Who won the Max Unger/ Jimmy Graham Trade?

[hgwellz12]

We lost. But, I'd rather be rooting for my Seattle Seahawks for the rest of my life and beyond than the Saints.
Jimmy seems depressed lately. Like he'd rather just be in his airplane.

 

[XxXdragonXxX]

Saints clearly won. The only good trade this FO has made so far has been Lynch (let's see how Richardson's trade develops).

Youre forgetting Daryl Tapp for Chris Clemons and a pick.

 

[onanygivensunday]

Saints clearly won. The only good trade this FO has made so far has been Lynch (let's see how Richardson's trade develops).

Youre forgetting Daryl Tapp for Chris Clemons and a pick.

You're also forgetting that we traded a 5th round choice to NE for Justin Coleman, and then turned around and traded Cassius Marsh to NE thereby recovering our 5th rounder... AND also getting NE's 5th rounder next year. I'd call that some pretty nifty trading.

And have you seen the three or so bonehead plays that Marsh has made with NE? Thank goodness he's no longer doing those as a Seahawk.

Addition by subtraction comes to mind..

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

Hilarious.

I mean what is the alternative.

The reason the Seahawks probably traded for Graham was because the draft was pretty mediocre after the top 25 or so guys.

I'm willing to bet, even with that first rounder, you're looking at what the Seahawks still taking Frank Clark with that first pick, and Lockett with the 2nd pick. You'd have to fit a TE somewhere I guess.

The top 5 TEs taken in 2015 together probably couldn't hold Jimmy's jockstrap.

If you include JG part of that that TE class, he'd be the only TE to achieve 400 yards in a season.

He had what 600 yards in 11 games in 2015.

923 yards in 2016.

On pace for around 600 yards after 4 games in 2017, probably will end up around 800-900 if I had to guess, with 3-6 TDs.

His 1670 yards, 8 TDs in less than two full seasons of games seems like a goldmine compared to that 2015 class.

Again a class's where no TE has caught more than 400 yards or 3 TDs in a single season.

Perspective goes a long way.

Btw, Unger probably would have been released regardless of the trade. And if he wasnt, doubt he would have been extended, doubt he would have saved the 2015 season.

 

[Maelstrom787]

Us, easily. Jimmy Graham has been a great contributor despite team struggles, and we found a damn good center in Britt. Us. No contest.

 

[Pandion Haliaetus]

To add to my most recent above post:

Also if Graham can end this season with 730 yards (very capable) and (somehow) 7 TDs. That would put his Seahawks career at 2400 yards and 15 TDs.

800 yards, 5 TDs on a per season average.

What Seahawks starting TE has ever come close to that level of performance and production? For a season let alone 3?

Since 2000.

Fauria. Nope.
Mili. Nope.
Stevens. Nope.
Carlson. Nope.
Miller. Nope.

Just a funny argument really. Never seen a fan base so blinded by a few faults that they can't see they could do a lot worse.

 

[pittpnthrs]

I think its funny how it all equates to great numbers for the Seahawks but horrible numbers for Graham when talking about Jimmy. Just shows how weak the TE position has been for this franchise throughout the years. The offense performed better when he was hurt. He has zero chance of being here next season.

 

[907Hawk]

Hilarious.

I mean what is the alternative.

The reason the Seahawks probably traded for Graham was because the draft was pretty mediocre after the top 25 or so guys.

I'm willing to bet, even with that first rounder, you're looking at what the Seahawks still taking Frank Clark with that first pick, and Lockett with the 2nd pick. You'd have to fit a TE somewhere I guess.

The top 5 TEs taken in 2015 together probably couldn't hold Jimmy's jockstrap.

If you include JG part of that that TE class, he'd be the only TE to achieve 400 yards in a season.

He had what 600 yards in 11 games in 2015.

923 yards in 2016.

On pace for around 600 yards after 4 games in 2017, probably will end up around 800-900 if I had to guess, with 3-6 TDs.

His 1670 yards, 8 TDs in less than two full seasons of games seems like a goldmine compared to that 2015 class.

Again a class's where no TE has caught more than 400 yards or 3 TDs in a single season.

Perspective goes a long way.

Btw, Unger probably would have been released regardless of the trade. And if he wasnt, doubt he would have been extended, doubt he would have saved the 2015 season.

Perspective, many people believe this is a four letter word and would rather label a player garbage or a bust. I can only imagine the kinds of comments if the man had actually played poorly.

 

[irocdave]

just like any forum, your going to get the view from both extremes. I think both teams lost in the trade. It doesn't seem like Unger has made much of an impact with the Saints, and JG hasn't made much of an impact with the Hawks. Don't listen to the posters that seem to think he is an integral part of the Hawks O, they have no clue what that means, especially when he is being paid what he is and ultimately producing what he has. Blame that on our OC , JG or RW, it is what it is and the results do not lie.

The JG experiment with the Hawks cannot be looked at in any other view other than a failure. Considering what was given up for him in players and draft picks, his salary and the cold hard facts / results he has put up since being here. If he never left NO, we all know his stats would have been much better and both teams would have had better records.

This was a lose lose trade. Only benefit was the Saints cut salary cap space.

 

[Maelstrom787]

The JG experiment with the Hawks cannot be looked at in any other view other than a failure.

It can be looked at in another way, and regularly is.

We won the trade, easily.

 

[ivotuk]

We did. We got Graham, who is playing well and will only get better, and we ended up with an All Pro Center who, so far, hasn't been injured.

Love Max Unger though. Hope he has success in New Orleans, just not against us

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=139846

 

[jammerhawk]

The problem with this topic the way it is framed is that it's an either/or answer. The truth lies in between.

The team has tried to change Grahams's style of play to match the serious need for blocking help when Graham is a mismatch move type TE. Greater use of his superior length notwithstanding last season's' steam record in receptions and great use of him in the redbone wherehe presents a real match up concern for opposing Ds would easily for me tip the scale in favour of the Hawks winning this trade.

For me it is frustrating to watch him not used somewhat similarly to his use in NO. His length creates a constant mismatch but seems to be ignored. As well the opportunity cost of losing a 1st round pick grates and although the team assuredly pickup a great player their use of his talent has disappointed.

Presently my vote was earlier stated, but easily could be changed if the team could learn to use his skill better. The problem for me is the seeming inability to constantly and in a game changing way to incorporate TEs into the scheme. Nick Vannett was universally thought to be a great addition and may have been insurance for Willson leaving but he has been mostly invisible.

Happily last game the use of our TEs improved and increased along with the general improvement of the O and a rarely seen use of slants and short outs to them was part of the equation. I remain hopeful.

 

[scutterhawk]

Jimmy Graham had the best year of any TE in Seahawks history last year, but apparently he hasn't done anything here.

1. That's not saying much, considering we've never had an amazing Pro Bowl caliber TE in 40 years. Mike Tice? Jeramy Stevens? Zach Miller? John Carlson? Not exactly a laundry list of HOF'ers there.

2. Expectations. When we traded for Graham, many of us envisioned 1,500 yards and 15 TD's, like he was rolling in New Orleans.

Probably not fair being in this offense, but none the less those were the expectations of a LOT of fans. So yeah Graham's done OK, maybe even above average for a year. But when you're one of the highest paid TE's, and you just got traded for a very good center, the expectations are very high..........and frankly he hasn't lived up to those expectations.

Expectations of think they know it all, echoing fans, maybe JG hasn't lived up to all their expected hype, but on the other side of reality, a younger & healthier Justin Britt certainly has replaced a Center that was likely going to be cut, so to that end, the trading away of our Center turned out to be a wash.
Without a top 10 Run game, Russell Wilson needed (needs) more targets, Graham isn't the TE Blocker that Zach Miller was, but he is a better Receiver, Both teams got what they needed, so the trade was a WIN for both sides.

 

[Seymour]

If we are such winners on this deal, I wonder why no contract extension has been offered?

On 2nd thought....No I don't,

 

[hawknation2017]

No one "won" that trade, unfortunately.

Saints lost a vital red zone threat they have never fully replaced. And the first round pick blew up in their faces.

Meanwhile, the Seahawks have stubbornly refused to use Graham as more receiver than in-line TE. We are still missing a red zone threat, and our blocking is the worst in the league.

I think the trade hurt both teams equally.

 

[SeahawksCanuck]

This Saints fellow also attentively added that we used the fourth rounder to draft Lockett. That makes the trade at least a wash at this juncture.

I don't like evaluating traded draft picks this way, there were other ways we could have moved up to draft Locket (eg. in theory we could have used the first rounder from this trade to get the high third used for Lockett, get back extra picks for moving down, and save all the other picks we sent to Washington).

How bad this trade was for the Seahawks kind of depends on to what extent we believe Britt's emergence last year was due to the move to center versus just gaining extra experience. If Britt would have made similar improvements at guard, even one-for-one (ignoring turning a 1st into a 4th), I'd take Unger over Graham. That's not to say Unger is the better player, just that the last couple years I think an extra quality lineman was more important than what turned out to be a decent receiving tight-end.

 

[HawaiiD]

Neither team won a Super Bowl nor even reached the game. So as far as I'm concerned? It is a wash.

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