throw to Dissly is hard.

    You literally can't even have a logical conversation about basic football...
    keasley45
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    hawks85 wrote:
    LTH wrote:
    12th Dimension wrote:He had a bad game. It happens. His mental mistakes far outweighed his physical issues.

    Even with all that, I thought it was a game we had a chance to win.



    Well the way I see it is that this was gthe issue last year... Russ just has this thing to where he wants to be a gun slinger and he is forcing balls into double coverage not because he is being selfish its because he believes he can make the play and Defenses have adjusted to him but he keeps throwing into double coverage and throwing INT's instead of taking what the D gives him and forcing the D to adjust to him again... The big plays will happen if he is patient but he is not.. he needs to wait until he gets a one on one with Metcalf or Lockett and that's not going to happen unless he adjusts to what the D is doing...


    People want to blame Carroll but its not Carroll or Waldron it's the decisions Russ is making... Geno is not as good a QB as Russ physically but I think he would have had a better game than Russ did purely because of his decision making...



    LTH


    ^^^^THIS^^^^
    I've been saying this for a LONG time. Wilson is a backyard gun slinging QB. He doesn't know how to and is very very bad at reading a defense and making the right decisions. He can't pick a defense apart whatsoever and his foot speed is sloppy and extremely bad. These are staples to operating a west coast offense properly. Look at Montana in SB23. A 1:53 left on the clock and drove that niners team down the field 90 something yards and pick that defense apart without throwing a single pass over 20 yards and scored the winning touchdown to Taylor on a slant route. That's a west coast QB in a west coast offense and that's what Wilson should be doing. Instead Wilson drops back a million miles and just chucks it up to the furthest WR in double coverage with guys clearly open in the flat and in the middle of the field. The other issue is that Wilson is very religious and thinks all things are possible through Christ, well he needs to have a sit down the Jesus and re-evaluate.


    That's exactly what he did on the play to DK later in the game. Dropped back 10 yards. Stood their patting the ball. Had two WR deep, both doubled, and chucked it anyway when he had his RB in the flat with yards and yards of space in front of him.

    Bit the throw 50 yards downfield to a bracketed DK
    He's OK with, and the gimme read and gimme throw to Dissly is hard.

    You literally can't even have a logical conversation about basic football...


    Your an idiot. That is a given.

    Throw up a 5050 ball...who to chose from...dk...supposedly big and fast compared to megatron(not)...or dissly who had a ball bounce off bare hands 10 yards away facing russ?
    Good choice. You take dissly. All go dk. Unfortunately we both lose because again no wr on this team makes contested catches.
    jamescasey1124
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:What you are also not looking at is the drop step wilson took. Is that play design or do you think he did that himself?
    Gurantee it is designed because they practice formational plays where they have dedicated amount of drop steps. 3 5 and 7. Not Russell's fault Chandler Jones beat him there. Cards ran a good defensive play. Also Chandler timed that up really well. I would suspect there is another problem. You don't see that though and everything is Russell's reads or mis-reads.


    I think I mentioned that A. If the qb reads a defense and in the first steps back sees a wr is going to be open he can modify his drop to hit the play - Anticipation. The notion that a qb is going to forego a gimme play because coach said to take a 5 step drop is absurd and it wasn't that. AND Russ's read despite the safety dropping g wide and Dissly breaking free right away was Lockett. When that was covered, play was over. Obvious read was Dissly as soon as the safety over Dissly fades outside. LITERALLY FOOTBALLE 101. B the pocket was an easy read, step up and right and the field is open to Dissly still or Collins.

    And honestly, if Russ can't make that read and sees it as being as difficult as you do, there's no hope for this offense or this team.



    Nah...its more of because he doesn't make dumb decisions like you. Will take a sack over turnover and doesn't throw plays you wish he would in hindsight. Doesn't matter man...you going to believe what you want and not what is reality. Your talking about modifying drop steps in the middle of looking at a completely different reciever. Oh yeah cuz that makes sense. Supposedly modify a drop step to reciever your not even looking for. Hmmm...seems funny. I guess no one wants to be wrong huh.


    Classy post.

    Your read of this play is literally laughable, and the fact that you and others here first saying that the safeties were in position to make the play (wrong), then that the LBs were in position to deflect the ball (wrong), then that he doesnt trust his receievers, then that the throw didnt match his drop... or that the throw was only one Rodgers could make...its embarrassinngly bad.

    SImple answer is he was locked into Lockett, the defense predicted it. When that wasnt there, he didnt even acknowledge Dissly or the open pocket in front of ihm and took the sack.

    And here. Here's the field in front of Dissly will no one in front of him... again.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105811_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr
    keasley45
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    hawks85 wrote:
    LTH wrote:

    Well the way I see it is that this was gthe issue last year... Russ just has this thing to where he wants to be a gun slinger and he is forcing balls into double coverage not because he is being selfish its because he believes he can make the play and Defenses have adjusted to him but he keeps throwing into double coverage and throwing INT's instead of taking what the D gives him and forcing the D to adjust to him again... The big plays will happen if he is patient but he is not.. he needs to wait until he gets a one on one with Metcalf or Lockett and that's not going to happen unless he adjusts to what the D is doing...


    People want to blame Carroll but its not Carroll or Waldron it's the decisions Russ is making... Geno is not as good a QB as Russ physically but I think he would have had a better game than Russ did purely because of his decision making...



    LTH


    ^^^^THIS^^^^
    I've been saying this for a LONG time. Wilson is a backyard gun slinging QB. He doesn't know how to and is very very bad at reading a defense and making the right decisions. He can't pick a defense apart whatsoever and his foot speed is sloppy and extremely bad. These are staples to operating a west coast offense properly. Look at Montana in SB23. A 1:53 left on the clock and drove that niners team down the field 90 something yards and pick that defense apart without throwing a single pass over 20 yards and scored the winning touchdown to Taylor on a slant route. That's a west coast QB in a west coast offense and that's what Wilson should be doing. Instead Wilson drops back a million miles and just chucks it up to the furthest WR in double coverage with guys clearly open in the flat and in the middle of the field. The other issue is that Wilson is very religious and thinks all things are possible through Christ, well he needs to have a sit down the Jesus and re-evaluate.


    That's exactly what he did on the play to DK later in the game. Dropped back 10 yards. Stood their patting the ball. Had two WR deep, both doubled, and chucked it anyway when he had his RB in the flat with yards and yards of space in front of him.

    Bit the throw 50 yards downfield to a bracketed DK
    He's OK with, and the gimme read and gimme throw to Dissly is hard.

    You literally can't even have a logical conversation about basic football...


    Your an idiot. That is a given.

    Throw up a 5050 ball...who to chose from...dk...supposedly big and fast compared to megatron(not)...or dissly who had a ball bounce off bare hands 10 yards away facing russ?
    Good choice. You take dissly. All go dk. Unfortunately we both lose because again no wr on this team makes contested catches.


    LOL . Listen to what you just said. nobody on this team makes contested catches. .. . So keep throwing the ball to players who have no choice but make contested catches.

    There was no need to throw a 5050 ball. the running back was a 100/0 choice.
    keasley45
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:What you are also not looking at is the drop step wilson took. Is that play design or do you think he did that himself?
    Gurantee it is designed because they practice formational plays where they have dedicated amount of drop steps. 3 5 and 7. Not Russell's fault Chandler Jones beat him there. Cards ran a good defensive play. Also Chandler timed that up really well. I would suspect there is another problem. You don't see that though and everything is Russell's reads or mis-reads.


    I think I mentioned that A. If the qb reads a defense and in the first steps back sees a wr is going to be open he can modify his drop to hit the play - Anticipation. The notion that a qb is going to forego a gimme play because coach said to take a 5 step drop is absurd and it wasn't that. AND Russ's read despite the safety dropping g wide and Dissly breaking free right away was Lockett. When that was covered, play was over. Obvious read was Dissly as soon as the safety over Dissly fades outside. LITERALLY FOOTBALLE 101. B the pocket was an easy read, step up and right and the field is open to Dissly still or Collins.

    And honestly, if Russ can't make that read and sees it as being as difficult as you do, there's no hope for this offense or this team.



    Nah...its more of because he doesn't make dumb decisions like you. Will take a sack over turnover and doesn't throw plays you wish he would in hindsight. Doesn't matter man...you going to believe what you want and not what is reality. Your talking about modifying drop steps in the middle of looking at a completely different reciever. Oh yeah cuz that makes sense. Supposedly modify a drop step to reciever your not even looking for. Hmmm...seems funny. I guess no one wants to be wrong huh.


    Classy post.

    Your read of this play is literally laughable, and the fact that you and others here first saying that the safeties were in position to make the play (wrong), then that the LBs were in position to deflect the ball (wrong), then that he doesnt trust his receievers, then that the throw didnt match his drop... or that the throw was only one Rodgers could make...its embarrassinngly bad.

    SImple answer is he was locked into Lockett, the defense predicted it. When that wasnt there, he didnt even acknowledge Dissly or the open pocket in front of ihm and took the sack.

    And here. Here's the field in front of Dissly will no one in front of him... again.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105811_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr



    Oh yeah the play where dissly is wide open!!!

    You right man...

    Cuz both the safeties aren't clearly looking at russ in this pic. Yeah neither would make it there. Oh and is that ruas clearly getting sacked at the time your saying dissly is wide open. Sure.

    You've gone so far passed losing your mind. Your telling it $h!t that isn't even true and believing it. Haha. Delusional.
    jamescasey1124
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    hawks85 wrote:
    ^^^^THIS^^^^
    I've been saying this for a LONG time. Wilson is a backyard gun slinging QB. He doesn't know how to and is very very bad at reading a defense and making the right decisions. He can't pick a defense apart whatsoever and his foot speed is sloppy and extremely bad. These are staples to operating a west coast offense properly. Look at Montana in SB23. A 1:53 left on the clock and drove that niners team down the field 90 something yards and pick that defense apart without throwing a single pass over 20 yards and scored the winning touchdown to Taylor on a slant route. That's a west coast QB in a west coast offense and that's what Wilson should be doing. Instead Wilson drops back a million miles and just chucks it up to the furthest WR in double coverage with guys clearly open in the flat and in the middle of the field. The other issue is that Wilson is very religious and thinks all things are possible through Christ, well he needs to have a sit down the Jesus and re-evaluate.


    That's exactly what he did on the play to DK later in the game. Dropped back 10 yards. Stood their patting the ball. Had two WR deep, both doubled, and chucked it anyway when he had his RB in the flat with yards and yards of space in front of him.

    Bit the throw 50 yards downfield to a bracketed DK
    He's OK with, and the gimme read and gimme throw to Dissly is hard.

    You literally can't even have a logical conversation about basic football...


    Your an idiot. That is a given.

    Throw up a 5050 ball...who to chose from...dk...supposedly big and fast compared to megatron(not)...or dissly who had a ball bounce off bare hands 10 yards away facing russ?
    Good choice. You take dissly. All go dk. Unfortunately we both lose because again no wr on this team makes contested catches.


    LOL . Listen to what you just said. nobody on this team makes contested catches. .. . So keep throwing the ball to players who have no choice but make contested catches.

    There was no need to throw a 5050 ball. the running back was a 100/0 choice.


    Of course the running back was 100/0 choice when looking at the play after the fact. A play where russ never keys on anybody else, but dk, because they're losing a game and trying to come back, so a flat route won't help. It may sustain a drive, but then your playing with time.

    Good thing you can make these choices after the fact. You should play qb for the hawks.
    jamescasey1124
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    I think I mentioned that A. If the qb reads a defense and in the first steps back sees a wr is going to be open he can modify his drop to hit the play - Anticipation. The notion that a qb is going to forego a gimme play because coach said to take a 5 step drop is absurd and it wasn't that. AND Russ's read despite the safety dropping g wide and Dissly breaking free right away was Lockett. When that was covered, play was over. Obvious read was Dissly as soon as the safety over Dissly fades outside. LITERALLY FOOTBALLE 101. B the pocket was an easy read, step up and right and the field is open to Dissly still or Collins.

    And honestly, if Russ can't make that read and sees it as being as difficult as you do, there's no hope for this offense or this team.



    Nah...its more of because he doesn't make dumb decisions like you. Will take a sack over turnover and doesn't throw plays you wish he would in hindsight. Doesn't matter man...you going to believe what you want and not what is reality. Your talking about modifying drop steps in the middle of looking at a completely different reciever. Oh yeah cuz that makes sense. Supposedly modify a drop step to reciever your not even looking for. Hmmm...seems funny. I guess no one wants to be wrong huh.


    Classy post.

    Your read of this play is literally laughable, and the fact that you and others here first saying that the safeties were in position to make the play (wrong), then that the LBs were in position to deflect the ball (wrong), then that he doesnt trust his receievers, then that the throw didnt match his drop... or that the throw was only one Rodgers could make...its embarrassinngly bad.

    SImple answer is he was locked into Lockett, the defense predicted it. When that wasnt there, he didnt even acknowledge Dissly or the open pocket in front of ihm and took the sack.

    And here. Here's the field in front of Dissly will no one in front of him... again.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105811_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr



    Oh yeah the play where dissly is wide open!!!

    You right man...

    Cuz both the safeties aren't clearly looking at russ in this pic. Yeah neither would make it there. Oh and is that ruas clearly getting sacked at the time your saying dissly is wide open. Sure.

    You've gone so far passed losing your mind. Your telling it $h!t that isn't even true and believing it. Haha. Delusional.


    It's great to see the level of nonsense the folks that support Russ are willing to stand on on a play that isn't even close.

    Makes everything in this forum make complete sense.

    Keep on making excuses though
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    That's exactly what he did on the play to DK later in the game. Dropped back 10 yards. Stood their patting the ball. Had two WR deep, both doubled, and chucked it anyway when he had his RB in the flat with yards and yards of space in front of him.

    Bit the throw 50 yards downfield to a bracketed DK
    He's OK with, and the gimme read and gimme throw to Dissly is hard.

    You literally can't even have a logical conversation about basic football...


    Your an idiot. That is a given.

    Throw up a 5050 ball...who to chose from...dk...supposedly big and fast compared to megatron(not)...or dissly who had a ball bounce off bare hands 10 yards away facing russ?
    Good choice. You take dissly. All go dk. Unfortunately we both lose because again no wr on this team makes contested catches.


    LOL . Listen to what you just said. nobody on this team makes contested catches. .. . So keep throwing the ball to players who have no choice but make contested catches.

    There was no need to throw a 5050 ball. the running back was a 100/0 choice.


    Of course the running back was 100/0 choice when looking at the play after the fact. A play where russ never keys on anybody else, but dk, because they're losing a game and trying to come back, so a flat route won't help. It may sustain a drive, but then your playing with time.

    Good thing you can make these choices after the fact. You should play qb for the hawks.


    My lord. This is why we fail and other teams with qbs who can read defenses work. You don't need an f'ing time capsule to know where your players are going to be on a play YOU designed when you can see where the defended is.

    The play to DK had 3 options. Option 1 was covered from the beginning. Option 2 was covered from the beginning. No play there. Option 3 was open the hold time and the outlet. You know, that guy you pretty much know is going to be open if the other two options covered.
    keasley45
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:

    Nah...its more of because he doesn't make dumb decisions like you. Will take a sack over turnover and doesn't throw plays you wish he would in hindsight. Doesn't matter man...you going to believe what you want and not what is reality. Your talking about modifying drop steps in the middle of looking at a completely different reciever. Oh yeah cuz that makes sense. Supposedly modify a drop step to reciever your not even looking for. Hmmm...seems funny. I guess no one wants to be wrong huh.


    Classy post.

    Your read of this play is literally laughable, and the fact that you and others here first saying that the safeties were in position to make the play (wrong), then that the LBs were in position to deflect the ball (wrong), then that he doesnt trust his receievers, then that the throw didnt match his drop... or that the throw was only one Rodgers could make...its embarrassinngly bad.

    SImple answer is he was locked into Lockett, the defense predicted it. When that wasnt there, he didnt even acknowledge Dissly or the open pocket in front of ihm and took the sack.

    And here. Here's the field in front of Dissly will no one in front of him... again.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105811_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr



    Oh yeah the play where dissly is wide open!!!

    You right man...

    Cuz both the safeties aren't clearly looking at russ in this pic. Yeah neither would make it there. Oh and is that ruas clearly getting sacked at the time your saying dissly is wide open. Sure.

    You've gone so far passed losing your mind. Your telling it $h!t that isn't even true and believing it. Haha. Delusional.


    It's great to see the level of nonsense the folks that support Russ are willing to stand on on a play that isn't even close.

    Makes everything in this forum make complete sense.

    Keep on making excuses though


    I am making excuses or are you not being more open minded about your beliefs? Just wondering.

    Funny how you can question others on what they see, but not be willing to compromise, while expecting others to do so for your opinions.

    Hypocritical
    jamescasey1124
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    Your an idiot. That is a given.

    Throw up a 5050 ball...who to chose from...dk...supposedly big and fast compared to megatron(not)...or dissly who had a ball bounce off bare hands 10 yards away facing russ?
    Good choice. You take dissly. All go dk. Unfortunately we both lose because again no wr on this team makes contested catches.


    LOL . Listen to what you just said. nobody on this team makes contested catches. .. . So keep throwing the ball to players who have no choice but make contested catches.

    There was no need to throw a 5050 ball. the running back was a 100/0 choice.


    Of course the running back was 100/0 choice when looking at the play after the fact. A play where russ never keys on anybody else, but dk, because they're losing a game and trying to come back, so a flat route won't help. It may sustain a drive, but then your playing with time.

    Good thing you can make these choices after the fact. You should play qb for the hawks.


    My lord. This is why we fail and other teams with qbs who can read defenses work. You don't need an f'ing time capsule to know where your players are going to be on a play YOU designed when you can see where the defended is.

    The play to DK had 3 options. Option 1 was covered from the beginning. Option 2 was covered from the beginning. No play there. Option 3 was open the hold time and the outlet. You know, that guy you pretty much know is going to be open if the other two options covered.


    Nope I don't. Cuz there is an option everybody is covered and covered well.
    jamescasey1124
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    hawks85 wrote:
    LTH wrote:

    Well the way I see it is that this was gthe issue last year... Russ just has this thing to where he wants to be a gun slinger and he is forcing balls into double coverage not because he is being selfish its because he believes he can make the play and Defenses have adjusted to him but he keeps throwing into double coverage and throwing INT's instead of taking what the D gives him and forcing the D to adjust to him again... The big plays will happen if he is patient but he is not.. he needs to wait until he gets a one on one with Metcalf or Lockett and that's not going to happen unless he adjusts to what the D is doing...


    People want to blame Carroll but its not Carroll or Waldron it's the decisions Russ is making... Geno is not as good a QB as Russ physically but I think he would have had a better game than Russ did purely because of his decision making...



    LTH


    ^^^^THIS^^^^
    I've been saying this for a LONG time. Wilson is a backyard gun slinging QB. He doesn't know how to and is very very bad at reading a defense and making the right decisions. He can't pick a defense apart whatsoever and his foot speed is sloppy and extremely bad. These are staples to operating a west coast offense properly. Look at Montana in SB23. A 1:53 left on the clock and drove that niners team down the field 90 something yards and pick that defense apart without throwing a single pass over 20 yards and scored the winning touchdown to Taylor on a slant route. That's a west coast QB in a west coast offense and that's what Wilson should be doing. Instead Wilson drops back a million miles and just chucks it up to the furthest WR in double coverage with guys clearly open in the flat and in the middle of the field. The other issue is that Wilson is very religious and thinks all things are possible through Christ, well he needs to have a sit down the Jesus and re-evaluate.


    That's exactly what he did on the play to DK later in the game. Dropped back 10 yards. Stood their patting the ball. Had two WR deep, both doubled, and chucked it anyway when he had his RB in the flat with yards and yards of space in front of him.

    Bit the throw 50 yards downfield to a bracketed DK
    He's OK with, and the gimme read and gimme throw to Dissly is hard.

    You literally can't even have a logical conversation about basic football...


    Your an idiot. That is a given.

    Throw up a 5050 ball...who to chose from...dk...supposedly big and fast compared to megatron(not)...or dissly who had a ball bounce off bare hands 10 yards away facing russ?
    Good choice. You take dissly. All go dk. Unfortunately we both lose because again no wr on this team makes contested catches.


    Do me a favor and look at someone who I guess is also an idiot calling out Russ for doing the same BS. Watch that and then post your synopsis. Says the same thing this thread has been saying.

    https://youtu.be/E6BUU_FZAPE

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oq1NR9-zFig
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6BUU_FZAPE&t=1078s

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cnarei9FgGo&t=313s
    keasley45
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  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    hawks85 wrote:
    ^^^^THIS^^^^
    I've been saying this for a LONG time. Wilson is a backyard gun slinging QB. He doesn't know how to and is very very bad at reading a defense and making the right decisions. He can't pick a defense apart whatsoever and his foot speed is sloppy and extremely bad. These are staples to operating a west coast offense properly. Look at Montana in SB23. A 1:53 left on the clock and drove that niners team down the field 90 something yards and pick that defense apart without throwing a single pass over 20 yards and scored the winning touchdown to Taylor on a slant route. That's a west coast QB in a west coast offense and that's what Wilson should be doing. Instead Wilson drops back a million miles and just chucks it up to the furthest WR in double coverage with guys clearly open in the flat and in the middle of the field. The other issue is that Wilson is very religious and thinks all things are possible through Christ, well he needs to have a sit down the Jesus and re-evaluate.


    That's exactly what he did on the play to DK later in the game. Dropped back 10 yards. Stood their patting the ball. Had two WR deep, both doubled, and chucked it anyway when he had his RB in the flat with yards and yards of space in front of him.

    Bit the throw 50 yards downfield to a bracketed DK
    He's OK with, and the gimme read and gimme throw to Dissly is hard.

    You literally can't even have a logical conversation about basic football...


    Your an idiot. That is a given.

    Throw up a 5050 ball...who to chose from...dk...supposedly big and fast compared to megatron(not)...or dissly who had a ball bounce off bare hands 10 yards away facing russ?
    Good choice. You take dissly. All go dk. Unfortunately we both lose because again no wr on this team makes contested catches.


    Do me a favor and look at someone who I guess is also an idiot calling out Russ for doing the same BS. Watch that and then post your synopsis. Says the same thing this thread has been saying.

    https://youtu.be/E6BUU_FZAPE

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oq1NR9-zFig
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6BUU_FZAPE&t=1078s

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?

    v=Cnarei9FgGo&t=313s


    Nah. I'm good. Cuz your assuming I haven't seen it. I don't care what anyone's opinion is on a few plays here and there. Because the positives outweigh the negatives. Period. Its not negatives outweigh positives just because we choose to focus on negative. Your looking passed the positives. That ain't my fault. Bye.
    jamescasey1124
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    And the thing you say about throwing with anticipation doesn't really make sense. A throw with anticipation is exactly the thing that gets passes completed in even great coverage (which this play was actually beatable coverage) because the defenders dont get a jump on a wr because by the time they are immediately open, the ball is on the way. And again, thats the point. You watch the Bucs, the Chargers, The Rams, GB, Dallas, KC... you watch ANY of those offenses run and you will see balls being squeezed between zones, over zones, to a wr just coming out of his break when the defender is in tight man... because the QB pulls the trigger based on reading the coverage and knows where to put the ball precisely when the player will be open. The ball should have been in Dissly's hands 2 steps after he turned around. It wasnt a hard throw, didnt have to be a laser. The LB was beat, the other lb to that side was covering everett to Russ left, and the LB to the right of the play was scrambling to cover Collins.


    And he didn't pull the trigger on this play. Which indicates he didn't think dissly was open. Just because you think he was in hindsight looking at freeze frames doesn't mean he did. within the matter of milliseconds it takes to make that play he didn't think so...you would rather him throw the pick so you have an actual reason to b!@ch.

    Dissly was safety squeezed with linebackers underneath and you are saying he would have been wide open. No. Safeties are better athletes then you give them credit for and the one thing you are ignoring is what russ actually sees and feels sitting in the pocket. I gurantee this whole play happened in less than 4 seconds from snap to sack. One because Collins was barely open by the time sack happened and dissly ran a straight go. Safeties started in cover two and no gurantee from presnap which direction they would go.

    You are assuming dissly running directly into 3 lbs and passed into 2 Safeties that he is open. Your wrong. In the two seconds he reads that Chandler Jones is already in the backfield as soon as russ hits back foot. That is clear in picture. Then your saying he saw lockett, not open, dissly not open so he should have stepped up and ran with probably less than 1 sec to sacked. Doesn't happen man.

    Again, overly critical of 1 player vs everything that is breaking down.


    You said it he didn't think he was open, the real issue is he didn't trust the player or himself to make the throw and may have a turnover if Dissly misplayed the ball and tipped it up, he over through it somehow. That has been his issue no matter the receiver. Thats wide ass open for any QB of worth other then Wilson.


    No it's not in the time given. Didnt trust himself? Really to throw a potential 5050. Your right...I would have held it too. Besides no one on the hawks this year has show they can easily win a jump ball. Wonder why he questions those throws.



    Not to mention what is PC mantra no turn overs dont take chances.
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  • FloridaSeahawk18 wrote:Looks like he 1-read the DK route and when it wasn't open panicked and took the sack. Typical Russ. Do you have the screenshots on the PA shot to DK also that was double covered? Anything underneath that was open?

    He audibled into that play. He was throwing it no matter what
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    That's exactly what he did on the play to DK later in the game. Dropped back 10 yards. Stood their patting the ball. Had two WR deep, both doubled, and chucked it anyway when he had his RB in the flat with yards and yards of space in front of him.

    Bit the throw 50 yards downfield to a bracketed DK
    He's OK with, and the gimme read and gimme throw to Dissly is hard.

    You literally can't even have a logical conversation about basic football...


    Your an idiot. That is a given.

    Throw up a 5050 ball...who to chose from...dk...supposedly big and fast compared to megatron(not)...or dissly who had a ball bounce off bare hands 10 yards away facing russ?
    Good choice. You take dissly. All go dk. Unfortunately we both lose because again no wr on this team makes contested catches.


    Do me a favor and look at someone who I guess is also an idiot calling out Russ for doing the same BS. Watch that and then post your synopsis. Says the same thing this thread has been saying.

    https://youtu.be/E6BUU_FZAPE

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oq1NR9-zFig
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6BUU_FZAPE&t=1078s

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?

    v=Cnarei9FgGo&t=313s


    Nah. I'm good. Cuz your assuming I haven't seen it. I don't care what anyone's opinion is on a few plays here and there. Because the positives outweigh the negatives. Period. Its not negatives outweigh positives just because we choose to focus on negative. Your looking passed the positives. That ain't my fault. Bye.


    Thanks for admitting that.
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:So, looking at the Arizona game. Didnt have to wait long to see the same tendencies Russel showed the week before.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105736_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Dissly will run a seam, Everett will drift shallow left and Collins will be available out of the backfield, short right

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105755_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Dissly breaks right through the line and is immediately open. The LB's don't even attempt to cover him up the middle. Russ reached his drop, Dissly obviously coming open if he anticpates it and has an open pocket to step into to the right, Collins is coming open in front of him.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105811_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Again, open pocket to the right in front of him. all he has to do is step forward and right and he avoids the rush. Dissly is still available, and Collins would be there and still could be with a flip of the ball.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105909_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Play ends in a sack.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105934_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Same from behind

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-110037_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Drop reached, Dissly WIDE OPEN. Ball in Russ's hand

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-110058_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    This is a split second after Russ has already decided to pull the ball down. Dissly is an easy win if he reads the fact that the LB's never even move to react to the pattern

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-110116_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Russ never moves from his drop at the 41 yard line. never steps up to read the pressure. Sack.

    The next play is also a sack but this one is more a bust in protection by Homer. However, even with the bust, Russ of 2 years ago steps into the pocket , beats the lone rusher and makes the play


    Dude your wrong again. Sure throw dissly open and he missed it right? However at that distance, both safeties sitting in cover 2 would be able to get to the ball. It wouldn't be a rope with linebackers underneath. It would have to have touch and again at that distance, both safeties arrive on top of dissly. He could have went underneath to Collins and stepped up yes. Shell could have also held his block. Chandler Jones could have went right or left on Shell. Hole isn't open that long.

    Dude you are narrowing in on russ when there are many other things going wrong.

    This one yes he should have put it in the left or right flat immediately.

    The safeties bailed at the snap, hips turned. They have no shot to stop a ball over the top to Dissley.
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  • John63 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    And he didn't pull the trigger on this play. Which indicates he didn't think dissly was open. Just because you think he was in hindsight looking at freeze frames doesn't mean he did. within the matter of milliseconds it takes to make that play he didn't think so...you would rather him throw the pick so you have an actual reason to b!@ch.

    Dissly was safety squeezed with linebackers underneath and you are saying he would have been wide open. No. Safeties are better athletes then you give them credit for and the one thing you are ignoring is what russ actually sees and feels sitting in the pocket. I gurantee this whole play happened in less than 4 seconds from snap to sack. One because Collins was barely open by the time sack happened and dissly ran a straight go. Safeties started in cover two and no gurantee from presnap which direction they would go.

    You are assuming dissly running directly into 3 lbs and passed into 2 Safeties that he is open. Your wrong. In the two seconds he reads that Chandler Jones is already in the backfield as soon as russ hits back foot. That is clear in picture. Then your saying he saw lockett, not open, dissly not open so he should have stepped up and ran with probably less than 1 sec to sacked. Doesn't happen man.

    Again, overly critical of 1 player vs everything that is breaking down.


    You said it he didn't think he was open, the real issue is he didn't trust the player or himself to make the throw and may have a turnover if Dissly misplayed the ball and tipped it up, he over through it somehow. That has been his issue no matter the receiver. Thats wide ass open for any QB of worth other then Wilson.


    No it's not in the time given. Didnt trust himself? Really to throw a potential 5050. Your right...I would have held it too. Besides no one on the hawks this year has show they can easily win a jump ball. Wonder why he questions those throws.



    Not to mention what is PC mantra no turn overs dont take chances.


    Yeah it would be a shame to get a 1st down once in a while, why throw to a open receiver in the middle of the field when you can take a sack, in fact looking at those images he had three guys open or coming open if he pulls the trigger on time rather ten wait to see if the deep guy can get past the deep safety so if he throws it and not caught it is too long to be intercepted.
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:ImageScreenshot_20211124-105811_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    I added more arrows and bubbles to show you the assignments the safeties had on this play that they were committed to and were obvious the entire time. They were covering the areas of the field Russ goes 99% of the time regardless of the read... DK and Lockett outside and leaving the middle open.

    Dissly has covered 17 yards. The only safety capable of making the play has dropped 11 and is still dropping

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-105909_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    This is as close as that safety would have been if the ball was thrown to Dissly if the ball was released when Dissly was 17 yards down field. This is of course hypothetical because the play was over by then. point being a safety running backward and outside wouldnt have had an angle to make this play at any point the pass could have been completed.


    So you ate saying they can't plant there foot and get to the ball in time for that throw? Deep safety is maybe five yards off hash where dissly is and other safety is probably 8 yards off opposite hash...your saying they wouldn't get there?

    Also...what was time from snap to sack?

    If you think that's not open, you would never throw the ball. That's as open as it gets in THE NFL. If a QB cant make that throw/read, they shouldn't be playing. That's gross negligence
    OrangeGravy
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:What you are also not looking at is the drop step wilson took. Is that play design or do you think he did that himself?
    Gurantee it is designed because they practice formational plays where they have dedicated amount of drop steps. 3 5 and 7. Not Russell's fault Chandler Jones beat him there. Cards ran a good defensive play. Also Chandler timed that up really well. I would suspect there is another problem. You don't see that though and everything is Russell's reads or mis-reads.

    That was a bad defensive play. Busted coverage. If that's DK instead of Dissley, it's a TD.

    This is the same type breakdown we have on defense and everyone is b!@ch about how bad the defense sucks.
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  • Because someone asked for this play.. The question was what was Russ thinking throwing to a doubled DK. i answered earlier that i remember him having the RB out of the backfield open. Only because i looked for the play per request here it is. And Russ had an easy pass to Penny and the long route to Lockett open at the sticks as he'd beaten his guy, the corner was trailing and teh safety too far over top since Lockett was curling back to the LOS

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143344_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Two deep routes by DK and Lockett, one outlet in a one on one for the RB on a LB

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143359_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143414_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    DK starts left and breaks behind a curling Lockett who takes his route to the sideline. Penny is an option out of the backfield. At this point, the safety over Lockett is dropping and the corner and safety on DK have him Bracketed. Its well protected, and Russ can choose, without pressure to look at the read and go over the top to DK, hit Lockett on a curl - hes got his guy beat. Or Penny who has a 9 yard cushion but even if the defender closes, a 1v1 vs a LB. And the quicker Russ makes the read, the faster has can go there. If he throws here, his line is giving him a 5 yard cushion and Lockett is already breaking - Easy 1st down.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143652_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    This is the moment the ball was thrown. Lockett was an easy option. Hes running his route to the 1st down marker and if Russ hits him, its basically uncontested. Lockett has position.

    Or, Russ can hit Penny, - which let me guess, despite never having a defender ( a LB) within 8 yards of him on what would be a quick, fastball throw, would have been covered or picked? - but he goes to the hardest of the 3 reads.

    Image2021-11-24_04-27-34 by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Three options. One read.

    And by the way, this is a nice play design to beat the 2 safety look. Russ has an option for the big play, a mid range option at the sticks, and a short option before the sticks but with a RB who only needs to break one tackle. His choice, but he only has one thing in mind.
    Last edited by keasley45 on Wed Nov 24, 2021 2:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.
    keasley45
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  • OrangeGravy wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:What you are also not looking at is the drop step wilson took. Is that play design or do you think he did that himself?
    Gurantee it is designed because they practice formational plays where they have dedicated amount of drop steps. 3 5 and 7. Not Russell's fault Chandler Jones beat him there. Cards ran a good defensive play. Also Chandler timed that up really well. I would suspect there is another problem. You don't see that though and everything is Russell's reads or mis-reads.

    That was a bad defensive play. Busted coverage. If that's DK instead of Dissley, it's a TD.

    This is the same type breakdown we have on defense and everyone is b!@ch about how bad the defense sucks.


    Except it's a good defensive play because it resulted in a sack. Nothing more...nothing less. We cant redo play with dk running the seam.
    jamescasey1124
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  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    OrangeGravy wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:What you are also not looking at is the drop step wilson took. Is that play design or do you think he did that himself?
    Gurantee it is designed because they practice formational plays where they have dedicated amount of drop steps. 3 5 and 7. Not Russell's fault Chandler Jones beat him there. Cards ran a good defensive play. Also Chandler timed that up really well. I would suspect there is another problem. You don't see that though and everything is Russell's reads or mis-reads.

    That was a bad defensive play. Busted coverage. If that's DK instead of Dissley, it's a TD.

    This is the same type breakdown we have on defense and everyone is b!@ch about how bad the defense sucks.


    Except it's a good defensive play because it resulted in a sack. Nothing more...nothing less. We cant redo play with dk running the seam.


    It was a completely failed defensive play. the LB are caught flat footed. One is late to Collins, The other is late to Everett, and the 3rd is beaten by Dissly. The safeties both play outside coverage and leave Dissly open to run uncontested down the middle of the field. Its not post rationalism or... if only he'd seen this almost impossible play, Its a broken defense, a wide open wr, and a qb stuck on one read, often seemingly unable to get the ball to anyone but who he's zeroed in on.
    keasley45
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  • keasley45 wrote:Because someone asked for this play.. The question was what was Russ thinking throwing to a doubled DK. i answered earlier that i remember him having the RB out of the backfield open. Only because i looked for the play per request here it is. And Russ had an easy pass to Penny and the long route to Lockett open at the sticks as he'd beaten his guy, the corner was trailing and teh safety too far over top since Lockett was curling back to the LOS

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143344_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Two deep routes by DK and Lockett, one outlet in a one on one for the RB on a LB

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143359_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143414_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    DK starts left and breaks behind a curling Lockett who takes his route to the sideline. Penny is an option out of the backfield. At this point, the safety over Lockett is dropping and the corner and safety on DK have him Bracketed. Its well protected, and Russ can choose, without pressure to look at the read and go over the top to DK, hit Lockett on a curl - hes got his guy beat. Or Penny who has a 9 yard cushion but even if the defender closes, a 1v1 vs a LB. And the quicker Russ makes the read, the faster has can go there. If he throws here, his line is giving him a 5 yard cushion and Lockett is already breaking - Easy 1st down.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143652_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    This is the moment the ball was thrown. Lockett was an easy option. Hes running his route to the 1st down marker and if Russ hits him, its basically uncontested. Lockett has position.

    Or, Russ can hit Penny, - which let me guess, despite never having a defender ( a LB) within 8 yards of him on what would be a quick, fastball throw, would have been covered or picked? - but he goes to the hardest of the 3 reads.

    Image2021-11-24_04-27-34 by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Three options. One read.

    And by the way, this is a nice play design to beat the 2 safety look. Russ has an option for the big play, a mid range option at the sticks, and a short option before the sticks but with a RB who only needs to break one tackle. His choice, but he only has one thing in mind.

    Russell checked into this play. I was curious to know what he saw presnap that lead to the check
    OrangeGravy
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 826
    Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2016 5:47 pm


  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    OrangeGravy wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:What you are also not looking at is the drop step wilson took. Is that play design or do you think he did that himself?
    Gurantee it is designed because they practice formational plays where they have dedicated amount of drop steps. 3 5 and 7. Not Russell's fault Chandler Jones beat him there. Cards ran a good defensive play. Also Chandler timed that up really well. I would suspect there is another problem. You don't see that though and everything is Russell's reads or mis-reads.

    That was a bad defensive play. Busted coverage. If that's DK instead of Dissley, it's a TD.

    This is the same type breakdown we have on defense and everyone is b!@ch about how bad the defense sucks.


    Except it's a good defensive play because it resulted in a sack. Nothing more...nothing less. We cant redo play with dk running the seam.


    It was a completely failed defensive play. the LB are caught flat footed. One is late to Collins, The other is late to Everett, and the 3rd is beaten by Dissly. The safeties both play outside coverage and leave Dissly open to run uncontested down the middle of the field. Its not post rationalism or... if only he'd seen this almost impossible play, Its a broken defense, a wide open wr, and a qb stuck on one read, often seemingly unable to get the ball to anyone but who he's zeroed in on.


    Ok because you say so right? You can't be wrong. Cuz lb covering dissly isn't sitting his zone(supposedly flat footed) passing off to deeper. And everett or Collins didn't look for the Ball until they split toward sidelines. Except russ was pretty much sacked by then. God man...you cant be wrong in your analysis of russ can you? It's gotta be his fault or no one else.

    That's cool. You ride with that. I'm hoping the seahawks make it no matter what. I don't need to call anyone out or attest own opinions into victory. I know what I saw.

    I'm tired of arguing an opinion, when clearly it doesn't matter. Only yours does right?

    To bad neither of our opinions matter and russ will ball anyway.

    Stupid discussion.
    jamescasey1124
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 1004
    Joined: Mon May 04, 2020 12:36 am


  • OrangeGravy wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:Because someone asked for this play.. The question was what was Russ thinking throwing to a doubled DK. i answered earlier that i remember him having the RB out of the backfield open. Only because i looked for the play per request here it is. And Russ had an easy pass to Penny and the long route to Lockett open at the sticks as he'd beaten his guy, the corner was trailing and teh safety too far over top since Lockett was curling back to the LOS

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143344_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Two deep routes by DK and Lockett, one outlet in a one on one for the RB on a LB

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143359_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143414_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    DK starts left and breaks behind a curling Lockett who takes his route to the sideline. Penny is an option out of the backfield. At this point, the safety over Lockett is dropping and the corner and safety on DK have him Bracketed. Its well protected, and Russ can choose, without pressure to look at the read and go over the top to DK, hit Lockett on a curl - hes got his guy beat. Or Penny who has a 9 yard cushion but even if the defender closes, a 1v1 vs a LB. And the quicker Russ makes the read, the faster has can go there. If he throws here, his line is giving him a 5 yard cushion and Lockett is already breaking - Easy 1st down.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143652_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    This is the moment the ball was thrown. Lockett was an easy option. Hes running his route to the 1st down marker and if Russ hits him, its basically uncontested. Lockett has position.

    Or, Russ can hit Penny, - which let me guess, despite never having a defender ( a LB) within 8 yards of him on what would be a quick, fastball throw, would have been covered or picked? - but he goes to the hardest of the 3 reads.

    Image2021-11-24_04-27-34 by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Three options. One read.

    And by the way, this is a nice play design to beat the 2 safety look. Russ has an option for the big play, a mid range option at the sticks, and a short option before the sticks but with a RB who only needs to break one tackle. His choice, but he only has one thing in mind.

    Russell checked into this play. I was curious to know what he saw presnap that lead to the check


    Ok...with you saying 3 options...only 1 read. You are saying you recognize he locks on dk. Now tell me was that his choice or was it a forced play?

    I'll wait. Cuz we can keep playing this who's fault and he was open after the fact, but the truth is you have no idea. Just need someone to blame right?
    jamescasey1124
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 1004
    Joined: Mon May 04, 2020 12:36 am


  • OrangeGravy wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:Because someone asked for this play.. The question was what was Russ thinking throwing to a doubled DK. i answered earlier that i remember him having the RB out of the backfield open. Only because i looked for the play per request here it is. And Russ had an easy pass to Penny and the long route to Lockett open at the sticks as he'd beaten his guy, the corner was trailing and teh safety too far over top since Lockett was curling back to the LOS

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143344_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Two deep routes by DK and Lockett, one outlet in a one on one for the RB on a LB

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143359_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143414_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    DK starts left and breaks behind a curling Lockett who takes his route to the sideline. Penny is an option out of the backfield. At this point, the safety over Lockett is dropping and the corner and safety on DK have him Bracketed. Its well protected, and Russ can choose, without pressure to look at the read and go over the top to DK, hit Lockett on a curl - hes got his guy beat. Or Penny who has a 9 yard cushion but even if the defender closes, a 1v1 vs a LB. And the quicker Russ makes the read, the faster has can go there. If he throws here, his line is giving him a 5 yard cushion and Lockett is already breaking - Easy 1st down.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143652_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    This is the moment the ball was thrown. Lockett was an easy option. Hes running his route to the 1st down marker and if Russ hits him, its basically uncontested. Lockett has position.

    Or, Russ can hit Penny, - which let me guess, despite never having a defender ( a LB) within 8 yards of him on what would be a quick, fastball throw, would have been covered or picked? - but he goes to the hardest of the 3 reads.

    Image2021-11-24_04-27-34 by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Three options. One read.

    And by the way, this is a nice play design to beat the 2 safety look. Russ has an option for the big play, a mid range option at the sticks, and a short option before the sticks but with a RB who only needs to break one tackle. His choice, but he only has one thing in mind.

    Russell checked into this play. I was curious to know what he saw presnap that lead to the check


    I don't think he saw anything, TBH. Think he was set on the big play right there no matter what. Needed a momentum swing.

    To be fair, if DK wants to be paid 20mil per year, he needs to make these catches.
    hoxrox
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 1988
    Joined: Wed Aug 05, 2009 6:29 pm


  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    OrangeGravy wrote:That was a bad defensive play. Busted coverage. If that's DK instead of Dissley, it's a TD.

    This is the same type breakdown we have on defense and everyone is b!@ch about how bad the defense sucks.


    Except it's a good defensive play because it resulted in a sack. Nothing more...nothing less. We cant redo play with dk running the seam.


    It was a completely failed defensive play. the LB are caught flat footed. One is late to Collins, The other is late to Everett, and the 3rd is beaten by Dissly. The safeties both play outside coverage and leave Dissly open to run uncontested down the middle of the field. Its not post rationalism or... if only he'd seen this almost impossible play, Its a broken defense, a wide open wr, and a qb stuck on one read, often seemingly unable to get the ball to anyone but who he's zeroed in on.


    Ok because you say so right? You can't be wrong. Cuz lb covering dissly isn't sitting his zone(supposedly flat footed) passing off to deeper. And everett or Collins didn't look for the Ball until they split toward sidelines. Except russ was pretty much sacked by then. God man...you cant be wrong in your analysis of russ can you? It's gotta be his fault or no one else.

    That's cool. You ride with that. I'm hoping the seahawks make it no matter what. I don't need to call anyone out or attest own opinions into victory. I know what I saw.

    I'm tired of arguing an opinion, when clearly it doesn't matter. Only yours does right?

    To bad neither of our opinions matter and russ will ball anyway.

    Stupid discussion.


    First what typiy gets engaged in here is squabble about opinions. So you post clips of game tape so that opinion matters less. And I don't even post the tricky tack could be this, could be that kind of plays, just the obvious ones that contribute to the purpose of this thread, which is a discussion about what's wrong with Russ beyond his finger.

    The play says what the play says. Because i had to say 5 times the safetues werent in a positiyokn to break on Dissly because physics and their motion on film shows it, doesnt make me so.r ody trying to be right. You just can't say things when facts are in the table and are being discussed and expect no response. For example, you said the LB wasn't beat and passed Dissly off ...to who? The ref? There's nobody there picking him up.

    There are plenty of plays that weren't on Russ. Sorry if this thread is about the mounting nimber of times where the failure of a series is on him and trying to understand why. Drops are obvious. Fumbles are obvious, an offsides is obvious, an overthrow is obvious, a missed block like the one on Homer is obvious.The responsibility for failure within a pkay, not always so.

    I don't get the constant desire to defend the guy when he's the most important piece on the field and needs to be functioning correctly for us to win. All great players are great for a period, and then they are not. Lately everything on the Russ fan Side of things is about how he's playing poorly because of his finger. Or because ofnthe line.

    GOD FORBID THAT THAT CONSTANT DRUMBEAT IS UPSET BY SIMPLE XS AND OS THAT SHOW OTHERWISE.

    your side sits back and blames blocking, his finger, the play calls, the OC, the HC, Jody Allen, his friend passing... and call for the whole team being blown up... andnthen acuse somebody else of saying maybe that the whole thing doesn't need to be blown up, but that one key player needs to play better. And I'm the negative one.

    Yes, there are weekly failures by different players at different times on this team and on every team in the league. We have our share of dumb plays well beyond Russ. This thread is about Russ and his poor play. If you want to start a thread about how the line needs to improve in certain situations or how Waldron could call a better game and provide some measurable basis for discussion, have at itplays, go ahead and start it. Post to it. That would be a perfectly valid thing to do. And enlightening for everyone.

    I'd thought to post one on how poor the defenses scheme is covering TE and running backs overbthe middle. Also thought about breaking down the improved play on the back end of the defense, or a couple of key, brilliant plays that Tre Brown made in his short stint this year.

    Plenty to talk about. Again, this one is about Russ.
    keasley45
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 752
    Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2010 6:40 pm
    Location: Cockeysville, Md


  • jamescasey1124 wrote:
    OrangeGravy wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:Because someone asked for this play.. The question was what was Russ thinking throwing to a doubled DK. i answered earlier that i remember him having the RB out of the backfield open. Only because i looked for the play per request here it is. And Russ had an easy pass to Penny and the long route to Lockett open at the sticks as he'd beaten his guy, the corner was trailing and teh safety too far over top since Lockett was curling back to the LOS

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143344_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Two deep routes by DK and Lockett, one outlet in a one on one for the RB on a LB

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143359_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143414_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    DK starts left and breaks behind a curling Lockett who takes his route to the sideline. Penny is an option out of the backfield. At this point, the safety over Lockett is dropping and the corner and safety on DK have him Bracketed. Its well protected, and Russ can choose, without pressure to look at the read and go over the top to DK, hit Lockett on a curl - hes got his guy beat. Or Penny who has a 9 yard cushion but even if the defender closes, a 1v1 vs a LB. And the quicker Russ makes the read, the faster has can go there. If he throws here, his line is giving him a 5 yard cushion and Lockett is already breaking - Easy 1st down.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143652_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    This is the moment the ball was thrown. Lockett was an easy option. Hes running his route to the 1st down marker and if Russ hits him, its basically uncontested. Lockett has position.

    Or, Russ can hit Penny, - which let me guess, despite never having a defender ( a LB) within 8 yards of him on what would be a quick, fastball throw, would have been covered or picked? - but he goes to the hardest of the 3 reads.

    Image2021-11-24_04-27-34 by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Three options. One read.

    And by the way, this is a nice play design to beat the 2 safety look. Russ has an option for the big play, a mid range option at the sticks, and a short option before the sticks but with a RB who only needs to break one tackle. His choice, but he only has one thing in mind.

    Russell checked into this play. I was curious to know what he saw presnap that lead to the check


    Ok...with you saying 3 options...only 1 read. You are saying you recognize he locks on dk. Now tell me was that his choice or was it a forced play?

    I'll wait. Cuz we can keep playing this who's fault and he was open after the fact, but the truth is you have no idea. Just need someone to blame right?


    I do t even know what that means. Forced how?Are you suggesting the play didn't allow him to do anything but throw to double coverage?? The play has options. And if there a wb in the league who ha shown he'll toss what the plays says and do what he wants it's #3.
    keasley45
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 752
    Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2010 6:40 pm
    Location: Cockeysville, Md


  • keasley45 wrote:
    jamescasey1124 wrote:
    OrangeGravy wrote:
    keasley45 wrote:Because someone asked for this play.. The question was what was Russ thinking throwing to a doubled DK. i answered earlier that i remember him having the RB out of the backfield open. Only because i looked for the play per request here it is. And Russ had an easy pass to Penny and the long route to Lockett open at the sticks as he'd beaten his guy, the corner was trailing and teh safety too far over top since Lockett was curling back to the LOS

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143344_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Two deep routes by DK and Lockett, one outlet in a one on one for the RB on a LB

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143359_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143414_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    DK starts left and breaks behind a curling Lockett who takes his route to the sideline. Penny is an option out of the backfield. At this point, the safety over Lockett is dropping and the corner and safety on DK have him Bracketed. Its well protected, and Russ can choose, without pressure to look at the read and go over the top to DK, hit Lockett on a curl - hes got his guy beat. Or Penny who has a 9 yard cushion but even if the defender closes, a 1v1 vs a LB. And the quicker Russ makes the read, the faster has can go there. If he throws here, his line is giving him a 5 yard cushion and Lockett is already breaking - Easy 1st down.

    ImageScreenshot_20211124-143652_Chrome by J_Otte, on Flickr

    This is the moment the ball was thrown. Lockett was an easy option. Hes running his route to the 1st down marker and if Russ hits him, its basically uncontested. Lockett has position.

    Or, Russ can hit Penny, - which let me guess, despite never having a defender ( a LB) within 8 yards of him on what would be a quick, fastball throw, would have been covered or picked? - but he goes to the hardest of the 3 reads.

    Image2021-11-24_04-27-34 by J_Otte, on Flickr

    Three options. One read.

    And by the way, this is a nice play design to beat the 2 safety look. Russ has an option for the big play, a mid range option at the sticks, and a short option before the sticks but with a RB who only needs to break one tackle. His choice, but he only has one thing in mind.

    Russell checked into this play. I was curious to know what he saw presnap that lead to the check


    Ok...with you saying 3 options...only 1 read. You are saying you recognize he locks on dk. Now tell me was that his choice or was it a forced play?

    I'll wait. Cuz we can keep playing this who's fault and he was open after the fact, but the truth is you have no idea. Just need someone to blame right?


    I do t even know what that means. Forced how?Are you suggesting the play didn't allow him to do anything but throw to double coverage?? The play has options. And if there a wb in the league who ha shown he'll toss what the plays says and do what he wants it's #3.


    Was it a predetermined play or russ call?
    jamescasey1124
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 1004
    Joined: Mon May 04, 2020 12:36 am


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