Seattle Sounders 2016 season thread

[knownone]

I was wrong about this team. I feel like it's time for me to admit that.

Honestly, this team has had some bad luck, they aren't barren for talent, and for the most part the players seem to genuinely care about the losses. Unfortunately, they have 16 points in 15 matches, an MLS worst 13 goals, and there are no excuses for that. I can't logically defend that.

The question I have is this. Who do we blame? In years past it was pretty easy to blame Sigi. It was easy to question his lineup choices, his substitutions, and formations. This doesn't feel that simple. I don't think this is Sigi's fault. In fact, I can't think of anything Sigi has done that I staunchly disagree with. So who do we blame?

I'm slowly leaning more and more toward blaming Garth. He's not responsible for Oba leaving. He is however responsible for Andy Rose, Lamar Neagle, Marco Pappa, and Michael Azira leaving. Marco Pappa scored or assisted on 23 goals in 47 games. Lamar Neagle scored or assisted on 37 goals in 93 games. Our biggest issue? Scoring goals...

Who did Garth bring into replace those guys? Was Ivanschitz really supposed to replace Pappa? Ivanschitz is 4 years older, nearly 3 times as expensive, and he's not a creative distributor in the same way as Pappa. Were they relying on Nelson Valdez to fill that void? Valdez is a great workhorse, but his best years were on teams with great CAMs, he's not gonna create his own shot, he's not blow past guys like Oba. We knew this going into the season, Valdez being injured has only compounded that problem, but it's not Valdez's fault.

It's easy to say that the Sounders were caught of guard by Oba leaving. Yet, Rumors of Oba leaving for China had been circulating since the end of last season. Adrian and Garth have stated numerous times that they plan 2,3,4 windows ahead. Garth even said they had players in mind for replacing Oba long before the transfer became a reality.

Where are these guys? Garth likes to talk about bringing in the right guys, guys who can help build for the future, and I'm fine with that. So long as they commit to rebuilding, and they haven't, they haven't even admitted they are rebuilding. So why are they waiting on guys like Lodeiro? Why does Garth keep saying he won't sign one player, he wants to package players "One DP and One TAM that compliments him" which implies that he's not building around our current roster, but building around a DP that we don't even have yet. Well no wonder we haven't signed anyone, signing one player is hard enough, signing 2 players who compliment each other... even harder.

I really felt like I needed to rant about this...

 

[SeatownJay]

On a brighter note, the Sounders won their US Open Cup match against RSL last night on penalties. I'm pretty sure this is the first time in franchise history they've won a penalty shootout.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

The question I have is this. Who do we blame? In years past it was pretty easy to blame Sigi. It was easy to question his lineup choices, his substitutions, and formations. This doesn't feel that simple. I don't think this is Sigi's fault. In fact, I can't think of anything Sigi has done that I staunchly disagree with. So who do we blame? .

As with any complicated problem, blame is divided amongst all involved.

It starts at the top for ownership giving Sigi a new contract after close to a decade of not delivering what he was brought here to deliver, a MLS Cup. Is he a bad manager? No, he's fine. But fine isn't the expectation a club that keeps telling us it's aim is to be a "world class" organization should be content with. Sigi should have been fired after last year.

Lagerwey is next up. I assume he was given control over the major decisions last off season, the biggest one with selling our best player by a mile for a lowball transfer fee. A player who was the engine and focal point of our entire attack. ESPECIALLY with no real replacement plan in place, other than crossing our fingers that we could sign another quality DP in the transfer window..........which if you haven't noticed, hasn't happened yet.

Instead Lagerwey gambled on an unproven rookie and old ass often injured forward to pick up the slack on offense.

Lagerwey also didn't see the writing on the wall with at least 3-4 other players who's expiration dates have come. Ozzie, Evans, Mears......and even Marshall isn't the same player he was a couple years ago. Too many aging players counted on to perform or regain form.

So no, I don't blame the players. I still see the effort on the pitch.............but what bothers me is all the excuses I've been hearing out of the organization, especially Sigi. Too many bad calls, unfair calls, Clint's been gone, young players aren't where we thought they would be. Blah blah blah, loser talk.

 

[Glasgow Seahawk]

The question I have is this. Who do we blame? In years past it was pretty easy to blame Sigi. It was easy to question his lineup choices, his substitutions, and formations. This doesn't feel that simple. I don't think this is Sigi's fault. In fact, I can't think of anything Sigi has done that I staunchly disagree with. So who do we blame? .

As with any complicated problem, blame is divided amongst all involved.

It starts at the top for ownership giving Sigi a new contract after close to a decade of not delivering what he was brought here to deliver, a MLS Cup. Is he a bad manager? No, he's fine. But fine isn't the expectation a club that keeps telling us it's aim is to be a "world class" organization should be content with. Sigi should have been fired after last year.

Lagerwey is next up. I assume he was given control over the major decisions last off season, the biggest one with selling our best player by a mile for a lowball transfer fee. A player who was the engine and focal point of our entire attack. ESPECIALLY with no real replacement plan in place, other than crossing our fingers that we could sign another quality DP in the transfer window..........which if you haven't noticed, hasn't happened yet.

Instead Lagerwey gambled on an unproven rookie and old ass often injured forward to pick up the slack on offense.

Lagerwey also didn't see the writing on the wall with at least 3-4 other players who's expiration dates have come. Ozzie, Evans, Mears......and even Marshall isn't the same player he was a couple years ago. Too many aging players counted on to perform or regain form.

So no, I don't blame the players. I still see the effort on the pitch.............but what bothers me is all the excuses I've been hearing out of the organization, especially Sigi. Too many bad calls, unfair calls, Clint's been gone, young players aren't where we thought they would be. Blah blah blah, loser talk.

I agree with this, yeah we've been unlucky losing weird goals and ref decisions but good teams over come that. The better teams create their own luck.

I agree the effort is there but not the talent this year and part of that is a lot of players have lost a step, Oba leaving and a lot of the younger players not being as good. Too many games we see the players waiting for someone to step up and it hasn't happened. In the past Oba did that.

I know it was the open cup but I was impressed with the GK Miller and the CB's last night who were playing RSL's mostly first team. I felt Morris coming on changed the momentum of the game. I've wanted to see Morris come on later in games to kill teams with his pace and last night was a good example.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I know it was the open cup but I was impressed with the GK Miller and the CB's last night who were playing RSL's mostly first team. I felt Morris coming on changed the momentum of the game. I've wanted to see Morris come on later in games to kill teams with his pace and last night was a good example.

That's the thing though, we need Morris to produce for 90 minutes, and not just be a 70th or 80th minute sub with pace.

In a perfect situation Morris would be a late game sub, easing him into the demands of the MLS. Because I do think he's pressing and making mistakes under the pressure of needing to produce for this club.

Should have kept Oba, and dumped Ozzie and Valdez (2.5M in savings).........still would have had an open DP slot without Valdez on the roster.

 

[Glasgow Seahawk]

I know it was the open cup but I was impressed with the GK Miller and the CB's last night who were playing RSL's mostly first team. I felt Morris coming on changed the momentum of the game. I've wanted to see Morris come on later in games to kill teams with his pace and last night was a good example.

That's the thing though, we need Morris to produce for 90 minutes, and not just be a 70th or 80th minute sub with pace.

In a perfect situation Morris would be a late game sub, easing him into the demands of the MLS. Because I do think he's pressing and making mistakes under the pressure of needing to produce for this club.

Should have kept Oba, and dumped Ozzie and Valdez (2.5M in savings).........still would have had an open DP slot without Valdez on the roster.

Agreed, you run the risk of destroying his confidence if he doesn't play well. He should have been eased in and got more playing time as the season went on. Badly need a true replacement for Oba to help with that.

 

[SeatownJay]

Sounders will face the Galaxy in L.A. on July 20th in the quarters of the US Open Cup.

 

[Uncle Si]

I know it was the open cup but I was impressed with the GK Miller and the CB's last night who were playing RSL's mostly first team. I felt Morris coming on changed the momentum of the game. I've wanted to see Morris come on later in games to kill teams with his pace and last night was a good example.

That's the thing though, we need Morris to produce for 90 minutes, and not just be a 70th or 80th minute sub with pace.

In a perfect situation Morris would be a late game sub, easing him into the demands of the MLS. Because I do think he's pressing and making mistakes under the pressure of needing to produce for this club.

Should have kept Oba, and dumped Ozzie and Valdez (2.5M in savings).........still would have had an open DP slot without Valdez on the roster.

Why though?

Players his age have been producing at all types of competitive levels, including the MLS and much, much higher. This isn't the NFL where you groom players. He has been managed poorly.

The issue with Morris is that the Sounders played him out of position and with little support around him.

Morris needed to play 70-80 minutes at the forward position, have a strong midfield around him and have goal scorers behind him and to his wings.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Morris needed to play 70-80 minutes at the forward position, have a strong midfield around him and have goal scorers behind him and to his wings.

Then he should have gone to Europe, because what you described here doesn't exist in the MLS.

 

[Uncle Si]

Morris needed to play 70-80 minutes at the forward position, have a strong midfield around him and have goal scorers behind him and to his wings.

Then he should have gone to Europe, because what you described here doesn't exist in the MLS.

Well maybe... (I did say he should have gone to Europe like on page 2 of this thread... but was also excited he was staying in the MLS).

He'd have developed quite well at LA though

 

[SeatownJay]

Morris with an absolute beauty of a goal tonight to get Seattle a point on the road. The back line continues to be horrid, though, and Marshall left after 50 minutes with some sort of injury.

 

[SeatownJay]

Seattle may be looking at bring Alvaro Fernandez back on a free transfer.

http://www.sounderatheart.com/sounders- ... re-reality

 

[Glasgow Seahawk]

Not against it if he is cheap and not a dp. Bit concerned thiugh that he hasnt done much since leaving Seattle and is a bit injury prone.

 

[SeatownJay]

Should Seattle just go ahead and dump Sigi now or actually wait until the season is over? I kinda wish MLS had relegation at this point, the threat of being demoted might actually motivate the front office to make some moves.

 

[hawkfan68]

Should Seattle just go ahead and dump Sigi now or actually wait until the season is over? I kinda wish MLS had relegation at this point, the threat of being demoted might actually motivate the front office to make some moves.

The Sounders just can't seem to "finish" this year. They've had plenty of chances but never seem to cash in. While the loss Oba is huge, I think the subtractions of Neagle, Barrett, and Pappa are also a reason why they are inept at scoring. They purged most of the offense from the past seasons. Thus the results. Lagerway is a bigger problem than Sigi. They have won with Sigi in the past. Whether it's despite his influence, they still seemed to come out on top most of the time. They have self-destructed under Lagerway in 1 1/2 seasons.

 

[Smurf]

This is just getting ridiculous.....


I am so tired of us throwing out the same broken thing expecting different results.

The vets can't get it done, why aren't we letting the kids get a run out?

Why isn't Oalex Anderson starting? He is our most dynamic attacking player right now....and he gets MAYBE 20 minutes of work....Who cares if he is a liability defending....We need to score goals. Period.

Remick, Fisher, Jones, Mansaray....lets give them opprotunities with the first team.


What do we have to lose? We can't score goals right now...We just can't.

We are boring. Stagnant. Dis-functional. Anemic. Toothless.

We suck, and I'm sick of it.

Change the system. Change the players. Change the coach. Change something. Doing the same crap just isn't getting the job done.

 

[knownone]

I've got a strange feeling we're gonna see Jason Kreis in Seattle sooner than later. The rumored players we are supposedly chasing all fit the mold of a Kreis/Lagerway system. The fact that we're waiting on Lodeiro, who doesn't exactly fit the mold of a Sigi DP, is pretty telling in my opinion. Lodeiro does fit well as the center piece (think Javier Morales) of the 4-3-3 / 4-2-1-3 system that Kreis favored with RSL - In fact you could make a very strong argument he'd be a best case scenario for that role in MLS. Blanco fits this role as well.

I'm starting to wonder if maybe it wasn't Sigi's idea to switch to a 4-4-3. Maybe Lagerway pushed for it...

 

[Glasgow Seahawk]

I've got a strange feeling we're gonna see Jason Kreis in Seattle sooner than later. The rumored players we are supposedly chasing all fit the mold of a Kreis/Lagerway system. The fact that we're waiting on Lodeiro, who doesn't exactly fit the mold of a Sigi DP, is pretty telling in my opinion. Lodeiro does fit well as the center piece (think Javier Morales) of the 4-3-3 / 4-2-1-3 system that Kreis favored with RSL - In fact you could make a very strong argument he'd be a best case scenario for that role in MLS. Blanco fits this role as well.

I'm starting to wonder if maybe it wasn't Sigi's idea to switch to a 4-4-3. Maybe Lagerway pushed for it...

I think both are to blame.

Sigi has stuck with 433 all year and it hasnt worked. Why hasnt he changed this? We played way better 2nd half today when we switched to 442. All our success has came from 442 in previous years, why change? Players across the team have not been playing well.

If lagerway wants the Sounders to play that way, why didnt he can Sigi and get his own guy to start the year. Most Sounders fans would have been fine with doing so and felt it was time to move on. Why was no replacement brought in for oba? Unacceptable. If he wanted to go, tell oba your waiting to the summer to do so, given he left 2 weeks before the season.

Why was no defensive depth brought in, Evans has always felt like a stop gap at cb. Scott is 35 and jury is out on when torres is back which leaves Marshall who has lost a step.

Today was the first time ive ever heard sigi being asked if his job was in danger. Nevef ever heard that from tv media before. I can see Garth sacrifice him and bring his own guy to save himself. I do also wonder how influential Hanauer is still. Is he overshadowing lagerway or completely hands off non on field now?

Personally wouldnt mind seeing both gm and coach leave. I think we are due a big rebuild and to be honest id keep morris and frei and blow it up. We are an old team and a lot of long term servants just arent cutting it any more. If we can get a lot out of a trade for dempsey, ozzy, evans etc id bite the bullet to get younger, hungrier and faster and get a new set of dps in. We need new ideas.

 

[SeatownJay]

Sigi's the one that insists on playing Joevan Jones, Zach Scott & Nelson Valdez. He's the one that insists on playing Morris out of position. Name one young player that has developed and improved under Sigi, because I can't think of any. He needs to be the first one gone before this organization can move forward.

 

[Glasgow Seahawk]

Sigi's the one that insists on playing Joevan Jones, Zach Scott & Nelson Valdez. He's the one that insists on playing Morris out of position. Name one young player that has developed and improved under Sigi, because I can't think of any. He needs to be the first one gone before this organization can move forward.

Yedlin? He was super raw when he first came in a got better, but was still a liability at the defensive part of his game when he left.

Clutching after that though. Always felt Neagle had the potential to be good when he first came through but never developed any consistency. Getting shunted wide a lot never helped. A good coach might have helped Montero be less streaky when here.

I wouldnt say there are too many players who leave who I was bummed about or have came back to haunt us. Yedlin, Oba, felt Gspurning got a raw deal. Other than that it always felt like Montero, eddie johnson, rosales times were up for one reason or another

Morris should be up front or coming off the bench. None of this out wide stuff. Get proper wingers for that. Its his rookie season so i expect inconsistent play. Just hope next year there is no tinkering to mess with his development for both the sounders and the usmnts sake.