Bruce Irvin

[Blitzer88]

I hope Bruce has a good year for us this year as we do need him to step it up a bit.

 

[RiverDog]

Patience is a virtue.

Chris Clemons first 3 years in the NFL: 16 tackles, 5 sacks, 2 PD, 2 FF, 3 AV

Bruce Irvin first 2 years in the NFL: 62 tackles, 10 sacks, 2 PD, 2 FF, 1 INT, 10 AV

Seeing how Bruce Irvin is bigger, stronger, faster and all-around more athletic than Chris Clemons was at point of entry... the potential is there to be a great LEO prospect.

Seeing how Bruce Irvin was a very raw project player and not only need coaching but experience, leads me to believe he'll age just fine like Clemons did but faster.

Seeing how Bruce Irvin needed to think like Linebacker in order to become a better LEO, I would say he's still on schedule in his development.

Sorry, guys not everyone can dominant to your standards from Day 1... Bruce Irvin is still growing as a player and he possesses the right passion to deliver himself to his potential one day despite all you negative nancys who just love to trash talk players without ever understanding the situations those players are in Ie. Carpenter and Sweezy. You guys act like players can't ever get better or work to strengthen their weaknesses over time.

IMO the most discouraging thing about Irvin last year was that we were not using him like Quinn and PC said they were going to. When Irvin was drafted, he was supposed to be Chris Clemmons eventual replacement at Leo. You would have thought that with Clemmons having undergone major knee surgery that they would have moved Irvin into that position at the start of the season, but the decision was made to put him in this "spinner" role, which would allow him to free lance on the LOS, rush from different spots, etc, but that never seemed to come to fruition, either, as Irvin's playing time diminished as the season went on and he was being pulled in most passing situations.

You can come up with rationalizations for almost any player, excuse their play due to an unfamiliarity with the position, a PED suspension, and preach patience, but that's not what I would call positive progress. It's pretty hard to disguise the fact that he's not progressing as one would expect a #15 overall selection that's heading into his 3rd year.

 

[hawknation2014]

IMO the most discouraging thing about Irvin last year was that we were not using him like Quinn and PC said they were going to. When Irvin was drafted, he was supposed to be Chris Clemmons eventual replacement at Leo. You would have thought that with Clemmons having undergone major knee surgery that they would have moved Irvin into that position at the start of the season, but the decision was made to put him in this "spinner" role, which would allow him to free lance on the LOS, rush from different spots, etc, but that never seemed to come to fruition, either, as Irvin's playing time diminished as the season went on and he was being pulled in most passing situations.

You can come up with rationalizations for almost any player, excuse their play due to an unfamiliarity with the position, a PED suspension, and preach patience, but that's not what I would call positive progress. It's pretty hard to disguise the fact that he's not progressing as one would expect a #15 overall selection that's heading into his 3rd year.

The Seahawks had a strong rotation at LEO in 2013 with Bennett and Clemons, so they had the luxury of developing Irvin at SLB. Irvin was productive at LEO as just a rookie (19 QB hits), and he was efficient as a two-down player at SLB. It's nice to have that kind of versatility locked up for the next two seasons.

 

[RiverDog]

The Seahawks had a strong rotation at LEO in 2013 with Bennett and Clemons, so they had the luxury of developing Irvin at SLB. Irvin was productive at LEO as just a rookie (19 QB hits), and he was efficient as a two-down player at SLB. It's nice to have that kind of versatility locked up for the next two seasons.

Irvin didn't play Leo in his rookie year, except for one game after Clemmons got hurt in the playoffs. In that game, vs. Atlanta in the divisional round, he looked awful, which might have had something to do with his move to OLB.

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

@Riverdog?

Rationalize?

How about just the truth?

Bruce Irvin was drafted before Chris Clemons signed a 3 year deal.

That's says to me at least they felt he was a 3 year project before they felt he could be a starting LE0.

They also signed Avril to a 2 yr contract that would also put Irvin as being the prime LEO in his 4th year if they don't resign Avril.

That part was simple speculation but the truth is:

Clemons made 8 million last year, he's an alpha dog, and he fought his way back from injury to reclaim his starting position.

Irvin was also out much of the PS with a groin injury and then had to miss the first 4 games because of said suspension. However he did start 12 games for the best defense in the NFL. He wasn't a play-maker but its not like he was a weaknesses. He did the job Quinn asked.

And FYI the Seahawks started getting cute with the pass-rush @Arizona, that produce what 7 sack and the continuation of trying to be cute with the pass-rush backfired @STL and vs TB where those teams put up 200 yards each on us. Quinn then simplified the technique, just stuck to rushing four without all the complexities and we started playing better again.

Irvin's Progression

Yr 1: Learn how pass-rush without just relying on speed. He worked on that.
Yr 2: Learn how to think like a LBer: Tackling through garbage, dropping into coverage, setting the strongside, defending the flats. He worked on that.
Yr 3: because of yr 1 and yr 2... he has the experience needed to be a better LEO prospect and he'll continue to get bigger, stronger, and smarter imo... he has the best coaching and the best players around him to ensure that plus the attitude to get it done.


For me I can't wait for Irvin to play the LEO2 position again only because his time as an LB should open the Delayed Zone Blitz more that Wagner has been so successful at.

 

[3Girls'HawkDad]

Irvin sucks

 

[HawKnPeppa]

Irvin sucks

Some peeps continue to bring the most insightful ish.

 

[RiverDog]

@Riverdog?

Rationalize?

How about just the truth?

Bruce Irvin was drafted before Chris Clemons signed a 3 year deal.

That's says to me at least they felt he was a 3 year project before they felt he could be a starting LE0.

They also signed Avril to a 2 yr contract that would also put Irvin as being the prime LEO in his 4th year if they don't resign Avril.

That part was simple speculation but the truth is:

Clemons made 8 million last year, he's an alpha dog, and he fought his way back from injury to reclaim his starting position.

Irvin was also out much of the PS with a groin injury and then had to miss the first 4 games because of said suspension. However he did start 12 games for the best defense in the NFL. He wasn't a play-maker but its not like he was a weaknesses. He did the job Quinn asked.

And FYI the Seahawks started getting cute with the pass-rush @Arizona, that produce what 7 sack and the continuation of trying to be cute with the pass-rush backfired @STL and vs TB where those teams put up 200 yards each on us. Quinn then simplified the technique, just stuck to rushing four without all the complexities and we started playing better again.

Irvin's Progression

Yr 1: Learn how pass-rush without just relying on speed. He worked on that.
Yr 2: Learn how to think like a LBer: Tackling through garbage, dropping into coverage, setting the strongside, defending the flats. He worked on that.
Yr 3: because of yr 1 and yr 2... he has the experience needed to be a better LEO prospect and he'll continue to get bigger, stronger, and smarter imo... he has the best coaching and the best players around him to ensure that plus the attitude to get it done.


For me I can't wait for Irvin to play the LEO2 position again only because his time as an LB should open the Delayed Zone Blitz more that Wagner has been so successful at.

If the plan for him to be the starting Leo was on schedule, you would think that we would have seen him at that position for more than one game in the past two seasons. He hasn't played a down at that position since that awful performance vs. Atlanta and there's been no indication that they've been working him out there since then. Was it so bad that they gave up on him as a Leo and looked for a home for him somewhere else on the field? Did they not like what they saw out of him in practice when they worked him out at Leo? Perhaps you're right, that we'll see him at Leo this season and that he'll do just fine. But I have my doubts. He's never been a good run stopper and he'll be going up against the best OL on the opposing team if they play him at Leo.

A lot of people, myself included, came up with multiple rationalizations for Aaron Curry's slow start and had to be dragged kicking and screaming before we finally admitted that he was a bust. I'm stopping short of predicting that Irvin's fate will reflect that of Curry's, but I see some common threads to how us fans have viewed both players performance at similar points in their careers. This is Year 3, we should see something out of him that would justify the #15 overall selection, whether that be at Leo or some other place on the field.

 

[hawknation2014]

If the plan for him to be the starting Leo was on schedule, you would think that we would have seen him at that position for more than one game in the past two seasons. He hasn't played a down at that position since that awful performance vs. Atlanta and there's been no indication that they've been working him out there since then.

This is actually not true. In fact, Irvin lined up at the LEO position for almost all of his snaps in the Super Bowl. That dominant team defensive performance may have been a sign of things to come this season with Wright and Smith back at their natural positions, and Irvin getting more opportunities to rush the passer at LEO.

The reason Irvin didn't get many opportunities to rush the passer in 2013 was two fold: (1) Seattle had a surplus of outside pass rushers with Bennett, Avril, and Clemons giving them a perfect rotation; and (2) the coaches wanted to further develop Irvin's skills at SLB. And the experiment worked out pretty well. Irvin started 14 games at SLB and had one of the highest grades of any SLB in the league, per PFF. But now that Smith has asserted himself as the ideal WLB and Clemons has been released, there is a more obvious opportunity for Irvin to continue developing his pass rushing skills at the LEO position. The fact that Irvin is now listed solely as a DE on the team's roster is a positive indicator.

Carroll, in an interview with a few reporters at the NFL Combine, said that Irvin’s role is “a blend, and it will continue to be a blend of the outside backer stuff and the rush end stuff, and we are thrilled about him. He had a really good year playing linebacker and we want to continue to develop his rush ability. It took away a little bit from that (playing LEO) because he was dropping and covering people, which he did really well. But we’d like to continue to develop his rush ability as we go forward. We used him in the (Super Bowl) quite a bit (at LEO) but he was sprinkled in throughout the season.”

 

[RiverDog]

If the plan for him to be the starting Leo was on schedule, you would think that we would have seen him at that position for more than one game in the past two seasons. He hasn't played a down at that position since that awful performance vs. Atlanta and there's been no indication that they've been working him out there since then.

This is actually not true. In fact, Irvin lined up at the LEO position for almost all of his snaps in the Super Bowl. That dominant team defensive performance may have been a sign of things to come this season with Wright and Smith back at their natural positions, and Irvin getting more opportunities to rush the passer at LEO.

The reason Irvin didn't get many opportunities to rush the passer in 2013 was two fold: (1) Seattle had a surplus of outside pass rushers with Bennett, Avril, and Clemons giving them a perfect rotation; and (2) the coaches wanted to further develop Irvin's skills at SLB. And the experiment worked out pretty well. Irvin started 14 games at SLB and had one of the highest grades of any SLB in the league, per PFF. But now that Smith has asserted himself as the ideal WLB and Clemons has been released, there is a more obvious opportunity for Irvin to continue developing his pass rushing skills at the LEO position. The fact that Irvin is now listed solely as a DE on the team's roster is a positive indicator.

Carroll, in an interview with a few reporters at the NFL Combine, said that Irvin’s role is “a blend, and it will continue to be a blend of the outside backer stuff and the rush end stuff, and we are thrilled about him. He had a really good year playing linebacker and we want to continue to develop his rush ability. It took away a little bit from that (playing LEO) because he was dropping and covering people, which he did really well. But we’d like to continue to develop his rush ability as we go forward. We used him in the (Super Bowl) quite a bit (at LEO) but he was sprinkled in throughout the season.”

OK, you got me on that one. Nice job. Nevertheless, Irvin's percentage of available snaps anywhere on the field diminished as the season wore on, so it's hard to believe that they were completely satisfied.

As far as the quote from Pete, that's Pete Speak, and should be taken with a grain of salt. He's the same Pete that once said that he was going to "build around Tavaris." Not that he's any different than any other NFL head coach in that regard.

 

[hawknation2014]

If the plan for him to be the starting Leo was on schedule, you would think that we would have seen him at that position for more than one game in the past two seasons. He hasn't played a down at that position since that awful performance vs. Atlanta and there's been no indication that they've been working him out there since then. Was it so bad that they gave up on him as a Leo and looked for a home for him somewhere else on the field?

I have watched the Super Bowl about a dozen times. I am 100% certain Irvin substituted for Clemons at LEO on at least ten snaps. For example, if you go to the 13 min. mark of the 3rd Quarter, you will see Clemons go to the sideline after the defense gives up the first down, while Irvin enters the game and lines up at LEO. Irvin rushes into the backfield unblocked from LEO, and then chases down Demaryius Thomas on the screen pass. Not many DEs are athletic enough to make that play.

 

[RiverDog]

If the plan for him to be the starting Leo was on schedule, you would think that we would have seen him at that position for more than one game in the past two seasons. He hasn't played a down at that position since that awful performance vs. Atlanta and there's been no indication that they've been working him out there since then. Was it so bad that they gave up on him as a Leo and looked for a home for him somewhere else on the field?

I have watched the Super Bowl about a dozen times. I am 100% certain Irvin substituted for Clemons at LEO on at least ten snaps. For example, if you go to the 13 min. mark of the 3rd Quarter, you will see Clemons go to the sideline after the defense gives up the first down, while Irvin enters the game and lines up at LEO. Irvin rushes into the backfield unblocked from LEO, and then chases down Demaryius Thomas on the screen pass. Not many DEs are athletic enough to make that play.

OK, I already conceded your point about Irvin at Leo.

I watched the SB twice, and didn't see Irvin very much, but I wasn't looking for him, either. You gotta admit that he was pretty easy to miss as he was in on just 17 plays, compared to the 40-50 snaps the other starters in the front 7 got and considering that those 17 snaps produced just two tackles and zippo QB sacks or pressures. He only had 5 tackles in the entire post season, and no sacks or pressures in any of those contests. He only saw 23 snaps in the NFCCG, and that produced 1 tackle and zero sacks or pressures. Irvin was a non factor in the post season.

 

[hawknation2014]

If the plan for him to be the starting Leo was on schedule, you would think that we would have seen him at that position for more than one game in the past two seasons. He hasn't played a down at that position since that awful performance vs. Atlanta and there's been no indication that they've been working him out there since then. Was it so bad that they gave up on him as a Leo and looked for a home for him somewhere else on the field?

I have watched the Super Bowl about a dozen times. I am 100% certain Irvin substituted for Clemons at LEO on at least ten snaps. For example, if you go to the 13 min. mark of the 3rd Quarter, you will see Clemons go to the sideline after the defense gives up the first down, while Irvin enters the game and lines up at LEO. Irvin rushes into the backfield unblocked from LEO, and then chases down Demaryius Thomas on the screen pass. Not many DEs are athletic enough to make that play.

OK, I already conceded your point about Irvin at Leo.

I watched the SB twice, and didn't see Irvin very much, but I wasn't looking for him, either. You gotta admit that he was pretty easy to miss as he was in on just 17 plays, compared to the 40-50 snaps the other starters in the front 7 got and considering that those 17 snaps produced just two tackles and zippo QB sacks or pressures. He only had 5 tackles in the entire post season, and no sacks or pressures in any of those contests. He only saw 23 snaps in the NFCCG, and that produced 1 tackle and zero sacks or pressures. Irvin was a non factor in the post season.

Sorry, I didn't see your post above. Irvin split reps at SLB with K.J. Wight in the NFCCG with Irvin taking 60% of those reps and Wright getting around 40%. The rest of the time (23 snaps) the coaches elected to replace the SLB with a nickel corner. On the other side, Smith was on the field at WLB for 93% of the total defensive snaps.

With Wright out in the Divisional game, Irvin took 43/45 reps at SLB and played well. For the other 23 reps, the coaches had a nickel on the field.

I, for one, am excited to see how Irvin does this season with more pass rushing opportunities.

 

[Evil_Shenanigans]

Irvin was the guy I most wanted to see excel last year and it just was not to be. As has been mentioned, the lack of production when Clemons got hurt the year before I think played a major role in Pete Moving him to LB and adding Avril and Bennett. The guy is one of the more naturally gifted athletes on the team so I think he can do well practically wherever you put him but he has just not found his niche yet. Whether he remains at LB or moves back into the DE role is a question we will have to wait and see. I am leaning towards the latter. The main reason is the loss of Clemons. I believe that is going to be a big hole to fill. When you look around the defense you see guys at the top of their game at nearly all positions. Irvin needs to join that party, wherever he lands.

 

[TwilightError]

So a LEO is a hybrid of OLB and DE, irvin has now had a season of both. If he becomes a finished product during this season and plays a career year next season, will we be able to pay him? Or did we polish a rough diamond for some other team? No biggie if the diamond already has more than one ring though...

I really like Irvin and would like to see him a longtime Seahawk, but there are obstacles on the way for that to happen.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

So a LEO is a hybrid of OLB and DE, irvin has now had a season of both. If he becomes a finished product during this season and plays a career year next season, will we be able to pay him? Or did we polish a rough diamond for some other team? No biggie if the diamond already has more than one ring though...

I really like Irvin and would like to see him a longtime Seahawk, but there are obstacles on the way for that to happen.

That's a worry for another day. Don't buy trouble.

 

[TwilightError]

That's a worry for another day. Don't buy trouble.

True dat.

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

By the way I thought 1st round contracts are 5 years? Or at least have that option. That not true?

 

[RiverDog]

If the plan for him to be the starting Leo was on schedule, you would think that we would have seen him at that position for more than one game in the past two seasons. He hasn't played a down at that position since that awful performance vs. Atlanta and there's been no indication that they've been working him out there since then. Was it so bad that they gave up on him as a Leo and looked for a home for him somewhere else on the field?

I have watched the Super Bowl about a dozen times. I am 100% certain Irvin substituted for Clemons at LEO on at least ten snaps. For example, if you go to the 13 min. mark of the 3rd Quarter, you will see Clemons go to the sideline after the defense gives up the first down, while Irvin enters the game and lines up at LEO. Irvin rushes into the backfield unblocked from LEO, and then chases down Demaryius Thomas on the screen pass. Not many DEs are athletic enough to make that play.

OK, I already conceded your point about Irvin at Leo.

I watched the SB twice, and didn't see Irvin very much, but I wasn't looking for him, either. You gotta admit that he was pretty easy to miss as he was in on just 17 plays, compared to the 40-50 snaps the other starters in the front 7 got and considering that those 17 snaps produced just two tackles and zippo QB sacks or pressures. He only had 5 tackles in the entire post season, and no sacks or pressures in any of those contests. He only saw 23 snaps in the NFCCG, and that produced 1 tackle and zero sacks or pressures. Irvin was a non factor in the post season.

Sorry, I didn't see your post above. Irvin split reps at SLB with K.J. Wight in the NFCCG with Irvin taking 60% of those reps and Wright getting around 40%. The rest of the time (23 snaps) the coaches elected to replace the SLB with a nickel corner. On the other side, Smith was on the field at WLB for 93% of the total defensive snaps.

With Wright out in the Divisional game, Irvin took 43/45 reps at SLB and played well. For the other 23 reps, the coaches had a nickel on the field.

I, for one, am excited to see how Irvin does this season with more pass rushing opportunities.

Played well? In those 43 snaps, Irvin had two tackles and zero sacks.

 

[FreshlySnipes]

Why are we attempting to judge Irvin by comparing his progress to RW.
Few 1st rounders will ever be as polished as RW (a third round)in their first years as a pro. Irvin's progress has been slowed by position change but we know he has great athleticism and has proven versatile. He's been able to stay out of trouble which was one of the biggest question going into his pro career. He could someday be an Aldon Smith type player minus the Bipolar craziness.

Uhh Aaron Curry??