An after-season shake up...

I've been thinking about this a lot. Pete Carroll seems incredibly loyal to the staff he selects. Has he fired anyone since being here? Honest question, I cannot remember. If we are a one-and-done in the dance, everyone knows changes are coming...I mean, right? You can't just line up and do this again next season. It makes me sick to think about this--and no matter what side of the Bevell argument you fall on, would Pete let him go if he was the problem?

It makes me sick to think about this, but after several seasons that underwhelmed expectations, consecutively, what would be the course of action? My honest opinion is that we will see some shocking changes to the roster, instead of the coaching staff. I'm basing this on nothing, mind you, so be gentle. But if that were the case, who would you speculate would be dealt, not renewed, cut, etc? There are a lot of players on this team I want to see here for life (career). And likewise, how would you feel about that kind of a change?

Only staff member out right fired was Jeremy Bates OC due to "philosophical differences. We were scoring to fast and often.

Just like every year, we will see a bit of a roster churn. We will have a few big names that might not be here, but I think our core will be intact. As much as I would like to see a change in coaching on the offensive side of the ball, I don't see it being a probable thing. I would say there is maybe a 20% chance either cable or Bevell is gone. I don't blame cable as much as Bevell because Cable has nothing to work with year in and year out, whereas Bevell has some phenomenal weapons that I see as underused or used incorrectly. Bevell doesn't really have an excuse.

johnnyfever":1ieaksqr said:

Just like every year, we will see a bit of a roster churn. We will have a few big names that might not be here, but I think our core will be intact. As much as I would like to see a change in coaching on the offensive side of the ball, I don't see it being a probable thing. I would say there is maybe a 20% chance either cable or Bevell is gone. I don't blame cable as much as Bevell because Cable has nothing to work with year in and year out, whereas Bevell has some phenomenal weapons that I see as underused or used incorrectly. Bevell doesn't really have an excuse.

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Cable has nothing to work with, but I"m not sure he is without guilt.

It might be that he has Pete convinced that he can work a OL with training and his ability to coach players. Sweezy is a prime example. I realize that we are robbing Mary to pay Paul, but at some point, it has to work out and unfortunately it hasn't.. who knows, maybe next year they will jell into the mold that Cable wants.. but will it be too late?

Our core defense is fast starting to age at this point. We have one or maybe two years and then it will fall into rebuild mold.

If PC thinks for one second that he can keep his offensive coaches together after the things that happened this season he is delusional and is the problem. He also needs to seriously look at how his DC is preparing his game schemes and in-game adjustments. Because he is no really talented DC if you ask me.

I will post more in detail after the last game is lost: yes we will lose and not make the Super Bowl. More than likely one and done.

No team this inconsistent is going anywhere in the playoffs. Just look at the teams we may face. All of them are consistent and getting better at this point in the late season. But not us.

KARAVARUS":2yikvbyh said:

I've been thinking about this a lot. Pete Carroll seems incredibly loyal to the staff he selects. Has he fired anyone since being here? Honest question, I cannot remember. If we are a one-and-done in the dance, everyone knows changes are coming...I mean, right? You can't just line up and do this again next season. It makes me sick to think about this--and no matter what side of the Bevell argument you fall on, would Pete let him go if he was the problem?

It makes me sick to think about this, but after several seasons that underwhelmed expectations, consecutively, what would be the course of action? My honest opinion is that we will see some shocking changes to the roster, instead of the coaching staff. I'm basing this on nothing, mind you, so be gentle. But if that were the case, who would you speculate would be dealt, not renewed, cut, etc? There are a lot of players on this team I want to see here for life (career). And likewise, how would you feel about that kind of a change?

Click to expand...

A Superbowl win, followed by a Super Bowl appearance, followed by a playoff win, followed by a playoff appearance and a division title qualifies as several seasons that underwhelmed expectations?

Basis4day":3gsn3769 said:

KARAVARUS":3gsn3769 said:

I've been thinking about this a lot. Pete Carroll seems incredibly loyal to the staff he selects. Has he fired anyone since being here? Honest question, I cannot remember. If we are a one-and-done in the dance, everyone knows changes are coming...I mean, right? You can't just line up and do this again next season. It makes me sick to think about this--and no matter what side of the Bevell argument you fall on, would Pete let him go if he was the problem?

It makes me sick to think about this, but after several seasons that underwhelmed expectations, consecutively, what would be the course of action? My honest opinion is that we will see some shocking changes to the roster, instead of the coaching staff. I'm basing this on nothing, mind you, so be gentle. But if that were the case, who would you speculate would be dealt, not renewed, cut, etc? There are a lot of players on this team I want to see here for life (career). And likewise, how would you feel about that kind of a change?

Click to expand...

A Superbowl win, followed by a Super Bowl appearance, followed by a playoff win, followed by a playoff appearance and a division title qualifies as several seasons that underwhelmed expectations?

Click to expand...

Hell yes!! Hawks fans expect a smooth running scoring machine for 60 minutes of play. They have shown that they can do it for 30 minutes....why not 60? :stirthepot:

Basis4day":1v2ghnph said:

KARAVARUS":1v2ghnph said:

I've been thinking about this a lot. Pete Carroll seems incredibly loyal to the staff he selects. Has he fired anyone since being here? Honest question, I cannot remember. If we are a one-and-done in the dance, everyone knows changes are coming...I mean, right? You can't just line up and do this again next season. It makes me sick to think about this--and no matter what side of the Bevell argument you fall on, would Pete let him go if he was the problem?

It makes me sick to think about this, but after several seasons that underwhelmed expectations, consecutively, what would be the course of action? My honest opinion is that we will see some shocking changes to the roster, instead of the coaching staff. I'm basing this on nothing, mind you, so be gentle. But if that were the case, who would you speculate would be dealt, not renewed, cut, etc? There are a lot of players on this team I want to see here for life (career). And likewise, how would you feel about that kind of a change?

Click to expand...

A Superbowl win, followed by a Super Bowl appearance, followed by a playoff win, followed by a playoff appearance and a division title qualifies as several seasons that underwhelmed expectations?

Click to expand...

Spoiled Seahawks fans. Easily pleased with the best of everything.

Basis4day":1axv99i7 said:

KARAVARUS":1axv99i7 said:

I've been thinking about this a lot. Pete Carroll seems incredibly loyal to the staff he selects. Has he fired anyone since being here? Honest question, I cannot remember. If we are a one-and-done in the dance, everyone knows changes are coming...I mean, right? You can't just line up and do this again next season. It makes me sick to think about this--and no matter what side of the Bevell argument you fall on, would Pete let him go if he was the problem?

It makes me sick to think about this, but after several seasons that underwhelmed expectations, consecutively, what would be the course of action? My honest opinion is that we will see some shocking changes to the roster, instead of the coaching staff. I'm basing this on nothing, mind you, so be gentle. But if that were the case, who would you speculate would be dealt, not renewed, cut, etc? There are a lot of players on this team I want to see here for life (career). And likewise, how would you feel about that kind of a change?

Click to expand...

A Superbowl win, followed by a Super Bowl appearance, followed by a playoff win, followed by a playoff appearance and a division title qualifies as several seasons that underwhelmed expectations?

Click to expand...

Okay, that's one way to look at it... Now for those of us who are not just interested in berating people or trying to make them look stupid, our exit from the playoffs was less than ceremonious last season, and IF it happens again this season, I can soundly say that it has fallen short of expectations as well. Then we'd be looking at back to back (several) seasons where we fell short of expectations. That is what this post suggested. I'm not a spoiled fan. Had we lost a battle again Carolina last season, I'd maybe feel differently. But very much of the same shit we see today was the first half of that game, and it cost us. I didn't necessarily expect us to win, but I expected us to be competitive for 60 minutes, not just surge when we were down 100 and the other team relaxed.

The point is, the offense comes out flat nearly every game. It goes back beyond this season. If Carroll doesn't address that with coaching changes (which is my fear, due to loyalty), he may do so with roster shakes. To take this back from me being an entitled baby of a fan, back to the point, again, I'll ask... What players can you see being moved and how do you feel about moving players as opposed to coaches?

We've managed to do pretty well for a few reasons, first of which is Pete and John have put together an incredibly good roster of talented players that match Pete's system and then kept them together. Good players typically beat less talented players in the NFL regardless of system.

Secondly, our division has really slid. Look at this year: do you really think this team would've made the playoffs 3 or 4 years ago ? You had the Harbaugh led 49ers, you had the Fisher led Rams teams that would have a winning record in division, yet lose to everyone else, and you had very tough AZ teams. It was also a murderer's row of defenses (and DL's); maybe the best defensive division in history at points. I don't think this team makes the playoffs in that environment. I also think it's dulled our competitive edge.

You have to look for trends. Here are the ones I've seen:

Our ST play has consistently gotten worse. Gone are the days where we were the best ST's in the league. Our ST unit just got their asses handed to them in multiple areas by literally the worst ST unit in the league. ST's are a weakness on that AZ squad and they just convincingly beat us there.

Offensive personnel usage. We have the best red zone threat in the league. How many red zone TD's does he have this year? I know he has a whopping 13 red zone targets since we traded a pretty penny for the right to "fix our red zone issues" according to our HC, then turn around and completely ignore him. When we target him and he produces, we win. Simple. So we quit targetting him. If this is on Wilson, then you can throw QB coaching in here as well, as someone needs to drill it into his head that Graham needs to be his best friend on not Kearse. Speaking of which:

1st play from scrimmage, OPI on Kearse. If he doesn't lead the league in OPI's, I'd be curious as hell to find out who is. It's not all jermaine's fault, but bad things happen when we target him. INT's, OPI's, drops, etc. He's been targeted this year more in the red zone than Jimmy Graham. Might want to look at our 27th ranked red zone percentage there Mr. Bevell. If Richardson or McEvoy can't beat Kearse out, then we need to look at our WR corps. Or play guys that are better than other guys.

Pass protection. This will be the 11th consecutive season that Cable has had an OL that is 25th or worse ranked in pass protection. Seriously, that's a trend that really doesn't need much more comment. 11 years, 3 teams, multiple QB's, GM's, and personnel, and you can't get better than 25th ? Ok, so you run block well and don't get draft capital. Maybe it's time to bring in a "pass protection specialist" and just punt on the fact that Cable will be able to teach pass protection. I mean, one of these years, our mobile QB won't be quick enough, and he could get hurt or something.

chris98251":1731w8fm said:

Only staff member out right fired was Jeremy Bates OC due to "philosophical differences. We were scoring to fast and often.

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That was the "official reason", one of the guys on 710 said it was his actions/behavior at a company x-mas party that got him 86'ed.

Pete Carroll will do whatever he believes is necessary to win Championships.

Anyone who doesn't believe that, doesn't get Pete.

Basis4day":1muil6it said:

A Superbowl win, followed by a Super Bowl appearance, followed by a playoff win, followed by a playoff appearance and a division title qualifies as several seasons that underwhelmed expectations?

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According to Pete it would be. He stated this is the best roster he's ever coached at the beginning of the season, and 1 and done would qualify for underwhelming for certain.

theENGLISHseahawk":sx4i4kja said:

Pete Carroll will do whatever he believes is necessary to win Championships.

Anyone who doesn't believe that, doesn't get Pete.

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I've said this same thing multiple times and I still believe it but I wonder if Pete is loyal to a fault and is afraid of making a change because while the ceiling could be higher with someone else the floor could be much lower as well if it falls apart. I agree with you that Bevell isn't as bad as some think he is but his red zone play calling and personnel usage in certain situations is often baffling. I've seen too many offensive minded guys say the same thing that played or coached in the league so the criticism isn't just Seahawks fans, its coming from outside as well.

He has to do better getting Graham the ball in the red zone. I know teams used bracketed coverages but they do the same thing in New England and KC and yet they find creative ways to work around it. Graham faced similar coverages in New Orleans yet scored almost a TD a game and was the BEST red zone guy in the league. Some of that is on Bevell whether people want to admit it or not.

I tend to agree with you, but it's a little premature IMO.

It obviously feels like another playoff flameout type of year, and if that is the case then yes I think Pete and John are going to make a couple surprising off season moves involving some veteran team leaders...........and it's pretty damn obvious that there's a huge crack in this team's culture and leadership right now.

This is not the same positive tight knit group of 2-3 years ago, and if we don't get to the SB, I guarantee you there will be big moves in the off season to try and fix it.

Sgt. Largent":1yh2un36 said:

I tend to agree with you, but it's a little premature IMO.

It obviously feels like another playoff flameout type of year, and if that is the case then yes I think Pete and John are going to make a couple surprising off season moves involving some veteran team leaders...........and it's pretty damn obvious that there's a huge crack in this team's culture and leadership right now.

This is not the same positive tight knit group of 2-3 years ago, and if we don't get to the SB, I guarantee you there will be big moves in the off season to try and fix it.

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This is pretty much exactly what I'm thinking. Just that it will be players as opposed to coaches. Also, that it will make me sad. I will get over it as long as we win forever!

theENGLISHseahawk":3ekc3d9d said:

Pete Carroll will do whatever he believes is necessary to win Championships.

Anyone who doesn't believe that, doesn't get Pete.

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That's what every coach does...Some are better at it than others and none are infallible........

Pete believes in continuity in his staff but what bothers me is we finally have our franchise QB and our offensive line continuity is not there.

I'm growing tired of watching our bullfighting zone blocking scheme....OLE....OLE....whiff...whiff. Glowinski should be showing improvement, has a year in the system before this year, but looks terrible out there.

It's getting Russ killed, it's getting almost all of our RB's killed, and I would like to see a change at Cables position.

Bobblehead":hpkuwegl said:

johnnyfever":hpkuwegl said:

Just like every year, we will see a bit of a roster churn. We will have a few big names that might not be here, but I think our core will be intact. As much as I would like to see a change in coaching on the offensive side of the ball, I don't see it being a probable thing. I would say there is maybe a 20% chance either cable or Bevell is gone. I don't blame cable as much as Bevell because Cable has nothing to work with year in and year out, whereas Bevell has some phenomenal weapons that I see as underused or used incorrectly. Bevell doesn't really have an excuse.

Click to expand...

Cable has nothing to work with, but I"m not sure he is without guilt.

It might be that he has Pete convinced that he can work a OL with training and his ability to coach players. Sweezy is a prime example. I realize that we are robbing Mary to pay Paul, but at some point, it has to work out and unfortunately it hasn't.. who knows, maybe next year they will jell into the mold that Cable wants.. but will it be too late?

Click to expand...

Cable has had 3 1st rd picks, 1 2nd and 2 3rds to work with. In comparison Dallas' OL is starting 3 1st's a 4th and an UDFA. I disagree that he has had nothing to work with.

EverydayImRusselin":2pasa47h said:

Bobblehead":2pasa47h said:

johnnyfever":2pasa47h said:

Just like every year, we will see a bit of a roster churn. We will have a few big names that might not be here, but I think our core will be intact. As much as I would like to see a change in coaching on the offensive side of the ball, I don't see it being a probable thing. I would say there is maybe a 20% chance either cable or Bevell is gone. I don't blame cable as much as Bevell because Cable has nothing to work with year in and year out, whereas Bevell has some phenomenal weapons that I see as underused or used incorrectly. Bevell doesn't really have an excuse.

Click to expand...

Cable has nothing to work with, but I"m not sure he is without guilt.

It might be that he has Pete convinced that he can work a OL with training and his ability to coach players. Sweezy is a prime example. I realize that we are robbing Mary to pay Paul, but at some point, it has to work out and unfortunately it hasn't.. who knows, maybe next year they will jell into the mold that Cable wants.. but will it be too late?

Click to expand...

Cable has had 3 1st rd picks, 1 2nd and 2 3rds to work with. In comparison Dallas' OL is starting 3 1st's a 4th and an UDFA. I disagree that he has had nothing to work with.

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Agree and as both Pete and John have said Cable has had a lot of input on the players he has wanted brought in. Cable has not been successful anywhere he has been. Always amazed me the power he seems to have.