Please Pete, Fix our OL Next Year

[hawknation2014]

Constructing an OL like Dallas has is easier said than done. Three of their linemen are First Round picks, and they amazingly hit on all three.

Of the 19 offensive tackles drafted in 2014, none of them have looked 'great.' The four selected in the First Round have all struggled.

Jake Matthews has looked terrible as both a run blocker and pass protector. Matthews has allowed a league-high 39 pressures, including six sacks, and has yet to have a positive game as a run blocker. Most of time, he has been manhandled like a rag doll.

Ja'Wuan James has allowed 31 pressures and has not had an impact as a run blocker.

Greg Robinson had some solid games at left guard, but has looked average at best since being moved outside to tackle.

Taylor Lewan has been solid but not spectacular. He and Justin Britt are the only rookie OTs out of 19 who have really flashed in the run game.

The only rookie center who has played great this year is Green Bay's 5th Rounder Corey Linsley. I thought Mebane and Co. would eat Linsley's lunch in the opener, but he held his own and looks to have an extremely bright future. The rest of this class's centers have been average (Bryan Stork and Chris Watt) to awful (Marcus Martin and Jonotthan Harrison).

Guard is one of the bright areas in this rookie class. Joel Bitonio and Zach Martin have played like Pro Bowlers. Bitionio has the highest run blocking grade PFF has awarded a rookie since Mike Iupati in 2010. He has also allowed just nine pressures and no sacks. The Seahawks have to be kicking themselves that they didn't take Bitonio at No. 32.

Good write up.

I actually like the OL in this order from 2014;

1) Zach Martin
2) Taylor Lewan
3) Justin Britt

Mathews will be fine, just fine. He's in a very tough spot, but, he'll be fine. Don't know much about Bitonio.

Another thing to remember about Dallas is they have the pass blocking equivalent of Tom Cable in Bill Callahan. He's pretty good. And it's not right to judge anyone that plays a Tucker defense. They seemed to be playing a prevent zone, with a three man rush, in the first quarter. It was bizarre.

My ranking of rookie linemen would be similar, but I would include Linsley and Bitonio.

These five would make a damn good line:
(1) LG Joel Bitinio
(2) RG Zach Martin
(3) C Corey Linsley
(4) LT Taylor Lewan
(5) RT Justin Britt

 

[Recon_Hawk]

Seahawks fans are destined to complain about offensive lines until the end of earth.

For starters -- go and watch that All-Star Cowboys line against the Redskins and Eagles. Two big fat home defeats where they were torn to shreds. Romo was so badly injured against Washington he couldn't play in the game against Arizona (a defeat) and he's having to take painkilling injections to get through games now.

The idea that other teams have these unbelievable lines with QB's who are never touched, sacked or pressured and get endless time in the pocket is a complete fallacy. A daydream made up by fans brought up on 'you only win in the trenches'.

Here's a question. If a team blitzes with six or even seven rushers (eg Arizona, frequently), do you expect any offensive line to just block the extra 1-2 defenders? How is that physically possible? It's up to the QB to either a.) scramble to extend the play or b.) get the ball out as quickly as possible, probably to a hot read.

Wilson is always going to struggle to stay in the pocket and find a hot read because he's 5-10. So more often than not he scrambles. Sometimes he scrambles when he doesn't even need to. Why? Because Pete Carroll wants him to. He wants to be the best scrambling team in the league and he knows Wilson is at his best out of the pocket. So you know what? A lot of the time he isn't running for his life. It's either by design or by Wilson's nature.

Have you ever considered how difficult it is to create a pocket for a QB who could literally be anywhere in the backfield? When you're blocking for Peyton Manning, it's much easier to set, execute a standard block and have a mental image of where your quarterback will be. Wilson moves around all the time -- again, even when he doesn't have to. If you set up a standard pocket for him and he scrambles left to throw -- are people really expecting Russell Okung to know this and adjust to protect his QB? It's a totally unrealistic expectation. Blocking for Wilson is almost as hard as it trying to contain him defensively.

According to Football Outsiders, Seattle ranks #6 overall for run blocking and #28 for pass blocking. Which kind of rings true given we're the #1 run offense and something like the #31 passing offense (if not #32). Seattle's priority is to run the football first and foremost. We get all caught up imagining what it'd be like if our passing offense was better, and yet our offensive line is providing the #1 run game and is ranked #6 overall in the entire league. Philadelphia is ranked #2 in pass protection and #29 in run blocking. They want to throw a ton and they've put the run game on the shelf for the most part (Shady McCoy was having a major down year until recently). Offensive philosophy plays a huge part here. We want to run the ball. It won us a title.

A few more stats. The Seahawks have given up 31 sacks. San Francisco has given up 38. The much vaunted Cowboys offensive line is ranked... wait for it... 21st for pass protection. 21st. They've given up just six fewer sacks than Seattle. This warrants a total rebuild on our behalf? So we can be the #21 pass protecting team instead of #28? And give up six fewer sacks? A few other comparisons... Green Bay has five fewer sacks. Detroit has four more sacks than Seattle. The Oakland Raiders at 1-11 have the #5 ranked pass protecting team in the entire league and have conceded just 18 sacks. So figure that out.

And finally -- you know what might actually help Wilson more than a change in offensive line? Some actual weapons. His #1 receiver is Doug Baldwin. He doesn't have hardly any genuine weapons to throw to. No great tight end. No great #1 wide out. That is a much bigger problem for this offense.

Bravo. Well said.

As to Football Outsiders pass pro ranking, you can correct me if I'm wrong, but it's ranking is based highly on adjusted sack numbers and some adjustment for the opponent.

It does not take into consideration the effects a QB or offensive play calling has on the offensive line. Its why a Payton Manning led offense is ranked near the top year after year. It's why a 1-11 Oakland riders team with a QB who takes gets the ball out extremely fast is ranked #5 and yet Carr's individual stats are below league average (quick throws = INTs and poor completion %). It's why a savvy, veteran Matt Ryan led team with a known talent-less and injured offensive line is ranked 13.

And it's why the Seahawks are ranked 28, because Russell tends to not take a chance with the ball and would rather take a sack scrambling to find space than make a tough or even risky throw from the pocket. This is awesome because turnovers make it impossible to win the field position battle and Russell makes magic happen when he's on the move, but it also makes Russell look a bit better on paper (higher completion rate and less INTs) while the offensive line look worse, taking more blame than they probably should.

 

[hawknation2014]

The good news is next year's offensive line class looks deeper and stronger than this year's. I hope we draft some of these tackles who are equally good at pass blocking. To a man, all of our starters were better run blockers in college than pass protectors. Justin Britt is just the latest example. The only real exceptions have been Bailey and Jeanpierre.

 

[theENGLISHseahawk]

The good news is next year's offensive line class looks deeper and stronger than this year's. I hope we draft some of these tackles who are equally good at pass blocking. To a man, all of our starters were better run blockers in college than pass protectors. Justin Britt is just the latest example. The only real exceptions have been Bailey and Jeanpierre.

Tackles who are equally good at pass protecting and run blocking go in the top ten.

And who are you replacing anyway? The teams best pass protecting tackle (Okung) or the tackle they just drafted in the second round, who is starting as a rookie (Britt)?

Okung is on $7m next year which is an absolute bargain. Britt isn't going anywhere. I sense if Okung can stay healthy he'll get an extension. Might even get one this off-season.

 

[hawknation2014]

The good news is next year's offensive line class looks deeper and stronger than this year's. I hope we draft some of these tackles who are equally good at pass blocking. To a man, all of our starters were better run blockers in college than pass protectors. Justin Britt is just the latest example. The only real exceptions have been Bailey and Jeanpierre.

Tackles who are equally good at pass protecting and run blocking go in the top ten.

And who are you replacing anyway? The teams best pass protecting tackle (Okung) or the tackle they just drafted in the second round, who is starting as a rookie (Britt)?

Okung is on $7m next year which is an absolute bargain. Britt isn't going anywhere. I sense if Okung can stay healthy he'll get an extension. Might even get one this off-season.

It would be nice to get a good pass protector to develop behind Okung and push Britt. Assuming Carpenter is not re-signed and Bailey takes over at left guard, that leaves Garry Gilliam as our only backup OT on the roster next year. IMO, Britt's ceiling as an outside pass protector is awfully low and a move inside to guard may be in his best long-term interests; his run blocking is special.

Fortunately, 2015 is looking like a very deep year for pass-blocking OTs. Andrus Peat, Cedric Ogbuehi, Ereck Flowers, Tyrus Thompson, La'el Collins, D.J. Humphries, Jake Fisher, etc. are all very athletic pass blockers. More than one of those guys will be available in the 2nd Round, especially someone like Humphries or Fisher, who were hurt this year and have maybe fallen off the radar for those teams looking for day one starters.

 

[RiverDog]

I'm watching the Thursday Night Cowboys vs Bears debacle and it makes me angry to see that wall of protection Romo has on nearly each and every play. It's a WALL. He has all the time he needs to sit back, comfortably survey his options, and throw. You see this often around the league with the top passers in the NFL. Well no wonder they are averaging over 300 yards passing, and from the pocket. They have PROTECTION.

The day Russell Wilson is afforded the same luxury will be a very fine day indeed.

So all we need to do is miss the playoffs for 4 straight seasons.....

That's the reality of parity. Jerry Jones has had the luxury of having high draft picks on which to acquire much of that WALL, a luxury he earned because he's consistently fielded very poor teams over the past 4 years or so. I don't think I'd want to trade him his past 4 years for ours.

 

[Sarlacc83]

Yeah! The Seattle offensive line advantage sure helped in 2005 (6)!

 

[StoneCold]

I think our Oline needs the same fix that just hit our Defense in the last two games. Being healthy and getting a chance to work together.

Really loving the ENGLISHseahawk dudes write up. Even if the Football Outsiders ranking have some holes, the pure numbers tell a story that's different then the emotional reaction we have upon seeing RW have to scramble around. Which as Scottemojo pointed out is as much RW's fault as the Oline.

WE ALL WE GOT YOUR BACK WE ALL GOT BACK!

Go Hawks!

SC

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

Yeah! The Seattle offensive line advantage sure helped in 2005 (6)!

Bill Leavy, is that you?

 

[MizzouHawkGal]

I'm watching the Thursday Night Cowboys vs Bears debacle and it makes me angry to see that wall of protection Romo has on nearly each and every play. It's a WALL. He has all the time he needs to sit back, comfortably survey his options, and throw. You see this often around the league with the top passers in the NFL. Well no wonder they are averaging over 300 yards passing, and from the pocket. They have PROTECTION.

The day Russell Wilson is afforded the same luxury will be a very fine day indeed.

So all we need to do is miss the playoffs for 4 straight seasons.....

That's the reality of parity. Jerry Jones has had the luxury of having high draft picks on which to acquire much of that WALL, a luxury he earned because he's consistently fielded very poor teams over the past 4 years or so. I don't think I'd want to trade him his past 4 years for ours.

That's awesome that they have a WALL yet no defense so they will still go 10-6 and miss the playoffs. Besides I'm not convinced Wilson actually needs a stellar OL, one that is decent at pass blocking? Sure but he doesn't need a classic pocket the way Romo does. Maybe they could build something similar to New Orleans with the stellar guards but you're still going to sacrifice in other areas.

 

[zhawk]

Brings up an interesting thought.
#3 RW is great at making things happen on the run/scramble, and a lot of what we do is based off that.

Do y'all think that if he had a protected pocket more often that he would be as successful?

I think he is winner and will be good either way but I do have concern that he might struggle if he is expected to stay in the pocket.

I almost feel silly for asking that question but it seems to me that his height might become an issue, where it hasn't been.

y'all may disagree, but I always thought that's what happened to Mirer. had a great rookie season and then regressed when the coach tried to turn him into a deep vertical game passer. Flores, IIRC.

 

[EntiatHawk]

Please excuse me if I am repeating anyone because I did skip through some of the thread.

I do not think we will ever go hog wild on a O-line because we will always be more focused on defense. What would you rather have another stud pass rusher or an o-lineman? I think we have been a bit snake bit on o-line health because when the starters are in we are not a horrible o-line.

I think we look for that missing piece at the wide receiver and another monster on D-line that can wreck havoc. I think that would be my focus next year. We may lose Avril which would be too bad because I think he fits in real well here.