How many points did the refs take off the board tonight....

[Rainger]

I believe the NFL is deliberately trying to keep games close for obvious reasons. Look at your top teams, Seattle, Denver and NE for the teams most penalized and the Jaguars for the least.

Believe what you want. I have watched the game for 40 years and I know the difference between a timely ticky tacky call or just plain bad call and an actual bad call. There is a very visible pattern that coincides with the stats and the eyeball test. You can believe what you want I prefer to believe what I see and common sense tells me.

Well said. For those that disagree, what do you make of the graph posted? Can you explain that without there being any sort of bias? Are the refs encouraged to keep it close? Or, do they in general dislike the Seahaws? Or, do refs inherently try and help the team that is losing or the underdog? I don't know, but you just can't get statistics that are that out of wack without some sort of bias going on. Last nights 49er game was the worst. Coincidentally, what NFL HC has made the biggest stink about the Seahawks cheating on defense? Also, what rule was said going to be more strictly enforced this year? What team's secondary was getting nit picked last night? How many more sacks would the Seahawks have this year if it was "offensive holding" as the point of emphasis before the season?

I criticize referees as a sport and make no apologies for it as it's what I enjoy doing, but I used to believe it was mostly all in my head. That is until I watched the NBA ref that got caught gambling explain, that the inside knowledge he relied on to make his wagers was the locker room talk of the other refs and how they were going to "send a message" etc. to certain players, etc. Watch this. Start about the 4 minute mark if you are in a hurry.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/ex-nba-ref- ... onal-foul/

Oh but this cant happen in the NFL no no they are 100% honest here . :sarcasm_off: Just ask a bunch of the .neters who have told me so because there is no evidence.

 

[StoneCold]

I believe the NFL is deliberately trying to keep games close for obvious reasons. Look at your top teams, Seattle, Denver and NE for the teams most penalized and the Jaguars for the least.

Believe what you want. I have watched the game for 40 years and I know the difference between a timely ticky tacky call or just plain bad call and an actual bad call. There is a very visible pattern that coincides with the stats and the eyeball test. You can believe what you want I prefer to believe what I see and common sense tells me.

Well said. For those that disagree, what do you make of the graph posted? Can you explain that without there being any sort of bias? Are the refs encouraged to keep it close? Or, do they in general dislike the Seahaws? Or, do refs inherently try and help the team that is losing or the underdog? I don't know, but you just can't get statistics that are that out of wack without some sort of bias going on. Last nights 49er game was the worst. Coincidentally, what NFL HC has made the biggest stink about the Seahawks cheating on defense? Also, what rule was said going to be more strictly enforced this year? What team's secondary was getting nit picked last night? How many more sacks would the Seahawks have this year if it was "offensive holding" as the point of emphasis before the season?

I criticize referees as a sport and make no apologies for it as it's what I enjoy doing, but I used to believe it was mostly all in my head. That is until I watched the NBA ref that got caught gambling explain, that the inside knowledge he relied on to make his wagers was the locker room talk of the other refs and how they were going to "send a message" etc. to certain players, etc. Watch this. Start about the 4 minute mark if you are in a hurry.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/ex-nba-ref- ... onal-foul/

Oh but this cant happen in the NFL no no they are 100% honest here . :sarcasm_off: Just ask a bunch of the .neters who have told me so because there is no evidence.

You mean the evidence the Seahawks commit more penalties than their opponents? Sign of good aggressive football. All of the better teams commit more penalties. They play harder. Stuff happens.

SC

 

[jammerhawk]

How many points robbed from the Seahawks? 8

Actually I think it correctly should be 11 as SF would not have gotten their 3 w/o 'official assistance'. Of course that's a matter of opinion but some others feel the same way.

The number however does not account for other lost opportunities as several possessions were stalled b/c of penalties.

To me there were many 'keep the game close' type calls, but less once the outcome was determined. The degree of referee activism seemingly decreased in direct relationship to the likely determination of the final result, To me it seemed there were more penalties against the Hawks while the game was still undetermined in clear final outcome.

Either the Hawks physical style has been the subject of official consideration and thus attention, or the games are being called with an intentional or I suppose unintentional double standard, I believe there is seemingly no other clear explanation for the significant statistical difference between our team's penalties and those of an opponent, Seattle doesn't hold more on passing plays than other teams do but they are called on Seattle more frequently. As well there seems to be some inequity in in certain calls being made against Seattle's more physical players like roughing or late hits or helmet to helmet hits.When assessed critically the greater number of calls so far against Seattle relative to other competitors may explain the increase in calls as referees looking at past results preparing for a Seattle game would for example notice numerous defensive holding calls and thus focus on watching Seattle for that supposed foul thus increasing the number of fouls called against Seattle, i.e.: a self fulfilling circumstance.

It would be interesting to see if the team had the fouls called against them cut down if they focused on reducing a particular type foul. Seattle however is right to continue to complain to the league about the differential.

It is however becoming worrisome b/c although recently the Hawks have been able to overcome the disparity in calls and the 5:1 disparity against SF sooner or later the disparity is going to be the difference in the outcome.

 

[MidwestHawker]

Oh but this cant happen in the NFL no no they are 100% honest here . :sarcasm_off: Just ask a bunch of the .neters who have told me so because there is no evidence.

Meh, I'll stop beating my head into a wall with this argument, especially since your aversion to fact-based and evidence-based arguments basically makes it impossible to discuss the matter with you.

Think as you will about this issue.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

How many points robbed from the Seahawks? 8

Actually I think it correctly should be 11 as SF would not have gotten their 3 w/o 'official assistance'. Of course that's a matter of opinion but some others feel the same way.

The number however does not account for other lost opportunities as several possessions were stalled b/c of penalties.

To me there were many 'keep the game close' type calls, but less once the outcome was determined. The degree of referee activism seemingly decreased in direct relationship to the likely determination of the final result, To me it seemed there were more penalties against the Hawks while the game was still undetermined in clear final outcome.

Either the Hawks physical style has been the subject of official consideration and thus attention, or the games are being called with an intentional or I suppose unintentional double standard, I believe there is seemingly no other clear explanation for the significant statistical difference between our team's penalties and those of an opponent, Seattle doesn't hold more on passing plays than other teams do but they are called on Seattle more frequently. As well there seems to be some inequity in in certain calls being made against Seattle's more physical players like roughing or late hits or helmet to helmet hits.When assessed critically the greater number of calls so far against Seattle relative to other competitors may explain the increase in calls as referees looking at past results preparing for a Seattle game would for example notice numerous defensive holding calls and thus focus on watching Seattle for that supposed foul thus increasing the number of fouls called against Seattle, i.e.: a self fulfilling circumstance.

It would be interesting to see if the team had the fouls called against them cut down if they focused on reducing a particular type foul. Seattle however is right to continue to complain to the league about the differential.

It is however becoming worrisome b/c although recently the Hawks have been able to overcome the disparity in calls and the 5:1 disparity against SF sooner or later the disparity is going to be the difference in the outcome.

Really good post my friend.

 

[Rainger]

Oh but this cant happen in the NFL no no they are 100% honest here . :sarcasm_off: Just ask a bunch of the .neters who have told me so because there is no evidence.

Meh, I'll stop beating my head into a wall with this argument, especially since your aversion to fact-based and evidence-based arguments basically makes it impossible to discuss the matter with you.

Think as you will about this issue.

Thank you because i didn't ask your opinion or to discuss it with you. I made a post. It is not your job to 'correct" everyone.

You also have no evidence or facts that it isn't happening in the NFL. Other than it hasn't made it into the media. Many things are occurring in the world behind the scenes that the media and you do not know about. That doesn't mean it isn't happening just because you don't know about it.

I am also not asking to "discuss" it with you.

 

[MidwestHawker]

You also have no evidence or facts that it isn't happening in the NFL. Other than it hasn't made it into the media. Many things are occurring in the world behind the scenes that the media and you do not know about. That doesn't mean it isn't happening just because you don't know about it.

To be clear: my stance isn't that it's definitely not happening. My stance is that it's loony to affirmatively assert that it definitely IS happening when there's no proof of it.

But I realize that your argument boils down to "I watch games and I've applied my eye test, just take my word for it on this," which of course makes for pretty terrible discussion.