Is Clowney a dirty player?

[OrangeGravy]

I do think it deserved a penalty - he DID hit Wentz in the head, and you penalize results, not intent. The penalties, including the inevitable fine, are meant to motivate players to think more about how they're playing the game. But it wasn't 'dirty' in the sense that he was not trying to injure Wentz.

I fully agree. This reminds me a lot of the ET hit on Mason Rudolph. ET wasn't headhunting Rudolph deliberately, but fact is he did make contact w/the crown, and ET was called mainly because that was the result.

The problem with that is if it's a RB, no one thinks it deserves a penalty. That play would never draw a flag if a RB is carrying the ball. Once it's a QB, even though he's considered a runner, everyone thinks it should be a flag. If it's Philly's RB leaving the game, they wouldn't even know what play knocked him out.

 

[Smellyman]

anybody have the clip of RW sliding, giving himself up and getting drilled in the back. He winced in pain and I thought it could be bad.

No complaining, just another cheap shot on RW when he slides. Seahawks are pretty used to it.

 

[Stanley]

anybody have the clip of RW sliding, giving himself up and getting drilled in the back. He winced in pain and I thought it could be bad.

No complaining, just another cheap shot on RW when he slides. Seahawks are pretty used to it.

Not true, Wilson tends to slide really late when defenders have already begun their approach.

This is also a completely different situation than the Clowney hit.

Clowney clearly went out of his way to intentionally lead with his head/shoulder in order to deliver a bigger blow to back of Wentz.

This is a fascinating case of human psychology. This play is 100 times clearer than Hollister and his non OFFENSIVE PI call. Yet the Seahawk fan can’t admit it.

 

[Smellyman]

anybody have the clip of RW sliding, giving himself up and getting drilled in the back. He winced in pain and I thought it could be bad.

No complaining, just another cheap shot on RW when he slides. Seahawks are pretty used to it.

Not true, Wilson tends to slide really late when defenders have already begun their approach.

This is also a completely different situation than the Clowney hit.

Clowney clearly went out of his way to intentionally lead with his head/shoulder in order to deliver a bigger blow to back of Wentz.

This is a fascinating case of human psychology. This play is 100 times clearer than Hollister and his non OFFENSIVE PI call. Yet the Seahawk fan can’t admit it.

so Wilson sliding, apparently late, and getting hit which is a penalty is not.

Wentz, a runner, getting hit is a penalty and obviously intentional after trying to evade MacDougald and getting tripped up.

got it.

 

[cymatica]

anybody have the clip of RW sliding, giving himself up and getting drilled in the back. He winced in pain and I thought it could be bad.

No complaining, just another cheap shot on RW when he slides. Seahawks are pretty used to it.

Not true, Wilson tends to slide really late when defenders have already begun their approach.

This is also a completely different situation than the Clowney hit.

Clowney clearly went out of his way to intentionally lead with his head/shoulder in order to deliver a bigger blow to back of Wentz.

This is a fascinating case of human psychology. This play is 100 times clearer than Hollister and his non OFFENSIVE PI call. Yet the Seahawk fan can’t admit it.

Completely false. Clowney didn't go "out of his way" at all, you are making bs up. He was lunging at Wentz, who was running for a 1st, then dives at him from behind and to the side right as Wentz gets grabbed by the ankle and tripped up, just a fraction of a second before Clowney is in the air. If you bother to watch the play in real time, objectionably, it's very clear it was a bang bang play that was unavoidable.

Seriously, what can he do to avoid the hit mid air? You tell me. Should Clowney have moved his head over to the right probably resulting in a neck injury? Should he have belly flopped exposing his ribs? Maybe he should have used the 10 seconds of slow motion that you have access to, then he could have stopped mid air and gracefully spanked Wentz on the butt.

Some of you are unbelievable, but you would probably be fine with Clowney injuring himself to go out of his way in .25 seconds to miss a moving target. :roll:

 

[Hawkpower]

anybody have the clip of RW sliding, giving himself up and getting drilled in the back. He winced in pain and I thought it could be bad.

No complaining, just another cheap shot on RW when he slides. Seahawks are pretty used to it.

Not true, Wilson tends to slide really late when defenders have already begun their approach.

This is also a completely different situation than the Clowney hit.

Clowney clearly went out of his way to intentionally lead with his head/shoulder in order to deliver a bigger blow to back of Wentz.

This is a fascinating case of human psychology. This play is 100 times clearer than Hollister and his non OFFENSIVE PI call. Yet the Seahawk fan can’t admit it.

You came back over here, just for this??

Don't you have a talented Vikings team to worry about this weekend? Why are you back over here?

Oh and PS, you are still wrong. It was PI. And your Clowney take is absolute trash.

Go Vikings. :49ersmall:

 

[cymatica]

And while we are at it, Wilson did get thrown to the ground several seconds after a throw while in the pocket. Blatant roughing, no flag. No one cares because he is durable and can take it. There's NEVER a peep about the cheap shots he always takes.
It's because Seattle is the leagues pariah. Complete hypocrisy

 

[BubbaGump]

All this silliness about rules that apply to a PASSER, when Wentz was a RUNNER who did not give himself up. Clowney is chasing him and trying to make a diving tackle from behind, a type of tackle he made several times this game, including a tackle on McCown from behind. When you are trying to make a tackle like that, it's natural for the player's head to be forward. No dirtiness, and the hit came from an acceleration action that whipped Wentz head into the ground.

If Wentz doesn't want to get hit, he needed to slide and give himself up. End of story.

Russell deals with that at least one time a game, if you run your goin g to get hit and they hit Wilson a lot harder and more frequently.

I agree with this. RW get spiked multiple times when he gives himself up. There has been a majority of those spikes that hit him square in the helmet and no flag. I feel bad for Wentz but Clowney was playing hard through the whistle on a QB who was running. Clowney is in no way a dirty player!

 

[KitsapGuy]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/TheNFLWire/status/1214382772480905216[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/MarkMaske/status/1214375863850033152[/tweet]

Clowney was not penalized for his hit on Wentz and after the game, on-field officials ruled that Wentz was a runner and the helmet contact was incidental.

https://theeagleswire.usatoday.com/2020 ... son-wentz/

 

[Hawkpower]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/TheNFLWire/status/1214382772480905216[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/MarkMaske/status/1214375863850033152[/tweet]

Clowney was not penalized for his hit on Wentz and after the game, on-field officials ruled that Wentz was a runner and the helmet contact was incidental.

https://theeagleswire.usatoday.com/2020 ... son-wentz/

So the initial feeling is that he probably won’t be fined, and yet we still have niner and eagle fans saying it was malicious, cheap, dirty and worthy of ejection??

Time to let it go.

 

[ClippedBird]

Good morning mates. Here is the take from one of yours. I have to admit that this does look a bit shady on DCs part.

https://twitter.com/chrisgailus/status/1213950624141697025

 

[Mindsink]

Good morning mates. Here is the take from one of yours. I have to admit that this does look a bit shady on DCs part.

https://twitter.com/chrisgailus/status/1213950624141697025

Again... this is just another example of lazy analysis of a slow-mo video clipped to make it appear Clowney was tracking and targeting Wentz's head.

It's short-sighted, and quite frankly, the people on the side of "dirty hit" are the same type of people whose minds are easily manipulated.

Imagine yourself running at that speed towards another human being, then at the instant you see them dive forward, try to aim your head at theirs. I bet you would miss every time. And if you do happen to connect, it would only be by sheer luck.

Then imagine that same challenge, except this time, you're primary objective is to bring the other person down, and you don't know if or when he will trip or dive forward. You'd have to have the reflexes of Spiderman where the world around you slows down to be able to connect head to head.

The notion that Clowney was able to connect helmet to helmet on purpose at that speed is absurd.

 

[SantaClaraHawk]

...And Florio's PFT runs a story about Clowney calling Eagles fans the worst in the world: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... the-world/


I also found this: profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/08/04/nfl-rules-will-now-treat-head-first-dives-like-feet-first-slides/

“A quarterback does not have to slide feet first to be considered to be giving himself up,” the league’s online rules say. “Regardless whether the slide is feet first or head first, as long as he gives himself up, he should receive the protections afforded to him as a player in a defenseless posture.”

Since 2018, that's been the rule: Even if going head first, once the QB has given himself up, he is not supposed to be hit. Then again, when defenders are already mid-leap, they don't get penalized under the slide rule.

That's what I think happened here initially with the no-call--it could've gone either way. And after that, the refs didn't have the PR issue of no-calling it with an unconscious QB lying on the field. The no-call became vastly more important when Wentz was ruled out several plays later after the decision had been made. That's why the NFL is reviewing Clowney for fines, because if that same hit had ended in with Wentz being unconscious on the field, it gets called if there's any gray area.

Clowney easily could have gotten a penalty, but it isn't his fault he didn't. It is totally his fault that he baited Philadelphia fans through the Inquirer of all people. They'd just lost their QB, they'd just lost their playoffs, and he's there telling the world Philly fans are the worst, booing him when he was a "friendly guy." Talk about inflaming the situation.

 

[SoCalSeahawk]

I rewatched the broadcast of the game. After that tackle of Wentz there was zero reaction from the Eagles players, zero reaction from Wentz, zero reaction from the Eagle's sideline, no discernable groan from the crowd and not even a mention from the announcers. Wentz played the next five plays and looked like himself. Seemed clear headed, made adjustments at the line, completed a pass for first down, etc. So the play was not worthy of a mention until Wentz has to walk into the locker room.

IMO, this was a typical borderline hit you will see in playoff football. If Clowney would have been flagged we would probably all agree it was close enough to justify the call. There was no egregious intent to injure, it was a bang, bang play. The outrage is based purely on the result but being twisted into the intent.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

He turned sideways. This is football, guys get hit. Is this really what the game is becoming?

 

[EWA]

I rewatched the broadcast of the game. After that tackle of Wentz there was zero reaction from the Eagles players, zero reaction from Wentz, zero reaction from the Eagle's sideline, no discernable groan from the crowd and not even a mention from the announcers. Wentz played the next five plays and looked like himself. Seemed clear headed, made adjustments at the line, completed a pass for first down, etc. So the play was not worthy of a mention until Wentz has to walk into the locker room.

This. No one knew anything even happened until he went to locker room.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I rewatched the broadcast of the game. After that tackle of Wentz there was zero reaction from the Eagles players, zero reaction from Wentz, zero reaction from the Eagle's sideline, no discernable groan from the crowd and not even a mention from the announcers. Wentz played the next five plays and looked like himself. Seemed clear headed, made adjustments at the line, completed a pass for first down, etc. So the play was not worthy of a mention until Wentz has to walk into the locker room.

IMO, this was a typical borderline hit you will see in playoff football. If Clowney would have been flagged we would probably all agree it was close enough to justify the call. There was no egregious intent to injure, it was a bang, bang play. The outrage is based purely on the result but being twisted into the intent.

I saw one of their O-lineman protesting to the refs, that was it.

You could literally slow down every play in the NFL and see penalties, and maybe Clowney's hit was a penalty after slowing it down and looking at it over and over...........but in real time real speed? Anyone can see why the refs just thought it was a routine out of the pocket bang bang tackle.

 

[Torc]

...And Florio's PFT runs a story about Clowney calling Eagles fans the worst in the world: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... the-world/


I also found this: profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/08/04/nfl-rules-will-now-treat-head-first-dives-like-feet-first-slides/

“A quarterback does not have to slide feet first to be considered to be giving himself up,” the league’s online rules say. “Regardless whether the slide is feet first or head first, as long as he gives himself up, he should receive the protections afforded to him as a player in a defenseless posture.”

Since 2018, that's been the rule: Even if going head first, once the QB has given himself up, he is not supposed to be hit. Then again, when defenders are already mid-leap, they don't get penalized under the slide rule.

That's what I think happened here initially with the no-call--it could've gone either way. And after that, the refs didn't have the PR issue of no-calling it with an unconscious QB lying on the field. The no-call became vastly more important when Wentz was ruled out several plays later after the decision had been made. That's why the NFL is reviewing Clowney for fines, because if that same hit had ended in with Wentz being unconscious on the field, it gets called if there's any gray area.

Clowney easily could have gotten a penalty, but it isn't his fault he didn't. It is totally his fault that he baited Philadelphia fans through the Inquirer of all people. They'd just lost their QB, they'd just lost their playoffs, and he's there telling the world Philly fans are the worst, booing him when he was a "friendly guy." Talk about inflaming the situation.

Did you read the whole article? I don't know if the rule was changed back but it clearly isn't being enforced and this is probably why:

"“It’s a big change this year,” line judge Rusty Baynes told ESPN. “Because if you were a runner or a quarterback and you dove head first you could, if you were untouched, get all of that slide. If you went head first. Now, you cannot. It’ll be interesting to see what happens at the goal line.”

Interesting indeed: Imagine it’s fourth-and-goal in the final seconds of the game, a quarterback whose team trails by five points drops back to pass, then sees an opening in the middle of the field, runs toward the end zone, and just as a linebacker approaches at the 1-yard line the quarterback dives head-first into the end zone. That won’t be a game-winning touchdown anymore. It will be the quarterback giving himself up at the 1-yard line. The first time that happens, there’s going to be outrage from players, coaches and fans of the losing team."

 

[beaumaris]

Granted I'm in Philly territory but the Eagles fans are really claiming Clowney has always been a dirty player. I didn't watch many Houston games but I don't remember any plays this he was even close to being dirty.



Sent from my E6910 using Tapatalk

LOL! Give them a towel to cry in. Besides, McCown did a better job than Wentz.

Methinks Philly got rid of the wrong QB?

My thoughts also.McCowan looked like he could do more damage than Wentz.

 

[ClippedBird]

Granted I'm in Philly territory but the Eagles fans are really claiming Clowney has always been a dirty player. I didn't watch many Houston games but I don't remember any plays this he was even close to being dirty.



Sent from my E6910 using Tapatalk

LOL! Give them a towel to cry in. Besides, McCown did a better job than Wentz.

Methinks Philly got rid of the wrong QB?

My thoughts also.McCowan looked like he could do more damage than Wentz.

Methinks Philly got rid of the wrong QB?

Methinks that is an ignorant and silly question. I now question your football IQ.