Hawks should impose a deadline w/ Kam

[Basis4day]

I'd say trade him. He's wasting a roster spot that you might either get used by another very good player or get what would likely be a high draft pick or so.

Get something for him given it'll just get beyond manageable if they acede to his demands.

I don't believe he uses up a roster spot or counts against the cap while he sits out. So he can't use that as leverage against the team. He just sits out and loses money. But he won't affect the Seahawks at all beyond his absence on the field.

That's correct.

 

[WilsonMVP]

I'd say trade him. He's wasting a roster spot that you might either get used by another very good player or get what would likely be a high draft pick or so.

Get something for him given it'll just get beyond manageable if they acede to his demands.

Couldn't disagree more. See my post above, Kam is one of the most uniquely talented players in the league. You don't trade that kind of player away when you have them under contract for three more years. It sounds like they're throwing him a bone, similar to what they did with Marshawn, and he deserves it. Kam has never given less than 100%, and has consistently sold out his body to try to help this team win football games. Can you honestly say there's ever been a play on defense where you felt like Kam could have tried harder? I can't. Sometimes allowances have to be made for the greater good. This is one of them. If it was Doug Baldwin holding out and making demands, I wouldn't bat an eye at trading him. Same with quite a few other players on this team. But a guy like Kam is just not someone who can be replaced or even come close to being replaced, so you need to compromise a little. What they're doing sounds fair to me, guarantee some of next year's salary and maybe look to throw him a bigger bone next offseason if the cap permits.

If you don't believe that the Seahawks' Defense would take a significant hit by not having Kam on the field, you are mistaken. FACT.

Not to mention the fact that even if we did get fair market value for Chancellor--which is not a sure thing, BTW--that value would likely come in the form of draft choices that would not help our team until next year at the earliest, whereas we would be taking a hit now with him being gone.

To be honest, though, I am not a fan of giving him anything other than promising to waive the fines. I look at guys like Michael Bennett and Antonio Brown who weren't happy with their contracts, came to camp anyway, and have only worked that much harder. Then I look at Kam Chancellor and see someone whose holdout came out of nowhere, who I believe WILL hold out of at least one regular season game (my prediction is that he stays away for the first two) and it really upsets me. I absolutely see where he is coming from and in a perfect world would love to see him get more money, but he is going about it the wrong way and his actions will have repercussions that could easily damage this team no matter how this plays out. And I have to wonder what would have happened if he had told the front office, "I want a new deal but am going to come into camp, work hard, be a leader, and show you AGAIN why I deserve one." We'll never know, but my honest opinion is that the team would have been more likely to make a concession for Chancellor (and probably a bigger concession than what he will eventually get) if he hadn't forced the issue by holding out.

Not to mention I cant believe his relationship with the D is on good terms right now. Sherman and Thomas have to be pissed off at him right now

 

[Our Man in Chicago]

They - Bennett especially - were probably initially interested to see if his gambit paid off. At some point, that impulse will be superseded by a necessary focus on team unity.

 

[idahawks]

The three years left thing is a bit of misnomer as he is in the last year of his guaranteed contract. If the team can bail on the non guaranteed part it is smart for the player to make moves now.

Sorry but I don't think you accurately described this. He's getting the last of his guaranteed money but he's still under contract for 3 years to the Seahawks. He isn't a free agent at the end of the year and his contract and pay covers him for the next 3 years. Seahawks can cut him which essentially makes him a free agent, and only pay him his guaranteed portion of his contract but he can't leave and play for another team next year or the year after.

His hold out is asinine. The only thing that makes sense is he's suffered a career ending injury and knows he's not going to get the unguaranteed portion of his contract so he's trying to get more guaranteed money, pass the physical and play a few games until his injury permanently sidelines him so he can collect the rest of his guaranteed money.

If this isn't the case he and his agent are incredibly stupid and have grossly underestimated the Seahawks front office. If this goes into the regular season he's cost himself millions of dollars and may never play for the hawks again. He'll get traded for pennies what Seattle was going to pay him and probably never have a chance to win another super bowl. I would love to hear what the conversations between him and his agent are like right now.

He's 27 yrs old and has maybe 3 prime years left and 6 years total. He's going to throw one away and lose millions of dollars over it. He's a better fb player than negotiator, his agent is an idiot.

 

[Laloosh]

Can I ask a stupid question?

If Kam sat for the entire season and the team decided to keep him in 2016, would he be looking at earning the 7+ or whatever it is slated for 2016? This is purely hypothetical, I am just curious how that works.

 

[idahawks]

Even if Kam decides to hold out all season, wouldn't the 'Hawks still own his rights?

I don't see that Kam has any choices besides play or retire.

Yes they would. And if he holds out all season they own his right for the next 3 seasons (after this season), this season wouldn't count.

He's an idiot so is his agent.

 

[idahawks]

The argument for players holding out is that teams will cut a player if they're not performing, but that holds no water in this instance. If a team signs a player to a contract with large guarantees, they're on the hook for those guarantees no matter how that player performs.

Kam and his agent signed a very bad deal in hindsight, but he made his bed. Seattle signed Percy for a contract with large guarantees, and even after trading him, they're still on the hook for the rest of his guaranteed money. That was a bad deal for Seattle in hindsight, but they are having to pay for it now. Same with Kam.

Kam didn't sign a bad deal He's within $5,000/year of being the highest paid SS in the league and he got over 50% of his contract in guarantees. He's already received $12 million of a $28 million contract and he's only played one of 4 years. He got his guaranteed money up front and now he wants more. He's either hiding an injury or he's a complete idiot, or both.

If he doesn't report next week to prepare for St Louis the hawks should move on.

 

[Basis4day]

The three years left thing is a bit of misnomer as he is in the last year of his guaranteed contract. If the team can bail on the non guaranteed part it is smart for the player to make moves now.

Sorry but I don't think you accurately described this. He's getting the last of his guaranteed money but he's still under contract for 3 years to the Seahawks. He isn't a free agent at the end of the year and his contract and pay covers him for the next 3 years. Seahawks can cut him which essentially makes him a free agent, and only pay him his guaranteed portion of his contract but he can't leave and play for another team next year or the year after.

His hold out is asinine. The only thing that makes sense is he's suffered a career ending injury and knows he's not going to get the unguaranteed portion of his contract so he's trying to get more guaranteed money, pass the physical and play a few games until his injury permanently sidelines him so he can collect the rest of his guaranteed money.

If this isn't the case he and his agent are incredibly stupid and have grossly underestimated the Seahawks front office. If this goes into the regular season he's cost himself millions of dollars and may never play for the hawks again. He'll get traded for pennies what Seattle was going to pay him and probably never have a chance to win another super bowl. I would love to hear what the conversations between him and his agent are like right now.

He's 27 yrs old and has maybe 3 prime years left and 6 years total. He's going to throw one away and lose millions of dollars over it. He's a better fb player than negotiator, his agent is an idiot.

I don't think a career ending injury would be easy to hide from a contract mandated physical to the point where you can play additional games. The speculated belief that Kam is hiding an injury and this is the main cause of his holdout in order to fleece the Seahawks is a bit over the top and getting a bit too popular around he fandom for my taste.

However, the fear of a career ending injury with no guaranteed money left on a deal is a very real part of the situation.

 

[HawkFan72]

Can I ask a stupid question?

If Kam sat for the entire season and the team decided to keep him in 2016, would he be looking at earning the 7+ or whatever it is slated for 2016? This is purely hypothetical, I am just curious how that works.

All he has to do to count as playing a full season is be on the active roster for 6 games. So if he shows up for the final 6 weeks this season, it will count as a fully accrued season and he will get everything he is entitled to for next year.

As far as what he gets if he sits the whole year out, I don't know because he will not have met his requirements to accrue a season in 2015. I don't know how that affects his pay after this year beyond the fact that he will still have 3 years left on his deal.

 

[Phoenix]

The latest, I suppose on Kam and Fred Jackson:

“In dealing with Chancellor, expect that they’re going to add a year to his contract and give him some money up front,” Cole said. “That seems like the most logical solution at this point in time.”

http://blog.seattlepi.com/football/...olding-up-seahawks-deal-with-rb-fred-jackson/

 

[StoneCold]

The three years left thing is a bit of misnomer as he is in the last year of his guaranteed contract. If the team can bail on the non guaranteed part it is smart for the player to make moves now.

Sorry but I don't think you accurately described this. He's getting the last of his guaranteed money but he's still under contract for 3 years to the Seahawks. He isn't a free agent at the end of the year and his contract and pay covers him for the next 3 years. Seahawks can cut him which essentially makes him a free agent, and only pay him his guaranteed portion of his contract but he can't leave and play for another team next year or the year after.

His hold out is asinine. The only thing that makes sense is he's suffered a career ending injury and knows he's not going to get the unguaranteed portion of his contract so he's trying to get more guaranteed money, pass the physical and play a few games until his injury permanently sidelines him so he can collect the rest of his guaranteed money.

If this isn't the case he and his agent are incredibly stupid and have grossly underestimated the Seahawks front office. If this goes into the regular season he's cost himself millions of dollars and may never play for the hawks again. He'll get traded for pennies what Seattle was going to pay him and probably never have a chance to win another super bowl. I would love to hear what the conversations between him and his agent are like right now.

He's 27 yrs old and has maybe 3 prime years left and 6 years total. He's going to throw one away and lose millions of dollars over it. He's a better fb player than negotiator, his agent is an idiot.

Small misunderstanding. I wasn't saying he would be a FA and could move on. The Seahawks have rights to him for the next 3 years, 2015, 2016 and 2017, but only the salary for 2015 is guaranteed. My point was that for Kam, he is at the Hawks mercy after this year. If they don't like the way he is performing or if he gets injured, he will be cut. His only leverage is that the Seahawks want him to play this year, and if they want that he wants them to guarantee some more money.

 

[edogg23]

The latest, I suppose on Kam and Fred Jackson:

“In dealing with Chancellor, expect that they’re going to add a year to his contract and give him some money up front,” Cole said. “That seems like the most logical solution at this point in time.”

http://blog.seattlepi.com/football/...olding-up-seahawks-deal-with-rb-fred-jackson/

If the seahawks give him even 1 cent more they are making a huge mistake and will have 10 guys holding out next year in training camp. It's not worth it to get Kam back. He has no leverage. Sitting out a year and not getting paid is not leverage.

 

[Exittium]

I don't want to see them give into Kam. As it does would set a bad precedent going forward and I think we'll see more player holding out. I myself have lowered my expectations of seeing Kam week one against St Louis. Probably just like everyone else I'll be pleasently suprised if he does show.

I also have to think Sherm and Earl can't be to happy with him for doing this.

 

[Tech Worlds]

He is seriously hurting his image with the fans. He needs to get back with the team before its too late.

He is my favorite player on the defense. But i am about fed up and am almost ready to move on as i am sure other fans are as well.

 

[Bigpumpkin]

All he has to do to count as playing a full season is be on the active roster for 6 games. So if he shows up for the final 6 weeks this season, it will count as a fully accrued season and he will get everything he is entitled to for next year.
/quote]

Do you really believe that John and Pete would bring him back at Week 10 so he could get his money? Crazy!

 

[StoneCold]

All he has to do to count as playing a full season is be on the active roster for 6 games. So if he shows up for the final 6 weeks this season, it will count as a fully accrued season and he will get everything he is entitled to for next year.

Do you really believe that John and Pete would bring him back at Week 10 so he could get his money? Crazy!

Depends on the perceived need. If we are battling to get into the playoffs they would bring him back.

My brain says, "Don't cave". But my heart says, "Pay that man his money". I know it will set a bad precedent, but when I read the false report that they had extended Kam, my heart skipped a beat and did a yippee dance.

 

[Seahawk Sailor]

The latest, I suppose on Kam and Fred Jackson:

“In dealing with Chancellor, expect that they’re going to add a year to his contract and give him some money up front,” Cole said. “That seems like the most logical solution at this point in time.”

http://blog.seattlepi.com/football/...olding-up-seahawks-deal-with-rb-fred-jackson/

If the seahawks give him even 1 cent more they are making a huge mistake and will have 10 guys holding out next year in training camp. It's not worth it to get Kam back. He has no leverage. Sitting out a year and not getting paid is not leverage.

With all due respect, I completely disagree. The above scenario is the best that could come out of this, and possibly even better than what we had before had he not held out. If they give a slight nod to Kam while using this opportunity to extend him even further as a Seahawk, this is a great thing. Kam wants some guarantees because he knows his career is likely to be short. The Seahawks can't just say "well sure we'll give you more money" because then every player would do this. But by saying "tell you what, we'll add an extra year into your contract and give you some of that money up front," they do two things: first, they defuse the situation and get him back to camp by getting him guarantees he's happy with, and second, they don't appear weak and give other players leverage to do the same without knowing they'll be restructuring a longer contract in the bargain.

The type of situation above is a win-win-win, for Kam, for the Seahawks, and for the fans who want to see Kam in a Seahawks uniform for the foreseeable future. Also similar to what they did for Marshawn Lynch, if I recall correctly.

 

[edogg23]

All he has to do to count as playing a full season is be on the active roster for 6 games. So if he shows up for the final 6 weeks this season, it will count as a fully accrued season and he will get everything he is entitled to for next year.
/quote]

Do you really believe that John and Pete would bring him back at Week 10 so he could get his money? Crazy!

He would only get some of his money, he would be missing all of the missing game checks and all of the fines and whatever proration of his signing bonus he owes back.

 

[Basis4day]

All he has to do to count as playing a full season is be on the active roster for 6 games. So if he shows up for the final 6 weeks this season, it will count as a fully accrued season and he will get everything he is entitled to for next year.

Do you really believe that John and Pete would bring him back at Week 10 so he could get his money? Crazy!

Depends on the perceived need. If we are battling to get into the playoffs they would bring him back.

My brain says, "Don't cave". But my heart says, "Pay that man his money". I know it will set a bad precedent, but when I read the false report that they had extended Kam, my heart skipped a beat and did a yippee dance.

I believe that if a player wants to report then the front office can't really prevent him from doing so absent enforcement of any fines.

 

[Our Man in Chicago]

He is seriously hurting his image with the fans. He needs to get back with the team before its too late.

He is my favorite player on the defense. But i am about fed up and am almost ready to move on as i am sure other fans are as well.

I, for one, will accept all pristine Kam Limited jerseys in M. Home, away, and Wolf Gray are all fine with me.