Would you be in favor of trading Russell and rebuilding now?

[Jerhawk]

You really think a HC candidate wants to be told he answers to his QB?

What? Who says Pete answers to Russ?

Lefleur answers to Rodgers. It depends on the situation.
If we get a new head coach that keeps Waldron, that would solve that dynamic. Russ trusts Waldron

 

[OrangeGravy]

You really think a HC candidate wants to be told he answers to his QB?

What? Who says Pete answers to Russ?

Lefleur answers to Rodgers. It depends on the situation.
If we get a new head coach that keeps Waldron, that would solve that dynamic. Russ trusts Waldron

I think he's responding to someone who said you do whatever it takes to keep Russell, even if that's letting him decide who the next head coach is. Essentially making that HC beholden to Russell.

 

[Fade]

Trade Wilson now the team becomes the Lions. I'd rather not see them become the Lions. Get rid of the obvious problem, and aspiring coaching candidates will be llning up to take the job.

The #1a thing coaches worry about when taking a job is ownership. Might be shaky perception wise right now in terms of a figurehead and leadership, but is run by Vulcan and they pay $$$ and give the head coach everything they need to succeed.

#1b is who is the QB? Trade Wilson, interest dwindles from coaches substantially. And you will get a Tomsula type, no credible coach will take the job.

Trading Wilson in his prime would be one of the dumbest moves in NFL history. Even if your plan is to rebuild.

 

[pittpnthrs]

Seattle would be a great destination for any head coach. Top tier facility, great GM, finances to get paid big. This would be a coach's dream come true

Great GM? Really?

Not sure I agree with Seattle being a dream come true for any head coach with the myriad of issues they would have to deal with. Uncertain and uninvolved ownership, lack of draft picks and capital, having to rebuild one of the worst defenses in NFL history, the leagues most brutal division, etc,,,. I know I would think twice.

My biggest fear is that Carrolls son takes over the mantle when Pete steps down. That would be disastrous.

 

[chris98251]

Trade Wilson now the team becomes the Lions. I'd rather not see them become the Lions. Get rid of the obvious problem, and aspiring coaching candidates will be llning up to take the job.

The #1a thing coaches worry about when taking a job is ownership. Might be shaky perception wise right now in terms of a figurehead and leadership, but is run by Vulcan and they pay $$$ and give the head coach everything they need to succeed.

#1b is who is the QB? Trade Wilson, interest dwindles from coaches substantially. And you will get a Tomsula type, no credible coach will take the job.

Trading Wilson in his prime would be one of the dumbest moves in NFL history. Even if your plan is to rebuild.

Nah, we rebounded from Mora & Ruskell, its about the hiring after the fire. Lions have a special spot in football hell, now closely followed by the Jets.

 

[RiverDog]

If we had our first round pick then it could be a debate but it makes no sense at all as long as the Jets have our pick.

We should try to win as many games this year as possible without trading away any future draft capital, and then re-evaluate next off-season depending on how this season played out.

If we trade Russell..and that's a huge "if"...the optimum time would be just before the Nov. 2nd trading deadline. By then, we should have a much better idea of where this team is heading, to the playoffs or on a runaway train heading for a washed out bridge.

There's a good possibility that a team that's on the cusp of a playoff run either suffers a season or career ending injury to their starting QB or they experience some really bad play and the team wins in spite of it. They could be very desperate and willing to make a big offer, especially if there's two or three teams in similar situations.

Keep your eye on the Saints. They're one of the 4 teams Russell's agent said he'd be willing to be traded to. I have a hard time believing that Sean Payton views Jameis Winston as his QB of the future. They're 2-1 even though Winston has played just so-so or a little below par with a completion percentage at 60% and passing YPG at just 128, not exactly Breesian.

 

[NJlargent]

Trade Wilson now the team becomes the Lions. I'd rather not see them become the Lions. Get rid of the obvious problem, and aspiring coaching candidates will be llning up to take the job.

The #1a thing coaches worry about when taking a job is ownership. Might be shaky perception wise right now in terms of a figurehead and leadership, but is run by Vulcan and they pay $$$ and give the head coach everything they need to succeed.

#1b is who is the QB? Trade Wilson, interest dwindles from coaches substantially. And you will get a Tomsula type, no credible coach will take the job.

Trading Wilson in his prime would be one of the dumbest moves in NFL history. Even if your plan is to rebuild.

This is 100% spot on.

Talk of rebuild is a waste of time. Until PC is gone, which should have been years ago, we will always be a competitive team due to a great QB. But extending him 5 years was a horrific decision. Adams was also horrific considering our OL and DL were average at best at the time. Coupled with the comic drafting and overreaching signings we now are clearly continuing the downward PC spiral while the rest of the division is heading in the right direction.

We desperately need to dump PC and dangle Wilson as bait to a potentially hungry coach that might right the ship.

 

[RiverDog]

Talk of rebuild is a waste of time. Until PC is gone, which should have been years ago, we will always be a competitive team due to a great QB. But extending him 5 years was a horrific decision. Adams was also horrific considering our OL and DL were average at best at the time. Coupled with the comic drafting and overreaching signings we now are clearly continuing the downward PC spiral while the rest of the division is heading in the right direction.

We desperately need to dump PC and dangle Wilson as bait to a potentially hungry coach that might right the ship.

All coaches contracts do is insure that they don't go coach for another team and it guarantees the coach his salary. There's nothing contractual that keeps Pete from getting fired. All it takes to get rid of him is a willingness by ownership to buy out the remaining years in his contract, peanuts to someone like Jodi Allen.

The Adams trade is looking worse and worse every week, and will stick out like a huge sore thumb if we aren't in the playoff hunt. For fans like us, the only 'good' thing about a losing season is that it gives us a higher draft pick. We don't have a #1 or a #4 due to the Adams trade.

If we implode, we don't know if Russell will even want to stay with us. There's just as good of a chance that he will want out as there is that he'll want to stick it out and be part of a rebuild. My gut feel is that he'll want out, that he'll want to go to a contender, in which case we'd have very little option but to trade him.

 

[Jerhawk]

Seattle would be a great destination for any head coach. Top tier facility, great GM, finances to get paid big. This would be a coach's dream come true

Great GM? Really?

Not sure I agree with Seattle being a dream come true for any head coach with the myriad of issues they would have to deal with. Uncertain and uninvolved ownership, lack of draft picks and capital, having to rebuild one of the worst defenses in NFL history, the leagues most brutal division, etc,,,. I know I would think twice.

My biggest fear is that Carrolls son takes over the mantle when Pete steps down. That would be disastrous.

You don't think Schneider is a good GM?
I think he's done a good job. Hes in it to win it. Coaching is our biggest issue.

And most new coaches are coming into a rebuilding situation when they get hired. It's nothing new but it's part of the challenge, and some coaches may argue they enjoy the challenge.

I wouldn't want a coach to come in and say "We will run the team exactly the way Carroll ran it. I want no change in personnel or scheme."

Look at what Carroll had to take over when he got here. Holmgren, Mora and Ruskell left this team a dumpster fire and they turned it around in 2 years.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Almost half the board want him traded. Wow

 

[TheLegendOfBoom]

Seattle is going to be an unattractive option for any decent HC candidate.

You have an either uninvolved owner or the unknown threat of potential sale.

You have a cupboard that is almost stripped bare and you have a fan base that is used to winning (at least in the regular season) at a high clip. Expectations will be high and resources are scant.

You have a defense filled with aging players and guys that really shouldn't be starting.

You don't trade Wilson. For any reason. Even if he is caught kicking someone in the face on video. You keep him. And you make it work, weaknesses and all.

You also make the person he kicks in the face actually apologizes to Wilson.

Lol.

That potential sale factor is truly a deal breaker for most coaches.

All this could be easily resolved if Carroll pulls his head out of his arse and develops half a clue on how to play effective defense at a professional NFL level.

I mean, the defensive concepts he has can be exploited by all levels of amateur football.

What’s so hard about completing a pass when the nearest cornerback is 10 yards away? All the time?!

SMH.

 

[RiverDog]

Almost half the board want him traded. Wow

If you think that's bad, just wait until we lose to the Niners and Rams.

 

[chris98251]

Look at it this way, Wilson see's that we have a defense that sucks, he see's he has a coach that wants him to play a certain way but not his way, we are trending the wrong direction for him to be "Legendary", he may like Seattle as a place to visit but the shiny aspect of playing here has tarnished the last 3 to 4 seasons. He wanted to be the guy, he is I guess, be careful what you wish for.

Why rather then watch him walk away for nothing other then a comp pick you trade him to a team that needs that last piece or an emergency replacement.

Pete controls all the personnel decisions, John does the homework and details, but Pete gives his blessings or pass on them due to talent, money possibly and fit, yes he gets input from coaches, but he is where the buck stops.

That may be part of the issue as well, too much on his plate to be good at everything.

 

[TwilightError]

Well to rebuild one has to have draft picks. Wilson, Metcalf, Adams and Maybe Wagner could fetch us some. Also I’d want someone else than JSPC handling it. So if they blow this up, it should be done completely.

I’m thankful for the Legion of Boom, but in this Not For Long league, we now have the Legion of Boo! and that needs to chance.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Be careful what you wish for. This team is going to suck for a long while if he is traded.

 

[chris98251]

Well to rebuild one has to have draft picks. Wilson, Metcalf, Adams and Maybe Wagner could fetch us some. Also I’d want someone else than JSPC handling it. So if they blow this up, it should be done completely.

I’m thankful for the Legion of Boom, but in this Not For Long league, we now have the Legion of Boo! and that needs yo chance.

That's the whole point, you know if you liquidate your assets to rebuild and even do it right it's 2 or 3 years of learning and acquiring before the results start to show up in games. Why keeping Wilson Wagner, Adams, Diggs, Lockett, and Metcalf would get you nothing in the short term.

Also player fit and scheme for the next Coach and OC is a big factor also. Look how we jettisoned Mora players when Pete came in.

John may be Ok as a GM, he is really the Watson behind Holmes in Pete. On his own he may make different decisions.

 

[TwilightError]

Well to rebuild one has to have draft picks. Wilson, Metcalf, Adams and Maybe Wagner could fetch us some. Also I’d want someone else than JSPC handling it. So if they blow this up, it should be done completely.

I’m thankful for the Legion of Boom, but in this Not For Long league, we now have the Legion of Boo! and that needs yo chance.

That's the whole point, you know if you liquidate your assets to rebuild and even do it right it's 2 or 3 years of learning and acquiring before the results start to show up in games. Why keeping Wilson Wagner, Adams, Diggs, Lockett, and Metcalf would get you nothing in the short term.

Also player fit and scheme for the next Coach and OC is a big factor also. Look how we jettisoned Mora players when Pete came in.

John may be Ok as a GM, he is really the Watson behind Holmes in Pete. On his own he may make different decisions.

Exactly. So the question is, should we trust Pete, Russ and John to turn this squad into a contender? Cause if not, there is no point in keeping the team mediocre just because that way it does not completely suck. I’m fine with a couple of years of complete sucking if it results in getting a contender team. And there is no rebuild with a franchise quarterback in his prime. That makes no sense for the player or for the team.

I’m not yet sure. But now for the first time in the Pete Carroll era, I’m considering it as a realistic option.. Anyway the real question is: Is Jody Allen ready to pull the plug on the backbone of this, or any successful, team? That being HC/GM/QB. I think if there is a change, it should be total and at once. Wilson's salary does not fit in a rebuild.

 

[sprhawk73]

Exactly. So the question is, should we trust Pete, Russ and John to turn this squad into a contender? Cause if not, there is no point in keeping the team mediocre just because that way it does not completely suck. I’m fine with a couple of years of complete sucking if it results in getting a contender team. And there is no rebuild with a franchise quarterback in his prime. That makes no sense for the player or for the team.

I’m not yet sure. But now for the first time in the Pete Carroll era, I’m considering it as a realistic option.. Anyway the real question is: Is Jody Allen ready to pull the plug on the backbone of this, or any successful, team? That being HC/GM/QB. I think if there is a change, it should be total and at once. Wilson's salary does not fit in a rebuild.

Keeping RW isn't an option if we rebuild because he'll keep finding ways to win. That's what he's been doing for the last 5 years. It's what we want to love about the guy but in this situation it's doing more harm than good.

We went 12-4 last year. Does anybody really feel like that was a 12-4 team?

It's a sad situation but it would really be best for both parties to go separate ways.

 

[Jerhawk]

Be careful what you wish for. This team is going to suck for a long while if he is traded.

We don't know that. There's lots of good talent coming out of college now days at the QB position.

For the record I do not want Russell gone, but I don't agree that it would be the end of the story

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Be careful what you wish for. This team is going to suck for a long while if he is traded.

We don't know that. There's lots of good talent coming out of college now days at the QB position.

For the record I do not want Russell gone, but I don't agree that it would be the end of the story

Depends on who's 2-3 first rounders we got.

Top 5 perennial loser franchise? Sure, three first rounders means something. But all the teams on Russell's list were contenders, so then you have three picks in the 20's......and we all know what Pete and John do with 1st rounders when we're in the 20's. Trade down 87 times to accumulate the most 5th round picks as possible.

So no thanks, I'll take the franchise QB in his prime for another 6-7 years over three more Malik McDowells and Germaine Ifedi's.