Projecting the O-Line: 2016 -->

[theENGLISHseahawk]

Tom Cable said in his most recent press conference that only one speed rusher in the NFL can beat Gilliam off the edge. He didn't say who.

His issue for me is engaging and winning with power. Stoning his guy, the initial jolt and disrupting the initial rush and forcing a counter. In a straight speed race he generally wins I think -- Cable seems to think so.

It's also his first full year as a starter and OT.

They seem to really like his potential.

 

[kf3339]

I think we let Okung walk and trade for Joe Thomas. I believe he has two years left at 8 million per and he has never missed a snap in the NFL. His salary will be a wash from Okung's this year so no jump in cap space.

This would be ideal for sure, and Seattle has shown in the past they're not scared of trading 1st rounders, and doing what is necessary to make it happen.

He is a great player, but I don't see this happening at all. The Browns are more than likely going to pick the Cal QB at the 2nd pick in the draft, unless someone mortgages their draft capital to get the number 1 pick. I don't see that happening.

IF they are going for a rookie QB, you keep your all pro LT to protect him.

 

[kf3339]

What does the FA market for Olineman look like?

Ravens look like they may be ready to part with Eugene Monroe. Monroe was a pretty solid LT for Jags. If not Thomas, maybe Monroe?

The major thing that the OL has suffered from is inconsistency and continuity. They have a chance to improve both by keeping Okung and Sweezy. In the past couple of years, they let Bowie, Breno, and Carp walk. Bowie hasn't done much but Carp and Breno formed a very solid Jets OL. Think of how good the Seahawk OL would have been if they kept those guys.

The weakest link has been Gilliam, IMO. He has to have TE help to be successful. If they can find someone who doesn't need that in the 2016 draft or via FA, then replace Gilliam at RT.

While I don't believe Okung or Sweezy are great, for continuity and consistency sake they are good enough.

My 2016 OL -

Okung - Britt - Lewis - Sweezy - Gilliam or 2016 draft pick

This is kinda how I see it as well. IF anything we have seen what happens when we blow up the OL with how our first half of this season went. If the numbers are reasonable I think we should just stay pat and draft and/or find FA help for more quality depth.

 

[Fade]

I think we let Okung walk and trade for Joe Thomas. I believe he has two years left at 8 million per and he has never missed a snap in the NFL. His salary will be a wash from Okung's this year so no jump in cap space.

This would be ideal for sure, and Seattle has shown in the past they're not scared of trading 1st rounders, and doing what is necessary to make it happen.

He is a great player, but I don't see this happening at all. The Browns are more than likely going to pick the Cal QB at the 2nd pick in the draft, unless someone mortgages their draft capital to get the number 1 pick. I don't see that happening.

IF they are going for a rookie QB, you keep your all pro LT to protect him.

That is a good point if they go Rookie QB.

 

[Fade]

Great thoughts guys.

For those that keep saying Okung is going to be re-signed. What is the contract going to look like? I would love to have him back on a 1 yr $8-10M deal. My anticipation is he will have 5yr $50M+ offers on the table. Are you comfortable signing him to that? I'm just trying to figure out how you can pay that knowing he is a ticking time bomb when it comes to him getting injured. In this scenario he would be a cap sink for 2016, and then a dead money cap sink for 2017 when you cut him to get out from under his bad contract.

That is why I keep going back to being proactive at LT. Okung is just as big a risk as going for someone new.

 

[ivotuk]

We need to keep Sweezy because he has value not on as a blocker, but he intimidates people. IIRC it was Patrick Lewis on 710 who said defensive players come up to JR and say things like "Hey Sweez, don't be hitting me when the play is over." Apparently a lot of defensive players shy away from Sweezy.

I think Gilliam can play left tackle, after all he was recently a tight end and is learning to be an offensive lineman.

L to R I see Gilliam, Britt, Lewis, Sweezy, draft pick.

 

[Hawks46]

Tom Cable said in his most recent press conference that only one speed rusher in the NFL can beat Gilliam off the edge. He didn't say who.

His issue for me is engaging and winning with power. Stoning his guy, the initial jolt and disrupting the initial rush and forcing a counter. In a straight speed race he generally wins I think -- Cable seems to think so.

It's also his first full year as a starter and OT.

They seem to really like his potential.

Good post, and I totally agree. THis is also why I'd like to see a decent veteran if Okung ends up being too expensive. We get a decent LT for a couple of years and let Gilliam season on the right side for a couple of years.

Honestly, I think it's easier to just resign Okung, but only if he doesn't break the bank...he's just not healthy enough to give him elite LT money.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

Tom Cable said in his most recent press conference that only one speed rusher in the NFL can beat Gilliam off the edge.

The tape says otherwise. Weekly.

Coaches lie all the time to protect their guys, so this says little to me. He may have potential, but that's all he is at this point.

Heck, keep him. Continuity counts for something.

 

[Tical21]

If it takes 5/50 to sign Okung, done. If you are going to make your QB the centerpiece of your franchise, you don't let go his best pass blocker, especially when that play is responsible for his blind side. If you don't have a LT, your QB gets hurt, and fumbles a lot in the process, period. We've been lucky enough to have good LT play, but we also saw for a few years what happens when you have a hole at LT. Complete disaster. It's a lot of money, but that is the market rate. You aren't going to find an upgrade in free agency. You're not going to draft high enough to find a replacement, and this group doesn't exactly have an outstanding track record of drafting linemen.

Bailey has to be re-signed I think. Your 6th man is pretty darn important, especially when he can do a decent job everywhere.

I don't personally even think JR Sweezy is average. Even in the run game he misses too many assignments. He gets too many dumb penalties, and isn't assignment sound in the pass game. There are literally 20 ways I would rather spend his money. But if I had to bet, I think we consider him a core guy and bring him back.

 

[Fade]

If it takes 5/50 to sign Okung, done. If you are going to make your QB the centerpiece of your franchise, you don't let go his best pass blocker, especially when that play is responsible for his blind side. If you don't have a LT, your QB gets hurt, and fumbles a lot in the process, period. We've been lucky enough to have good LT play, but we also saw for a few years what happens when you have a hole at LT. Complete disaster. It's a lot of money, but that is the market rate. You aren't going to find an upgrade in free agency. You're not going to draft high enough to find a replacement, and this group doesn't exactly have an outstanding track record of drafting linemen.

Bailey has to be re-signed I think. Your 6th man is pretty darn important, especially when he can do a decent job everywhere.

I don't personally even think JR Sweezy is average. Even in the run game he misses too many assignments. He gets too many dumb penalties, and isn't assignment sound in the pass game. There are literally 20 ways I would rather spend his money. But if I had to bet, I think we consider him a core guy and bring him back.

Nice post.

I said I go back and forth on Sweezy. Yesterday I said re-sign him. Now today after reading everyone's opinions including yours Tical on Sweezy, I'm back to letting him walk, and going with Glowinski.

 

[The Dirty Truth]

Sweezy is far and away better than Glowinski. We are a run first team and Glow can't run block. If anything we try to resign Okung on the cheap side and maybe let him walk. Sweezy is going to get big offers from other teams and I'm not sure we will pony up. That would be a huge mistake in my opinion. We can't keep losing 2 OL every year.

 

[DHawk]

If Tom Cable leaves Seattle for any team, don't be surprised if any of these guys follow him.

 

[hawk45]

Okung is the retain-at-all-costs player to me unless Thomas is plan B. Any other plan is one I do not trust, especially a plan that involves Gilliam at LT. The more Cable talks up his pass pro the *less* comfortable I get.

Sweezy is a guy I want back for the right price only.

Lewis is a great starting point at center. We can try to get better at that position but I want Lewis on the roster in case Cable plucks another Nowak out of his butt.

But, since this is the Seahawks and Cable we are talking about, I'm sure that we will pay Sweezy too much, let Okung walk to be replaced by Gilliam, and have another experiment at center and another experiment at guard because Britt will be moved to RT where he sucks.

If we started the season with a line that wasn't a disaster I'd fall off my chair.

 

[theENGLISHseahawk]

Tom Cable said in his most recent press conference that only one speed rusher in the NFL can beat Gilliam off the edge.

The tape says otherwise. Weekly.

Coaches lie all the time to protect their guys, so this says little to me. He may have potential, but that's all he is at this point.

Heck, keep him. Continuity counts for something.

Give me an example of a rusher beating him purely by speed in the last six weeks.

I'll go and take a look.

I don't recall ever seeing him beaten by speed. Technique/power? Yes.

 

[nanomoz]

I'm with Fade and English on this--in fact, I think his numbers are conservative. Okung will get at least $20 million+ in guarantees, at roughly $10-13 per year.

I can't see the Hawks paying that. Gilliam is probably, whether or not you like it, next year's left tackle.

Sweezy I'm not sure about. He's not a great fit for most teams.

 

[Fade]

Whelp, I've seen enough, and I am sticking to my opinion of moving on from Okung. The playoffs crystallized, and framed my thoughts on Okung perfectly. Outside of Okung signing a 1 year incentive based contract he is just not worth it. Alvin Bailey looked better than him, and he is an undrafted player.

Justin Britt gets eaten alive by Aaron Donald. Gets destroyed by Kawann Short which caused RW's pick 6. They need a LG too. He has never been good, and will just be a serviceable backup for his career. Think Paul McQuistan. Glowinski should be given a chance to compete for this job IMO.

Lewis for stability reasons needs to be tendered, but I fully expect Seattle to spend a draft pick to be the guy eventually.

Sweezy for stability reasons should be retained, but it wouldn't be the end of the world if he signed somewhere else.

Gilliam made strides this season, and can be a starting tackle in the NFL. Competition will still need to be added though.


Projected O-Line 2016

(LT) Joe Dahl, WSU -- (LG) Mark Glowinski -- (C) Patrick Lewis -- (RG) J.R. Sweezy -- (RT) Garry Gilliam

Reserves
T - Shon Coleman, Auburn
C - Mike Matthews, Texas A&M
T - Alvin Bailey
G - Justin Britt

 

[Grahamhawker]

Isn't Terry Poole still on IR?

Wasn't he Cable's #1 favorite pick last year?

 

[NFSeahawks]

Okung has been injured his entire career and he's an average at best LT right now.

Not worth keeping when were just going to have to replace him again when he's injured.

 

[TheLegendOfBoom]

A team more likely will be successful built thru drafting than free agents/trades. Free agents and trade is like adding a "final" piece or adding "toppings" to an ice cream sundae.

IMO, the Hawks are more than one piece away from having the talent and depth to reach SuperBowl champion level.

Clearly, this offensive line is not ready.

The defensive line did not have its depth. I think PC and company clearly under estimated the value and importance of an interior pass rusher opposite Mike Bennett. Being able to penetrate the pocket from the inside was a glaring weakness whenever Michael Bennett was rushing on the edge.

Cary Williams was a terrible move which cost the Seahawks some games.

Kam Chancellor hold out clearly affected the communication between the secondary.

Cover-3 is not stopping any team that has a decent tight end and the defensive line playing a solid offensive line. No pressure, opposing QB's threw rather easily.

That being said:

LT: Draft
LG: Britt (some reason I feel PC keeps him here)
C: Lewis (See Britt)
RG: Draft
RT: Gilliam (I see him starter next year)

 

[Thepeelsessions]

I gave up on Okung a long time ago. The Hawks can do better. It's really too bad though, because he looked like he was going to be a top 3 LT his first two years (when he was on the field). Injuries and age have caught up with him and it shows in his play.

I'm still undecided on Britt. I think he can be a force at LG, but that's a big question mark. I think he's shown big improvements there from when he was plugged in in the pre season.

You absolutely tender Lewis. He is starter material.

Sweezy is replaceable. He is what he is. An average to below average guard in the NFL.

Gilliam is......I'm not even sure. Like Britt, he showed improvement, but he still has a long way to go. I think he needs a short leash.

I've been high on mad dog since draft day. I think he'll emerge as the starting RG next season. Bailey can go. I'm really interested in Poole. He was the first O lineman taken in the draft, and spent the whole season on the PS. I'd like to see how he looks in the TC and the preseason. Once again, the I line should be top priority. Hopefully Pete and John actually makes it happen this offseason. Personally, I'd love it if they go all out on draft day and use rounds 1, 2, 3 (x2) on the O line. I don't care. Do whatever it takes. This is what I'd like to see the starting line for week one look like.

LT: Stud vet or rookie
LG: Britt
C: P-lew
RG: Mad dog
RT: Gilliam or rookie

Depth: Poole, decent cheap vet or two, rookie, rookie. When I'm back in football mode I'll be doing draft research. I have no idea who's declared yet.