Me3 vs Chiefs

[RiverDog]

Seriously, the only way I can imagine this situation being more entertaining for me would be if The Teeth were still in charge in Denver.

You mean Ole Horseface?

Prior to 2022, I was of the opinion that Russell was going to have to change his game to compensate for the advance of Father Time, that he was going to have to reduce is time to throw similar to what other older QB's like Brady and Worthlessburger had done to extend their careers, that he couldn't rely on his escapability and extending plays as he had done so well in the past. I felt that he could and would change his style of play, become more of a west coast offense type of QB. I was wrong.

Just a few minutes ago, I took a peek at the current starting quarterbacks ranked by their time to throw, and Russell is at the very bottom of the list, slower than it was last season and below such notables as Justin Fields and Zach Wilson (Geno's isn't that great, either). In addition, or perhaps due to, he doesn't read the field well. I used to think that the reason why he passed up open receivers at the 10-15 yard range in lieu of taking a deep shot was that he wanted to play hero ball, and that a cold slap in the face could break him of that tendency. Now, I think that it was/is more of a matter of his inability to read defenses, that he predetermines where he's going to go with a pass and either can't or won't survey the field. I also feel that I over estimated is intelligence or football IQ in basing my opinion that he could change his game, something that to this point, even his preferred coach Sean Payton hasn't been able to do.

Russell is perhaps the person that I have the most conflicting emotions about. On the one hand, I am very appreciative of his contributions to the best period of Seahawk football that we've ever had. He's also a decent guy, not a conceited jerk like a Brady or Rodgers, not a sexual predator like Deshawn Watson. But on the other hand, he's asked for this, seems to have gotten too big for his britches, and in that regard, he deserves every insult and joke that's been hurled towards him.

 

[Lagartixa]

You mean Ole Horseface?

Yep.

Prior to 2022, I was of the opinion that Russell was going to have to change his game to compensate for the advance of Father Time, that he was going to have to reduce is time to throw similar to what other older QB's like Brady and Worthlessburger had done to extend their careers, that he couldn't rely on his escapability and extending plays as he had done so well in the past. I felt that he could and would change his style of play, become more of a west coast offense type of QB. I was wrong.

Just a few minutes ago, I took a peek at the current starting quarterbacks ranked by their time to throw, and Russell is at the very bottom of the list, slower than it was last season and below such notables as Justin Fields and Zach Wilson (Geno's isn't that great, either). In addition, or perhaps due to, he doesn't read the field well. I used to think that the reason why he passed up open receivers at the 10-15 yard range in lieu of taking a deep shot was that he wanted to play hero ball, and that a cold slap in the face could break him of that tendency. Now, I think that it was/is more of a matter of his inability to read defenses, that he predetermines where he's going to go with a pass and either can't or won't survey the field. I also feel that I over estimated is intelligence or football IQ in basing my opinion that he could change his game, something that to this point, even his preferred coach Sean Payton hasn't been able to do.

You're not the only one who thought this. I greatly underestimated Carroll and Schneider and greatly overestimated Wilson. At the time of the trade, I thought the Broncos were going to become a very good team, and that the Seahawks would suffer through a terrible season in 2022, and that it wouldn't be much better in '23. When I saw the stuff @keasley45 and @Maelstrom787 were saying about Wilson and Smith in the 2022 preseason, at first I thought they were nuts, but I kept reading and saw that they were making interesting arguments. And in the end, the surprising-to-me things they were predicting ended up happening.

Russell is perhaps the person that I have the most conflicting emotions about. On the one hand, I am very appreciative of his contributions to the best period of Seahawk football that we've ever had. He's also a decent guy, not a conceited jerk like a Brady or Rodgers, not a sexual predator like Deshawn Watson.

...or Ben Rapelisburger.

But on the other hand, he's asked for this, seems to have gotten too big for his britches, and in that regard, he deserves every insult and joke that's been hurled towards him.

Yeah, before reading your final sentence, I was going to say Wilson does appear to be conceited (but of course, I don't know him, nor Brady, nor Rodgers, so I can't say if any of them really is a conceited jerk), but you hit it yourself with "too big for his britches."

 

[IndyHawk]

Ugly game last night. That has to be one of the worst games I've seen Russell put up. His final numbers were 13-22 for a measly 95 yards or 3.2 yards per attempt, 1 TD and 2 INT's, sacked 4 times. Russell's on pace to equal his league leading 55 sacks from last year. He must have had 4-5 passes batted down at the LOS, one of them accounting for one of his interceptions, the other pick being an unforced bad read. They were on the way to Payton's first ever shutout until they scored late in the 4th quarter. The Donkeys are now 1-5 on the season, 5-16 with Russell as a starter. Some fans are calling for them to tank the season and enter into the Caleb Williams sweepstakes.

Mahomes didn't look that much better. Fortunately for the Chiefs, their PK had a great game, connecting on two long distance FG's into a swirling wind. If all they can manage is one TD against a defense that gave up 70 points in one game...well, it's still early, but I'm not at all impressed with the Chiefs. The best teams seem to reside in the NFC this season.

He's 5-21 as a starter no?

 

[RiverDog]

He's 5-21 as a starter no?

In 2022, the Broncos were 5-12. Russell did not start in their victory over the Cards and their defeat to the Jets, leaving him with a 4-11 record in 2022. Add in their 1-5 record for this season brings his total W/L as a starter to 5-16.

 

[keasley45]

He's 5-21 as a starter no?

And the thing folks who keep leaning on his stats and eind while he was here is that he was NEVER capable of doing back in the day what he can't do now. He's stopped being a rushing threat. That's been the biggest change in his game, but that preceeded father time stealing a step from him. He stopped wanting to run circa 2018.

And he was NOT lighting the world on fire before we turned him into west coast RG3. In fact he was so average that there was talk of him brewing benched for Matt Flynn his rookie year.

But I forget most folks don't remember that.

To remind everyone :

Seattle Seahawks Must Bench Russell Wilson, Start Matt Flynn

The Seattle Seahawks won in Week 5 against the Carolina Panthers , but rookie quarterback Russell Wilson's two interceptions nearly cost his team the game. CBSSports ...

syndication.bleacherreport.com

A quote from the article in 2012 could have been written in 2023:

"For the season, Wilson has completed 79-of-125 passes (63.2 percent) for 815 yards, five touchdowns and six interceptions. He has consistently shown poor footwork, even sometimes on the most basic of throws, and though his talent is undeniable, his judgement leaves much to be desired"

It was against the Bears during his rookie season that he became a dual threat and remained so for years until defenses realized that he either wasn't going anywhere because he didn't want to or because he was out of shape and just didn't have the wheels. One cannot underestimate what the threat of him running with the likes of Beat Mode beside him did for his game.

But the Wilson today, looks more like the Wilson before he started tilting the field with his legs than anything else- a guy who

 

[CalgaryFan05]

Chiefs not putting up 100 on Denver is a testament to their fall back to normalcy.

This Denver team is bad.

that's kinda what i thought - didn't see the game -

gonna catch the highlights - but that score should have been alot more lopsided if the Chiefs are for real this year -

Ahhhhhh.... the 'Swift' effect?

 

[James in PA]

How would you all feel about Payton benching Me3? I have mixed feelings. It would be the cherry on top, so to speak. But oh how I do enjoy watching Me3 throw picks, take unnecessary sacks and get clowned by everyone not named John63.

 

[Lagartixa]

How would you all feel about Payton benching Me3? I have mixed feelings. It would be the cherry on top, so to speak. But oh how I do enjoy watching Me3 throw picks, take unnecessary sacks and get clowned by everyone not named John63.

Well, everyone not called John63, P*****thrs, or rc***o.
Or Stink Schlereth, who jumped right on the blame-the-receivers bandwagon.
Does nobody else remember that around the time of the big trade last year, everyone was saying that Wilson was going to a team with a much-better OL, a better defense, and better "weapons"? I really don't think I imagined it.

 

[warden]

Wilson had 95 yards passing last night. You are going to lose a lot of games if that is your output

 

[sc85sis]

Well, everyone not called John63, P*****thrs, or rc***o.
Or Stink Schlereth, who jumped right on the blame-the-receivers bandwagon.
Does nobody else remember that around the time of the big trade last year, everyone was saying that Wilson was going to a team with a much-better OL, a better defense, and better "weapons"? I really don't think I imagined it.

Stink isn’t wrong about Denver’s receivers. They really aren’t very good. I was less than impressed by Jeudy when watching tape from when Lock was the QB.

There’s a lot of blame to be placed at Russ’ feet, but he’s not the sole problem.

 

[IndyHawk]

In 2022, the Broncos were 5-12. Russell did not start in their victory over the Cards and their defeat to the Jets, leaving him with a 4-11 record in 2022. Add in their 1-5 record for this season brings his total W/L as a starter to 5-16.

I was hoping to be right but just need 5 more of LRL

 

[RiverDog]

How would you all feel about Payton benching Me3? I have mixed feelings. It would be the cherry on top, so to speak. But oh how I do enjoy watching Me3 throw picks, take unnecessary sacks and get clowned by everyone not named John63.

As a matter of practicality, it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense to bench Russell at this point in the season for a couple reasons. First of all, although their chances of making the playoffs are one in ten or worse, there's still a lot of football left to be played, and as badly as Russell played last night, he's played relatively well in the Broncos other games this season. Even the defending champs Chiefs looked very ordinary last night. Russell still gives them their best chance of winning, and at least until you're mathematically eliminated, you always play to win.

Secondly, their backup is a journeyman named Jarrett Stidham. If they had a rookie or first year QB that they were grooming as a possible QBOTF, then you might consider benching Russell and use the rest of the season to evaluate him. But not when the alternative is someone like Stidham.

And lastly, that hideous contract they signed him to pretty much dictates that they are hitched to him, so as unlikely as it may seem, they might as well let him see if he and Payton can turn things around and make him into at least a reliable starter.

 

[IndyHawk]

Stink isn’t wrong about Denver’s receivers. They really aren’t very good. I was less than impressed by Jeudy when watching tape from when Lock was the QB.

There’s a lot of blame to be placed at Russ’ feet, but he’s not the sole problem.

I thought their WRs were better than Hawks?
That is what the Me3 people said after the trade..

I think it's just Me3 with his limited usage of the field for passing
his hating the pocket after 1 read or so and clearly not reading
defenses well prior to snap makes his OL,WRs and himself look bad.

 

[RiverDog]

Stink isn’t wrong about Denver’s receivers. They really aren’t very good. I was less than impressed by Jeudy when watching tape from when Lock was the QB.

There’s a lot of blame to be placed at Russ’ feet, but he’s not the sole problem.

I suspect that this is true, but we would had to have seen the game from the vantage point of the 300 level where you can see the entire field from sideline to sideline and end zone to end zone before we can state this as a fact.

Plus, we also have to consider the role of the coaching staff in designing and calling the plays, and Russell was under quite a bit of pressure, having been sacked 4 times and escaping from what seemed to be a sure sack on several occasions.

But I agree with your basic premise, that Russell wasn't the sole problem with the Broncos' passing game last night.

 

[12AngryHawks]

There’s a lot of blame to be placed at Russ’ feet, but he’s not the sole problem.

 

[warden]

Russ can no longer do anything to freeze the defenses or make them hesitate for a split second. Defenses know how to defend him. In his early years, the read option and his ability to run held defenses back. He struck fear into defenses. Russ was incredibly good at throwing on the run. This froze the defenses. But he not only lost his legs, he lost his desire to be a mobile QB. He can not do the three step ball gone play, cannot do the quick developing plays. But he wants to be a pocket passer. He no longer wants to be hit, he complained about his OL in his later years in Seattle, wanted to pick his own OC. He became uncoachable because he didn’t want to do what the coaches were asking anymore. His better days are long gone. Everybody knows it except for Russ

 

[CactusJack]

 

[toffee]

Stink isn’t wrong about Denver’s receivers. They really aren’t very good. I was less than impressed by Jeudy when watching tape from when Lock was the QB.

There’s a lot of blame to be placed at Russ’ feet, but he’s not the sole problem.

The ownership and front office would hope that Wilson's the sole hope and bright spot, Wilson's 9.5% of total Broncos' cap this year, and his OL is around 16%, one would hope that one's 25% of total investment would be the bright spot.

 

[Welshers2]

No one has ever called anything the way I called the fall of Russ!!! Ok maelstroms prediction about genos rise was pretty good

But REALLY I got flamed on here for telling everyone russ was going to suck with Denver when the trade happened! Guess what, he's terrible!

 

[GemCity]

No one has ever called anything the way I called the fall of Russ!!! Ok maelstroms prediction about genos rise was pretty good

But REALLY I got flamed on here for telling everyone russ was going to suck with Denver when the trade happened! Guess what, he's terrible!

Props to you!

I thought he would have his best year (statistically).

I’m glad I was wrong.