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Colin in Black and White

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Re: Colin in Black and White
Fri Nov 05, 2021 6:57 pm
  • hawker84 wrote:Welp, I obviously opened a can of worms here which was not my intention but I'm glad I did.

    I'll never understand why some folks get so angry when they see a person of color standing up for their beliefs, and doing whatever they can to uplift their own kind. Why does that anger some so much, in what way is that affecting you that you feel the need to lash out? There really us only one explanation....

    I'll never understand why some folks refuse to accept the fact that POC have been dealt an unfair hand in this country even to this day, when there is volumes of evidence to that suggests just that.

    We don't have to dwell on the pain of the past as long as we're working together for a brighter future. But that would mean equal treatment for all, and that's just asking a bit much.

    So what makes you so angry? If cops were out there shooting unarmed white males, I guarantee I'd be out there marching shoulder to shoulder with you in protest, why can't you do the same for us? Because it doesn't affect you?because that's the.way it's always been, and why fix something that ain't broke, right?

    This board is a microcosm of our state and country, and it's truly sad, in 2021 we are more divided than ever. And quite frankly, it's about to get much worse in a couple years.

    But what's really sad to me is that out of the 100's of posters on this site, only a handful had the courage to speak up in defense of Colin and my post, regardless if they agreed with his or my message or not.

    I'm sure you'll have a field day with this so have at it, hope it makes you feel better. I won't be replying because I won't be reading your responses. You couldn't possibly say anything more that would suprise or offend me that hasn't already been said. But I will leave you with this.

    My 6 year old grandson told me yesterday that a little white girl on his bus told him and I quote...

    "your black because your skin is dark, mine is not so I'm white, white people are better than black people". He asked me if that was true. I wanted to cry.

    6 years old and he's already having encounters with racism.. now I'm sure that little girl didn't know any better, probably just repeating what she learned at home. But my grandson will forever be scarred from that incident, and every incident in the future.

    And that VA49er is opression. Now you know. I have no delusion of hope you'll understand, but you've been whining for an example, now you have one...

    So I'll sign off and move on and leave you to your right wing Alt Right circle jerk. Enjoy your evening....


    Our entire conversation have you asked what my ethnicity is? No you haven't, you just assume who I am based on my feelings about CK. You know what they same about assuming.

    And since you say you're black or I believe you said 1/2 black but you say you'retreated as black, how about answering a few questions?

    What gender and race is most often shot by police in the US?

    What race commits the largest number of violent crimes against the black population of the US?

    Please don't google it, just answer what you believe to be true.
    VA49er
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Fri Nov 05, 2021 8:40 pm

Re: Colin in Black and White
Fri Nov 05, 2021 9:04 pm
  • YKMHawk wrote:Please watch this and tell me what you honestly think about it:

    Thanks:

    https://youtu.be/5CpFEInkFHY


    Same as I said before. Comparing the combine to slavery is absurd. And last time I checked it isn't just blacks or minorities participating in the combine.

    It's just CK trying to keep himself relevant.
    VA49er
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Sat Nov 06, 2021 10:41 am
  • TWO THOUGHTS ON THIS:

    1) I think talking about if Kaepernick is oppressed or not oppressed in a binary fashion is probably unhelpful, and maybe makes us talk past each other a bit.

    For instance, I think we can all agree that from the age of 4 on Kaepernick has been raised with and lived with a lot of class privilege. He doesn't personally know what it's like to worry about where your next meal is going to come from. In our country it is disproportionately black children who know what that worry feels like, but that doesn't mean he knows it, and it doesn't mean that for white children who know and feel that worry it hurts any less than for the black children who feel it in higher proportion.

    At the same time, I think we can all understand how growing up as the only black member of an all white family and in a pretty rural all white community could be alienating, lonely, umcomfortable, challenging, and sprinkled with experiences in which you're made to feel that you don't belong, or reminded that maybe you truly don't entirely belong. Living with an all white family and not having anyone to process those experiences with or to talk you through those experiences also presents its own challenges. That's the opposite of privilege, which is what people mean by oppression.


    2) Regarding comparing the NFL combine to a slave auction, this is an old comparison, and I think in some ways it's deeply unserious and in other ways it makes a lot of sense. The distinction I think, is if you understand the making of that comparison as being one about the player or one about the owner.

    If making a comparison about the player-as-slave, comparing NFL players to chattel slavery in the U.S. is simply stupid. For a comparison to work both sides of the comparison have to have some equivalence and that's pretty laughable in this case. For instance, would you rather be a multimillionaire, or not only be forced to spend the rest of your life working for free, but to also have your children and your children's children be forced to work for free by the same owner because they had originally purchased you? I mean, c'mon.

    At the same time though, if you're making the comparison about owners, the similarities between a slave auction and the combine can be a little bit uncomfortable: they're both ultimately events in which owners and their representatives poke and prod people's bodies to help them decide who to buy and to help them try to figure out who they can make the most money off of.

    So while I've personally always found this comparison to not be that helpful, I also think we can all understand how having a bunch of (overwhelmingly white) representatives of team owners poke you and prod you on a stage while deciding how much money you are worth is a very different experience for black potential NFL players than it is for white potential NFL players. For black players I can totally understand how this very weird experience hits way too close to home despite not being at all the same thing. How close it hits to home (while obviously not being at all the same thing) is, I think, why people have been making the observation for so long.


    SMALLER THOUGHTS:

    a) Funny to see folks on a Hawks board still claiming to hate Kaepernick because of his hair and clothes. :lol: Ten years ago it was his shoe collection, whereas now I guess it's his afro. ;)

    Personally, having grown up in the East Bay in the 90s around graying Black Panthers and their kids I find Kaepernick's New York Fashion Week version of appropriating the Black Panther Party aesthetic to be pretty corny and eye rolling, but also harmless. Jay Caspian Kang recently wrote about how watching younger people reappropriating the parts that didn't matter from 60s radicalism for the cool pictures and the clout is very backwards looking and depressing, which I agree with, but in the grand scheme of things I also don't think it matters.

    b) That said I reject the idea that activists are impure if they make money. I think people involved in these movements regularly and very seriously have conversations about selling out and self interest and giving to the movement rather than taking from it, but the people who proudly announce Kap having made money as a criticism never seem to actually be involved in these movements, or to care beyond using the criticism as a way to score a point. So, I take that criticism as unseriously as the people who make it are, meaning I think it can absolutely be valid but isn't being made seriously.

    c) As for the Netflix show, I don't think I'm going to watch it? I was a fan of Kapernick as a player and remain a fan of his and the work he continues to do, but the trailer felt like a racism after school special plus infographics, and I'm not really sure who the audience is supposed to be. People who like Vox explainer videos? Middle schoolers? Me?

    Admittedly, another part for me is that while Kap is clearly very book smart he's never been a particularly interesting person to listen to. I kind of think oh him like a very scaled down version of Tank Man (the guy who stood in front of tanks and blocked them in Tiananmen Square) or the monk who set himself on fire in '63 to protest Diem's oppression of Buddhists. Kaepernick, like these guys, is important for what he did. I don't need to learn about their high school experiences, or for them to explain why they did what they did, to understand why they're important.

    For people who get something out of this I think that's great and for that reason I'm glad it exists, but I just don't think I'm probably the audience for that at this point in my life, or at least right now in my life.
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Sat Nov 06, 2021 3:47 pm
  • hawker84 wrote:I'll be the first to admit, I couldn't stand Kaepernick when he was playing. But this young man just continues to impress me. Here is a great docuseries to check out on Netflix...

    Seen "Colin in Black & White" on Netflix yet?

    https://www.netflix.com/us/title/802444 ... p=81265490


    Don't go to the scouting combine. It's a f*** slave market.
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Sun Nov 07, 2021 9:16 am
  • Popeyejones wrote:TWO THOUGHTS ON THIS:
    ... (ellipsed so people don't have to scroll through the whole post)
    For people who get something out of this I think that's great and for that reason I'm glad it exists, but I just don't think I'm probably the audience for that at this point in my life, or at least right now in my life.

    I appreciate this thoughtful and excellently nuanced post, Popeyejones.
    Somos doces
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Sun Nov 07, 2021 1:34 pm
  • VA49er wrote:
    hawker84 wrote:Welp, I obviously opened a can of worms here which was not my intention but I'm glad I did.

    I'll never understand why some folks get so angry when they see a person of color standing up for their beliefs, and doing whatever they can to uplift their own kind. Why does that anger some so much, in what way is that affecting you that you feel the need to lash out? There really us only one explanation....

    I'll never understand why some folks refuse to accept the fact that POC have been dealt an unfair hand in this country even to this day, when there is volumes of evidence to that suggests just that.

    We don't have to dwell on the pain of the past as long as we're working together for a brighter future. But that would mean equal treatment for all, and that's just asking a bit much.

    So what makes you so angry? If cops were out there shooting unarmed white males, I guarantee I'd be out there marching shoulder to shoulder with you in protest, why can't you do the same for us? Because it doesn't affect you?because that's the.way it's always been, and why fix something that ain't broke, right?

    This board is a microcosm of our state and country, and it's truly sad, in 2021 we are more divided than ever. And quite frankly, it's about to get much worse in a couple years.

    But what's really sad to me is that out of the 100's of posters on this site, only a handful had the courage to speak up in defense of Colin and my post, regardless if they agreed with his or my message or not.

    I'm sure you'll have a field day with this so have at it, hope it makes you feel better. I won't be replying because I won't be reading your responses. You couldn't possibly say anything more that would suprise or offend me that hasn't already been said. But I will leave you with this.

    My 6 year old grandson told me yesterday that a little white girl on his bus told him and I quote...

    "your black because your skin is dark, mine is not so I'm white, white people are better than black people". He asked me if that was true. I wanted to cry.

    6 years old and he's already having encounters with racism.. now I'm sure that little girl didn't know any better, probably just repeating what she learned at home. But my grandson will forever be scarred from that incident, and every incident in the future.

    And that VA49er is opression. Now you know. I have no delusion of hope you'll understand, but you've been whining for an example, now you have one...

    So I'll sign off and move on and leave you to your right wing Alt Right circle jerk. Enjoy your evening....


    Our entire conversation have you asked what my ethnicity is? No you haven't, you just assume who I am based on my feelings about CK. You know what they same about assuming.

    And since you say you're black or I believe you said 1/2 black but you say you'retreated as black, how about answering a few questions?

    What gender and race is most often shot by police in the US?

    What race commits the largest number of violent crimes against the black population of the US?

    Please don't google it, just answer what you believe to be true.


    The question in red is a $h!t question. If you go per capita, black men are more than twice as likely to get shot by LEO than white men. The rest are valid questions but have nuance in racism. This is why I continually say this is a problem that needs to be approached from both sides. All the police reform in the world isn't going to make enough difference if there isn't an effort to change violence culture in poor communities.
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Sun Nov 07, 2021 1:35 pm
  • JustTheTip wrote:
    VA49er wrote:
    hawker84 wrote:Welp, I obviously opened a can of worms here which was not my intention but I'm glad I did.

    I'll never understand why some folks get so angry when they see a person of color standing up for their beliefs, and doing whatever they can to uplift their own kind. Why does that anger some so much, in what way is that affecting you that you feel the need to lash out? There really us only one explanation....

    I'll never understand why some folks refuse to accept the fact that POC have been dealt an unfair hand in this country even to this day, when there is volumes of evidence to that suggests just that.

    We don't have to dwell on the pain of the past as long as we're working together for a brighter future. But that would mean equal treatment for all, and that's just asking a bit much.

    So what makes you so angry? If cops were out there shooting unarmed white males, I guarantee I'd be out there marching shoulder to shoulder with you in protest, why can't you do the same for us? Because it doesn't affect you?because that's the.way it's always been, and why fix something that ain't broke, right?

    This board is a microcosm of our state and country, and it's truly sad, in 2021 we are more divided than ever. And quite frankly, it's about to get much worse in a couple years.

    But what's really sad to me is that out of the 100's of posters on this site, only a handful had the courage to speak up in defense of Colin and my post, regardless if they agreed with his or my message or not.

    I'm sure you'll have a field day with this so have at it, hope it makes you feel better. I won't be replying because I won't be reading your responses. You couldn't possibly say anything more that would suprise or offend me that hasn't already been said. But I will leave you with this.

    My 6 year old grandson told me yesterday that a little white girl on his bus told him and I quote...

    "your black because your skin is dark, mine is not so I'm white, white people are better than black people". He asked me if that was true. I wanted to cry.

    6 years old and he's already having encounters with racism.. now I'm sure that little girl didn't know any better, probably just repeating what she learned at home. But my grandson will forever be scarred from that incident, and every incident in the future.

    And that VA49er is opression. Now you know. I have no delusion of hope you'll understand, but you've been whining for an example, now you have one...

    So I'll sign off and move on and leave you to your right wing Alt Right circle jerk. Enjoy your evening....


    Our entire conversation have you asked what my ethnicity is? No you haven't, you just assume who I am based on my feelings about CK. You know what they same about assuming.

    And since you say you're black or I believe you said 1/2 black but you say you'retreated as black, how about answering a few questions?

    What gender and race is most often shot by police in the US?

    What race commits the largest number of violent crimes against the black population of the US?

    Please don't google it, just answer what you believe to be true.


    The question in red is a $h!t question. If you go per capita, black men are more than twice as likely to get shot by LEO than white men. The rest are valid questions but have nuance in racism. This is why I continually say this is a problem that needs to be approached from both sides. All the police reform in the world isn't going to make enough difference if there isn't an effort to change violence culture in poor communities.


    How about the 3rd?
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Sun Nov 07, 2021 3:06 pm
  • Somos doces wrote:
    Popeyejones wrote:TWO THOUGHTS ON THIS:
    ... (ellipsed so people don't have to scroll through the whole post)
    For people who get something out of this I think that's great and for that reason I'm glad it exists, but I just don't think I'm probably the audience for that at this point in my life, or at least right now in my life.

    I appreciate this thoughtful and excellently nuanced post, Popeyejones.


    Thanks, Somos!
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Sun Nov 14, 2021 11:08 pm
  • JustTheTip wrote:
    VA49er wrote:What gender and race is most often shot by police in the US?

    What race commits the largest number of violent crimes against the black population of the US?

    Please don't google it, just answer what you believe to be true.


    The question in red is a $h!t question. If you go per capita, black men are more than twice as likely to get shot by LEO than white men. The rest are valid questions but have nuance in racism. This is why I continually say this is a problem that needs to be approached from both sides. All the police reform in the world isn't going to make enough difference if there isn't an effort to change violence culture in poor communities.


    So you prefer the "per capita" analysis and don't like that his question doesn't align with your preferred narrative. There are a lot of different ways to look at the data. This article has a few different ways of looking at police shootings. Spoiler: It doesn't support the "racist police shootings" narrative.
    https://phys.org/news/2019-07-white-pol ... ities.html
    "By connecting the findings of police officer race, victim race and crime rates, the research suggests that the best way to understand police shootings isn't racial bias of the police officer; rather, by the exposure to police officers through crime."

    CK is a highly privileged self-serving race hustler who worships the almighty dollar. NFL teams decided he wasn't a good enough QB when he last played to be worth the baggage he'd bring and contract he'd demand. Plus they noticed the activism gig was his priority over the QB gig. (Kind of like clearly privileged Johnny Manziel prioritized the party gig over the NFL QB gig.)

    Chicago has tried to have Kaepernicks's back for years, as evidenced here:
    https://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/08/colin- ... dier-field

    Still waiting for CK to return Chicago's love and show up in Chicago to protest all the black lives lost there.
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Sun Nov 14, 2021 11:38 pm
  • hawker84 wrote:I'll be the first to admit, I couldn't stand Kaepernick when he was playing. But this young man just continues to impress me. Here is a great docuseries to check out on Netflix...

    Seen "Colin in Black & White" on Netflix yet?

    https://www.netflix.com/us/title/802444 ... p=81265490


    Why couldn't you stand him as a player?
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Mon Nov 15, 2021 9:12 am
  • hawker84 wrote:
    VA49er wrote:
    hawker84 wrote:
    xray wrote:He played the racial " hair card ". ... " See how black I am ? " Sad on many levels .


    So a black man wearing a hair style that has been around for centuries is playing the race card? Do you have any idea how racist that remark is? Tell the truth, that really is you in your avatar, it has to be...

    News flash Jethro, anytime a black man wants to see how black he really is, just needs to walk up and down the street at 3am. Or perform a peaceful protest during the national anthem.


    He didn't start wearing his hair in a fro or corn rows until it was convenient for his agenda, you know kinda like "heels up Harris" doesn't claim to be black until she feels it helps her narrative.


    You're ignorance is truly astounding.
    He's been wearing his hair in a fro his whole life and got corn rows fornthe first time when he was 14. Again why do you care how he wears his hair....? And did you actually type he's trying to look blacker?

    I know this is gonna shock you, but there's nothing a black man can do to look more black. Kinda sounds silly when I say it back to you doesn't it.

    You're special, there's no denying that now.. by the way, I answered your question in my last post. You won't get it though. But then again I don't care. I truly feel dumber having talked to you these last couple days, that takes real talent. Congrats...


    hawker84, all of your arguments reek of "I'm black, racism exists to the extent I tell you it does, you can never understand it anyways because of your privilege of not being black, if you deny this its a sign of your fragility, yada yada yada." You seem very content with stopping at surface level information and uninterested in diving into the nuances of a very complex situation.
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Re: Colin in Black and White
Tue Nov 16, 2021 12:10 pm
  • olyfan63 wrote:
    JustTheTip wrote:
    VA49er wrote:What gender and race is most often shot by police in the US?

    What race commits the largest number of violent crimes against the black population of the US?

    Please don't google it, just answer what you believe to be true.


    The question in red is a $h!t question. If you go per capita, black men are more than twice as likely to get shot by LEO than white men. The rest are valid questions but have nuance in racism. This is why I continually say this is a problem that needs to be approached from both sides. All the police reform in the world isn't going to make enough difference if there isn't an effort to change violence culture in poor communities.


    So you prefer the "per capita" analysis and don't like that his question doesn't align with your preferred narrative. There are a lot of different ways to look at the data. This article has a few different ways of looking at police shootings. Spoiler: It doesn't support the "racist police shootings" narrative.
    https://phys.org/news/2019-07-white-pol ... ities.html
    "By connecting the findings of police officer race, victim race and crime rates, the research suggests that the best way to understand police shootings isn't racial bias of the police officer; rather, by the exposure to police officers through crime."

    CK is a highly privileged self-serving race hustler who worships the almighty dollar. NFL teams decided he wasn't a good enough QB when he last played to be worth the baggage he'd bring and contract he'd demand. Plus they noticed the activism gig was his priority over the QB gig. (Kind of like clearly privileged Johnny Manziel prioritized the party gig over the NFL QB gig.)

    Chicago has tried to have Kaepernicks's back for years, as evidenced here:
    https://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/08/colin- ... dier-field

    Still waiting for CK to return Chicago's love and show up in Chicago to protest all the black lives lost there.


    I don't have a narrative. People you don't agree with don't like my input either. I don't disagree with the need to consider the rate at which crime is being committed by race. I also think that in probably 80%+ of police shootings where shooting was not the correct response the person being shot holds a not-insignificant portion of the responsibility for the shooting occurring (ie, they aren't victims). For those people, we need to stop treating them like they are owed something for being a victim.
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