Cliff Avril checks in on where things went wrong

erik2690":2am9hp1x said:

mikeak":2am9hp1x said:

SoulfishHawk":2am9hp1x said:

What about the D giving up a 10 point 4th quarter lead? That had nothing to do with it? :lol:

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I am SO TIRED of this narrative

Seahawks offense LAST FOUR POSSESSIONS in the Super Bowl

Number of plays
4, 3, 3, 7

Time:
2.2, 2.07, 1.03 and 1.42

Result

Punt, Punt, Punt, Interception

The ONLY thing the offense accomplished on those four drives was putting a depleted defense back on the field time after time. The offense and specifically Bevell and PC gave the game away

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Since we are giving context. The one that drives me crazy is that first "punt" drive you listed. We are up 10 and get the ball. Russ immediately zings it 25 yards to Lockette near mid-field. 2 yard stuffed run to Lynch and then a short completion for 6 to Kearse. Here's the one that I feel gets underplayed as a turning point. 3rd and 2 and Russ lays in an absolute beauty to Kearse at maybe like the 15 or so down the left sideline. Right in basket, both hands on it and Kearse doesn't come up with it.

So the context for that drive is Wilson throws 3 dimes and yet off the field quick. I just find that sequence to be huge.

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It no doubt was huge. Game changing, SB winning, Dynasty making huge. One drop there that if he does his job, steps on their throat and ends the game long before "the play".

Why does everyone assume that defensive players, and only the defensive players, think this was a knucklehead play call?

It was a terrible call. Bevell made Ricardo Lockette:
- 4 receptions all season
- 4th on the depth chart, the primary WR.
Not Baldwin. Not Kearse. Not Lockett.

Bevell made things worse by throwing Lockette under the bus by saying he didn't execute. He should have manned up by saying Pats D made a great play. No, he blamed the player and that got the entire WR group pissed. We know Beastmode was pissed too, but do you think it's stops there?

And, while everyone is saying the players should get over it, should we tell Hawks fans to get over SB XL too?

Not so easy is it.

truehawksfan":3f39zxft said:

Why does everyone assume that defensive players, and only the defensive players, think this was a knucklehead play call?

It was a terrible call. Bevell made Ricardo Lockette:
- 4 receptions all season
- 4th on the depth chart, the primary WR.
Not Baldwin. Not Kearse. Not Lockett.

Bevell made things worse by throwing Lockette under the bus by saying he didn't execute. He should have manned up by saying Pats D made a great play. No, he blamed the player and that got the entire WR group pissed. We know Beastmode was pissed too, but do you think it's stops there?

And, while everyone is saying the players should get over it, should we tell Hawks fans to get over SB XL too?

Not so easy is it.

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That is not what I'm saying at all. The defense (as it appears now) are the only ones that let it fester, let it come out on the field, and were not able to get over it well enough to do their job to the best of their abilities.

Everyone knows it was a shitty call, this is about not getting over it. Getting over it does not mean it cannot be discussed either (the fan card), it means you no longer let it effect your attitude toward your job IMO.

truehawksfan":58fzoyt2 said:

Why does everyone assume that defensive players, and only the defensive players, think this was a knucklehead play call?

It was a terrible call. Bevell made Ricardo Lockette:
- 4 receptions all season
- 4th on the depth chart, the primary WR.
Not Baldwin. Not Kearse. Not Lockett.

Bevell made things worse by throwing Lockette under the bus by saying he didn't execute. He should have manned up by saying Pats D made a great play. No, he blamed the player and that got the entire WR group pissed. We know Beastmode was pissed too, but do you think it's stops there?

And, while everyone is saying the players should get over it, should we tell Hawks fans to get over SB XL too?

Not so easy is it.

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BINGO! Thread winner right there. ^ :2thumbs:

Don't care if you are tired of it or not, they gave up a 10 point lead. They are part of the blame along with the Offense for not playing add on. TEAM loss. Regardless WHICH players couldn't get over it, that's on them. This is sports, you lose some heartbreakers, it should motivate you to push even harder the next season. Sounds more like excuses for not getting to another SuperbOwl

Another article on this with a little more in depth look at what could have been.....

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...er-bowl-49-int-derailed-seahawks-locker-room/

"If you think about it, the Seahawks would have won their second straight Super Bowl ... in five or 10 years from now we'd look back at Pete Carroll as the architect of the teams that beat Manning and Brady in back-to-back Super Bowls. Man, you talk about dynasty. Manning and Brady in back-to-back Super Bowls. That's the Seahawks defense that could have been, but that play derailed the whole narrative or legacy or whatever and it all just unraveled from there.

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I didn't find anything new in it. In fact, it strikes me as just another regurgitation of very dated and worn out story line. There is so much more in the way of current football stories going uncovered.

Jville":hrgs59dd said:

I didn't find anything new in it. In fact, it strikes me as just another regurgitation of very dated and worn out story line. There is so much more in the way of current football stories going uncovered.

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Why do you suppose that is?

Often when people read, they find what THEY are looking for. That article speculated more on the changes that would have been not only in Seattle but in NE also. The other did not.

Seymour":2kcul26k said:

Jville":2kcul26k said:

I didn't find anything new in it. In fact, it strikes me as just another regurgitation of very dated and worn out story line. There is so much more in the way of current football stories going uncovered.

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Why do you suppose that is?

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Journalism and originality is suffering.

I prefer looking thru the windshield ...... fixating on the rear view mirror invites disaster.

Jville":3r70q8ig said:

Seymour":3r70q8ig said:

Jville":3r70q8ig said:

I didn't find anything new in it. In fact, it strikes me as just another regurgitation of very dated and worn out story line. There is so much more in the way of current football stories going uncovered.

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Why do you suppose that is?

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Journalism and originality is suffering.

I prefer looking thru the windshield ...... fixating on the rear view mirror invites disaster.

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Agree. But glancing back regularly is a good reminder of where you came from and lessons of the past. Forgetting that invites futility.

Seymour":1r8tvuow said:

Jville":1r8tvuow said:

Seymour":1r8tvuow said:

Jville":1r8tvuow said:

I didn't find anything new in it. In fact, it strikes me as just another regurgitation of very dated and worn out story line. There is so much more in the way of current football stories going uncovered.

Click to expand...

Why do you suppose that is?

Click to expand...

Journalism and originality is suffering.

I prefer looking thru the windshield ...... fixating on the rear view mirror invites disaster.

Click to expand...

Agree. But glancing back regularly is a good reminder of where you came from and lessons of the past. Forgetting that invites futility.

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All the many personnel changes at the VMAC are a reflection of adjustments to lessons learned. Regurgitation is for those who have lost traction and are high centered. So, I guess regurgitation does serve a purpose in feeding fuel to those who remain hopelessly high centered.

Jville":9s3nt94u said:

Seymour":9s3nt94u said:

Jville":9s3nt94u said:

Seymour":9s3nt94u said:

Why do you suppose that is?

Click to expand...

Journalism and originality is suffering.

I prefer looking thru the windshield ...... fixating on the rear view mirror invites disaster.

Click to expand...

Agree. But glancing back regularly is a good reminder of where you came from and lessons of the past. Forgetting that invites futility.

Click to expand...

All the many personnel changes at the VMAC are a reflection of adjustments to lessons learned. Regurgitation is for those who have lost traction and are high centered.

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Well if someone is high centered after being warned, I suggest to that person who's advise was ignored to wave and move on.

Many discussions and disagreements were had on why we have since been underachieving. We JUST NOW are finding out why that is as confirmed by players. Now real discussion can be had with the known cause and solution.

Keep in mind...It doesn't need to include everyone.

It's an open forum.

Jville":30kgusq7 said:

It's an open forum.

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Exactly. And open means that we are free to discuss what is of interest (within the rules) without being told we should NOT discuss this or that because someone doesn't like that subject.

Look at the interest in this thread compared to others.

That SHOULD tell you something I would think,...but maybe not. :?:

Seymour":3mu4uwbb said:

Jville":3mu4uwbb said:

It's an open forum.

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Exactly. And open means that we are free to discuss what is of interest (within the rules) without being told we should NOT discuss this or that because someone doesn't like that subject.

Look at the interest in this thread compared to others.

That SHOULD tell you something I would think,...but maybe not. :?:

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If you have a problem, there is both a "PM" button and a "Report" button provided for your convenience.

My understanding is that respect for 1st amendment principles and tolerance for a diversity of views is welcomed on this forum.

First amendment rights do not apply to all public forums. There are many forbidden subjects and words that are not allowed here.

Either way, I'm done with this. Enjoy. :2thumbs:

Sorry if this was said, I didn't read the thread but did read the article. I just can't believe players would feel that way. How they can let one play have more value then the Super Bowl before, the winning culture, the greatness they displayed for years on Defense. I just don't see it. Even if the play call was poor, it is there job to execute the play and they didn't. An almost impossible play was made on the defensive side. The Seahawks displayed one of the greatest defenses in NFL history, during a period where the rules heavily favored offense and they are claiming they couldn't buy in anymore. I think it was more maturity issue than anything.

ringless":26gf10c6 said:

Sorry if this was said, I didn't read the thread but did read the article. I just can't believe players would feel that way. How they can let one play have more value then the Super Bowl before, the winning culture, the greatness they displayed for years on Defense. I just don't see it. Even if the play call was poor, it is there job to execute the play and they didn't. An almost impossible play was made on the defensive side. The Seahawks displayed one of the greatest defenses in NFL history, during a period where the rules heavily favored offense and they are claiming they couldn't buy in anymore. I think it was more maturity issue than anything.

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You are remembered for the last thing you did, we lost, we lost on a really bad play call with really bad personnel on the field to execute it. The players felt betrayed that they didn't have the best play and the best personnel out there with everything on the line more or less. Pete may have said go ahead and pass, Bevell and Cable called the pay and who the personnel was going to be.

That play didn't break the will of the team. Bringing everyone back is what broke us. Firing Bevell the next day would have fixed plenty.

Would it have been fair? Almost certainly not. But plenty of firings in the NFL are rarely about the person being fired. It would have sent the message to the team that that result was not acceptable, and that heads can and will roll at the VMAC. It's championship or bust around here. But bringing back the same coaching staff to carry on with the same old show just sapped the energy from the locker room. It send the message that everything was fine when it clearly wasn't.

PR firings are a common occurrence in the business world--and the NFL. It's not about being fair, it's about protecting your brand above any one person. When the Seahawks kept their coaching staff intact, it fractured the brand to an extent it can only now begin to heal from. Even as fans, who didn't feel a weight lifted when Bevell and Cable were finally fired? Why do you think more of the players are only now finally talking about it? Firing Bevell finally broke the spell.

I always knew it broke the team and would never be the same. I know some on here said it didnt and maybe some were hoping it didnt. Unfortunately, its been confirmed by many sources that it did.

I remember the getaway with the players to Hawaii where they almost fought each other.