Dear Russell Wilson

[kf3339]

Sources: Offense source of friction
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A quick search and I found this from Werder. You'll notice it says he CHECKED into a pass play.

Dec 24, 2009
Ed Werder
ESPN NFL Insider
MINNEAPOLIS -- The tension between Minnesota Vikings quarterback Brett Favre and coach Brad Childress is the result of disagreement over how much influence each should expect to have in running the offense during games, according to multiple team sources.


Childress has a reputation for limiting the number of audibles he allows his quarterbacks to call at the line of scrimmage. Favre apparently believes his knowledge of the offensive system and 19 years of NFL experience qualify him to make changes based on his extensive film study of opponents.

Although the two have discussed their recent disagreement -- which became public when Favre resisted Childress' attempts to pull him from Sunday night's loss in Carolina -- it is unclear whether they have resolved the fundamental issue: Are Childress and his coaching staff going to control the game from the sideline, or will Favre be permitted the autonomy he feels is necessary to control it at the line of scrimmage?

At news conferences on Wednesday, Childress and Favre said they had spoken and resolved to move forward. Childress said they had a "good talk" on Monday and Wednesday about their disagreement

"He and I talked, as we have all year," Favre said, adding that given the team's recent slump, "the frustration is gonna show."

"It's gotten blown way out of proportion," he said.

With the NFC North-leading Vikings (11-3) mired in an offensive slump that has seen them lose two of their last three games, Favre has indicated to teammates he is moving forward and is focused on Monday night's game against the Chicago Bears, the Vikings' first cold-weather game of the season.

What happened in Carolina and in several other games this season in which Childress considered removing Favre for too often changing running plays into pass attempts has nothing to do with Childress attempting to protect his 40-year-old quarterback from punishment or wanting to replace Favre with a quarterback who offers a different style, sources said.


According to sources, Favre dislikes that Childress seldom discusses the game plan with him during the week, and does not encourage the quarterback to offer suggestions as to which plays he feels most comfortable calling in certain situations. When Favre changes the play at the line of scrimmage -- using his film study and experience -- Childress bristles, even when the audible Favre calls works perfectly.

Wednesday, Favre addressed that report, saying he has not demanded more freedom to call his own shots.

"I think there are times I see things that maybe I feel like we could get to or a change that maybe at the line of scrimmage I could get to. As I've told [offensive coordinator] Darrell [Bevell] and I've told [Childress] and anyone who has ever played the game -- we all think we know it all at some point. I know that's not the case," Favre said.

"I know our offense starts with Adrian Peterson and that's where it ends and we have to get that back on track," he said. "However, we do that we have to get it back on track and we're working towards it. I'm not going up there and saying, 'Hey, you have to give me more freedom,' because we've been good this year. We've sputtered the last couple of weeks but it can be fixed. I don't think anything major has to happen other than we have to play better."

Favre's experience in the offense -- which, before he signed, he said he knew better than the coaches -- and his leadership were among the qualities he thought the Vikings valued most in pursuing him. Teammates and coaches have lauded the endless hours Favre dedicates to studying tape of opponents, one coach saying Favre knows the names of the janitors at the team complex because he keeps such late hours.

Teammates have apparently supported Favre's refusal to leave the field against Carolina when he had what the quarterback later terms as a "heated discussion" with Childress.

LeRoy Butler, Favre's former teammate in Green Bay, said he was not surprised by the incident, explaining that he believes "Everybody in Minnesota knows that Brett Favre is running that organization," according to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.

Butler, who earlier this season was critical of his former Packers teammate for signing with the archrival Vikings, said Favre should not have questioned Childress when he was asked to come out of the game at Carolina, according to the report.

I saw the same article, but it is not indicative of what happened that whole season, but just one instance. Again I will try to find the actual TV interviews where both Favre and other players made statements about the situation.

 

[Siouxhawk]

Should have just said "Fire Bevell" Sheesh.

Nowhere did I say any such thing. My comments were to Wilson; not Bevell.

"Dear Russell, please call your own plays and ignore Mr. Bevell"

I paraphrase, but...

Actually, Yes.

That is completely different from saying Fire Bevell. But I would trust a QB (Wilson) with 66 career regular season starts and 10 postseason starts than an OC who has "NEVER" played in an NFL game. My point is I believe Wilson is now better qualified to run this offense than Bevell. He is not a rookie any longer. He is a true veteran.That's it.

If we were talking about TJ the answer would be absolutely NO. But were talking about Wilson.

Some think this is foreign to the QB position. The fact is the NFL has had many past QB's who have called their own plays. Many are in the Hall of Fame with mulitple Super Bowl rings. This is not unusual at all.

When's the last time that's happened? 1972?
At this stage, they are trying to give Russ more control to freely call an audible at the line of scrimmage. He'll get more comfortable with that.
Let's also remember that there's no mutiny on the team that you seem to be suggesting with this radical idea. The game plan is put in chunks over the week. Unlike that Favre story, from what I infer, Russ is an active participant in the film room in scripting that together.

 

[LeftHandSmoke]

Maybe instead of it being a binary question of Do They or Don't They have authority to 'call their own plays,' it is more a question around How Much Latitude the QB's have.

Latitude must surely vary between various OC/QB relationships. I'm happy with ours given the recent good evidence of it.

 

[chris98251]

Sources: Offense source of friction
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A quick search and I found this from Werder. You'll notice it says he CHECKED into a pass play.

Dec 24, 2009
Ed Werder
ESPN NFL Insider
MINNEAPOLIS -- The tension between Minnesota Vikings quarterback Brett Favre and coach Brad Childress is the result of disagreement over how much influence each should expect to have in running the offense during games, according to multiple team sources.


Childress has a reputation for limiting the number of audibles he allows his quarterbacks to call at the line of scrimmage. Favre apparently believes his knowledge of the offensive system and 19 years of NFL experience qualify him to make changes based on his extensive film study of opponents.

Although the two have discussed their recent disagreement -- which became public when Favre resisted Childress' attempts to pull him from Sunday night's loss in Carolina -- it is unclear whether they have resolved the fundamental issue: Are Childress and his coaching staff going to control the game from the sideline, or will Favre be permitted the autonomy he feels is necessary to control it at the line of scrimmage?

At news conferences on Wednesday, Childress and Favre said they had spoken and resolved to move forward. Childress said they had a "good talk" on Monday and Wednesday about their disagreement

"He and I talked, as we have all year," Favre said, adding that given the team's recent slump, "the frustration is gonna show."

"It's gotten blown way out of proportion," he said.

With the NFC North-leading Vikings (11-3) mired in an offensive slump that has seen them lose two of their last three games, Favre has indicated to teammates he is moving forward and is focused on Monday night's game against the Chicago Bears, the Vikings' first cold-weather game of the season.

What happened in Carolina and in several other games this season in which Childress considered removing Favre for too often changing running plays into pass attempts has nothing to do with Childress attempting to protect his 40-year-old quarterback from punishment or wanting to replace Favre with a quarterback who offers a different style, sources said.


According to sources, Favre dislikes that Childress seldom discusses the game plan with him during the week, and does not encourage the quarterback to offer suggestions as to which plays he feels most comfortable calling in certain situations. When Favre changes the play at the line of scrimmage -- using his film study and experience -- Childress bristles, even when the audible Favre calls works perfectly.

Wednesday, Favre addressed that report, saying he has not demanded more freedom to call his own shots.

"I think there are times I see things that maybe I feel like we could get to or a change that maybe at the line of scrimmage I could get to. As I've told [offensive coordinator] Darrell [Bevell] and I've told [Childress] and anyone who has ever played the game -- we all think we know it all at some point. I know that's not the case," Favre said.

"I know our offense starts with Adrian Peterson and that's where it ends and we have to get that back on track," he said. "However, we do that we have to get it back on track and we're working towards it. I'm not going up there and saying, 'Hey, you have to give me more freedom,' because we've been good this year. We've sputtered the last couple of weeks but it can be fixed. I don't think anything major has to happen other than we have to play better."

Favre's experience in the offense -- which, before he signed, he said he knew better than the coaches -- and his leadership were among the qualities he thought the Vikings valued most in pursuing him. Teammates and coaches have lauded the endless hours Favre dedicates to studying tape of opponents, one coach saying Favre knows the names of the janitors at the team complex because he keeps such late hours.

Teammates have apparently supported Favre's refusal to leave the field against Carolina when he had what the quarterback later terms as a "heated discussion" with Childress.

LeRoy Butler, Favre's former teammate in Green Bay, said he was not surprised by the incident, explaining that he believes "Everybody in Minnesota knows that Brett Favre is running that organization," according to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.

Butler, who earlier this season was critical of his former Packers teammate for signing with the archrival Vikings, said Favre should not have questioned Childress when he was asked to come out of the game at Carolina, according to the report.

Childress was fired, Bevell was not even the guy in the conversation so it makes sense that Farve discounted him and brushed him off. Bevell was OC in title not application, he may have looked like an idiot as well considering Childress wasn't communicating crap.

 

[StoneCold]

Should have just said "Fire Bevell" Sheesh.

Nowhere did I say any such thing. My comments were to Wilson; not Bevell.

"Dear Russell, please call your own plays and ignore Mr. Bevell"

I paraphrase, but...

Actually, Yes.

That is completely different from saying Fire Bevell. But I would trust a QB (Wilson) with 66 career regular season starts and 10 postseason starts than an OC who has "NEVER" played in an NFL game. My point is I believe Wilson is now better qualified to run this offense than Bevell. He is not a rookie any longer. He is a true veteran.That's it.

If we were talking about TJ the answer would be absolutely NO. But were talking about Wilson.

Some think this is foreign to the QB position. The fact is the NFL has had many past QB's who have called their own plays. Many are in the Hall of Fame with multiple Super Bowl rings. This is not unusual at all.

Russel should and does call audibles, but it's not because he's smarter than or better at it than Bevell. The play gets called, they go to the line of scrimmage and the defense shifts. That's why the play gets changed. RW should and does have the option to call audibles, but I think it's silly to tell him to ignore the OC. If you're going to ignore him then fire him.

 

[Siouxhawk]

Sources: Offense source of friction
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Twitter
A quick search and I found this from Werder. You'll notice it says he CHECKED into a pass play.

Dec 24, 2009
Ed Werder
ESPN NFL Insider
MINNEAPOLIS -- The tension between Minnesota Vikings quarterback Brett Favre and coach Brad Childress is the result of disagreement over how much influence each should expect to have in running the offense during games, according to multiple team sources.


Childress has a reputation for limiting the number of audibles he allows his quarterbacks to call at the line of scrimmage. Favre apparently believes his knowledge of the offensive system and 19 years of NFL experience qualify him to make changes based on his extensive film study of opponents.

Although the two have discussed their recent disagreement -- which became public when Favre resisted Childress' attempts to pull him from Sunday night's loss in Carolina -- it is unclear whether they have resolved the fundamental issue: Are Childress and his coaching staff going to control the game from the sideline, or will Favre be permitted the autonomy he feels is necessary to control it at the line of scrimmage?

At news conferences on Wednesday, Childress and Favre said they had spoken and resolved to move forward. Childress said they had a "good talk" on Monday and Wednesday about their disagreement

"He and I talked, as we have all year," Favre said, adding that given the team's recent slump, "the frustration is gonna show."

"It's gotten blown way out of proportion," he said.

With the NFC North-leading Vikings (11-3) mired in an offensive slump that has seen them lose two of their last three games, Favre has indicated to teammates he is moving forward and is focused on Monday night's game against the Chicago Bears, the Vikings' first cold-weather game of the season.

What happened in Carolina and in several other games this season in which Childress considered removing Favre for too often changing running plays into pass attempts has nothing to do with Childress attempting to protect his 40-year-old quarterback from punishment or wanting to replace Favre with a quarterback who offers a different style, sources said.


According to sources, Favre dislikes that Childress seldom discusses the game plan with him during the week, and does not encourage the quarterback to offer suggestions as to which plays he feels most comfortable calling in certain situations. When Favre changes the play at the line of scrimmage -- using his film study and experience -- Childress bristles, even when the audible Favre calls works perfectly.

Wednesday, Favre addressed that report, saying he has not demanded more freedom to call his own shots.

"I think there are times I see things that maybe I feel like we could get to or a change that maybe at the line of scrimmage I could get to. As I've told [offensive coordinator] Darrell [Bevell] and I've told [Childress] and anyone who has ever played the game -- we all think we know it all at some point. I know that's not the case," Favre said.

"I know our offense starts with Adrian Peterson and that's where it ends and we have to get that back on track," he said. "However, we do that we have to get it back on track and we're working towards it. I'm not going up there and saying, 'Hey, you have to give me more freedom,' because we've been good this year. We've sputtered the last couple of weeks but it can be fixed. I don't think anything major has to happen other than we have to play better."

Favre's experience in the offense -- which, before he signed, he said he knew better than the coaches -- and his leadership were among the qualities he thought the Vikings valued most in pursuing him. Teammates and coaches have lauded the endless hours Favre dedicates to studying tape of opponents, one coach saying Favre knows the names of the janitors at the team complex because he keeps such late hours.

Teammates have apparently supported Favre's refusal to leave the field against Carolina when he had what the quarterback later terms as a "heated discussion" with Childress.

LeRoy Butler, Favre's former teammate in Green Bay, said he was not surprised by the incident, explaining that he believes "Everybody in Minnesota knows that Brett Favre is running that organization," according to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.

Butler, who earlier this season was critical of his former Packers teammate for signing with the archrival Vikings, said Favre should not have questioned Childress when he was asked to come out of the game at Carolina, according to the report.

Childress was fired, Bevell was not even the guy in the conversation so it makes sense that Farve discounted him and brushed him off. Bevell was OC in title not application, he may have looked like an idiot as well considering Childress wasn't communicating crap.

This was 2009. Childress wasn't fired until 2010. The only point I was trying to make was that Favre didn't just pull a play out of thin air. He just audibled into too many pass plays for Childress' liking.

 

[chris98251]

The damage was already done, Childress had lost the team, just took them time to realize they needed a change.

 

[kf3339]

"When's the last time that's happened? 1972?
At this stage, they are trying to give Russ more control to freely call an audible at the line of scrimmage. He'll get more comfortable with that.
Let's also remember that there's no mutiny on the team that you seem to be suggesting with this radical idea. The game plan is put in chunks over the week. Unlike that Favre story, from what I infer, Russ is an active participant in the film room in scripting that together."

I never stated there was a mutiny on the team. I also never said that Bevell isn't involved in the game planning stage each week. But I do have eyes, which clearly show extreme cases of play calling which borders on complete incompetence. That play calling and game plan's right now is from Bevell. Not Wilson. Hence my open letter to him.

I believe he should take charge. You seem to think Bevell is one of if not the best OC's that the game has ever seen. In that respect we live on two different planets and will never meet in the middle. That should be clear to you as well.

All I can go on right now is 1TD and 3 field goals in 8 quarters of NFL football. 15 Points. Almost any competent NFL team can do that in less than one half. Some in just one quarter. That is a fact..

 

[Siouxhawk]

The damage was already done, Childress had lost the team, just took them time to realize they needed a change.

Hyperbole. 2009 was an all-in year for the Vikes. The wheels fell off in 2010. Aside from Harvin being a head case, the team bonded well and made it to the 2009 NFC title game, where an ill-advised Favre pass cost them a chance at the Super Bowl.

 

[Siouxhawk]

"When's the last time that's happened? 1972?
At this stage, they are trying to give Russ more control to freely call an audible at the line of scrimmage. He'll get more comfortable with that.
Let's also remember that there's no mutiny on the team that you seem to be suggesting with this radical idea. The game plan is put in chunks over the week. Unlike that Favre story, from what I infer, Russ is an active participant in the film room in scripting that together."

I never stated there was a mutiny on the team. I also never said that Bevell isn't involved in the game planning stage each week. But I do have eyes, which clearly show extreme cases of play calling which borders on complete incompetence. That play calling and game plan's right now is from Bevell. Not Wilson. Hence my open letter to him.

I believe he should take charge. You seem to think Bevell is one of if not the best OC's that the game has ever seen. In that respect we live on two different planets and will never meet in the middle. That should be clear to you as well.

All I can go on right now is 1TD and 3 field goals in 8 quarters of NFL football. 15 Points. Almost any competent NFL team can do that in less than one half. Some in just one quarter. That is a fact..

I guess we do live on 2 different planets. But I do live on the planet where your idea is so foreign to the NFL today that it would never fly.
In my world the sky doesn't fall after 2 games either, especially when the team is searching for its offensive identity. I'll always back a coach who has my favorite team's offense at the top of the pack year after year. Figured that would be obvious.

 

[Largent80]

The problem with this team the last 2 years is "they are searching for their offensive identity".

Bullshit. They have invested heavily in the offense and have a huge list of core players. It's an excuse for fielding an o-line made from the scrap pile. We have a franchise QB and all pro wr's and one of the best red zone TE's in the league but were searching for identity?

The most ridiculous thing said EVER.

 

[IndyHawk]

P.S. Favre never called his own plays.

WRONG! I have heard interviews from Viking players from that time in which they stated he called his own plays in the huddle. You don't know what your talking about at all. I even heard Favre on two occassions state he would change the plays that came into the huddle from Bevell.

The IronMan called or changed the plays many times.To the poster who said if Russ did that he'd have Favres pick numbers..I disagree RW is not Favre,he would be showing DB/Pete that he knows what the hell he is doing.A lot of Elite QB's over the years called their own plays btw it's not new.

 

[Siouxhawk]

The problem with this team the last 2 years is "they are searching for their offensive identity".

Bullshit. They have invested heavily in the offense and have a huge list of core players. It's an excuse for fielding an o-line made from the scrap pile. We have a franchise QB and all pro wr's and one of the best red zone TE's in the league but were searching for identity?

The most ridiculous thing said EVER.

TwistedHusky and I had a good discussion on this in the "I've been thinking" thread. There's definitely an identity crisis that needs to be solved.

 

[Largent80]

The problem with this team the last 2 years is "they are searching for their offensive identity".

Bullshit. They have invested heavily in the offense and have a huge list of core players. It's an excuse for fielding an o-line made from the scrap pile. We have a franchise QB and all pro wr's and one of the best red zone TE's in the league but were searching for identity?

The most ridiculous thing said EVER.

TwistedHusky and I had a good discussion on this in the "I've been thinking" thread. There's definitely an identity crisis that needs to be solved.

Dude. Identity is solved after the draft. mini camps and training camp, then the whole of pre season.

It's ridiculous for a team to be searching for an identity during the regular season.

 

[Siouxhawk]

The problem with this team the last 2 years is "they are searching for their offensive identity".

Bullshit. They have invested heavily in the offense and have a huge list of core players. It's an excuse for fielding an o-line made from the scrap pile. We have a franchise QB and all pro wr's and one of the best red zone TE's in the league but were searching for identity?

The most ridiculous thing said EVER.

TwistedHusky and I had a good discussion on this in the "I've been thinking" thread. There's definitely an identity crisis that needs to be solved.

Dude. Identity is solved after the draft. mini camps and training camp, then the whole of pre season.

It's ridiculous for a team to be searching for an identity during the regular season.

You'd think so, but until the real bullets fly, how do you know? This is especially important where our offensive line is concerned.

 

[StoneCold]

The problem with this team the last 2 years is "they are searching for their offensive identity".

Bullshit. They have invested heavily in the offense and have a huge list of core players. It's an excuse for fielding an o-line made from the scrap pile. We have a franchise QB and all pro wr's and one of the best red zone TE's in the league but were searching for identity?

The most ridiculous thing said EVER.

TwistedHusky and I had a good discussion on this in the "I've been thinking" thread. There's definitely an identity crisis that needs to be solved.

Dude. Identity is solved after the draft. mini camps and training camp, then the whole of pre season.

It's ridiculous for a team to be searching for an identity during the regular season.

I honestly don't think they're looking for an identity. They know what they want to do, they're just having trouble doing that.

After the first two games there is a camp that thinks we'll never reach the playoffs again while PC coddles Bevell and another that thinks they'll figure it out and get better at executing the plan. There is also a group in the middle that questions specific player moves and play calls.

I believe they will figure it out and will offer this bet to anyone. If the Hawks go 8-8 I will pay you $5, in addition for every game under 8-8 I will pay an additional $5. You will pay me $5 for every game over 8-8 that they finish.

I will only accept one bet, there is always the possibility of injury and I could end up owing mucho dinero. Any takers?

 

[chris98251]

The problem with this team the last 2 years is "they are searching for their offensive identity".

Bullshit. They have invested heavily in the offense and have a huge list of core players. It's an excuse for fielding an o-line made from the scrap pile. We have a franchise QB and all pro wr's and one of the best red zone TE's in the league but were searching for identity?

The most ridiculous thing said EVER.

Not really,there is a rumor that there is well placed wireless interface that is tapping into the headset of Wilson, and the person calling the plays does a real good Darrell Bevell imitation, they are trying to track down where that device is but the equipment manager says he isn't involved and that Tom Brady will vouch for him. Sooner or later they will identify who's calling the plays, obviously Pete doesn't blame Darrell.

 

[LeftHandSmoke]

The problem with this team the last 2 years is "they are searching for their offensive identity".

Bullshit. They have invested heavily in the offense and have a huge list of core players. It's an excuse for fielding an o-line made from the scrap pile. We have a franchise QB and all pro wr's and one of the best red zone TE's in the league but were searching for identity?

The most ridiculous thing said EVER.

Not really,there is a rumor that there is well placed wireless interface that is tapping into the headset of Wilson, and the person calling the plays does a real good Darrell Bevell imitation, they are trying to track down where that device is but the equipment manager says he isn't involved and that Tom Brady will vouch for him. Sooner or later they will identify who's calling the plays, obviously Pete doesn't blame Darrell.

It's pretty obvious that the constant interference in RW's head comes directly from The Bevil Himself. It's no wonder he can't sleep!

 

[West TX Hawk]

The problem with this team the last 2 years is "they are searching for their offensive identity".

Bullshit. They have invested heavily in the offense and have a huge list of core players. It's an excuse for fielding an o-line made from the scrap pile. We have a franchise QB and all pro wr's and one of the best red zone TE's in the league but were searching for identity?

The most ridiculous thing said EVER.

TwistedHusky and I had a good discussion on this in the "I've been thinking" thread. There's definitely an identity crisis that needs to be solved.

Dude. Identity is solved after the draft. mini camps and training camp, then the whole of pre season.

It's ridiculous for a team to be searching for an identity during the regular season.

You'd think so, but until the real bullets fly, how do you know? This is especially important where our offensive line is concerned.

It begs the question, however, why are we constantly in an "offensive identity crisis"? Is is not safe to say that the system in place is now flawed and needs to be adapted? If so, why hasn't change happened sooner?

Most would agree that with the exception to the line, there has been a great deal of talent in our backs and receivers the last 2 years, regardless of injury. The oline was clearly terrible last year. Why then did it take half a season last year to open up on offense? How long is it going to take this year?

How much longer is Carroll and Co. proceeding with the myth that we're still a power running team? Wilson is clearly more comfortable in hurry-up situations. He gets in a groove and his accuracy becomes even more precise. The quicker tempo, high percentage passing attack we saw the end of last year was very promising. Why then has it been all but abandoned since?

 

[Siouxhawk]

TwistedHusky and I had a good discussion on this in the "I've been thinking" thread. There's definitely an identity crisis that needs to be solved.

Dude. Identity is solved after the draft. mini camps and training camp, then the whole of pre season.

It's ridiculous for a team to be searching for an identity during the regular season.

You'd think so, but until the real bullets fly, how do you know? This is especially important where our offensive line is concerned.

It begs the question, however, why are we constantly in an "offensive identity crisis"? Is is not safe to say that the system in place is now flawed and needs to be adapted? If so, why hasn't change happened sooner?

Most would agree that with the exception to the line, there has been a great deal of talent in our backs and receivers the last 2 years, regardless of injury. The oline was clearly terrible last year. Why then did it take half a season last year to open up on offense? How long is it going to take this year?

How much longer is Carroll and Co. proceeding with the myth that we're still a power running team? Wilson is clearly more comfortable in hurry-up situations. He gets in a groove and his accuracy becomes even more precise. The quicker tempo, high percentage passing attack we saw the end of last year was very promising. Why then has it been all but abandoned since?

That's exactly what TwistedHusky and I were conversing about.

We came to the consensus that Pete wanted to stick with that run-first concept that relies heavily on the defense and ball control, but might be realizing that we don't have the horses to do that anymore. And this really only surfaced this year in the post-Marshawn era.
I wouldn't be surprised to see us go back to more of a spread passing game, especially if Ifedi and Vannett return to the field to provide needed protection up front. Russ getting his normal mobility back will also be key obviously.
All of this will require Pete to concede his ball-control offense concepts probably don't fit the personnel we have this year and may result in more turnovers. Does he loosen his grip on that?