Revisiting the call - last play of Super Bowl XLIX

[Vancanhawksfan]

The slant pass was not a risk at all? Then why did it get intercepted if there was NO risk? LOL, SMH.

The same risk as handing the ball off to Lynch even though he spilled it without even being hit a year earlier in the NFC Championship game on the 1 yard line. In the past year more turnovers occurred with a hand off than a slant pass (or any pass for that matter) from the 1 yd line.

You're the one being ridiculous by calling the 1 yd slant a high risk pass when statistics simply don't support your argument.

 

[chris98251]

The slant pass was not a risk at all? Then why did it get intercepted if there was NO risk? LOL, SMH.

The same risk as handing the ball off to Lynch even though he spilled it without even being hit a year earlier in the NFC Championship game on the 1 yard line. In the past year more turnovers occurred with a hand off than a slant pass (or any pass for that matter) from the 1 yd line.

You're the one being ridiculous by calling the 1 yd slant a high risk pass when statistics simply don't support your argument.

Ok, where are the numbers that show on the less then a one yard line with a number 4 or 5 receiver that plays the edge and a DB that has practiced against that play for years that it has a higher chance of success then a running play with the best short yardage back in the game against one of the worst goal line defenses is better?

Actually a better call would have been to spike the ball and get another play and personnel group in.

 

[Sac]

I truly believe that if Marshawn was given the call and he fumbled the ball all of you would call for Bevell's head for being too predictable, or not <blah blah blah>

Really? All of us? Do you work for the Psychic Hotline or Ms Cleo? Can I have the lotto numbers?

Personally, I was ok with a pass play. But not a slant from the 1 yard line. If Bevell had called a play-action roll out, and at least forced the defense to respect the threat of Lynch, that would have opened up a passing opportunity or allowed Russ to run it in himself.

All the haters dude - not you necessarily...you know what I meant.

I would have preferred a roll out too upon first blush. But then how PO'd would we have been if Wilson gets tackled for a loss and the play clock is running and its no longer 1 yd to go? And then everyone would have scorched Bevell for not running the ball...you know that that would have happened for sure.

The slant pass really is not a high risk pass at all. I cannot think of one time in 30 years of watching the Seahawks where we've turned the ball over on a short yardage slant near the goal line.

First, Wilson is highly unlikely to get tackled for a loss under those circumstances. Russ is the guy who will throw the ball away under those circumstances as he should.

Second, slant passes aren't normally that risky in a normal situation because the defense has so much more ground they have to defend. From the goal line, the defense is assisted by the confined space which allows corners to take more chances and try and make a play on the ball because they're not worried about getting beat deep. That's why the slant isn't a great call there.

Play action roll out? Great.

Corner? Fine.

Run the damn ball? Definitely.

The slant is my least favorite option here. The goal line slant is how 99 yard pick 6's are made.

 

[original poster]

I cringed when I saw the thread title.

You obviously didn't read past the thread title then did you?

Here...do you really want to cringe?? Go to 1:13:45 of the video I posted. 2013 NFC Championship game against the 49ers.

4th quarter. The Seahawks just took the lead 20-17 five minutes earlier for the first time in the game THROWING for a 35 yard touchdown ON 4TH AND 7 (ridiculous!!!). Now they are ready to seal the deal at the 8:31 mark.

It is 4th down and goal at the one yard line.

And what is the obvious call that everyone in Seahawk nation would implore Bevell to do in what might be, at this point in time, the biggest play call in Seahawks history?!?!?!

Yeah...you guessed it.

And what was the outcome??????????????????????????????????????????????????

Watch the video. Go to 1:13:45.

There are reasons the coaches make their play calls. Some of it comes down to personnel. Some of it comes down to skill sets. Some of it comes down to situation and set ups. Some of it comes down to moment in time, momentum and feel. And some of it comes down to previous experiences.

To be fair I did read it and it was good to hear a different perspective of it, I just don't really want to discuss it anymore in all honesty, as I'm sure a lot don't.

 

[Year of The Hawk]

Not every thread has to be read and commented on by everyone. If you are not interested in discussing this anymore than ignore post. It is a Seahawks forum and all things Seahawks. Is it so unreasonable for people still to be dealing with the lose? IT is the offseason and not much to discuss. I guess speculating on a tweet from a player that is 6 years old about a friend who may have passed through Seattle on his travels and how that may bode well for a hometown discount from a star player that will make this team unstoppable and allow nobody to score on us is a better thread???

P.S. This post was not intended for "Original Poster".

 

[Vancanhawksfan]

I truly believe that if Marshawn was given the call and he fumbled the ball all of you would call for Bevell's head for being too predictable, or not <blah blah blah>

Really? All of us? Do you work for the Psychic Hotline or Ms Cleo? Can I have the lotto numbers?

Personally, I was ok with a pass play. But not a slant from the 1 yard line. If Bevell had called a play-action roll out, and at least forced the defense to respect the threat of Lynch, that would have opened up a passing opportunity or allowed Russ to run it in himself.

All the haters dude - not you necessarily...you know what I meant.

I would have preferred a roll out too upon first blush. But then how PO'd would we have been if Wilson gets tackled for a loss and the play clock is running and its no longer 1 yd to go? And then everyone would have scorched Bevell for not running the ball...you know that that would have happened for sure.

The slant pass really is not a high risk pass at all. I cannot think of one time in 30 years of watching the Seahawks where we've turned the ball over on a short yardage slant near the goal line.

First, Wilson is highly unlikely to get tackled for a loss under those circumstances. Russ is the guy who will throw the ball away under those circumstances as he should.

Second, slant passes aren't normally that risky in a normal situation because the defense has so much more ground they have to defend. From the goal line, the defense is assisted by the confined space which allows corners to take more chances and try and make a play on the ball because they're not worried about getting beat deep. That's why the slant isn't a great call there.

Play action roll out? Great.

Corner? Fine.

Run the damn ball? Definitely.

The slant is my least favorite option here. The goal line slant is how 99 yard pick 6's are made.

Rubbish. Statistics support nothing you've said. Where are the stats that show all these 99 yard pick sixes that occur from a goal line slant?!?!? I've never seen one. I've seen quick outs go for pick sixes - but never a slant up the middle from the 1 yard line. Ever.

And again...from the 1 yd line ZERO turnovers occurred in 2014 on a pass play in the NFL whether the QB was Peyton Manning or Johnny Football running the show. Not one.

Run the ball...statistics show that there is a higher likelihood of a loss occurring in a run whereas on the quick slant the ball will be thrown immediately.

Again...I'm not saying your choice of play is wrong - but for you to say that Bevell's choice was wrong based on historical evidence is rubbish.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

You stated in the other thread that my "hindsight (was) 20/20". As I stated in that post I wanted a Lynch run first and foremost. When he ran it to the one on first down I said out loud "run him again". I still want that to be the call. As for other pass plays/routes that I suggested as being better calls than the slant to an UDFA WR being 20/20 hindsight as you stated, you're correct. But, Darrell Bevell and Pete Carroll are paid a lot of money to make those calls not in hindsight, but rather with foresight. They failed. Period. In my opinion, running a power back like Lynch no matter his past fumble at the goal line vs. Frisco and no matter the opponent is a smarter call than a slant REGARDLESS of past situations and play calls UNLESS you are out of time outs which Seattle was not.

Anything you or anyone else says will not change my mind about that fateful play. I wanted a handoff to Marshawn then, now and forever in the future.



Looking forward to 2015.

 

[Vancanhawksfan]

The slant pass was not a risk at all? Then why did it get intercepted if there was NO risk? LOL, SMH.

The same risk as handing the ball off to Lynch even though he spilled it without even being hit a year earlier in the NFC Championship game on the 1 yard line. In the past year more turnovers occurred with a hand off than a slant pass (or any pass for that matter) from the 1 yd line.

You're the one being ridiculous by calling the 1 yd slant a high risk pass when statistics simply don't support your argument.

Ok, where are the numbers that show on the less then a one yard line with a number 4 or 5 receiver that plays the edge and a DB that has practiced against that play for years that it has a higher chance of success then a running play with the best short yardage back in the game against one of the worst goal line defenses is better?

Actually a better call would have been to spike the ball and get another play and personnel group in.

I'm not the one saying Bevell's play call was rubbish...posters like you have the onus of proving why his call was a poor one (without revisionist history).

His call was not a risky one and statistics back that up. Why don't you back up your trashing of him and demonstrate why a slant pass on the 1 yard line was so risky?

 

[Vancanhawksfan]

You stated in the other thread that my "hindsight (was) 20/20". As I stated in that post I wanted a Lynch run first and foremost. When he ran it to the one on first down I said out loud "run him again". I still want that to be the call. As for other pass plays/routes that I suggested as being better calls than the slant to an UDFA WR being 20/20 hindsight as you stated, you're correct. But, Darrell Bevell and Pete Carroll are paid a lot of money to make those calls not in hindsight, but rather with foresight. They failed. Period. In my opinion, running a power back like Lynch no matter his past fumble at the goal line vs. Frisco and no matter the opponent is a smarter call than a slant REGARDLESS of past situations and play calls UNLESS you are out of time outs which Seattle was not.

Anything you or anyone else says will not change my mind about that fateful play. I wanted a handoff to Marshawn then, now and forever in the future.



Looking forward to 2015.

The foresight that likely came into play was that:

a) in 2014 Lynch was 5/12 from the 1 yard line (keeping in mind that they mix up the plays from the 1 yard line to be unpredictable;

b) in 2014 the Seahawks convert more on pass plays from the 1 yard line (50%) than Lynch carries from the 1 yard line;

c) that the Seahawks, nor the NFL, turned the ball over on pass plays from that position this year; and

d) a Lynch carry is not a 100% guarantee to keep possession (he lost the ball in the NFC Championship last year) AND is not a 100% guarantee of not losing yardage;

e) the Seahawks ran that play successfully before;

AND

f) the Seahawks, if they wanted to maximize the number of attempts at goal, had to have one pass attempt in the series so that if they didn't score they would get at least one clock stoppage without using their last timeout.

That is some of the foresight. Your foresight is revisionist only.

 

[Sports Hernia]

His call was not a risky one and statistics back that up. Why don't you back up your trashing of him and demonstrate why a slant pass on the 1 yard line was so risky?

Hogwash!
The PICK on that play SCREAMS and PROVES that it was a risky call, but you are too busy covering your ears to hear it.

You are too tunnel visioned in "full Bevell defense mode" to see this.

Browner knew where the ball was going when he saw the formation based on what he saw for many years of practicing against it when he was here. You would have thought the "genius" that you claim our OC is, he would have factored that into the play call?!?!?!


That's my last word on this subject, defend away.

 

[Sac]

[youtube]zAHO6L5tM-w[/youtube]

 

[chris98251]

The slant pass was not a risk at all? Then why did it get intercepted if there was NO risk? LOL, SMH.

The same risk as handing the ball off to Lynch even though he spilled it without even being hit a year earlier in the NFC Championship game on the 1 yard line. In the past year more turnovers occurred with a hand off than a slant pass (or any pass for that matter) from the 1 yd line.

You're the one being ridiculous by calling the 1 yd slant a high risk pass when statistics simply don't support your argument.

Ok, where are the numbers that show on the less then a one yard line with a number 4 or 5 receiver that plays the edge and a DB that has practiced against that play for years that it has a higher chance of success then a running play with the best short yardage back in the game against one of the worst goal line defenses is better?

Actually a better call would have been to spike the ball and get another play and personnel group in.

I'm not the one saying Bevell's play call was rubbish...posters like you have the onus of proving why his call was a poor one (without revisionist history).

His call was not a risky one and statistics back that up. Why don't you back up your trashing of him and demonstrate why a slant pass on the 1 yard line was so risky?

22 men in a box no room for separation is enough by itself to argue that play was wrong, Bevell should have known Browner knew the play the second reason and he didn't use it as a decoy and run something else out of it. That's a failure on the OC part.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

You stated in the other thread that my "hindsight (was) 20/20". As I stated in that post I wanted a Lynch run first and foremost. When he ran it to the one on first down I said out loud "run him again". I still want that to be the call. As for other pass plays/routes that I suggested as being better calls than the slant to an UDFA WR being 20/20 hindsight as you stated, you're correct. But, Darrell Bevell and Pete Carroll are paid a lot of money to make those calls not in hindsight, but rather with foresight. They failed. Period. In my opinion, running a power back like Lynch no matter his past fumble at the goal line vs. Frisco and no matter the opponent is a smarter call than a slant REGARDLESS of past situations and play calls UNLESS you are out of time outs which Seattle was not.

Anything you or anyone else says will not change my mind about that fateful play. I wanted a handoff to Marshawn then, now and forever in the future.



Looking forward to 2015.

The foresight that likely came into play was that:

a) in 2014 Lynch was 5/12 from the 1 yard line (keeping in mind that they mix up the plays from the 1 yard line to be unpredictable;

b) in 2014 the Seahawks convert more on pass plays from the 1 yard line (50%) than Lynch carries from the 1 yard line;

c) that the Seahawks, nor the NFL, turned the ball over on pass plays from that position this year; and

d) a Lynch carry is not a 100% guarantee to keep possession (he lost the ball in the NFC Championship last year) AND is not a 100% guarantee of not losing yardage;

e) the Seahawks ran that play successfully before;

AND

f) the Seahawks, if they wanted to maximize the number of attempts at goal, had to have one pass attempt in the series so that if they didn't score they would get at least one clock stoppage without using their last timeout.

That is some of the foresight. Your foresight is revisionist only.

Don't care about your stats, don't care about your opinion, don't care about your attempts to convince me (and others) you're right and we're wrong. You're not going to change my mind. Ever. Period.

The MAJORITY (and a large majority at that from the interviews I heard) of people who have played the game, coached the game and been around the game in a professional capacity said in interviews after XLIX that running Lynch was the right call. But they're wrong and you're right? Uh, no.

You've long since passed into the annoying zone and I'm done trying to get you to see the other side of the discussion. "You bore me son".

 

[Sports Hernia]

You stated in the other thread that my "hindsight (was) 20/20". As I stated in that post I wanted a Lynch run first and foremost. When he ran it to the one on first down I said out loud "run him again". I still want that to be the call. As for other pass plays/routes that I suggested as being better calls than the slant to an UDFA WR being 20/20 hindsight as you stated, you're correct. But, Darrell Bevell and Pete Carroll are paid a lot of money to make those calls not in hindsight, but rather with foresight. They failed. Period. In my opinion, running a power back like Lynch no matter his past fumble at the goal line vs. Frisco and no matter the opponent is a smarter call than a slant REGARDLESS of past situations and play calls UNLESS you are out of time outs which Seattle was not.

Anything you or anyone else says will not change my mind about that fateful play. I wanted a handoff to Marshawn then, now and forever in the future.



Looking forward to 2015.

The foresight that likely came into play was that:

a) in 2014 Lynch was 5/12 from the 1 yard line (keeping in mind that they mix up the plays from the 1 yard line to be unpredictable;

b) in 2014 the Seahawks convert more on pass plays from the 1 yard line (50%) than Lynch carries from the 1 yard line;

c) that the Seahawks, nor the NFL, turned the ball over on pass plays from that position this year; and

d) a Lynch carry is not a 100% guarantee to keep possession (he lost the ball in the NFC Championship last year) AND is not a 100% guarantee of not losing yardage;

e) the Seahawks ran that play successfully before;

AND

f) the Seahawks, if they wanted to maximize the number of attempts at goal, had to have one pass attempt in the series so that if they didn't score they would get at least one clock stoppage without using their last timeout.

That is some of the foresight. Your foresight is revisionist only.

Don't care about your stats, don't care about your opinion, don't care about your attempts to convince me (and others) you're right and we're wrong. You're not going to change my mind. Ever. Period.

The MAJORITY (and a large majority at that from the interviews I heard) of people who have played the game, coached the game and been around the game in a professional capacity said in interviews after XLIX that running Lynch was the right call. But they're wrong and you're right? Uh, no.

You've long since passed into the annoying zone and I'm done trying to get you to see the other side of the discussion. "You bore me son".

bravo! Well put! :th2thumbs:

 

[Vancanhawksfan]

[youtube]zAHO6L5tM-w[/youtube]

Not the same play dude. But that's ok...I can post a play where Brandon Browner makes a 100+ yard fumble return from a handoff just to prove the ridiculousness of this discussion:

[youtube]NX1zir_1lb8[/youtube]

 

[Sac]

[youtube]jE3W6rDpHUM[/youtube]

 

[chris98251]

[youtube]zAHO6L5tM-w[/youtube]

Not the same play dude. But that's ok...I can post a play where Brandon Browner makes a 100+ yard fumble return from a handoff just to prove the ridiculousness of this discussion:

[youtube]NX1zir_1lb8[/youtube]

Agreed, you started this discussion and after the Super Bowl it was relevant, now it is ridiculous. so what does that say?

 

[Largent80]

Look, let's keep it simple. This was, and maybe is, the worst call EVER at a particular moment.

Also, personnel wise, The WORST person to throw a ball to. So........

This play is my definition of EPIC FAIL.

And with that, I throw my last shovel load of dirt on this.

 

[Vancanhawksfan]

The same risk as handing the ball off to Lynch even though he spilled it without even being hit a year earlier in the NFC Championship game on the 1 yard line. In the past year more turnovers occurred with a hand off than a slant pass (or any pass for that matter) from the 1 yd line.

You're the one being ridiculous by calling the 1 yd slant a high risk pass when statistics simply don't support your argument.

Ok, where are the numbers that show on the less then a one yard line with a number 4 or 5 receiver that plays the edge and a DB that has practiced against that play for years that it has a higher chance of success then a running play with the best short yardage back in the game against one of the worst goal line defenses is better?

Actually a better call would have been to spike the ball and get another play and personnel group in.

I'm not the one saying Bevell's play call was rubbish...posters like you have the onus of proving why his call was a poor one (without revisionist history).

His call was not a risky one and statistics back that up. Why don't you back up your trashing of him and demonstrate why a slant pass on the 1 yard line was so risky?

22 men in a box no room for separation is enough by itself to argue that play was wrong, Bevell should have known Browner knew the play the second reason and he didn't use it as a decoy and run something else out of it. That's a failure on the OC part.

You can argue that Browner knows virtually every Seahawks play. That doesn't mean you throw away the entire offensive playbook.

Yes...Browner made a great play but he couldn't know for sure what routes everyone was going to run. Give Browner the credit he deserves, and every SS should take note and do what he did on that formation but the reality is that most safeties don't make that play (including Browner in the past)

 

[Vancanhawksfan]

Look, let's keep it simple. This was, and maybe is, the worst call EVER at a particular moment.

Also, personnel wise, The WORST person to throw a ball to. So........

This play is my definition of EPIC FAIL.

And with that, I throw my last shovel load of dirt on this.

I completely disagree. I think it was the most disappointing result of a play ever for a Seahawks fan and that the Patriot's safety Butler made a once in a lifetime play.