Donkeys interested in Bevell

[Siouxhawk]

You are never going to change Siouxhawks mind. It has been laid out right in front of him, but is wholly dismissed. Just ignore him. He looks at win record and makes that his argument that bevell is good. Running the ball up the gut on 3rd and 20, bubble screens that never go anywhere, long developing plays behind one of if not the worst line in the league when you haven't pushed them back with short "hot route" passing...the list goes on and on. Poor gameplanning is brutally apparent to anyone paying attention to the actual plays. Let it go, he will never see it.

It's all within Pete's philosophy and formula. Sorry you can't see that. But I do and I see a team that has won nearly 70 percent of the time since the 2012 season opened.

 

[LickMyNuts]

Whether or not db is a good offensive coach, may be irrelevant at this point. His offense is predictable to division opponents and it's time for some new creative control. Time for a mini rebuild and a more creative pass offense.

 

[RolandDeschain]

Point being that it's just as incredulous to hear any talk of firing when this team has won 10 games each of the past 5 years and is hosting a playoff game. As far as my hiring policy, how's your work ethic and will you bring donuts in the morning every Thursday?

Do you understand the difference between correlation and causation?

 

[RolandDeschain]

Here's the thing, I live amongst those Vikings fans you speak and not one will besmirch Bevell. Many had a disdain for Childress, but that was erroneous judgement too (and not of topic here), and they were happy when he was shown the door. How's that worked out for them the past 6 years?

On point, as OC of the VIkes, Bevell's teams did make the playoffs in 2008 and 2009. As I said before, Adrian put up some pretty good numbers, but guys like Sidney and Percy didn't really explode onto the scene until Favre rode up on his white horse in 2009. Then, yeah, it was NFC CHampionship Game time and a date with Bountygate Greg Williams' style.

Favre did what he wanted with the offense in Minnesota; that wasn't Bevell's show. What now?

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8 ... gs-offense

 

[Siouxhawk]

Here's the thing, I live amongst those Vikings fans you speak and not one will besmirch Bevell. Many had a disdain for Childress, but that was erroneous judgement too (and not of topic here), and they were happy when he was shown the door. How's that worked out for them the past 6 years?

On point, as OC of the VIkes, Bevell's teams did make the playoffs in 2008 and 2009. As I said before, Adrian put up some pretty good numbers, but guys like Sidney and Percy didn't really explode onto the scene until Favre rode up on his white horse in 2009. Then, yeah, it was NFC CHampionship Game time and a date with Bountygate Greg Williams' style.

Favre did what he wanted with the offense in Minnesota; that wasn't Bevell's show. What now?

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8 ... gs-offense

That's a good article on the dichotomy of the coaching staff and Favre in Minnesota circa. 2009. I don't know how you think you're throwing this back in my face. In fact, it's the general direction that Pete, Bevell and staff are trying to go with Russ, in handing him more liberties at the line of scrimmage in checking into audibles based on what he sees in the defense. This is what was expected of Favre, a future Hall of Famer, when he came to the Vikings to close out his career.

If you read the article it chronicles how Bevelll made him a part of the gameplanning strategy early in the week and then tweaked adjustments as the week wore on. It's also what goes on here.

Like many of us, Favre was a creature of habit and what cost the Vikings a chance to go to the Super Bowl cropped up again when he tried to do too much and threw that ill-fated pass across his body against the Saints to dash a pretty thrilling season if you were a Vikes fan.

 

[RolandDeschain]

I did read the article, and it flat-out quotes Childress saying Favre did stuff on his own that they didn't expect in the game, and that was in his FIRST MONTH. You're somehow twisting that into some sort of pro-Bevell stance? Unbelievable. The only logical conclusion from that article is Favre did what he wanted and management just had to go along with it.

You've GOT to be trolling. There's no way you can't comprehend this; it's impossible.

 

[Siouxhawk]

I did read the article, and it flat-out quotes Childress saying Favre did stuff on his own that they didn't expect in the game, and that was in his FIRST MONTH. You're somehow twisting that into some sort of pro-Bevell stance? Unbelievable. The only logical conclusion from that article is Favre did what he wanted and management just had to go along with it.

You've GOT to be trolling. There's no way you can't comprehend this; it's impossible.

You'd better re-read it. Favre called audibles. If you don't know what that means, it's a check into a play within a play which better serves that situation. It's based on defensive looks. So Favre called an audible which might switch things from a run to a pass. He was given those liberties because he was a future Hall of Famer and earned those privileges. Childress wasn't objecting to that because it usually worked.

I don't know how you really want to bring Bevell into this that much anyhow. As I said before, Childress, because he was from an offensive background, pretty much ran the offense in Minnesota. He called the plays on game days. Bev helped incorporate the gameday script and devised a series of plays to gameplan against whatever particular offense they were facing.

 

[Lanakila]

I don't know Siouxhawk and he doesn't know me, but I really got to commend the guy for sticking to his guns with Bevell.

Thread after thread, he defends Bevell, and continues to be put down for it. I just wanted to say I admire his courage.

Who knows, if Bevell does leave the team one day and our offense gets worse, we all can owe Siouxhawk an apology

I don't agree with Siouxhawk but, like you, I do very much admire that he keeps to his beliefs. Keep it up, Siouxhawk!

 

[RolandDeschain]

You'd better re-read it. Favre called audibles. If you don't know what that means, it's a check into a play within a play which better serves that situation. It's based on defensive looks. So Favre called an audible which might switch things from a run to a pass.

"Usually Tuesday nights, as they're finalizing the base game plan, (Bevell) will either call or send me an e-mail or something of what they have going in (to see) if I have any thoughts or ideas," Favre said. "Then as the week progresses and I find things I like (and say), 'I feel more comfortable with this as opposed to that.'"

He told Bevell what to do. Get over it.

I don't agree with Siouxhawk but, like you, I do very much admire that he keeps to his beliefs. Keep it up, Siouxhawk!

Because the ability to stubbornly still believe in something when you're proven wrong is what; honorable? A good thing, somehow? :roll:

 

[Siouxhawk]

You'd better re-read it. Favre called audibles. If you don't know what that means, it's a check into a play within a play which better serves that situation. It's based on defensive looks. So Favre called an audible which might switch things from a run to a pass.

"Usually Tuesday nights, as they're finalizing the base game plan, (Bevell) will either call or send me an e-mail or something of what they have going in (to see) if I have any thoughts or ideas," Favre said. "Then as the week progresses and I find things I like (and say), 'I feel more comfortable with this as opposed to that.'"

He told Bevell what to do. Get over it.

I don't agree with Siouxhawk but, like you, I do very much admire that he keeps to his beliefs. Keep it up, Siouxhawk!

Because the ability to stubbornly still believe in something when you're proven wrong is what; honorable? A good thing, somehow? :roll:

He worked with Bevell to try to come up with a solid gameplan. Why is that so hard to accept? It was Brett Favre, after all.

 

[RolandDeschain]

Well, at least you're no longer trying to claim he only audibled. Maybe there's hope after all.

 

[cymatica]

From another discussion:

My 13yr old can tell you why the Seahawks offense isn't good. They start every game by testing the perimeter with short throws outside the numbers, they refuse to throw the in breaking routes and eschew mid range passing entirely. It's a dink outside or a low percentage shot down the sideline. This means they face not only too many third-and-long situations, but too many third downs in general. Seattle has one pass catcher who overwhelms all coverage attempts, yet they target him way too rarely. That would be Graham. Kearse is useless and Baldwin beats coverage with technique rather than physicality. Nothing wrong with that, but he needs help.

Seattle, even at its peak, had an offense that didn't look the same as that of other elite teams. This worked for a while but the adjustment has clearly been made.

Sadly, Seattle also seems to be stubborn. They consistently adjust and start gashing defenses and scoring late in games using quick throws in the middle and to the seams. They clearly ARE capable of doing this. The reason why they don't start games like this baffles me. I personally attribute it to Bevell. He has always presided over dink/shot offenses. At this point though that's not all of it. Can anyone envision Tom Brady accepting starting every game the same way even when it puts the team in an early hole repeatedly? I can't. Russell Wilson is at fault now. He's either too optimistically, koolaid drinkingly stupid to see the tendency or he's too optimistically, koolaid drinkingly timid to demand that Bevell adjust or go sit in the back of the room and pipe down.

Bevell is an NFL afterthought who is a commodity coach. He has no gravity and will be forgotten as soon as he's gone. Russell Wilson could be great. Be Great, Russell!

 

[Siouxhawk]

If Bevell does get an interview, let's make it the last week of January.

 

[rigelian]

I don't know Siouxhawk and he doesn't know me, but I really got to commend the guy for sticking to his guns with Bevell.

Thread after thread, he defends Bevell, and continues to be put down for it. I just wanted to say I admire his courage.

Who knows, if Bevell does leave the team one day and our offense gets worse, we all can owe Siouxhawk an apology

For the most part he's right. The Bevell hate has descended into the irrational. The biggest problem I have with him is his scripted plays at the beginning of the game don't seem to work, other than that, no problem at all.

Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk

 

[seahawkfreak]

I don't know Siouxhawk and he doesn't know me, but I really got to commend the guy for sticking to his guns with Bevell.

Thread after thread, he defends Bevell, and continues to be put down for it. I just wanted to say I admire his courage.

Who knows, if Bevell does leave the team one day and our offense gets worse, we all can owe Siouxhawk an apology

I don't agree with Siouxhawk but, like you, I do very much admire that he keeps to his beliefs. Keep it up, Siouxhawk!

Riiiiiight because stubbornly following an ideology and refuting every fact presented is such an endearing quality. Would Siouxhawk refute his beliefs if Bevell left and our offense got better, I think not. He would say Bevell would have done better.

 

[WindCityHawk]

I don't know Siouxhawk and he doesn't know me, but I really got to commend the guy for sticking to his guns with Bevell.

Thread after thread, he defends Bevell, and continues to be put down for it. I just wanted to say I admire his courage.

Who knows, if Bevell does leave the team one day and our offense gets worse, we all can owe Siouxhawk an apology

I don't agree with Siouxhawk but, like you, I do very much admire that he keeps to his beliefs. Keep it up, Siouxhawk!

Riiiiiight because stubbornly following an ideology and refuting every fact presented is such an endearing quality. Would Siouxhawk refute his beliefs if Bevell left and our offense got better, I think not. He would say Bevell would have done better.

Yup, opinions and facts are treated equally these days, unfortunately. Sioux will do mental gymnastics to make everything come up roses for Bevell.

You sure you're not a lawyer in real life, man? You'd make a great defending attorney.

 

[flmmkrz]

Yup, can't believe they're chalking this up to great play calling. Russ throws the most passes of his career and puts up the most yards. Shocking twist. Russ favorite target has a career year in a year Russ throws up his most pass attempts, another shocker. Russ also put up a high in interceptions and less tds than in years past so is that on Bevell, probably not those are on Russ, only the positives go to Bevell.

What negatives? The negatives you don't see on some fantasy planet where there is no real Defense to play against, RW throws 60 TDs a game, and Jimmy catches them all with basketball blockouts? Sheesh, dream on!

Conversely, the whole argument about 'is it RW or is it Bevell?' for the positives, the record-setters, is like so many arguments here: a false dichotomy. Lots goes into how any play-design develops.

The negatives that he also put up highs in ints and that despite a career high in total yards which is nice our red zone percentage dipped and didn't translate into as many points as it should have. Some of you don't place any of that blame at Bevells door step. You can't have it both ways, claim that Bevell had this amazing year look at all the good things the offense did and then absolve him of any of the negatives. If he can take credit for the good then the bad falls at his feet as well. The offense is his domain, good and bad. Bevell may get too much flack from most but not nearly enough from the pro Bevell crowd and there are offensive flaws and he is part of that problem.

I wasn't arguing about it being Russ v Bevell, I said the reason for highs can be explained. Their combination didn't translate into a higher completion percentage, a higher yard per catch rate, they were all around his career average so you add more attempts and you get higher yards per game. I would like to see the higher yards translate into a better red zone percentage and I feel that is where the play calling is an issue. Not the only issue, he is not the sole person to blame but he has had his kick at the can and he hasn't been the solution either.

 

[RichNhansom]

Yup, can't believe they're chalking this up to great play calling. Russ throws the most passes of his career and puts up the most yards. Shocking twist. Russ favorite target has a career year in a year Russ throws up his most pass attempts, another shocker. Russ also put up a high in interceptions and less tds than in years past so is that on Bevell, probably not those are on Russ, only the positives go to Bevell.

What negatives? The negatives you don't see on some fantasy planet where there is no real Defense to play against, RW throws 60 TDs a game, and Jimmy catches them all with basketball blockouts? Sheesh, dream on!

Conversely, the whole argument about 'is it RW or is it Bevell?' for the positives, the record-setters, is like so many arguments here: a false dichotomy. Lots goes into how any play-design develops.

The negatives that he also put up highs in ints and that despite a career high in total yards which is nice our red zone percentage dipped and didn't translate into as many points as it should have. Some of you don't place any of that blame at Bevells door step. You can't have it both ways, claim that Bevell had this amazing year look at all the good things the offense did and then absolve him of any of the negatives. If he can take credit for the good then the bad falls at his feet as well. The offense is his domain, good and bad. Bevell may get too much flack from most but not nearly enough from the pro Bevell crowd and there are offensive flaws and he is part of that problem.

I wasn't arguing about it being Russ v Bevell, I said the reason for highs can be explained. Their combination didn't translate into a higher completion percentage, a higher yard per catch rate, they were all around his career average so you add more attempts and you get higher yards per game. I would like to see the higher yards translate into a better red zone percentage and I feel that is where the play calling is an issue. Not the only issue, he is not the sole person to blame but he has had his kick at the can and he hasn't been the solution either.

The red zone is condensed so it is much more about anticipation and accuracy than play call.

With how off Wilson has been in the red zone and his limits over the middle it is impossible for any OC to scheme success. Your not going to have receivers wide open.

This is an area that Wilson needs to improve on not the play calling and won't change with a different OC. Maybe more time to execute or a threat of a running game but again those won't change with a different OC.

I'm not pro or anti Bevell but I won't just blindly apply every problem to him when it is pretty obvious there are other major factors in play.

I won't be surprised at all either way if the offense gets better or worse with someone else calling plays.

 

[flmmkrz]

Yup, can't believe they're chalking this up to great play calling. Russ throws the most passes of his career and puts up the most yards. Shocking twist. Russ favorite target has a career year in a year Russ throws up his most pass attempts, another shocker. Russ also put up a high in interceptions and less tds than in years past so is that on Bevell, probably not those are on Russ, only the positives go to Bevell.

What negatives? The negatives you don't see on some fantasy planet where there is no real Defense to play against, RW throws 60 TDs a game, and Jimmy catches them all with basketball blockouts? Sheesh, dream on!

Conversely, the whole argument about 'is it RW or is it Bevell?' for the positives, the record-setters, is like so many arguments here: a false dichotomy. Lots goes into how any play-design develops.

The negatives that he also put up highs in ints and that despite a career high in total yards which is nice our red zone percentage dipped and didn't translate into as many points as it should have. Some of you don't place any of that blame at Bevells door step. You can't have it both ways, claim that Bevell had this amazing year look at all the good things the offense did and then absolve him of any of the negatives. If he can take credit for the good then the bad falls at his feet as well. The offense is his domain, good and bad. Bevell may get too much flack from most but not nearly enough from the pro Bevell crowd and there are offensive flaws and he is part of that problem.

I wasn't arguing about it being Russ v Bevell, I said the reason for highs can be explained. Their combination didn't translate into a higher completion percentage, a higher yard per catch rate, they were all around his career average so you add more attempts and you get higher yards per game. I would like to see the higher yards translate into a better red zone percentage and I feel that is where the play calling is an issue. Not the only issue, he is not the sole person to blame but he has had his kick at the can and he hasn't been the solution either.

The red zone is condensed so it is much more about anticipation and accuracy than play call.

With how off Wilson has been in the red zone and his limits over the middle it is impossible for any OC to scheme success. Your not going to have receivers wide open.

This is an area that Wilson needs to improve on not the play calling and won't change with a different OC. Maybe more time to execute or a threat of a running game but again those won't change with a different OC.

I'm not pro or anti Bevell but I won't just blindly apply every problem to him when it is pretty obvious there are other major factors in play.

I won't be surprised at all either way if the offense gets better or worse with someone else calling plays.

As I said, Bevell is not the sole problem on this offense and I won't pin all the blame on him either, Russ has his fair share, the oline has it's fair share but we are awfully predictable in the red zone. If we the casual fan can anticipate the play calls how hard is it for opposing defenses. It is hard to anticipate and be accurate when defenses know what is coming and that is on the play calling. You can't scheme receivers open necessarily in the red zone but you can throw some new looks at teams, you can scheme to give your red zone threats some more favorable match ups but how many times have we seen Jimmy used inefficiently in the red zone. Spare me the he's double covered, at times he is and I wouldn't force it in to double coverage but how often do we see him lined up in group bunches where he's never getting looked at while NE continues to find ways to get Gronk open. Every team outside us seems to double team Gronk yet production. That is my gripe, we're predictable and Bevell has had years to find ways to improve this red zone offense and we've gone backwards despite some better red zone talent, at some point he has to take some of the blame for that. It's not all Bevell but he isn't the answer either

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Whether or not db is a good offensive coach, may be irrelevant at this point. His offense is predictable to division opponents and it's time for some new creative control. Time for a mini rebuild and a more creative pass offense.

There's some truth to this............but ask yourself when our offense is predictable, is it because of Bevell's playcalling, or is it because of the limitations of a 75% Russell, poor RB play and a terrible O-line.

Because we've seen at times throughout this offense under Pete, Russell and Bevell how explosive it can be when the line blocks, Russell's explosive and the O-line is at least competent.

I've never had a problem with the playcalling. If I have one MAJOR criticism of our offense, it's on the scheme/game planning side of things. Too many slow starts, too many three and outs and 50 yards of total offense in the first half.

THAT'S what bothers me............and it's telling me that Pete, Russell, Bevell and the other offensive coaches are really bad at game planning and scheming during the week.