Wilson on Carrolls comment about wanting him to check down

[Elemas]

Let’s swap with Stafford.

Then, let’s see how far Russ’ foot is up your derrière when the Rams annihilate the Hawks for the next decade.

 

[pittpnthrs]

Terrible answer all-around from him. Heroball is what he wants, and he won't win $h!t that way.

He's basically won that way for 6 years now. People quickly forget how many times he's had to put the team on his back and pull rabbits out of the hat to win games due to crap game plans. So he didnt throw to a TE for 3 yards in OT last week. I think I can forgive him for failing every once in awhile.

 

[FloridaSeahawk18]

Terrible answer all-around from him. Heroball is what he wants, and he won't win $h!t that way.

He's basically won that way for 6 years now. People quickly forget how many times he's had to put the team on his back and pull rabbits out of the hat to win games due to crap game plans. So he didnt throw to a TE for 3 yards in OT last week. I think I can forgive him for failing every once in awhile.

He is allowed to miss and make mistakes, but when he is publicly defiant it's another story.

 

[RiverDog]

I posted the context in the other thread talking about this. The short version is that Russ was asked earlier about the cover 2 scheme, and gave a detailed answer that lines up more with what people want to hear. He mentioned throwing to open spots, running the ball with Chris Carson, and throwing more to tight ends.

This bit is from later in the press conference and was a response to a reporter criticizing one specific play. No mention was made of Pete Carroll or Pete Carroll's comments at all, the reporter just asked him if he should have done that specific pass to Lockett differently. In my view, Russ's answer here is understandably defensive. I'll bet you wouldn't like a reporter second guessing you on live TV either.

I appreciate you filling in some background. We'd have to see the actual interview, not just the text, to get a feeling of what Russell said to be able to put his remarks in context.

Especially after a tough loss like this one, athletes can understandably be defensive when reporters looking for a story start getting aggressive and ask provocative questions. It doesn't excuse the remarks, but it does help qualify them to some degree. Whether or not this was the case in this instance, who knows. If someone knows of a video of that interview, it would be interesting to see it. I certainly didn't like them as I saw/interpreted them in the OP.

 

[Maelstrom787]

Terrible answer all-around from him. Heroball is what he wants, and he won't win $h!t that way.

He's basically won that way for 6 years now. People quickly forget how many times he's had to put the team on his back and pull rabbits out of the hat to win games due to crap game plans. So he didnt throw to a TE for 3 yards in OT last week. I think I can forgive him for failing every once in awhile.

You are one of the people who professes that, as things currently are, the team is incapable of being remotely competitive in the offseason.

Why, then, would you defend the same methodology that has led to years of disappointing losses?

Doesn't matter who is saying it. Russ, Pete, Shane, Media Pundits: Heroball doesn't work anymore. It simply doesn't.

Russ has been provided a talented line (as long as injuries don't continue to bone them), an awesome set of receivers, and a top-10 bellcow rusher. It's time to operate neatly within a structured, contemporary offensive attack like other MVP level quarterbacks do. Create where you can, but this isn't the schoolyard. Hit your damn checkdowns and move the chains. Mahomes can do it. Tannehill can do it. Lamar doesn't have to because he can still run. Allen's learning to do it. Russ can, too. He's choosing not to.

He's an amazing improviser, but that just isn't how teams take the next step.

 

[xray]

Look at the difference between Brady and Wilson . 20 years in the league with 7 rings and Brady is still critical of his own game and takes responsibility for losses . Wilson has changed during his career from a talented and humble QB early on; to a QB that refers to himself as ' Mr Unlimited ' who cherishes the fame and the spotlights and can't believe that anybody would dare criticize his play . Off target here, but who threw the interception in the SB loss ? Has he ever taken any responsibility for that ?

 

[Jerhawk]

Where's John?

I don't like this answer from Russell. He's build an ego that Pete cannot control

 

[chris98251]

The fraying is happening, Pete used to bend over backwards to protect Russ to the chagrin of the defense that saved his butt time and time again.

Now that defense and those players are gone, Pete threw out Bevell, Schotty, brought in Waldron, DK, Everett, has Dissly and Carson. He brought in more Lineman over and over to protect Wilson and drive the run game. All things Wilson wanted

Wilson has complained about his line last off season, retracted part of it, patched fences etc, his in game interactions are not the same as they were, he is more isolated, don't see him cheerleading as much when the defense is on the field, none of these things are really big, but a lot of little things can point to a unsettling situation that may not be volatile, but isn't a happy one either. That all can lead to diminished success.

 

[Appyhawk]

Terrible answer all-around from him. Heroball is what he wants, and he won't win $h!t that way.

He's basically won that way for 6 years now. People quickly forget how many times he's had to put the team on his back and pull rabbits out of the hat to win games due to crap game plans. So he didnt throw to a TE for 3 yards in OT last week. I think I can forgive him for failing every once in awhile.

He is allowed to miss and make mistakes, but when he is publicly defiant it's another story.

I read it as more confident than defiant. Maybe it's just a matter of what you want to see and hear. Not meaning "you" personally...meaning "you" as whoever is the reader.

 

[John63]

Terrible answer all-around from him. Heroball is what he wants, and he won't win $h!t that way.

He's basically won that way for 6 years now. People quickly forget how many times he's had to put the team on his back and pull rabbits out of the hat to win games due to crap game plans. So he didnt throw to a TE for 3 yards in OT last week. I think I can forgive him for failing every once in awhile.

He is allowed to miss and make mistakes, but when he is publicly defiant it's another story.

I read it as more confident than defiant. Maybe it's just a matter of what you want to see and hear. Not meaning "you" personally...meaning "you" as whoever is the reader.

Exactly I have stayed relatively silent about this subject. The reason is having listened to the interviews, read what some wrote in the media, and on here I realized that the reality is unless you are in Wilson's mind you don't have a clue what he meant by anything. Everything he said can be taken multiple ways.

If you hate Wilson or blame him or whatever you will take it negatively
If you love Wilson you will take it positively
If you are neutral you will take it that way.

I have listened to the entire thing and did not hear anything that I take negatively. He made a play, thought he had it, and missed. He has made it more often than he has missed it.


As to his mindset me I took it as his mindset about his and the team's ability to win.

However, people are going to believe what they want. Some heer still has the narrative the only threw long in the last game despite both written and visual proof that was not true.


So its a matter of what you want to believe as none has any irrefutable proof otherwise

While I have enjoyed the laughs reading this and the other string on this have provided I have chosen till now not to waste my time on it or too much else.

I have come to the conclusion that people are going to believe what they want despite the truth.

I will engage when I think open minds are at play and not when there are no open minds.

3-2-1

 

[pmedic920]

https://twitter.com/bcondotta/status/1441125662559924228?s=20


Russell Wilson was asked about Carroll's statement that he wished Wilson had checked down on the first-down play in OT Sunday. Asked if he agreed with Carroll's assessment Wilson said "I think what I agree with is trying to find a way to win the game.'' ... Wilson noted the pass was just 3-4 inches from being complete and "I'm not gonna change my mindset'' and that he knows how to win games in those situations. ... -Bob Condotta

very interesting... sounds very defensive to me...

LTH

I'll have to go back and see/read the entire interview and make sure that it's not being taken out of context, but if it's like what I'm seeing now, it's disgusting. Russell is saying more than just that him and Pete agree with trying to find a way to win, which is a pretty stupid thing to say. Of course, they both want to find a way to win. Who doesn't?

What Russell is saying is that he thinks his method of finding a way to win, ie throwing a 50/50 ball 20 yards downfield to a covered receiver when we're backed up against our own end zone in a sudden death situation, is better than the head coach's suggestion that he should have checked down to an open receiver that would have gotten us out of the shadow of our own goal posts and given our defense a chance should the offense fail..again.

If that's what Russell said and if I'm not taking it out of context, then it's very disappointing to say the least.

I think you bring up a good point I based my opinion off of Condotta's tweet because He is a pretty good reporter but I do think your right about checking the context of the comment... Bob also wrote a story on it I saw it but didnt read it...


LTH

It’s freaking Twitter for crying out loud.

This guy ain’t as bad as most but he’s still gunna tweet what he can get away with to generate clicks.

I’m perplexed by how much credibility folks put into stuff like this these days.

At the end of the day, truth and accuracy don’t matter anymore, clicks mater.

Reporters don’t report these days, reporters give opinions and with the available information all a guy needs to do is say something to spark the conversation.

 

[AgentDib]

I appreciate you filling in some background. We'd have to see the actual interview, not just the text, to get a feeling of what Russell said to be able to put his remarks in context.

This was just from Russ's Thursday press conference. All press conferences can be watched by anyone at Seahawks.com under the video category here. This one was pretty dull, and only blew up because Condotta tweeted in such a way that it looked like Russ was disagreeing with Pete publicly.

I do highly recommend Tyler Lockett's press conference this week which is a great view into how he looks at the world. The discussion centering around a nothing press conference from Russ rather than an insightful one from Lockett is unfortunate.

 

[toffee]

Since that interview where Wilson threw the OL under the bus, I have determined that we are in post Wilson era.

Too bad we didn't manage to trade Wilson during the off season, I believe the best trade was with the Jets, sensing that, Wilson had this agent came up with four acceptable teams which took cared of that. Now we have to pray that Wilson won't get hurt, and his shortcomings won't get showcased too much, both will hurt his trade value. His trade value was at its peak 3 months ago.

We shall all enjoy this season as the Wilson appreciation games, he has been a wonderful QB, we have been lucky to have him.

Sent from my IN2017 using Tapatalk

 

[AgentDib]

If you can just determine stuff unilaterally then aren't there better options? Like what about determining the Seahawks as being in the best team era, or the Steelers as being in the worst team era. It seems weird to use that super power to get rid of our starting QB.

 

[hoxrox]

He mentioned these things for sure, but actions speak louder than words.

Definitely. Saying that right things at a press conference does not mean that everything is fixed and it's completely fair to be skeptical and wait for on field results.

What I disagree with is people taking that one defensive answer completely out of context as we've seen on twitter and in this thread so far.

I don’t really think it was taken out of context. (You may have to turn on closed captioning to see and hear the full question). https://youtu.be/y7watBH9Fe8?t=395

The question from the reporter was exactly this:

"Pete mentioned on his radio show Monday that the possession in overtime, maybe first down, if you tried to check down there, instead of throwing the pass the Lockett – I guess when you look back on the series, do you agree that would have been a better way to go, or?"

Russ: "I think what I agree with is trying to find a way to win the game." ... "I'm not gonna change my mindset."

Whether his response to this question is interpreted as confidence or defiance – doesn’t matter.

Bottom line, he didn’t agree the check down to move the chains was better – a very telling clue on his mindset and how he wants to play the game.

 

[Scorpion05]

So I just want to make sure I'm following this right.

Pete Carroll goes out of his way to criticize Wilson. He could have EASILY said "We did not get it done." But instead, he chose to call out his QB publicly.

Russ, who is literally TOP 2 in recent years for 4th quarter and overtime comebacks, basically gives a response. And now he's an arrogant, ego-centric pos? ukeface:

Most of Russell's passes in the 4th quarter...were short passes. The narrative that russ is trying to take deep shots on every play is not rooted in facts. Or his passing chart for that matter.

Terrible answer all-around from him. Heroball is what he wants, and he won't win $h!t that way.

Exactly. He's losing sight of Winning, and has his mind stuck on personal accolades, such as the MVP.

I thought his comment "We scored 30 points" was idiotic. The Defense gave you a short field, and on another TD, the Titans forgot Freddie Swain was on the field.

Nope, instead of taking the check downs and giving his punter a shot, he tried to play Heroball and put Special Teams in a bind, which in turn, shortened the field for Tennessee.

Russell needs to lose the EGO. He still finds it necessary to brag every now and then (I'm one of 32 people who get to be an NFL starting Quarterback") and I cringe every time he does so. There's a saying that one keeps hearing from players that have been doing this a long time, "Act like you've been there before."

If you feel the need to brag, that means you're lacking complete self-confidence, and are turning to your EGO to make up for it.

Those who are self-confident don't feel the need to tell anybody anything. They let their actions speak for them.

I like this new Russ. You all want him to know his place and nope...he's standing up for himself and speaking up for himself. He's not going to take being treated like a second rate QB anymore.

The offense scored 30 points. That's the bottom line. The defense couldn't stop a nose bleed in the 2nd half. If you want to break down each drive we can do so. But the offense gave the defense a major cushion to pin their ears back and attack the Titans offense. They didn't.

He did take checkdowns in the 4th quarter. MOST of his passes were short. As with all debates on this forum lately, facts are irrelevant so long as you get to crap all over Russ.

Russ does act like he's been there before. He's one of the most humble QBs in the league, who praises his teammates and visits the hospital every Tuesday. You don't talk about him like he does though. Maybe you should check into why that is?

He didn't brag, he defended himself. His coach chose to call him out, and he defended himself. You know who else has bragged about how good they are? Brees, Peyton, Mahomes. Pretty much any top 5 QB in history. I have quotes for you from them if that would help. Assuming your goal is to be fair.

 

[Scorpion05]

Dan Orlovsky gets it right here. Mina makes some good points too. This is what a fair overall discussion looks like, not treating Wilson like a punching bag and a bottom 10 QB which is how more and more on here are treating him:

[youtube]fF-IVPcSQws[/youtube]

 

[toffee]

Yep and it wasn't just the possession in OT. In the 4th quarter, Everett was open for the first down on 3rd and 3, when Russell decided to throw the jump ball to DK (incomplete).

Yes QBs miss open guys, but this is not just a one-off. It is an ongoing trend. Russ is looking for the splash play. Meanwhile, the TEs and RBs are just an after thought.

Carroll brought in Waldron to help find the sweet spot for which this offense can have maximum production and efficiency. So far Waldron is batting .500 with his new QB.

Wilson did put it on the record that he has no confidence in Hawk's coaching staffs, timing of this proclamation was curious, as it was after the hiring of our new OC.

 

[hawk45]

So I just want to make sure I'm following this right.

Pete Carroll goes out of his way to criticize Wilson. He could have EASILY said "We did not get it done." But instead, he chose to call out his QB publicly.

Russ, who is literally TOP 2 in recent years for 4th quarter and overtime comebacks, basically gives a response. And now he's an arrogant, ego-centric pos? ukeface:

Most of Russell's passes in the 4th quarter...were short passes. The narrative that russ is trying to take deep shots on every play is not rooted in facts. Or his passing chart for that matter.

Terrible answer all-around from him. Heroball is what he wants, and he won't win $h!t that way.

Exactly. He's losing sight of Winning, and has his mind stuck on personal accolades, such as the MVP.

I thought his comment "We scored 30 points" was idiotic. The Defense gave you a short field, and on another TD, the Titans forgot Freddie Swain was on the field.

Nope, instead of taking the check downs and giving his punter a shot, he tried to play Heroball and put Special Teams in a bind, which in turn, shortened the field for Tennessee.

Russell needs to lose the EGO. He still finds it necessary to brag every now and then (I'm one of 32 people who get to be an NFL starting Quarterback") and I cringe every time he does so. There's a saying that one keeps hearing from players that have been doing this a long time, "Act like you've been there before."

If you feel the need to brag, that means you're lacking complete self-confidence, and are turning to your EGO to make up for it.

Those who are self-confident don't feel the need to tell anybody anything. They let their actions speak for them.

I like this new Russ. You all want him to know his place and nope...he's standing up for himself and speaking up for himself. He's not going to take being treated like a second rate QB anymore.

The offense scored 30 points. That's the bottom line. The defense couldn't stop a nose bleed in the 2nd half. If you want to break down each drive we can do so. But the offense gave the defense a major cushion to pin their ears back and attack the Titans offense. They didn't.

He did take checkdowns in the 4th quarter. MOST of his passes were short. As with all debates on this forum lately, facts are irrelevant so long as you get to crap all over Russ.

Russ does act like he's been there before. He's one of the most humble QBs in the league, who praises his teammates and visits the hospital every Tuesday. You don't talk about him like he does though. Maybe you should check into why that is?

He didn't brag, he defended himself. His coach chose to call him out, and he defended himself. You know who else has bragged about how good they are? Brees, Peyton, Mahomes. Pretty much any top 5 QB in history. I have quotes for you from them if that would help. Assuming your goal is to be fair.

The topic is the final drive in OT where Russell didn’t take the check down with his back to the end zone and instead fired the ball deep twice on lower percentage passes and then was sacked in the inevitable third and long he put himself into.

Maybe Pete should have kept his frustration to himself but factually, he was correct and Russell was incorrect in terms of the approach to take there.

That failed drive, again, the topic of this thread mind you, was textbook heroball and a self aware Russ would have admitted the flaw in his approach instead of doubling down on it, even if he didn’t like that his coach said it publicly.

 

[RiverDog]

This was just from Russ's Thursday press conference. All press conferences can be watched by anyone at Seahawks.com under the video category here. This one was pretty dull, and only blew up because Condotta tweeted in such a way that it looked like Russ was disagreeing with Pete publicly.

Thanks for the link to the press conferences. I found the part in question and replayed it a number of times.

You're right, Russell wasn't asked specifically if he agreed or disagreed with his head coach, but I think it was pretty clear when he said "what I agree with" that he was responding to Pete's public remarks that Russell should have taken the check down. Why else would he say "what I agree with" if he didn't think he was being asked about someone else's opinion, and given that, who else besides Pete would he be talking about?

I still say that Russell's statement indicating that he and Pete...or who ever it is he's agreeing with...have a common interest in finding a way to with the game is a stupid statement. It's like saying that he agrees with him that the sun sets in the west. It was just a way of his ducking the question and seems to be a bit of a Freudian slip suggesting that him and Carroll aren't on the same page.

I could give Russell the benefit of the doubt that he's not disagreeing with his coach because he wasn't specifically asked to comment about it if it wasn't for the fact that we have other evidence of his displeasure. These comments fit a pattern.